Podcast: The High Performance
Published Date:
Wed, 03 Feb 2021 00:30:00 GMT
Duration:
48:31
Explicit:
False
Guests:
MP3 Audio:
Please note that the summary is generated based on the transcript and may not capture all the nuances or details discussed in the podcast episode.
Dilbagh Gill is CEO and Team Principal of the Mahindra Racing Team. Mahindra Racing is one of ten founding teams – and the only Indian team – to compete in the Formula E Championship. Dilbagh has built his team from the ground up which has led to multiple race victories and podiums.
With more than two decades of experience working in technology and business development and a Tech Mahindra family member for over 10 years, Dilbagh developed unique sporting technology practices that led him to working on high-profile programmes including Project Manager of FIFA World Cup and A1GP ahead of his work with Mahindra Racing.
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## **Summary of the Podcast Episode with Dilbagh Gill, CEO and Team Principal of Mahindra Racing Team**
### **Introduction**
- Dilbagh Gill, CEO and Team Principal of Mahindra Racing Team, shares his journey of building a successful Formula E team from the ground up.
- Mahindra Racing is one of the ten founding teams and the only Indian team competing in the Formula E Championship.
- Gill's experience spans over two decades in technology and business development, including working on high-profile programs like Project Manager of FIFA World Cup and A1GP.
### **Key Points:**
**1. Consistency and High Performance:**
- Gill defines high performance as consistency in conviction, belief, influence, courage, and boldness.
- He emphasizes the importance of doing things right the first time and taking pride in one's work.
**2. Questioning Everything:**
- Gill stresses the importance of questioning everything and not accepting conventional wisdom.
- He believes that challenging assumptions and seeking deeper understanding leads to innovative solutions.
**3. Building a Family-Like Team:**
- Gill prioritizes creating a family-like atmosphere within the Mahindra Racing Team.
- He seeks individuals who are committed to working for each other and the team's collective success.
- This approach has resulted in long-term relationships and a strong team spirit.
**4. Dealing with Trust and Understanding:**
- Gill acknowledges that not everyone demonstrates trust and understanding within the team.
- He believes that such individuals typically don't last long in the organization.
- The core group of the team has remained together since inception, fostering alignment and a shared vision.
**5. Importance of Personal Success and Team Success:**
- Gill emphasizes the need to balance personal success with team success in motorsport.
- He seeks drivers who understand the team's philosophy and are willing to work towards building a strong team.
- This approach has led to drivers like Nick Heidfeld maintaining a relationship of trust and understanding with the team even after leaving.
**6. Early Career Experiences:**
- Gill's early work experiences, including repairing motorcycles in college, taught him the value of resourcefulness and adaptability.
- He learned the importance of taking risks, seeking opportunities, and working with diverse individuals.
**7. Purpose and Mission:**
- Gill believes that finding a purpose or mission is crucial for driving success.
- He views his role as carrying India's flag and representing the country in the world of motorsport.
- This purpose motivates him and his team to excel and achieve great things.
### **Conclusion:**
- Gill's journey exemplifies the power of questioning conventions, fostering a family-like team culture, and balancing personal and team success.
- His insights provide valuable lessons for leaders and teams looking to achieve high performance and make a positive impact in their respective fields.
**I. Introduction of Dilbagh Gill and Mahindra Racing:**
- Dilbagh Gill serves as the CEO and Team Principal of Mahindra Racing, one of the founding teams in the Formula E Championship.
- Gill has built the team from the ground up, leading them to multiple race victories and podium finishes.
- With over two decades of experience in technology and business development, Gill has a proven track record of success in various high-profile programs, including the FIFA World Cup and A1GP.
**II. Creating a Family Culture in a Competitive Sport:**
- Gill emphasizes the importance of creating a family culture within the team, fostering empathy, technical understanding, and brilliant driving skills.
- He believes that avoiding a blame culture and encouraging disagreement while committing to decisions is crucial for team success.
- To prevent fiefdoms and silos, Mahindra Racing employs strong communication, regular meetings, and team-based rewards, including bonuses structured around team performance rather than individual achievements.
**III. The Role of Drivers and the Importance of Technical Excellence:**
- Gill initially offered individual performance-based bonuses to drivers but later shifted to team-based incentives to promote collaboration and shared success.
- He acknowledges the need to challenge conventions and adapt to changing circumstances, such as modifying the driver reporting structure to align with the team's goals.
- Gill emphasizes the importance of technical excellence and continuous improvement, encouraging team members to strive for incremental gains and embrace a growth mindset.
**IV. Handling Bad Race Weekends and Debriefing Processes:**
- Mahindra Racing aims to avoid a blame culture during debriefing sessions, focusing on fundamentals and learning from mistakes.
- Gill recognizes the need to manage his emotions and prevent raw anger from hindering productive discussions.
- The team's core members have developed an understanding of Gill's emotional responses and have learned to navigate them effectively.
**V. Maintaining a High-Performance Mindset and Emotional Control:**
- Gill acknowledges the importance of emotional engagement and responding authentically to moments of triumph and disappointment.
- He emphasizes the need to flush negative emotions quickly and regain a logical and engineering mindset to make informed decisions.
- Gill credits his core team for recognizing his emotional moments and allowing him space to vent, knowing that he will eventually regain composure and contribute constructively.
**VI. Ensuring Safety and Accountability in a High-Risk Environment:**
- Gill stresses the critical need for safety and accountability in Formula E, where mistakes can have life-threatening consequences.
- He emphasizes the importance of constant preparation, attention to detail, and a strong work ethic to minimize risks and ensure the safety of drivers, team members, and spectators.
- Regular reminders and discussions are held to reinforce the team's commitment to safety and the responsibility of each individual to perform their duties flawlessly.
**VII. The Importance of Human Elements, Financial Support, and Technical Skills:**
- Gill believes that human elements are the most crucial factor for team success, followed by financial support and technical skills.
- He acknowledges the direct correlation between financial resources and results in motorsport but emphasizes the importance of innovation and agility to compete effectively.
- Gill highlights the success of smaller and customer teams in Formula E, demonstrating that financial resources alone do not guarantee victory.
**VIII. Reflecting on the Past Season and Preparing for the Future:**
- Mahindra Racing aims to continuously improve and identify areas for incremental gains, leaving no silver bullets untapped.
- Gill recognizes the importance of mental health and sports psychology in enhancing driver performance and overall team success.
- The team has invested in mental health support and seen positive results from engaging with a sports psychologist.
**IX. Gill's Personal Philosophy and Future Aspirations:**
- Gill believes in maximizing each day and living a high-performance life.
- He emphasizes the importance of asking questions rather than memorizing answers, focusing on experiences rather than content.
- Gill expresses his desire to become a middle school teacher in the future, driven by his passion for education and his belief that education needs to change to focus on asking better questions.
**X. Non-Negotiable Behaviors, Advice for Young Professionals, and Legacy:**
- Gill identifies integrity, doing it right the first time, and honesty as his non-negotiable behaviors.
- He advises young professionals not to take themselves too seriously and to focus on gaining experiences rather than just content.
- Gill believes legacy is very important and emphasizes the need to respect and appreciate the past to build a better future.
**XI. Golden Rule for Living a High-Performance Life:**
- Gill's golden rule for living a high-performance life is to maximize each day, making the most of every opportunity and living life to the fullest.
Dilbagh Gill, CEO and Team Principal of Mahindra Racing, has built his Formula E team from the ground up, leading them to multiple race victories and podiums. Gill's extensive experience in technology and business development, coupled with his unique sporting technology practices, has shaped his successful career.
Gill emphasizes the importance of recognizing what one doesn't know and actively seeking knowledge to bridge the gap. He highlights the Dunning-Kruger effect, where individuals tend to overestimate their abilities, leading to a lack of awareness of their own ignorance. Gill stresses the need to acknowledge this phenomenon and adopt a humble approach to learning.
In high-pressure situations, Gill believes that leaders should have the confidence to step up and take charge, while also being open to asking questions and seeking input from others. He acknowledges that this can be challenging, especially when emotions are running high, but emphasizes the importance of maintaining composure and focusing on the task at hand.
Gill's leadership style centers around fostering a positive and supportive team environment. He recognizes the value of passion and dedication among his team members and encourages them to pursue their interests with enthusiasm. Gill believes that this approach leads to greater job satisfaction and overall team success.
Gill's journey in various industries and roles has taught him the importance of adaptability and embracing new challenges. He encourages individuals to step outside their comfort zones and explore different opportunities, as this can lead to personal and professional growth.
Overall, Dilbagh Gill's insights offer valuable lessons on leadership, learning, and personal development, emphasizing the significance of self-awareness, humility, and a passion for lifelong learning.
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[03:21.040 -> 03:30.160] Hello there, I'm Jay Comfrey, you're listening to High Performance, the podcast that delves into the minds of the most successful athletes, visionaries, entrepreneurs and artists on
[03:30.160 -> 03:31.160] the planet.
[03:31.160 -> 03:34.760] Aim is to unlock the very secrets to their high performance life so you can follow in
[03:34.760 -> 03:35.760] their footsteps.
[03:35.760 -> 03:39.200] With me as ever, lecturer, author, professor Damien Hughes.
[03:39.200 -> 03:44.480] And Damien, from a rural tea plantation in India to the most cutting edge sporting series
[03:44.480 -> 03:46.720] on the planet. I think today's going to be quite a story. I think it's going to be fascinating. ym Mhantrefi Tia yn India i'r seriau sportio'r mwyaf ddifrifol ar y byd. Rwy'n credu bod heddiw yn mynd i fod yn
[03:46.720 -> 03:52.160] stori. Rwy'n credu ei fod yn ffasinatio ac rwy'n credu bod yw rhywun hwn, ac mae wedi ei ddysgu amdano,
[03:52.160 -> 03:57.440] yn siarad am un o'i sgiliau gwych yw bod yn adnoddwr a gwylwyr, ac rwy'n ddiddorol
[03:57.440 -> 04:03.840] o weithio o gwahanol bydau. Beth yw'r gwylwyr i'w gwylio? Mae'n ddiddorol, gadewch i ni ddod allan ac adael
[04:03.840 -> 04:08.320] i'r tricau, y mhathau, y meddwl a'r credu sydd ar gael i weithio mewn diwydiantau watches for. Interesting, let's find out and let's delve into the tricks, the behaviors, the mindsets and the belief that is required to work in industries
[04:08.320 -> 04:14.720] as diverse as T, IT, wind turbines, all the way to being the CEO and team
[04:14.720 -> 04:19.920] principal of the Mahindra Formula E team. Now how has our guest married personal
[04:19.920 -> 04:24.040] success with inspiring a team, competing on a global sporting stage but at the
[04:24.040 -> 04:28.760] same time keeping human emotion at the heart of his journey. And if you watch coverage of Formula
[04:28.760 -> 04:33.720] E, you will know that this man is very emotional in the back of the garage during every race.
[04:33.720 -> 04:37.920] Welcome to the High Performance Podcast, Dilbag Gill. Nice to have you with us.
[04:37.920 -> 04:39.160] Thanks guys for having me here.
[04:39.160 -> 04:44.000] Let's start with the question we ask all our guests at the very beginning. What is high
[04:44.000 -> 04:51.760] performance? For me I would look at high performance as consistency. Consistency of conviction,
[04:51.760 -> 04:58.080] consistency of belief, consistency of influence, consistency of courage,
[04:58.080 -> 05:03.200] consistency of boldness. So I would say like it's all like if you can be sort of
[05:03.200 -> 05:09.600] really strong on what you're trying to do and do it on a daily basis that for me that's high performance.
[05:09.600 -> 05:14.240] So where did that mindset come from then for you to to not just look for excellence
[05:14.240 -> 05:16.600] but to do it consistently?
[05:16.600 -> 05:22.180] So I go back to one of my earlier jobs and I still
[05:22.180 -> 05:25.120] remember my boss telling me do it right the first time.
[05:25.840 -> 05:28.240] And I think that sort of stuck with me all the time.
[05:28.240 -> 05:33.320] See when I grew up in India, labor was cheap. So therefore rework was cheap.
[05:33.640 -> 05:36.280] So a lot of time we just did a back job and said, okay
[05:36.280 -> 05:38.920] yeah, man, if this job needs to be redone, we'll redo it.
[05:39.080 -> 05:43.760] But this boss man said do it right the first time around and for me, I think that sort of struck a chord.
[05:44.200 -> 05:47.600] Let's try and do stuff. Let's take pride and pleasure in what we do and do it right the first time around and for me I think that sort of struck a chord let's try and do stuff let's take pride and pleasure in what we
[05:47.600 -> 05:51.200] do and do it right. And what was the job that you were doing when you got that
[05:51.200 -> 05:55.240] advice? I was head of marketing of a telecom company at that point of time
[05:55.240 -> 06:00.000] and I don't know what the context was it wasn't directly related to my job he was
[06:00.000 -> 06:03.680] just giving a blanket statement on something but that struck a chord and I
[06:03.680 -> 06:07.800] think yeah that's what like 22 years ago or something like that so it's been pretty
[06:07.800 -> 06:10.720] early in my career when I heard that and it sort of stuck with me. And you were
[06:10.720 -> 06:14.480] born into a family where you grew up on a tea plantation so your dad was already
[06:14.480 -> 06:17.960] a businessman. I know that you went to boarding school at only five years old
[06:17.960 -> 06:21.480] and I did a little bit of research into that and I saw that the motto for the
[06:21.480 -> 06:27.520] school was never give in. So I wonder whether you were getting these kinds of messages
[06:27.520 -> 06:30.200] about trying to achieve a high performance life
[06:30.200 -> 06:32.720] from really quite a young age, were you?
[06:32.720 -> 06:34.600] To be honest, no.
[06:34.600 -> 06:38.180] I think for me, the transformation in my life
[06:38.180 -> 06:40.140] was when I started working.
[06:40.140 -> 06:42.040] I think I was really laid back,
[06:42.040 -> 06:47.280] took life really easily while growing up.
[06:47.280 -> 06:52.440] I was quite lucky because I grew up, I would say, I won't say a privileged life, but in
[06:52.440 -> 06:54.160] a reasonably comfortable life.
[06:54.160 -> 06:56.480] So we did have everything that we needed.
[06:56.480 -> 06:59.720] At the same time, we did not have a lot of stuff which was needed also.
[06:59.720 -> 07:04.560] I grew up in this rural area, so we did not have television, we did not have telephones.
[07:04.560 -> 07:07.960] We had to interact with humans. Because that was the only form of thing.
[07:07.960 -> 07:11.400] The maximum was a radio and the newspaper which used to come up by the
[07:11.400 -> 07:15.640] first bus around 11 o'clock in the morning, the bus came up. So a lot of my
[07:15.640 -> 07:19.960] work was just like walking around the plantation, working with the people out
[07:19.960 -> 07:25.980] there and that industry is very labor intense because tea is very rural very
[07:25.980 -> 07:30.900] labor intense and there was I remember a strike, labor strike at one point in time
[07:30.900 -> 07:34.880] there was some dispute and my dad said we need to get produce from the field to
[07:34.880 -> 07:38.940] the factory someone needs to drive the truck I volunteered at 13 and I said
[07:38.940 -> 07:42.780] that's the best job I could get in my vocation was driving a truck with
[07:42.780 -> 07:46.760] produce but then that also give me a sense of responsibility.
[07:46.760 -> 07:50.200] Because I needed to get stuff from A to B right
[07:50.200 -> 07:53.000] while I was doing something reasonably illegal.
[07:53.000 -> 07:54.680] Because I didn't have a driving license
[07:54.680 -> 07:56.200] and I should not be driving a truck,
[07:56.200 -> 07:58.760] but it was private road, so we could get away with it.
[07:58.760 -> 08:01.880] And I think by now, it's been 35 years,
[08:01.880 -> 08:03.480] I don't think I can get into trouble with that.
[08:03.480 -> 08:04.280] I think you're OK.
[08:04.280 -> 08:07.440] I think you're OK. So that's where I think responsibility sort of came. My dad
[08:07.440 -> 08:11.480] just sort of trusted me. He said you're gonna do this. When you say that the sort
[08:11.480 -> 08:15.280] of the moment came from being in work, what was it that that gave you? What was
[08:15.280 -> 08:19.680] the emotion you got from finally being at work that impacted you more than
[08:19.680 -> 08:22.560] perhaps schoolwork? Because we hear this from a lot of our guests that school
[08:22.560 -> 08:27.160] didn't really resonate with them, they didn't really tune into it it was the world of
[08:27.160 -> 08:31.880] work that opened their eyes to what can be achieved. See while I was a student I
[08:31.880 -> 08:36.280] was an average student I could get by like I knew I could do the minimum to
[08:36.280 -> 08:39.800] get by and I always worked to the minimum. When I started work I realized
[08:39.800 -> 08:45.640] man now it is a world where you have to prove you're not going to be coasting
[08:45.640 -> 08:49.080] any longer. It's not automatic, okay, that this year in seventh grade,
[08:49.080 -> 08:52.200] you're going next year to eighth grade, and then the year after to ninth. If you want to
[08:52.200 -> 08:56.920] move up, you need to start showing some leadership, taking some risk, doing
[08:56.920 -> 09:00.920] something which is different. And I think that's where I really started pushing
[09:00.920 -> 09:05.800] myself. And also at that point I realized that I didn't take too much out of my education.
[09:05.800 -> 09:08.960] So I said, okay, maybe I'll be better as a general person
[09:08.960 -> 09:10.560] like learning different disciplines
[09:10.560 -> 09:12.760] rather than just focusing on trying to be an engineer
[09:12.760 -> 09:15.520] which I'd studied because I was a hopeless engineer.
[09:15.520 -> 09:19.280] So one of the key attributes that I've read
[09:19.280 -> 09:23.200] that you described a lot of your success has been
[09:23.200 -> 09:26.760] one doing it right first time, but another one is questioning everything
[09:27.360 -> 09:34.880] So when did that curiosity then start to ignite to start challenging and questioning and trying to understand?
[09:34.880 -> 09:39.760] I would say this was somewhere when I was like 18 19 years old. I
[09:40.480 -> 09:42.480] went out to university and
[09:43.800 -> 09:46.480] This is the first time I've been to city because I grew up in this
[09:46.480 -> 09:51.520] rural area as I said. My dad sort of said okay this is the money you're gonna have for the first
[09:51.520 -> 09:55.480] year of college. This is the first time I had access to a bank account because they opened a
[09:55.480 -> 10:00.240] bank account at university, deposited money and said okay how much do you estimate so we didn't
[10:00.240 -> 10:05.960] estimate I think that was like X amount of rupees per month. So we said, okay, for the next six months, this is what you need.
[10:05.960 -> 10:06.960] There's the money in the bank.
[10:06.960 -> 10:07.960] Off I go.
[10:07.960 -> 10:09.320] And he went home.
[10:09.320 -> 10:13.300] And this was a city, and this is the city of Bangalore, which is known for its pubs
[10:13.300 -> 10:16.260] in Bangalore, okay, like with the beer, etc.
[10:16.260 -> 10:18.980] So second day in university, we went out to have a drink.
[10:18.980 -> 10:22.640] The third day we went out and then I realized I think in a month and a half that I've spent
[10:22.640 -> 10:24.540] the six months of money already.
[10:24.540 -> 10:26.840] I cannot call up home because we don't have telephones at home,
[10:26.840 -> 10:28.160] so I have to write a letter.
[10:28.160 -> 10:30.640] And at that point in time, I can't be eating food, et
[10:30.640 -> 10:32.960] cetera, because I didn't have any money.
[10:32.960 -> 10:35.160] So that's when I decided that, OK, I need to survive.
[10:35.160 -> 10:38.240] My dad replied to me, he says, too bad.
[10:38.240 -> 10:40.040] You estimated for six months.
[10:40.040 -> 10:41.600] Figure it out yourself.
[10:41.600 -> 10:44.280] So what I decided then was the only way for me to survive
[10:44.280 -> 10:46.160] is to start repairing motorcycles
[10:46.160 -> 10:48.040] in the hostel of the college.
[10:48.040 -> 10:50.120] So I started repairing motorcycles,
[10:50.120 -> 10:51.560] and I started making money there.
[10:51.560 -> 10:53.940] And that's how I got into motorsport to a certain extent.
[10:53.940 -> 10:57.800] I said, OK, I was pretty good at working with my hands.
[10:57.800 -> 11:01.440] So in year one, I started repairing motorcycles.
[11:01.440 -> 11:05.320] And by year two, I hired two people who lived off campus,
[11:05.320 -> 11:07.600] but used to come into the campus during the day
[11:07.600 -> 11:08.600] to strip the bikes down.
[11:08.600 -> 11:10.220] So by the evening when I finished class,
[11:10.220 -> 11:11.100] I could come and work on it.
[11:11.100 -> 11:13.680] So they knew how to wash the bikes.
[11:13.680 -> 11:17.120] So then thereafter, what happened was every evening,
[11:17.120 -> 11:19.640] that became sort of a social point, the garage,
[11:19.640 -> 11:22.360] that corner where we used to repair motorcycles.
[11:22.360 -> 11:26.480] And people used to either pay me with cash, beer or cigarettes.
[11:26.480 -> 11:28.480] So it was like whatever they had, they like this repair.
[11:28.480 -> 11:30.120] You weren't fussy, you'd take it.
[11:30.120 -> 11:31.480] We'd just take it.
[11:31.480 -> 11:34.960] And then I started realizing, okay, we started doing a little bit of racing on a motorcycle.
[11:34.960 -> 11:37.240] I started doing that.
[11:37.240 -> 11:41.560] And I suddenly realized that the college campus, well, like started supporting me.
[11:41.560 -> 11:44.720] They said, okay, this guy is going on trying to do racing, etc.
[11:44.720 -> 11:46.360] So we didn't have much money.
[11:46.360 -> 11:49.080] So someone, and I knew every motorcycle in our college.
[11:49.080 -> 11:51.320] We had like 2,000 motorcycles there.
[11:51.320 -> 11:52.600] This guy had the best tires.
[11:52.600 -> 11:54.440] That guy had the best suspension.
[11:54.440 -> 11:56.640] So we used to borrow parts from everyone.
[11:56.640 -> 11:58.520] And they used to all give it to, OK, yeah, you use it,
[11:58.520 -> 11:59.760] and then bring it back.
[11:59.760 -> 12:02.200] And petrol, also, steel petrol from everyone,
[12:02.200 -> 12:04.520] like from the fill up your tank and go out.
[12:04.520 -> 12:09.160] And I think that's when it sort of came out that if you take something on, there are people
[12:09.160 -> 12:10.780] who are going to support you.
[12:10.780 -> 12:14.480] And I still remember when I finished college, I was earning a princely sum of money.
[12:14.480 -> 12:16.480] Like I did save a lot of money when I finished college.
[12:16.480 -> 12:18.600] I went to dad and said, here, you take your money back.
[12:18.600 -> 12:20.120] I'm giving you my money with interest.
[12:20.120 -> 12:21.880] What was his reaction to that?
[12:21.880 -> 12:24.120] He took it and he said, yeah, son, let's have a drink tonight.
[12:24.120 -> 12:25.120] And he bought it.
[12:25.120 -> 12:26.760] So it was like he was pretty clear.
[12:26.760 -> 12:28.280] He was actually proud of it, I think.
[12:28.280 -> 12:33.520] At the end of the day, he says, OK, he wasn't proud of my score, because I really didn't
[12:33.520 -> 12:35.000] focus too much on my education part of it.
[12:35.000 -> 12:37.200] But he was happy that, OK, I survived.
[12:37.200 -> 12:38.880] I sort of managed on my own.
[12:38.880 -> 12:41.040] I didn't bother him too much on stuff.
[12:41.040 -> 12:46.240] And I still remember, I think, it took me like five years of real working
[12:46.240 -> 12:50.520] to reach sort of the money I was making when I was a student. So when I
[12:50.520 -> 12:54.640] started work it wasn't as much money so I started my first job with cash in
[12:54.640 -> 12:59.440] pocket so it was really nice. But you had to be someone that was willing to forge
[12:59.440 -> 13:04.160] your own path because I think growing up in India Indian families are very very
[13:04.160 -> 13:05.420] keen on an
[13:05.420 -> 13:09.580] education and a strong education and going into your chosen field.
[13:09.580 -> 13:13.220] Whereas it almost feels to me like you'd made that decision at college that of course you
[13:13.220 -> 13:16.180] were going to be at college and you would get the grades.
[13:16.180 -> 13:19.220] But the key for you is the work out outside of that.
[13:19.220 -> 13:22.700] So at this point, do you feel that you'd become an entrepreneur?
[13:22.700 -> 13:27.760] I think yes, I did become an entrepreneur because I knew I'd done my engineering course but I'm not going to
[13:27.760 -> 13:31.600] be a very good engineer so I need to survive and talking about education as
[13:31.600 -> 13:35.320] you rightly say in India we take it really seriously so I have two siblings
[13:35.320 -> 13:39.600] an elder sister and a younger brother so my sister was a doctor I'm an engineer
[13:39.600 -> 13:43.480] and a brother's a lawyer so we sort of did the three tick boxes for my parents
[13:43.480 -> 13:50.480] they were happy. What you've done subsequently is looking at your career fel ymarferwyr. Felly rydyn ni'n gwneud y tri bocsau i fy mhobl ifanc, roeddent yn hapus. Yr hyn rydych chi wedi'i wneud yn ymdrech, yn edrych ar eich gyrfa, yw, er mwyn i chi ddefnyddio'r cyfansodd
[13:50.480 -> 13:57.600] mewn nifer o ffyrdd i'r tradeiddiol, Cymdeithasol, Medi, a Chweithredu,
[13:57.600 -> 14:01.040] mae eich gyrfa er mwynhau wedi bod yn eithaf anhygoel pan edrychwn ni arno,
[14:01.040 -> 14:05.040] y byddwch chi wedi mynd dros ymhellach o ddifrif o ddod o'r tŷ ar y gweithle, when we look at it that you've gone across quite a wide variety from selling
[14:05.040 -> 14:10.360] tea on the internet, working with wind turbines, IT and now into motorsport.
[14:10.360 -> 14:15.680] How do you establish credibility in each of those worlds when you first enter
[14:15.680 -> 14:19.620] them? Oh that's a nice question. I really don't know if I ever looked at
[14:19.620 -> 14:24.000] credibility and think because okay I took an opportunity, I found it exciting
[14:24.000 -> 14:29.320] and said let's go do our best and as you said like I've always changed industry
[14:29.320 -> 14:32.560] and function I went from marketing to manufacturing and stuff like that I
[14:32.560 -> 14:36.640] think I'm reasonably comfortable knowing I don't know what I don't know that in
[14:36.640 -> 14:40.120] itself is a very important mindset because I think a lot of people are not
[14:40.120 -> 14:45.120] brave enough to admit there are things they don't know. Are they? People like to
[14:45.120 -> 14:50.160] pretend they know everything. They think it makes them seem stronger or more powerful.
[14:50.160 -> 14:54.880] I don't know about that. For myself, I'm absolutely sure. I know I'm not the smartest guy in the
[14:54.880 -> 14:58.280] room and I don't want to be the smartest guy in the room. But at the same time, I would
[14:58.280 -> 15:02.560] love to work with like-minded people to get stuff done. So it's for us, whenever I take
[15:02.560 -> 15:05.040] up something, I've never looked at it as a job.
[15:09.680 -> 15:14.800] And maybe that's where this thing comes in. I look at it as a mission. Okay, this is something which I need to do, we have to do. So a lot of stuff which I've done is like jumping into new bits.
[15:14.800 -> 15:19.680] And some of it was like totally new for even our country. And that's what challenged me, I think,
[15:19.680 -> 15:23.520] we were like wind turbines just came to India, let me be one of the first employees for a wind
[15:23.520 -> 15:26.280] turbine company. I think this is going to be something exciting.
[15:26.280 -> 15:28.240] I never looked at it from a sustainability perspective.
[15:28.240 -> 15:29.080] Nothing.
[15:29.080 -> 15:30.640] It was just, it's a new industry.
[15:30.640 -> 15:31.600] No one knows anything.
[15:31.600 -> 15:34.200] It's sort of a flat playing field for all of us.
[15:34.200 -> 15:35.520] Let's go do it.
[15:35.520 -> 15:37.360] Another thing which has struck me is that
[15:37.360 -> 15:39.880] find the purpose the means will follow.
[15:39.880 -> 15:41.800] Like once you know where you're going to,
[15:41.800 -> 15:42.920] things start falling in place
[15:42.920 -> 15:45.000] because I think it's all your focus goes around that.
[15:45.000 -> 15:52.000] So what would you say your purpose was? Because you spoke about this idea of having a powerful drive and a mission. What's yours?
[15:52.000 -> 15:58.000] I think the purpose changes with time. So there's not been like one single purpose like with each thing.
[15:58.000 -> 16:07.040] But I think of recent, which sort of drives me a lot, is I sort of take it to a small extent that I'm carrying India.
[16:07.040 -> 16:10.760] I want to carry India like don't want to embarrass India at different stuff. So you know, I needed
[16:10.760 -> 16:15.080] the World Cup, which was I think, a much more challenging sort of job than what we're doing
[16:15.080 -> 16:20.600] right now at Formula E. I remember growing up watching athletes and we never ever believed
[16:20.600 -> 16:28.920] that we'll ever get out of where we are. And I've always been a fan of human talent. So when you're building teams and you've built teams across all
[16:28.920 -> 16:33.440] kinds of different industries, you've now created a Formula E team who've won
[16:33.440 -> 16:36.800] races in every single season, they've competed in Formula E right from the
[16:36.800 -> 16:42.680] very beginning of the sport. What do you look for in people? What is the talent
[16:42.680 -> 16:45.420] that you want in the teams that are around you? What
[16:45.420 -> 16:48.760] do you think are the key attributes?
[16:48.760 -> 16:53.920] I think first is trying to find out, break down what the problem you're trying to solve.
[16:53.920 -> 16:58.540] And what's the person's commitment to the problem. I mean, I think commitment to something
[16:58.540 -> 17:03.420] is really important. So I'm looking for people to a certain extent who are like me, nine
[17:03.420 -> 17:08.800] to five doesn't exist in our diary. Like we are, if we have to be, we are going to be called together to do
[17:08.800 -> 17:12.680] something on a Saturday morning and work for six straight days, is this person
[17:12.680 -> 17:16.720] going to be? I look at people who are saying if I'm going for a war, who do I
[17:16.720 -> 17:20.600] want to be on my side in the battle? Like who can I depend on? I love that,
[17:20.600 -> 17:24.760] that's something that I've read, is a big message that Sir Alex Ferguson used to
[17:24.760 -> 17:25.840] use at Manchester United, that he used to encourage his players to look on either Rwy'n hoffi hynny. Mae hynny'n rhywbeth rydw i wedi'i ddysgu. Mae'n gweithredu gwaith yma. Mae'n gweithredu gwaith yma. Mae'n gweithredu gwaith yma. Mae'n gweithredu gwaith yma.
[17:25.840 -> 17:26.480] Mae'n gweithredu gwaith yma.
[17:26.480 -> 17:27.680] Mae'n gweithredu gwaith yma.
[17:27.680 -> 17:28.480] Mae'n gweithredu gwaith yma.
[17:28.480 -> 17:29.280] Mae'n gweithredu gwaith yma.
[17:29.280 -> 17:30.080] Mae'n gweithredu gwaith yma.
[17:30.080 -> 17:30.880] Mae'n gweithredu gwaith yma.
[17:30.880 -> 17:31.680] Mae'n gweithredu gwaith yma.
[17:31.680 -> 17:32.480] Mae'n gweithredu gwaith yma.
[17:32.480 -> 17:33.280] Mae'n gweithredu gwaith yma.
[17:33.280 -> 17:34.080] Mae'n gweithredu gwaith yma.
[17:34.080 -> 17:34.880] Mae'n gweithredu gwaith yma.
[17:34.880 -> 17:35.680] Mae'n gweithredu gwaith yma.
[17:35.680 -> 17:36.480] Mae'n gweithredu gwaith yma.
[17:36.480 -> 17:37.280] Mae'n gweithredu gwaith yma.
[17:37.280 -> 17:38.080] Mae'n gweithredu gwaith yma.
[17:38.080 -> 17:38.880] Mae'n gweithredu gwaith yma.
[17:38.880 -> 17:39.680] Mae'n gweithredu gwaith yma.
[17:39.680 -> 17:40.480] Mae'n gweithredu gwaith yma.
[17:40.480 -> 17:41.280] Mae'n gweithredu gwaith yma.
[17:41.280 -> 17:42.080] Mae'n gweithredu gwaith yma.
[17:42.080 -> 17:46.860] Mae'n gweithredu gwaith yma. Mae'n gweithredu gwaith listening to this who are running teams, running businesses and they would love to have people around them who would go to war with them. How do you get the
[17:46.860 -> 17:49.960] right people in the room though? What are the questions you ask or the processes
[17:49.960 -> 17:53.680] that you go through to make sure the people in your team will go to war?
[17:53.680 -> 17:57.440] I'm not sure if it comes out through a question at least. I think now with a
[17:57.440 -> 18:00.720] little bit of experience is instinct. Yeah. You just look at a person, you start
[18:00.720 -> 18:08.160] talking and to be honest, sometimes if you do an interview you sort of make a decision the first 10-15 seconds after that it's
[18:08.160 -> 18:11.280] I think you just trying to validate your own decision which you have made. Sure
[18:11.280 -> 18:15.000] but that intrigues me because you're an engineer by training so you're somebody
[18:15.000 -> 18:20.480] that uses logic and precision so I so it intrigues me that you talk about
[18:20.480 -> 18:27.080] intuition as much as as much as logic in your decisions. But isn't intuition a part of logic?
[18:27.080 -> 18:30.120] Like, with logic, with experience becomes intuition?
[18:30.120 -> 18:31.120] Because like, after some time,
[18:31.120 -> 18:32.960] you experience the same thing again and again,
[18:32.960 -> 18:34.040] it's instinct of that, you know,
[18:34.040 -> 18:35.960] okay, I'm gonna protect myself from this situation because.
[18:35.960 -> 18:38.240] Sure, but I think what Jake's trying to ask is,
[18:38.240 -> 18:41.080] what is it that somebody listening to this
[18:41.080 -> 18:44.040] can tap in and learn from your logic
[18:44.040 -> 18:48.360] that they can use to accelerate their own decision making?
[18:48.360 -> 18:50.240] I think from my side, the first sort of,
[18:50.240 -> 18:52.320] where we sort of break the ice on the first question
[18:52.320 -> 18:54.960] is ask the person to talk about his personal,
[18:54.960 -> 18:56.880] what does he sort of believe,
[18:56.880 -> 18:58.000] and nothing to do with the job,
[18:58.000 -> 18:59.920] nothing to do with that,
[18:59.920 -> 19:01.920] let's take a break the ice question,
[19:01.920 -> 19:04.360] I think that's where you start hearing and learning,
[19:04.360 -> 19:05.960] okay, what sort of drives, tries to drive
[19:05.960 -> 19:07.160] this individual.
[19:07.160 -> 19:11.640] Because yes, for a job on the technical side, a person can read the books and he can come
[19:11.640 -> 19:14.200] in and he can give you all the brilliant answers.
[19:14.200 -> 19:17.680] And I think this also goes back to a little bit to myself, because I was never a good
[19:17.680 -> 19:18.680] student.
[19:18.680 -> 19:21.520] So I was never too sure that if I go for an interview, I'd be able to answer the technical
[19:21.520 -> 19:22.520] stuff.
[19:22.520 -> 19:26.360] So maybe I tried talking about stuff which is not technical and go because I was not very comfortable
[19:26.360 -> 19:30.160] and maybe that's something which I look for in the other individual is okay is
[19:30.160 -> 19:33.880] this person like who then like I said go for war have a beer in the evening with this
[19:33.880 -> 19:37.520] person. What's the first question you'd ask me then if I was applying to
[19:37.520 -> 19:40.600] come and join your team? First question last year is that if you were in my
[19:40.600 -> 19:43.600] position what would you do? So that gives me an idea if the guys thought about the
[19:43.600 -> 19:46.160] company does he feel there's a future of this
[19:46.160 -> 19:49.520] organization, does he have a vision where he should be
[19:49.520 -> 19:54.160] heading to? So I basically say okay you're me, what would you do? And do you
[19:54.160 -> 19:57.680] want the answer to be in line with what you would do or do you
[19:57.680 -> 20:01.280] want them to challenge your thinking? I would like them to challenge my
[20:01.280 -> 20:04.960] thinking because end of the day as you've seen in my
[20:04.960 -> 20:05.440] career I've taken in my career,
[20:05.440 -> 20:06.600] I've taken up new roles.
[20:06.600 -> 20:08.400] I don't know that industry, I don't know the job.
[20:08.400 -> 20:10.240] So I'm looking for people who know a bit more
[20:10.240 -> 20:11.560] to take this forward.
[20:11.560 -> 20:13.520] And many times I'm riding the wave of the people
[20:13.520 -> 20:15.840] who have done the hard work below me, or with me.
[20:15.840 -> 20:16.880] So I think at some point in time,
[20:16.880 -> 20:19.040] I don't know if I've really been lucky all my life,
[20:19.040 -> 20:21.600] that I've had teams who have sort of carried me.
[20:21.600 -> 20:22.760] And many times I do question myself,
[20:22.760 -> 20:25.320] am I a person who should have been the leader?
[20:25.520 -> 20:29.000] I'm very interested that you talk about questioning whether
[20:29.120 -> 20:31.640] you are really a leader or whether you're just lucky. And
[20:31.640 -> 20:34.040] we talk a lot on this podcast about evidence, people
[20:34.040 -> 20:37.720] constantly look for evidence. The evidence is, you haven't
[20:37.720 -> 20:40.960] just been, if you're lucky, you get lucky once, maybe you get
[20:40.960 -> 20:48.240] lucky twice. But you've been relentlessly successful in all kinds of different industries throughout your career, so it can't be
[20:48.240 -> 20:53.480] luck can it? You're being modest, like you can't constantly be successful
[20:53.480 -> 20:57.120] and constantly be lucky, the luck would run out. Again it depends on the
[20:57.120 -> 21:02.160] definition of success right, and for me I think when look at success out here it's
[21:02.160 -> 21:05.180] how do I achieve success in terms of
[21:06.320 -> 21:08.320] uplifting, motivating,
[21:08.400 -> 21:14.080] taking the whole spirit up and about. And I said this goes back again to the roots where we started from of India.
[21:14.080 -> 21:18.100] And that's something to really identify with the company which I work for because our
[21:18.480 -> 21:21.720] tagline is rise and that word means a lot to me.
[21:21.860 -> 21:25.800] How do you achieve that in a team where you have two individual drivers
[21:25.800 -> 21:28.160] looking for their own personal success,
[21:28.160 -> 21:31.440] and then you have a wider team looking for team success,
[21:31.440 -> 21:33.160] and then you having to please your sponsors,
[21:33.160 -> 21:34.520] and you having to work with the media?
[21:34.520 -> 21:37.680] How do you think you create an environment
[21:37.680 -> 21:39.000] to help people rise?
[21:39.000 -> 21:41.760] I think for us, what we've tried to do differently
[21:41.760 -> 21:43.920] is again, we questioned everything on motorsport
[21:43.920 -> 21:44.880] when it came in, okay?
[21:44.880 -> 21:46.540] For us, because we had never done motorsport so
[21:46.540 -> 21:50.340] there was nothing called convention okay this is how it's always been done because
[21:50.340 -> 21:53.800] we didn't I don't know that and when I heard it that actually that statement
[21:53.800 -> 21:58.100] irritated me okay that in person people come and tell you but this is how we
[21:58.100 -> 22:03.860] always do it like no question everything okay the five W's just go through that
[22:03.860 -> 22:07.480] like everything has to be because once you've gone through the five Ws. Just go through that, like everything has to be, because once you've gone through the five Ws, okay,
[22:07.480 -> 22:09.680] you've to a certain extent drilled down to it,
[22:09.680 -> 22:13.040] like so why, what, where, when, who, okay?
[22:13.040 -> 22:15.120] So you sort of go, I don't know whichever order it is in,
[22:15.120 -> 22:16.560] but you go through the five Ws,
[22:16.560 -> 22:20.760] you have drilled it down the problem to the basics, okay?
[22:20.760 -> 22:23.160] And then once you start questioning everything,
[22:23.160 -> 22:24.400] we sort of looked at it slightly differently.
[22:24.400 -> 22:32.480] And I think from our side we realized, okay, we are going to have an organization which is still going to be like a family.
[22:32.480 -> 22:35.440] And that's how Mahindra Racing sort of grown. Like we know each other.
[22:35.440 -> 22:40.080] We are like, okay, so as a team also we need people who are going to work for each other.
[22:40.080 -> 22:43.600] Like, oh yes, each driver when the visor goes down, he's for himself.
[22:43.600 -> 22:46.520] But I think the philosophy in our organization
[22:46.520 -> 22:47.840] is this, for the team.
[22:47.840 -> 22:49.880] And that's how we've had some of our drivers,
[22:49.880 -> 22:51.680] like even when he had Nick Heidfeld and et cetera,
[22:51.680 -> 22:54.840] they really understood what our motivation was
[22:54.840 -> 22:57.520] and started to work towards helping build a team.
[22:57.520 -> 22:59.600] I mean, it's interesting you mentioned Nick there
[22:59.600 -> 23:02.680] because I read some interesting comments on him
[23:02.680 -> 23:04.040] that even after he'd left the team,
[23:04.040 -> 23:11.840] we spoke about how his relationship with you was still one of trust and understanding.
[23:11.840 -> 23:17.000] How do you deal with people that don't demonstrate trust and understanding and buy into this
[23:17.000 -> 23:18.000] family ethos?
[23:18.000 -> 23:21.880] I don't think we would work for too long together.
[23:21.880 -> 23:24.400] And we've had I think one instance of that.
[23:24.400 -> 23:27.040] So I think we've been again again, using the word luck.
[23:27.040 -> 23:30.040] Over six years of this team, large part of the team
[23:30.040 -> 23:32.520] has been together since inception.
[23:32.520 -> 23:35.020] The core group, at least, has been together since inception.
[23:35.020 -> 23:38.440] And we still believe, and we are quite aligned in the direction
[23:38.440 -> 23:39.560] we want to go.
[23:39.560 -> 23:41.840] Nick still helps, advises, for example.
[23:41.840 -> 23:46.040] So he started as an opportunity maybe five
[23:46.040 -> 23:49.920] years ago and he's now become a part of the Mahindra family and this all goes
[23:49.920 -> 23:55.160] back again we were pretty close to doing a sponsorship deal with Sauber in 2008.
[23:55.160 -> 24:00.600] So I was a guest of Sauber at the Sao Paulo Grand Prix. Nick was a driver. I
[24:00.600 -> 24:03.080] met up with him and I think I was the last guy standing in the autograph line
[24:03.080 -> 24:06.840] as a guest or whatever it is. So he had some time to talk to me after it and
[24:06.840 -> 24:09.840] he was really really nice at that point in time I said man this guy is a great
[24:09.840 -> 24:14.720] guy and yeah I think what's five six years later when we had an opportunity
[24:14.720 -> 24:17.600] I said I'm gonna knock on this guy's door it's just that first interaction
[24:17.600 -> 24:22.320] and the way decently he sort of we spent time with me answering my
[24:22.320 -> 24:29.040] questions talking to it so this is a person who I believe will help us grow this team because he has the level of empathy
[24:29.160 -> 24:30.840] He has a technical understanding
[24:30.840 -> 24:31.840] He's a brilliant driver
[24:31.840 -> 24:38.240] But it's not an easy thing to create a family culture in a sport as cutthroat and as competitive as motor racing
[24:39.000 -> 24:42.440] So coming back to Damien's point about people that aren't right for you
[24:42.520 -> 24:45.540] How do you make sure they don't change the culture
[24:45.540 -> 24:47.040] of your organization?
[24:47.040 -> 24:48.600] Do you get rid of them quickly?
[24:48.600 -> 24:50.140] Are you ruthless in that situation?
[24:50.140 -> 24:51.240] I think I am.
[24:51.240 -> 24:53.140] Because at the end of the day, for the greater good,
[24:53.140 -> 24:55.680] see, we have to be, as you said, high performers.
[24:55.680 -> 24:58.700] At the end of the day, averages can pull you down,
[24:58.700 -> 25:01.000] and we have to make sure that, yeah,
[25:01.000 -> 25:03.180] just going by the old analogy that one apple,
[25:03.180 -> 25:05.400] one rotten apple can sort of dirty the basket.
[25:05.400 -> 25:09.080] So we have to take care of that and we take care of it pretty early and soon.
[25:09.080 -> 25:11.240] So I think at that point of time there has to be no compromise.
[25:11.240 -> 25:15.640] Because at the end of the day we are doing something for the greater good and for that
[25:15.640 -> 25:18.440] greater good people need to get aligned.
[25:18.440 -> 25:19.920] They need to believe in where we are getting to.
[25:19.920 -> 25:27.000] At the same time when you talk about belief, I would strongly say that we also encourage disagreement.
[25:27.000 -> 25:28.000] Do you?
[25:28.000 -> 25:31.000] Yes, but at the same time, disagreement but commit.
[25:31.000 -> 25:33.000] That's something which I talk to my leadership team all the time.
[25:33.000 -> 25:39.000] I said, guys, let's agree to disagree, whatever, but once you make a decision, we're going to commit to it.
[25:39.000 -> 25:47.640] That's difficult though, because for me there'd always be a small voice in the back of my head going you didn't want to do this and not wanting failure but kind of wanting to
[25:47.640 -> 25:51.880] be proven right I think would be something that would be on my mind
[25:51.880 -> 25:55.920] I'd be like I told them not to do this now it's gone wrong ha I told you so
[25:55.920 -> 25:57.800] you don't allow that?
[25:57.800 -> 26:00.640] We try not to encourage that and at the same time see the
[26:00.640 -> 26:04.720] group of people which we have who have been together for a reasonable long period
[26:04.720 -> 26:08.880] of time okay none of them are superstars so now I think
[26:08.880 -> 26:12.320] they also believe that okay we can come and make something better than what we
[26:12.320 -> 26:15.720] all sort of came from and I think that belief still continues within the team
[26:15.720 -> 26:19.220] and I think to a large extent what we try and do at our end because being a
[26:19.220 -> 26:22.360] smaller team is throw them in the deep end. No we're not going to let you drown
[26:22.360 -> 26:27.080] water is going to reach your nose you're going to flail for some time but you will not drown. The team is
[26:27.080 -> 26:31.520] going to jump in to save you. So you've used some really fascinating terms there
[26:31.520 -> 26:35.720] that you've spoken about. The culture you create is one of a family. You
[26:35.720 -> 26:40.160] speak about this idea of you look for commitment and yet you're in a world
[26:40.160 -> 26:47.600] where you also require technical excellence. So how do you stop people developing their own fiefdoms
[26:47.600 -> 26:52.000] or this silo mentality where people protect their knowledge
[26:52.000 -> 26:55.360] rather than have this culture of sharing it
[26:55.360 -> 26:59.200] and being prepared to open themselves up to disagreement?
[27:00.200 -> 27:02.320] What are the tips that you'd give to anyone
[27:02.320 -> 27:04.960] listening to this that avoids that?
[27:04.960 -> 27:10.280] I think one area which we try and protect from creating fiefdoms and silos is strong
[27:10.280 -> 27:12.000] communication.
[27:12.000 -> 27:15.480] So we tend to get together and speak on a very regular basis.
[27:15.480 -> 27:19.360] So I would say like what at Mahindra Racing we have a five person management committee.
[27:19.360 -> 27:23.040] So we tend to meet up, if not we speak every day.
[27:23.040 -> 27:25.520] There's at least two formal calls every week, a
[27:25.520 -> 27:28.360] Monday and a Friday, the start of the week and end of the week. So we are
[27:28.360 -> 27:32.200] literally on the same page what everyone is doing and the minutes of our
[27:32.200 -> 27:36.040] conversation is circulated to the entire organization. So what the five of us speak
[27:36.040 -> 27:40.280] is sort of sent out in a document to the entire team later in that morning. So
[27:40.280 -> 27:44.760] people know what's being discussed and we try and keep each person with their
[27:44.760 -> 27:46.240] experience helping the other one around
[27:46.500 -> 27:52.760] Then I think we use some of the traditional methods also of rewards also based on team performance not an individual performance
[27:52.760 -> 27:58.820] So the way the compensation rewards and other HR tools are designed is for team performance
[27:58.820 -> 28:03.500] Even when I look at drivers, a lot of the bonuses are structured around team performance, not individual performance
[28:03.500 -> 28:05.000] And is that different?
[28:05.000 -> 28:09.240] So is that an example of you challenging the convention of motorsport?
[28:09.240 -> 28:13.720] So for the first two years, we had like bonuses for drivers on individual performance.
[28:13.720 -> 28:17.120] And I said, by third year, man, this doesn't make sense.
[28:17.120 -> 28:22.080] Why am I incentivizing this person for his performance?
[28:22.080 -> 28:24.800] Because then we sort of each guy's just sort of going out.
[28:24.800 -> 28:25.280] And if there is a sort of going out and if
[28:25.280 -> 28:29.720] there is a bit of a financial and it's a pretty substantial financial incentive. So it's
[28:29.720 -> 28:33.600] just not a rounding off number. It's a number which makes a difference for them from a thing
[28:33.600 -> 28:37.800] and said no, let's do it for team performance. Not only them, but everyone on the team gets
[28:37.800 -> 28:43.840] where they were the drivers against that initially, do you think? I think since we had two drivers
[28:43.840 -> 28:45.600] at one time time who were
[28:45.600 -> 28:48.400] mature enough to understand the purpose what we're trying to do that is Nick and
[28:48.400 -> 28:51.880] Felix they said man this makes sense and they signed off on to it immediately.
[28:51.880 -> 28:55.800] When I did my first organization chart I had the drivers reporting into me.
[28:55.800 -> 29:01.120] Okay because all of these guys are the stars. By year three the drivers report
[29:01.120 -> 29:04.560] into a team manager so they also realize that they are employees like everyone
[29:04.560 -> 29:06.200] else for the rest of the year.
[29:06.200 -> 29:09.080] They're heroes on the day when they have to perform.
[29:09.080 -> 29:10.840] That's the day when we expect them to do.
[29:10.840 -> 29:13.520] But the rest of the year, in terms of when they need to come in,
[29:13.520 -> 29:16.380] when they have to work on the simulator, do other stuff,
[29:16.380 -> 29:17.960] they actually now report in the team manager.
[29:17.960 -> 29:19.240] When they call up to me and say,
[29:19.240 -> 29:22.500] sorry, you need to speak to David on this, it's not me.
[29:22.500 -> 29:24.440] If you just look at a traditional organization chart and
[29:24.440 -> 29:25.320] look at every level and think,
[29:25.320 -> 29:26.760] okay, that's one level more junior,
[29:26.760 -> 29:28.680] they're like a third in this chart.
[29:28.680 -> 29:30.160] So there's two layers above them
[29:30.160 -> 29:31.320] before they reach out to me.
[29:31.320 -> 29:33.440] And if you're not happy with the performance
[29:33.440 -> 29:35.480] of your drivers, who deals with them then?
[29:35.480 -> 29:36.760] Is that up to the team manager
[29:36.760 -> 29:39.080] or do you step forward in that situation?
[29:39.080 -> 29:42.600] I think we're small enough where each one of us
[29:42.600 -> 29:45.320] makes our displeasure clear at different points.
[29:45.320 -> 29:48.600] And I think each of us can get displeased
[29:48.600 -> 29:50.080] for different reasons.
[29:50.080 -> 29:52.720] As you guys know, I do not control,
[29:52.720 -> 29:54.680] I don't hold back my emotions.
[29:54.680 -> 29:56.400] I do share it at that point of time.
[29:56.400 -> 29:57.800] And there are many times I regret,
[29:57.800 -> 29:59.800] because what you say in anger is the stuff
[29:59.800 -> 30:01.600] you're going to regret sometime later.
[30:01.600 -> 30:04.400] But that's something I feel I needed to get it off my chest,
[30:04.400 -> 30:09.160] and I make it clear, and I sort of take it out. But at the same time, sometimes people I think
[30:09.160 -> 30:13.400] find it difficult to judge me because I'd be angry with you in the morning and by the
[30:13.400 -> 30:18.080] afternoon I'm okay. For me, even when we talk at home with my wife and I always say, let's
[30:18.080 -> 30:21.920] disagree on that point and not carry the fight everywhere else. Like, okay, this is something
[30:21.920 -> 30:25.720] we're going to be fighting on, but the rest of it, we still like each other on or something like that.
[30:25.720 -> 30:28.640] So, like, let's, when you have a disagreement in work,
[30:28.640 -> 30:31.600] also, please try and keep it to that point.
[30:31.600 -> 30:34.920] Let's bifurcate disagree and dislike.
[30:34.920 -> 30:36.760] I think that's a nutshell for successes.
[30:36.760 -> 30:39.160] If you disagree, but you don't need to dislike.
[30:39.160 -> 30:43.200] Sometimes I do realize it might have a much bigger effect on someone else, so
[30:43.200 -> 30:48.040] I do need to start controlling my emotions. But again we go back to our tagline which is
[30:48.040 -> 30:53.120] passioneering. Passioneering comes from the word passion. Passion is an emotion
[30:53.120 -> 30:56.560] it's an unstable emotion.
[30:56.560 -> 31:02.360] As a person with a very deep voice I'm hired all the time for advertising
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[31:53.680 -> 31:57.200] That's linkedin.com slash results. Terms and conditions apply.
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[33:37.120 -> 33:41.880] So that's the drivers. What about the team as a whole? When it's a bad race weekend,
[33:41.880 -> 33:47.040] what's your processes for debriefing and working out what went wrong?
[33:47.760 -> 33:53.360] I think when the blame culture, I don't think we have a blame culture, because at the end of the
[33:53.360 -> 33:58.960] day, we still feel you're learning, we're still improving, we're doing well. So we basically try
[33:58.960 -> 34:04.800] and break it down to go back and look at the fundamentals. Maybe if I find a raw emotion,
[34:04.800 -> 34:07.960] I tend to step away from the briefing.
[34:07.960 -> 34:09.800] I know I'm not going to be contributing anything useful
[34:09.800 -> 34:11.600] at that point of time, it's just going to be raw anger.
[34:11.600 -> 34:12.840] That's interesting,
[34:12.840 -> 34:14.400] because we spoke with Johnny Wilkinson,
[34:14.400 -> 34:15.600] the Rugby World Cup winner,
[34:15.600 -> 34:17.600] and he said, ask yourself in life,
[34:17.600 -> 34:19.280] not does this make me happy or unhappy,
[34:19.280 -> 34:22.600] ask yourself, is this helpful or unhelpful?
[34:22.600 -> 34:23.880] And you've obviously realized
[34:23.880 -> 34:26.260] that it might make you feel better to
[34:26.520 -> 34:30.380] Shout at people, but maybe it's not helpful. It's just noise
[34:30.900 -> 34:37.180] Yes, and I think at some point of time as you rightly say we confuse noise with action and stuff like that
[34:37.180 -> 34:40.000] I'm I'm trust you. I'll stand up. I raise my hands
[34:40.000 -> 34:45.240] I've done a lot of noise and I don't think I'm that's something which I'm going to change but that's that's who I am
[34:45.240 -> 34:46.400] And that's what I believe
[34:46.400 -> 34:48.820] So if you removed the negative emotion
[34:48.820 -> 34:53.520] You would be removing the positive emotion as well because I watched the formula e coverage and I see you in the back of the
[34:53.520 -> 34:57.720] Garage you respond to every moment you're delighted when things go well
[34:57.720 -> 35:04.880] You look devastated when things go badly, but it's important for you. Is it to keep that emotional connection to what you're doing?
[35:04.880 -> 35:07.500] Yes, I think that's what gets you out of the bed in the morning, right?
[35:07.620 -> 35:12.100] If it's like if my heartbeat was like the tolerance was just like two beats up or down
[35:12.860 -> 35:14.580] For me that's close to flat
[35:14.580 -> 35:20.820] It has to have its peaks and spikes and thing and that's where you believe and I think that's something which I've also encouraged folks
[35:20.820 -> 35:22.820] Who come and okay share emotion?
[35:22.980 -> 35:24.020] Do what you have to do
[35:24.020 -> 35:25.360] But then they learn the big picture what we're trying to get, do what you have to do but at the end of the day
[35:30.800 -> 35:38.320] learn the big picture what we're trying to get to. But what techniques have you learned that allow you to experience the emotion and then gain perspective quickly because I can imagine that your team
[35:38.320 -> 35:45.720] needs you to still be farsighted and not make decisions in haste because you're feeling that emotion.
[35:45.720 -> 35:50.560] So how have you learned to flush it and then get back into that logical
[35:50.560 -> 35:54.480] engineering technical mindset that served you so well?
[35:54.480 -> 35:58.920] I think now with having my core team with me for the last couple of years
[35:58.920 -> 36:03.480] they know it's Dilbag being Dilbag. This part of it can be ignored.
[36:03.480 -> 36:06.600] He's having a big moment.
[36:06.600 -> 36:07.880] He needs to vent it out.
[36:07.880 -> 36:09.600] 10 minutes later, he's going to be OK.
[36:09.600 -> 36:11.320] So I think to a certain extent, they've
[36:11.320 -> 36:14.760] also reached a stage where, well, just sort of,
[36:14.760 -> 36:16.600] let me sort of enter, because it's just
[36:16.600 -> 36:17.880] going to get easier after that.
[36:17.880 -> 36:21.200] So I think people also tend to get to know the other person.
[36:21.200 -> 36:24.000] When is a bad moment, when it needs to be stepping in.
[36:24.000 -> 36:28.760] It's not that we've just sort of come together right now, it's been built over a period of time.
[36:28.760 -> 36:31.960] So I think you just recognize the other person where his strengths are, where his weaknesses
[36:31.960 -> 36:33.640] are and then you work around that.
[36:33.640 -> 36:38.860] I've heard about this with some teams where they've had people that sometimes in meetings
[36:38.860 -> 36:43.040] they just let you speak and the rule is that nobody else can respond. You just get to speak
[36:43.040 -> 36:46.080] and you can be emotional, you can be angry, you can
[36:46.840 -> 36:50.040] respond in any way you like, but the rule is that nobody's allowed to interrupt you.
[36:50.120 -> 36:54.440] But equally nobody's allowed to take what you say personally. And then when you've exhausted yourself,
[36:54.440 -> 36:56.800] they then said now what do you want us to do differently with this?
[36:57.120 -> 37:01.840] Is that the kind of approach that you're describing your team take with you?
[37:01.840 -> 37:08.240] They just give you 10 minutes and then you come back and they know that they'll get something, they can action.
[37:08.240 -> 37:12.440] See, a lot of time under this heat of emotion,
[37:12.440 -> 37:14.240] it's not me who needs to make a decision.
[37:14.240 -> 37:17.720] I'm trying to get control of the situation.
[37:17.720 -> 37:20.680] I obviously am not, that's why my emotion is somewhere there
[37:20.680 -> 37:23.000] because I'm not in control at that point in time.
[37:23.000 -> 37:24.720] If there's something which is really out of control,
[37:24.720 -> 37:25.760] means you're not prepared for it. And I think preparation is in control at that point of time. If there's something which is really out of control means you're not prepared for it.
[37:25.760 -> 37:28.640] And I think preparation is where we spend a lot of time.
[37:28.640 -> 37:33.680] That's something that I do want to talk about because in my line of work as a TV presenter,
[37:33.680 -> 37:38.640] if someone doesn't do their job right, we might end up with a bad interview or a bad camera shot,
[37:38.640 -> 37:43.200] or if the worst happens, we fall off the air. In your team, if someone doesn't do their job right,
[37:43.200 -> 37:45.200] it can cost the life of a driver, a team
[37:45.200 -> 37:47.520] member, someone in the crowd that's watching.
[37:48.040 -> 37:53.200] So what processes do you have in place to keep your people fully plugged
[37:53.200 -> 37:57.600] into the fact that you are working in a life and death environment?
[37:57.680 -> 37:59.760] There can be no resting on laurels.
[37:59.760 -> 38:05.000] There can be no approach that is anything other than 100%.
[38:05.440 -> 38:07.680] I mean, we talk about it a lot with motorsport,
[38:07.680 -> 38:10.560] that marginal gains approach to constantly improving.
[38:10.560 -> 38:12.640] I think that again comes back to a work ethic
[38:12.640 -> 38:15.000] that people need to realize that there is their
[38:15.000 -> 38:16.600] responsibilities and I think that's a part also
[38:16.600 -> 38:18.160] where people take pride and again,
[38:18.160 -> 38:19.720] go back to where we started,
[38:19.720 -> 38:21.760] do it right the first time around.
[38:21.760 -> 38:23.240] So I think that message keeps going on.
[38:23.240 -> 38:24.960] And I think this is something which I repeat literally
[38:24.960 -> 38:26.060] every race weekend saying that
[38:26.060 -> 38:30.900] guys as every one of us can we remove one mistake this weekend. We're 20 people
[38:30.900 -> 38:35.060] in the garage if 20 of us can remove one mistake we'll remove 20 mistakes today.
[38:35.060 -> 38:39.580] So that's the constant phrase I think on the Saturday morning I go up and say in
[38:39.580 -> 38:43.220] that like a small little huddle which we have I say let's all try and remove one
[38:43.220 -> 38:46.680] mistake today. Do you address the team before every race weekend?
[38:46.680 -> 38:48.200] Yes, we do have a small huddle
[38:48.200 -> 38:50.040] on Saturday mornings, yeah, five minutes.
[38:50.040 -> 38:52.560] And how much of that is practical thoughts
[38:52.560 -> 38:55.760] about the weekend and how much of that is your emotion?
[38:55.760 -> 38:57.920] I think it's more of, it's literally,
[38:57.920 -> 38:59.600] by now I'm sure people roll their eyes and say,
[38:59.600 -> 39:01.760] oh man, I've heard this 46 times already.
[39:01.760 -> 39:03.240] Okay, so it's basically like,
[39:03.240 -> 39:06.040] I think it's, yeah, today's an opportunity,
[39:06.040 -> 39:07.640] we need to go do this, we need to perform,
[39:07.640 -> 39:09.940] this is what we're trying to do, why we are here,
[39:09.940 -> 39:12.880] or why do we sacrifice so many days of our lives?
[39:12.880 -> 39:14.440] This is for this moment.
[39:14.440 -> 39:15.960] So now let's rise for the moment.
[39:15.960 -> 39:17.520] And I think that's what we try to do,
[39:17.520 -> 39:18.560] just build up the emotion,
[39:18.560 -> 39:19.760] because we know by the time,
[39:19.760 -> 39:21.280] see in motorsport, et cetera,
[39:21.280 -> 39:23.020] the moment you come to the race,
[39:23.020 -> 39:24.800] you're actually at a physical tiredness
[39:24.800 -> 39:29.000] because you've been building it up for the period of time and it's been a long day already
[39:29.000 -> 39:32.660] the race at 4 o'clock you've started at maybe 5 in the morning or something like that preparing
[39:32.660 -> 39:37.120] the cars getting stuff done your practice if you've had a shunt rebuilding it so how
[39:37.120 -> 39:42.000] do you keep people up that's in now is the moment to just build them back up saying okay
[39:42.000 -> 39:44.640] guys we have one hour let's do our best.
[39:44.640 -> 39:48.960] I read that one of your comments about your role was that your job is to deliver three
[39:48.960 -> 39:54.480] three factors for your team, technical skills, financial support, and then the human element of
[39:54.480 -> 39:59.920] it. In your world, what would you say is the most important of those three?
[39:59.920 -> 40:05.440] Well, there's no one. For me, I can take two out of the three. I definitely would say it's human.
[40:05.440 -> 40:09.440] Obviously, the first, there's without any doubt, and there's financial.
[40:09.440 -> 40:11.760] I think, let's be clear, motorsport,
[40:11.760 -> 40:15.360] there's a direct correlation between financial resource and results.
[40:15.360 -> 40:17.480] Does that frustrate you, though?
[40:17.480 -> 40:22.000] Not exactly, because I think the tolerance level in the sport we are in,
[40:22.000 -> 40:25.420] it's not yet making too much of a difference.
[40:25.420 -> 40:30.660] This championship has been reasonably clever to curb certain areas where costs could have
[40:30.660 -> 40:32.420] gone out of control.
[40:32.420 -> 40:36.480] And to a certain extent, I think I would like to say I was one of the people who was able
[40:36.480 -> 40:39.780] to contribute towards that because I was the chairman of the Formula Eateams Association
[40:39.780 -> 40:40.780] in season two.
[40:40.780 -> 40:44.300] I think the biggest contribution which I could have done at that point of time, which I did
[40:44.300 -> 40:47.200] is get everyone to sign up for a common chassis
[40:47.200 -> 40:50.920] in a common battery over three generations. So at that point of time
[40:50.920 -> 40:54.880] itself I realized okay wearing the Mahindra hat and this could go way above
[40:54.880 -> 40:58.160] where we guys will be able to sustain ourselves. So as long as the competition
[40:58.160 -> 41:02.800] can be a thing with our innovation with our agility we still will be reason can
[41:02.800 -> 41:08.600] be successful and that's I think has been proven so we have seen smaller teams in this championship doing really
[41:08.600 -> 41:11.080] well we've seen customer teams in motorsport it's very rare but the
[41:11.080 -> 41:14.600] customer beats the factory team we've seen that happening in our championship
[41:14.600 -> 41:18.120] and I think so that's the good part of it is that when you go into a race
[41:18.120 -> 41:22.600] weekend it literally is a championship and it's not a cliche that all of us go
[41:22.600 -> 41:27.320] on the weekend believing that we can win. So are you an optimist? Do you sit here now ahead of a new
[41:27.320 -> 41:32.840] Formula One season and believe that you can win the championship? Yes sir, I do
[41:32.840 -> 41:37.360] believe it, otherwise I won't be here. So what have you as a family reflected on
[41:37.360 -> 41:41.800] from last season to do better to make sure that this year you do win the
[41:41.800 -> 41:45.560] championship? See there's no silver bullets left in motorsport now.
[41:45.560 -> 41:47.320] Okay, the incremental gains are over.
[41:47.320 -> 41:48.140] First couple of years,
[41:48.140 -> 41:50.520] you could see the silver bullets coming in.
[41:50.520 -> 41:54.040] So it's just going back to every process, every procedure,
[41:54.040 -> 41:56.000] how do we incrementally do it better?
[41:56.000 -> 41:57.680] There are small areas that you've tried to invest
[41:57.680 -> 42:01.280] in the recent past and something which honestly,
[42:01.280 -> 42:04.280] I did not take seriously earlier was mental health.
[42:04.280 -> 42:06.420] I always was a bit dismissive of it.
[42:06.420 -> 42:08.480] I thought it was a weakness.
[42:08.480 -> 42:10.260] And people talked about mental health.
[42:10.260 -> 42:15.500] And now we see okay, in terms of when I say just sports psychology, we send the drivers
[42:15.500 -> 42:19.500] down and each of them are experienced drivers, but I mandated you guys, you are going to
[42:19.500 -> 42:21.600] be spending some time with a sports psychologist.
[42:21.600 -> 42:23.120] It makes a difference.
[42:23.120 -> 42:27.520] And those little bits of change your mind on that because going back 5, 10, 15, 20 years
[42:27.720 -> 42:34.520] It wasn't an uncommon opinion to think that mental health problems were a weakness. What changed that opinion for you?
[42:34.520 -> 42:36.960] I think it was a selfish reason when you could see that
[42:36.960 -> 42:42.340] Okay, that could give me that one small little gain in performance when people have spoken about their experiences
[42:42.480 -> 42:46.320] And this is again something which Nick came to me. Nick said, okay, I was having a bad time
[42:46.320 -> 42:47.360] in some part of his career.
[42:47.360 -> 42:50.120] And I went and spoke to Dr. Dieter Hackforth in Munich.
[42:50.120 -> 42:53.320] I've spent some time with him and says that made a change.
[42:53.320 -> 42:55.920] And he says, I would encourage you to try it.
[42:55.920 -> 42:57.200] So I think it was again,
[42:57.200 -> 43:00.000] trying to look for that every little bit as a difference.
[43:00.000 -> 43:01.360] All of us have a comfort zone.
[43:01.360 -> 43:03.800] And I think we have to get out of it to start performing.
[43:03.800 -> 43:06.640] And because the moment you sit in your comfort zone, you're not progressing.
[43:06.640 -> 43:10.760] That to me is an interesting question about you because looking at the pattern of your
[43:10.760 -> 43:16.840] career that you have broken out of industries and gone into new worlds and then given your
[43:16.840 -> 43:21.680] experience in racing, what's next for you?
[43:21.680 -> 43:22.680] I don't know.
[43:22.680 -> 43:24.040] I really don't know.
[43:24.040 -> 43:26.000] And I've never planned my career forward.
[43:26.000 -> 43:28.920] That's why it sort of zigzags the way it goes.
[43:28.920 -> 43:30.240] And I think that's why I like it.
[43:30.240 -> 43:33.360] The philosophy for me has been maximized today.
[43:33.360 -> 43:35.200] I've loved sitting and having this conversation with you.
[43:35.200 -> 43:36.440] I think it's been so interesting.
[43:36.440 -> 43:38.160] I think you've been so eloquent
[43:38.160 -> 43:41.280] and I've picked up loads of interesting insights.
[43:41.280 -> 43:44.320] There's a couple of things that I just want to mention.
[43:45.280 -> 43:48.200] We spoke at the beginning about how your parents had a very
[43:48.680 -> 43:53.720] Strict idea of how education is the most important thing for you and you have shown that there are
[43:54.120 -> 43:58.000] There is another path for you. So, how are you with your own children? How
[43:58.600 -> 44:05.520] Obsessed are you about their education or are you spending your time encouraging them to just follow a path of emotion,
[44:05.520 -> 44:08.020] which I get the sense is what you've done.
[44:08.020 -> 44:09.120] I'm going to tell you something which I don't think
[44:09.120 -> 44:11.280] I've told anyone yet, okay.
[44:11.280 -> 44:12.240] I don't know what I'm going to do next,
[44:12.240 -> 44:14.380] but I would love to become a teacher.
[44:14.380 -> 44:15.360] Really?
[44:15.360 -> 44:16.660] A middle school teacher,
[44:16.660 -> 44:18.500] because that's something which is a passion for me
[44:18.500 -> 44:20.120] and which I would love to do
[44:20.120 -> 44:21.760] at some point in time in my life.
[44:21.760 -> 44:25.440] Going back to it, for me, I think education is broken.
[44:25.440 -> 44:31.320] Because when we, when I say we, I mean at my age and people, when we went to learn,
[44:31.320 -> 44:34.360] we went to learn answers.
[44:34.360 -> 44:37.160] We memorized answers.
[44:37.160 -> 44:41.520] I think education needs to change to ask questions.
[44:41.520 -> 44:43.440] Because answers are available today.
[44:43.440 -> 44:45.120] It's experiences which can help
[44:45.120 -> 44:49.720] you ask better questions and I keep telling my daughter please ask better
[44:49.720 -> 44:54.240] questions. Learn to ask questions. The answer is available with all the
[44:54.240 -> 44:58.560] tools out there, your internet, your Google's and stuff like that. You have all
[44:58.560 -> 45:02.400] the answers out there in the world. Learn how to ask the question. What would have
[45:02.400 -> 45:05.000] been a better question we could could have asked you that I
[45:07.000 -> 45:08.480] Haven't
[45:09.840 -> 45:11.800] Brilliant I've really enjoyed it. Um
[45:11.800 -> 45:14.760] You you mentioned that in your head you're doing this for India
[45:14.760 -> 45:17.720] I think it's very brave because you could be doing it for India
[45:17.720 -> 45:23.120] But you could do be doing it quietly in a laboratory somewhere away from the glare of the public yet. You very publicly
[45:23.840 -> 45:28.480] Have a team called Mahindra named after a huge Indian company and you're there on the
[45:28.480 -> 45:33.760] television every week fronting up and doing it for India so um congratulations
[45:33.760 -> 45:40.000] for being brave enough to do it. I don't know if it's brave or foolish but there's a fine line out there.
[45:40.000 -> 45:50.400] But in the end I think it's been a great journey in the end and I really need to thank the fans in India, people who supported us, believed in us, sent constant messages of
[45:50.400 -> 45:52.200] support, it's just amazing.
[45:52.200 -> 45:58.520] So we now do a quick fire round where we just ask you some questions and the first one is
[45:58.520 -> 46:02.840] what are the three non-negotiable behaviors that you and the people around you must buy
[46:02.840 -> 46:03.840] into?
[46:03.840 -> 46:08.000] Integrity, I think that's for me the most important thing is integrity.
[46:08.000 -> 46:12.000] The second thing is going back to my saying, do it right the first time around.
[46:12.000 -> 46:16.000] That's really important for me. The third bit is I think just honesty.
[46:16.000 -> 46:19.000] I think those are the three non-negotiable bits for me.
[46:19.000 -> 46:24.000] What advice would you give a teenage dillbag just starting out?
[46:24.000 -> 46:26.660] Don't take yourself so seriously. I think
[46:26.660 -> 46:30.500] sometimes with education we take it so seriously and I hope my daughter's not
[46:30.500 -> 46:35.660] listening to me because that's something different. I think it's like no take the
[46:35.660 -> 46:42.140] experience rather than the content. How important is legacy to you? Legacy is
[46:42.140 -> 46:46.400] very important to me. I think we don't give due respect to
[46:46.400 -> 46:50.800] legacy in our lives and I think especially in today's world and now I'm
[46:50.800 -> 46:55.360] going to be sounding the 50 year old that I am is that our attention spans are
[46:55.360 -> 47:00.840] so short and it is for this instant gratification that if you want something
[47:00.840 -> 47:06.160] we forget legacy, we forget how the like whatever has happened the last
[47:06.160 -> 47:10.080] has helped us get to where we are at this point in time. It could be in sport etc.
[47:10.720 -> 47:13.920] And we cannot forget it and we should not forget it.
[47:13.920 -> 47:19.200] And the final question, what is your one golden rule to living a high performance life?
[47:19.760 -> 47:21.680] For me is my philosophy is maximize today.
[47:22.400 -> 47:25.840] Maximize today, brilliant. We will allow you to leave
[47:25.840 -> 47:28.160] and go and maximize the rest of your day.
[47:28.160 -> 47:29.440] Thank you so much for taking the time.
[47:29.440 -> 47:31.240] I mean, I've picked out lots of little things from that.
[47:31.240 -> 47:34.640] I love your bit about learn to ask questions.
[47:34.640 -> 47:35.680] Don't just learn answers.
[47:35.680 -> 47:38.720] And I think take the experience from life,
[47:38.720 -> 47:39.880] not just the content.
[47:39.880 -> 47:41.080] I think that is a key takeaway.
[47:41.080 -> 47:43.080] Thanks guys for having me over, I really appreciate it.
[47:43.080 -> 47:44.040] And I'm looking forward,
[47:44.040 -> 47:47.680] today's gonna be an exciting day because I'm to be driving a Formula E car later this afternoon.
[47:47.680 -> 47:50.560] Okay? And I'm going to thoroughly embarrass myself.
[47:50.560 -> 47:52.360] No problem. Let's go do it.
[47:52.360 -> 47:53.960] Good luck, Billion. Thanks guys.
[47:53.960 -> 47:55.280] And good luck for the season ahead.
[47:59.560 -> 48:00.160] Damien.
[48:00.160 -> 48:01.000] Jake.
[48:01.000 -> 48:02.320] What a humble man.
[48:02.320 -> 48:04.440] Wasn't he brilliant? Yeah, I loved him.
[48:04.440 -> 48:07.000] I love the bit about education is broken. Jake. Pa mor hyderus. A oedd e'n brill? Ie, roeddwn i'n hoffi. Rwy'n hoffi'r rhan o'r fath bod addysg yn brif.
[48:07.000 -> 48:11.000] Dylunio eich bywyd i ddysgu i gysylltu, nid i ddysgu'n gysylltu.
[48:11.000 -> 48:16.000] Rwy'n credu mai hynny yw dod â'r addysg ar ei hyn a mae'n eithaf gywir, nid oes?
[48:16.000 -> 48:21.000] Ie, yn amlwg. Rwy'n credu ei fod yn cyflawni gyda'i ffilosofi o gwestiynau, pob un.
[48:21.000 -> 48:24.000] Rydyn ni wedi dweud y dda fwyaf ddangosfaol yng nghyfraith iaith Inglis,
[48:24.000 -> 48:45.800] rydyn ni wedi gwneud hynny bob amser. ynglyn â'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'r cyfrifiadau a'n cofio pan ddechreuais fy nghyfro'r swydd fel cyflwynwyr Formula 1 ar gyfer BBC
[48:45.800 -> 48:46.840] ac rwyf ymweld â'r cyfres
[48:46.840 -> 48:48.560] ac roedd yn y bwrdd ym Mhrosodd y BBC
[48:48.560 -> 48:50.800] sydd yn y gynulliad o'r Cynulliad Telefisiaethol Gŵr
[48:50.800 -> 48:53.000] ac rwy'n cofio, roeddwn i'n cael fy nghyfro
[48:53.000 -> 48:53.760] ac roeddwn i'n hir,
[48:53.760 -> 48:54.880] sy'n anhygoel iawn
[48:54.880 -> 48:56.160] oherwydd roedd y cyfres cyntaf
[48:56.160 -> 48:57.040] pan ddechreuais i gyd
[48:57.040 -> 48:59.000] ac roedd yna fel Martin Brundle,
[48:59.000 -> 49:02.000] y gynorthwyr a chyflwyno cyflawni
[49:02.000 -> 49:03.160] ac roedd David Coulthard
[49:03.160 -> 49:11.440] yn cyflawni cyflawni Formula 1 winner Eddie Jordan multiple millionaire my big boss of the BBC program and the editor and loads of other people
[49:12.360 -> 49:16.320] And I hardly spoke because I was so aware that in that company
[49:16.320 -> 49:22.240] I hardly knew anything and I was reminded as I walked in about that old phrase of better to be considered an idiot
[49:22.600 -> 49:26.640] Then open your mouth and have it confirmed. Yeah, I'm gonna be late and gang
[49:27.360 -> 49:29.360] and opening the door to the room and
[49:30.480 -> 49:33.880] The program editor was a good friend of my agent at the time and a few days later
[49:33.880 -> 49:39.520] He rang my agent and said I'm worried about Jake and whether he's right for the Formula One job because he didn't speak in the meeting
[49:40.520 -> 49:42.400] Only now do I think?
[49:42.400 -> 49:45.360] That was such a smart move to just sit there and be quiet
[49:45.360 -> 49:51.120] Yeah a bit like he spoke about today because I was I I didn't without really realizing it
[49:51.120 -> 49:53.480] I think I knew what I didn't know and I didn't know
[49:54.000 -> 49:59.940] Bloody loads. Yeah everything this comes back to we've spoke about this a number of times on the podcast
[49:59.940 -> 50:08.640] Is the Dunning-Kruger law that the Dunning-Kruger law Y Dŵr Dunin-Crugall yw'r peth sy'n mynd i'r holl bobl i'w ddod o'r ffordd y gallwn ni edrych ar ein gwleidyddiaeth ar y telyfysg a'n ni'n dweud, oh,
[50:08.640 -> 50:12.160] rydw i'n gwybod, gallaf wneud mwy o waith nes yna, ac yn ogystal â'r Dŵr Dunin-Crugall,
[50:12.160 -> 50:14.880] mae'n dweud, dydyn ni ddim yn gwybod beth dydyn ni ddim yn gwybod, dydyn ni ddim yn gwybod'r cyfathrebu,
[50:14.880 -> 50:19.040] y cyfathrebu, y triflenni o'r hyn sy'n ceisio ei gysylltu, felly
[50:19.040 -> 50:24.160] gallwn ni, rydym yn ystod yr ymweld â'r ddewis, ar ddechrau, er mwyn i ni
[50:24.160 -> 50:25.000] gydnabod yn y gwaith honno. Dydyn ni ddim yn sylw'n ddewis, oherwydd dydyn ni ddim yn sylw'n ymwneud â'r ddiddorol ar y dechrau o'i gilydd, ynglyn â'r uned rydyn ni'n gweithio yn y byd.
[50:25.000 -> 50:26.200] Dydyn ni ddim yn sylwi eich bod chi'n ddiddorol,
[50:26.200 -> 50:27.960] oherwydd dydyn ni ddim yn sylwi eich bod chi ddim yn gwybod.
[50:27.960 -> 50:28.800] Iawn, yn unig.
[50:28.800 -> 50:30.800] Yn ymdrech i mi, yr unig rydw i'n defnyddio i'w ddangos
[50:30.800 -> 50:34.120] yw os ydych chi'n meddwl o'r cyfnodau cyntaf o gynhalwadau ar TV,
[50:34.120 -> 50:36.560] lle'r peth rydyn ni'n hoffi yw pan ddewch y ddwfwyr
[50:36.560 -> 50:40.480] a dweud rydw i am chi chwarae fel Mariah Carey,
[50:40.480 -> 50:42.600] yna mae'n ddweud fel cawb yn cael ei gysylltu.
[50:42.600 -> 50:44.480] Dyna'n ddiddorol, oherwydd nid ydyn nhw'n gwybod
[50:44.480 -> 50:48.000] pa mor ddifrif ydyn nhw, ond yn unig, nid ydyn nhw'n ddiddorol oherwydd nad ydyn nhw'n gwybod pa mor ddifrif ydynt, ond yn yr un ffordd, nid ydyn nhw'n sylwi pa mor ffyr o ffyr o Mariah Carey ydynt.
[50:48.000 -> 50:53.000] Ac rwy'n credu y byddai'r hyn a ddod o'n i yno yw'r hyder i fynd i unrhyw sefyllfa
[50:53.000 -> 50:58.000] a bod yn ddiogel dydyn nhw ddim yn gwybod, ond yna gofyn cwestiynau i ddysgu
[50:58.000 -> 51:00.000] a chynyddu'r broses yn gyflym.
[51:00.000 -> 51:04.000] Ac rwy'n credu hefyd ei bod yn gwybod ei fod yn ddifrifoedd pan yw'n dod i'r eithaf o emociau,
[51:04.000 -> 51:06.120] oherwydd mae'n rhaid iddo fod yn gwybod ei fod yn ddifrifoedig pan yw'n dod i'r cymorth,
[51:06.120 -> 51:08.520] oherwydd mae'n rhaid iddo dynnu'n fyw.
[51:08.520 -> 51:12.640] Mae'n debyg mai'r cyfnod mwyaf y mae angen eich lywodaethau
[51:12.640 -> 51:13.760] yw pan yw pethau'n mynd yn iawn.
[51:13.760 -> 51:17.040] Ac o'i siarad, mae'n debyg mai dyna'r unig moment y mae'n dod i'w ffwrdd
[51:17.040 -> 51:19.040] oherwydd mae'n gwybod ei fod yn rhaid iddo dynnu'n fyw
[51:19.040 -> 51:21.040] ac mae'r tîm yn deall hynny.
[51:21.040 -> 51:23.840] Rwy'n ymdrech i ymdrechu y byddai hynny'n cymorth
[51:23.840 -> 51:25.000] yn beth da neu'n beth ddifrifol. Ie, eto, byddwn i'n mynd yn ôl a byddwn i'n ymdrechu i fod y cymorth hwnnw'n beth da neu ddau.
[51:25.000 -> 51:30.000] Iawn, i gyd byddwn yn mynd yn ôl a gofyn yr hyn y byddwn yn ei gael ei gynnal yn y cwestiwn Johnnie Wilkinson,
[51:30.000 -> 51:32.000] yw'n hynny'n helpu neu'n ddiddorol?
[51:32.000 -> 51:37.000] Ac rwy'n credu y mae'n ei gydnabod yw bod yn eitha'n ei gael i'w wneud, felly mae'n helpu iddo,
[51:37.000 -> 51:40.000] ond nid yn helpu i'w tîm, felly mae gennym gynllun mewn le
[51:40.000 -> 51:43.000] nad ydyn nhw'n ymddangos arnoddau yn y momentau hynny.
[51:43.000 -> 51:45.640] Mae'n hoff iawn. Diolch am eich am stuff. Thanks for your time. Oh brilliant. Thank you
[51:50.280 -> 51:55.880] Well, Damien it was great to sit down and have that conversation with deal back and I think people are gonna really get a lot
[51:55.880 -> 52:00.060] From that conversation because he's someone who he's a bit of a comedian in many ways
[52:00.060 -> 52:02.640] He kind of has moved around done all kinds of different things
[52:02.720 -> 52:05.840] but done all of them with passion at the very center of it and Mae wedi mynd o gwmpas, wedi gwneud pob math o bethau gwahanol, ond wedi gwneud pob un ohonyn nhw gyda phassion ar y pen draw.
[52:05.840 -> 52:13.920] Ac yn aml, rydyn ni'n siarad â phobl pan maen nhw'n gofyn i ni am sut y gallant gael mwy o hapus, sut y gallant teimlo'r llwyr, sut y gallant fod yn llwyr.
[52:13.920 -> 52:17.840] Mae ddod o hyd i beth y byddwch chi'n fwythfawros amdano, yn debyg, yn ymdrech i fod yn ymateb dda, does dim?
[52:17.840 -> 52:27.440] Mewn gwirionedd, rwy'n credu y byddai Dilbadd yn gyffredin iawn o'r pwer un o'r cyfleoedd gwych oedd y pŵer o'r hymdrech, gwybod, ymdrech, os ydym yn meddwl amdano yn trwy stage, jake,
[52:27.440 -> 52:30.960] y stage gyntaf, rhaid i ni ddod o'r stage peakeidio, rhaid i ni ddod o'r stage
[52:30.960 -> 52:33.760] yr hyn rydyn ni ddim yn gwybod ac dod o'r stage hwnnw ac rydyn ni'n mynd i'r
[52:33.760 -> 52:37.920] ddewis o hymdrech lle rydyn ni'n ddiddorol, rydyn ni'n gofyn cwestiynau, rydyn ni'n ceisio
[52:37.920 -> 52:41.120] ymdrechu'r crafft a sut mae'n gweithio cyn i ni
[52:41.120 -> 52:44.080] arrifio ar y stage tri, sy'n ymdrech i'r gwybodaeth, ac
[52:44.080 -> 52:47.520] rwy'n credu bod dillbagd yn rhywun sydd wedi mynd i'r Ffyrdd o Hymologaeth
[52:47.520 -> 52:51.120] mewn mwy o weithdai, oherwydd y bydd hyn yn y computerau,
[52:51.120 -> 52:53.360] oherwydd y bydd hyn yn y formula E.
[52:53.360 -> 52:55.920] Mae'n fyfyrdd sy'n dod i gyd i gyd i gyd,
[52:55.920 -> 52:58.240] trwy gofyn deall,
[52:58.240 -> 52:59.160] gofyn cwestiynau,
[52:59.160 -> 53:00.640] bod yn agor.
[53:00.640 -> 53:03.400] Ac rwy'n credu ei fod yn gyflawniad perffaith o hynny,
[53:03.400 -> 53:05.280] er mwyn i ni gysylltu â'i gilydd. Felly rwy'n ei ystyried fel trwydd. Rwy'n hoffi'r cyfrifiad, ac rwy'n gobeithio y byddwch chi'n ei wneud y tu hwn hefyd. And I think he was a perfect example of that, even when we sat down with him.
[53:05.280 -> 53:07.320] So I regarded it as a real tree.
[53:07.320 -> 53:08.320] I loved it.
[53:08.320 -> 53:09.560] And I hope you do at home as well.
[53:09.560 -> 53:11.340] We would love actually to know what you think of it.
[53:11.340 -> 53:15.920] So while you're listening to this, please feel free to hop onto wherever you get your
[53:15.920 -> 53:19.140] podcasts and rate and review the pod.
[53:19.140 -> 53:22.200] Just let us know what you thought of the conversation that we had with Dillbag.
[53:22.200 -> 53:24.480] I thought he was a really inspiring guy.
[53:24.480 -> 53:29.360] Thanks to you for downloading, supporting and listening. Check us out at High Performance
[53:29.360 -> 53:50.000] on Instagram and we'll see you very soon for another episode of the High Performance Podcast. Bye!