E127 - Dame Kelly Holmes (Re-Release): Be kind - everyone is fighting a battle you know nothing about.

In the week that Olympic champion Dame Kelly Holmes has bravely revealed she is gay, Jake & Damian revisit the conversation we recorded with Kelly before our podcast journey had even begun, and at a time Kelly has now admitted she was in a very tough place.

Her story of Olympic golds, doubt, depression, self-harm, and injury is one you need to hear and is just remarkable.

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# High Performance Podcast Episode Summary

### Episode Title: ### "The Girl with No Name: Dame Kelly Holmes' Journey to Olympic Gold"

### Key Points: ###

* **Identity and Belonging:** Dame Kelly Holmes, a double Olympic gold medalist and former British military officer, discusses the challenges she faced growing up as a mixed-race child in a predominantly white environment. She emphasizes the importance of finding an identity and a sense of belonging, which she eventually found through sports.


* **Overcoming Adversity:** Holmes shares her experiences of being bullied and feeling like an outsider during her school years. She highlights the significance of resilience and determination in overcoming adversity, and how these qualities helped her to persevere and achieve success.


* **The Power of Sports:** Holmes credits sports for giving her a sense of purpose and direction in life. She explains how running and athletics provided her with an outlet to channel her energy and focus, and how it ultimately led her to Olympic glory.


* **The Role of Mentors:** Holmes acknowledges the role of mentors and positive influences in her life, particularly her PE teacher who recognized her talent and encouraged her to pursue running seriously. She emphasizes the importance of having someone who believes in you and supports your dreams.


* **Mental Toughness and Self-Belief:** Holmes discusses the mental toughness and self-belief required to succeed at the highest level in sports. She emphasizes the need to stay focused, to believe in oneself, and to never give up, even in the face of setbacks and challenges.


* **The Importance of Hard Work and Dedication:** Holmes stresses the importance of hard work and dedication in achieving success. She shares her rigorous training regimen and the sacrifices she made to pursue her Olympic dreams, highlighting the importance of perseverance and commitment.


* **Legacy and Inspiration:** Holmes reflects on her legacy and the impact she hopes to have on future generations. She expresses her desire to inspire young people, particularly those from underrepresented backgrounds, to pursue their passions and to never let obstacles stand in their way.

### Conclusion: ###

Dame Kelly Holmes' journey to Olympic gold is a testament to the power of resilience, determination, and self-belief. Her story serves as an inspiration to all, demonstrating that with hard work, dedication, and the support of positive influences, it is possible to overcome adversity and achieve great things.

# Podcast Episode Summary: Olympic Champion Dame Kelly Holmes Reveals Her Journey of Triumphs, Setbacks, and Mental Health Struggles

---

### Introduction:

- The podcast episode features an interview with Olympic champion Dame Kelly Holmes, recorded before she publicly disclosed her struggles with mental health.
- Holmes' story of Olympic golds, doubt, depression, self-harm, and injury is remarkable and serves as an inspiration to listeners.

### Overcoming Obstacles:

- Despite facing numerous injuries and setbacks throughout her career, Holmes remained driven and focused on achieving her Olympic dream.
- She developed a scientific approach to her training, keeping detailed notes of her workouts and emotions.

### Breaking Down:

- In 2003, Holmes experienced a severe breakdown due to the cumulative stress of injuries, high expectations, and the pressure to succeed.
- She engaged in self-harm and contemplated suicide, feeling like she was cursed and unable to cope with the demands of her sport.

### Turning Point:

- Holmes credits her inner resolve and belief in fate for helping her overcome her breakdown.
- She recognized that she still had a dream to achieve and that she needed to push through the pain and challenges.
- Holmes sought professional help and began to address her mental health issues.

### Importance of Responsibility:

- Holmes emphasizes the significance of taking responsibility for one's actions and not blaming others for setbacks.
- She believes that finding a mindset of responsibility, even in the face of adversity, is crucial for personal growth and success.

### Mentoring Program:

- In 2004, Holmes established a mentoring program called "On Cam with Kelly" to help young athletes navigate the challenges of high-performance sports.
- The program focused on developing not only athletic skills but also mental resilience and the ability to handle setbacks.

### The Importance of Balance:

- Holmes stresses the need for balance in life, highlighting that high performers must learn to manage the emotional rollercoaster of their sport.
- She encourages athletes to find positives amidst negatives and to recognize that setbacks are often opportunities for growth.

### Lessons Learned:

- Holmes emphasizes the importance of trusting oneself and believing in one's ability to overcome challenges.
- She encourages athletes to focus on the process rather than the outcome and to appreciate the journey.
- Holmes believes that true success comes from within and is not solely defined by medals or achievements.

### Conclusion:

- The podcast episode offers valuable insights into the mental and emotional challenges faced by high-performance athletes.
- Holmes' story serves as a reminder of the importance of resilience, self-belief, and seeking support when needed.
- The episode highlights the need for a more open and supportive environment in sports, where athletes can prioritize their mental health without fear of stigma.

# Dame Kelly Holmes' Journey: From Olympic Golds to Self-Discovery

In a compelling conversation, Olympic champion Dame Kelly Holmes openly shares her remarkable story of triumph, adversity, and self-discovery.

## Olympic Achievements and Personal Struggles
Dame Kelly Holmes, known for her remarkable Olympic gold medal victories, reveals the challenges she faced beyond the spotlight. She candidly discusses her battles with depression, self-harm, and the profound impact of losing her mother.

## The Power of Authenticity
Holmes emphasizes the importance of authenticity and being true to oneself. She highlights the transformative moment when she decided to embrace her identity and express her personality openly, even if it meant deviating from societal norms.

## Mindset and Mental Strength
Holmes underscores the significance of mental strength and resilience in achieving high performance. She believes that only 20% of success is attributed to physical ability, while the remaining 80% is determined by mental fortitude and the right approach to life.

## Legacy and Impact
Holmes reflects on the concept of legacy and emphasizes the importance of creating a lasting impact through meaningful contributions. She believes that legacy is not merely about achieving recognition but about leaving a positive mark on the world.

## Advice for Aspiring Athletes and Individuals
Holmes offers valuable advice to young athletes and individuals seeking to live a high-performance life. She stresses the importance of self-belief and perseverance, emphasizing that challenges and setbacks are inevitable but should be embraced as opportunities for growth and resilience.

## Key Takeaways
- Authenticity and self-acceptance are crucial for personal fulfillment and success.
- Mental strength and the right mindset are fundamental to achieving high performance in all aspects of life.
- Legacy is not about seeking recognition but about creating a positive impact and leaving a lasting mark on the world.
- Challenges and setbacks are inevitable, but they should be embraced as opportunities for growth and resilience.
- Self-belief and perseverance are essential for overcoming obstacles and achieving success.

[00:00.000 -> 00:03.200] Hi there, I'm Jay Comfrey and you're listening to High Performance.
[00:03.200 -> 00:06.240] This is our gift to you for free every single week.
[00:06.240 -> 00:09.360] It's the podcast that reminds you that it's within.
[00:09.360 -> 00:12.880] Your ambition, your purpose, your story, it's within.
[00:13.520 -> 00:18.560] However, sometimes your truth and your story remains within
[00:18.560 -> 00:21.440] because it's too hard to let it out.
[00:22.000 -> 00:27.580] And this episode is in celebration of the fact that Dame Kelly Holmes has
[00:28.080 -> 00:34.900] Finally come out as being gay and I think that the reason why we wanted to re-release this episode today was just to continue the conversation
[00:35.760 -> 00:41.160] About the fact that to overcome a stigma can take decades
[00:41.160 -> 00:45.780] It can come as Kelly's admitted at a huge personal cost in her words. She
[00:45.780 -> 00:50.640] said finally I can breathe. So we'll share the episode with you in just a couple of moments,
[00:50.640 -> 00:55.940] but myself and Professor Damien Hughes, an expert in high performing team cultures. We
[00:55.940 -> 00:59.420] just wanted to have a quick chat before we play you what Kelly shared with us. And actually
[00:59.420 -> 01:03.140] Damien it was it was right at the start of our high performance journey. It was only
[01:03.140 -> 01:06.880] episode 10 when we sat down and spoke with Dame Kelly Holmes.
[01:06.880 -> 01:10.220] What did you feel and think when you saw the news?
[01:10.220 -> 01:12.280] I was delighted that she finally felt
[01:12.280 -> 01:14.160] that she was in a position
[01:14.160 -> 01:17.980] and that society was also meeting her in that same position
[01:17.980 -> 01:22.020] where she felt she could be truly herself and be authentic.
[01:22.020 -> 01:24.800] I think all our high performers talk about this value
[01:24.800 -> 01:30.680] of acting with integrity and the importance of authenticity so for Kelly to finally
[01:30.680 -> 01:34.920] be in a position to feel that she can do that and be honest is really heartening
[01:34.920 -> 01:38.760] and encouraging and to be quite frank I'm delighted for her.
[01:38.760 -> 01:43.240] I think I had mixed emotions on her behalf really because part of me is
[01:43.240 -> 01:49.800] delighted at the moment that you know Dame Kelly feels that now is the time that she can come out and she will be accepted for that
[01:49.800 -> 01:57.440] Obviously, we've just seen Jake Daniels come out as a gay footballer playing in English football Craig Napier and Lloyd Wilson who are
[01:57.920 -> 02:02.680] Referees in Scotland. They've also come out as gay Josh Cavallo as well
[02:03.040 -> 02:07.840] But then I saw the quote from her saying that she's lived with fear for 34 years
[02:07.840 -> 02:11.100] She said I'm exhausted didn't she and I don't want to hide it anymore
[02:11.100 -> 02:18.800] and I I suppose it's amazing and brilliant for her and I'm so so pleased and the the I'm sure the relief is incredible, but
[02:19.760 -> 02:25.120] 34 years of as in her words, you, living with fear and finding it debilitating.
[02:25.120 -> 02:29.160] It's so sad in so many ways and I guess that it's a reminder for the listeners
[02:29.160 -> 02:33.120] of high performance and it's a really strong and important reminder that you
[02:33.120 -> 02:37.160] can have all the outside perceived success. You know Dame Kelly has won two
[02:37.160 -> 02:41.400] Olympic gold medals but all of that outside success is never going to move
[02:41.400 -> 02:48.880] you closer to inner peace. We repeat this message over and over again don't we on the podcast and I think it's easy for people to dismiss it or just say oh, it's a cliche
[02:48.880 -> 02:55.300] You know to be at ease with yourself, but this is the perfect example of why it is so important
[02:55.360 -> 02:55.860] Yep
[02:55.860 -> 03:00.880] And it's a great example of that great of that quote that we've used numerous times in our interviews Jacob
[03:00.880 -> 03:07.280] I'll be kind because everyone's fighting a battle that you know nothing about and I think yn ein cyfrifiadau, Jacob, yw, gwrthdodd eich bobl, oherwydd mae pawb yn rhaggau ymgyrch a ddywedodd eich bod chi ddim yn gwybod amdanyn nhw. Ac rwy'n credu, fel pan ddweudom Kelly,
[03:07.280 -> 03:10.240] na fyddwn ni wedi cael clywed ei bod hi'n byw gyda'r ystyr o ffyrdd
[03:10.240 -> 03:14.600] o rywun yn ei ffyrdd neu'n sôn am ei gynhyrchu.
[03:14.600 -> 03:17.120] Y gwybodaeth hwnnw hefyd yn eich gofyn i mi o'r cwodl ffamos
[03:17.120 -> 03:19.360] o'r dofr Daniel Eamon sy'n siarad am,
[03:19.360 -> 03:21.840] ar 18, dydyn ni ddim yn gwneud llawer o bethau oherwydd
[03:21.840 -> 03:23.800] rydyn ni'n berygion yr hyn y mae pobl eraill yn meddwl amdano.
[03:23.800 -> 03:27.960] Pan ddod i 40, rydyn ni'n stopio ei go gobeithio beth mae pobl eraill yn meddwl amdano. Pan ddewis i 40, ddewis i stopio gofio beth mae pobl eraill yn meddwl amdano.
[03:27.960 -> 03:32.560] Ac mae'n unig pan ddewis i 60, rydyn ni'n sylwi nad oedd nobl yn meddwl o'n i'n ffyrdd.
[03:32.560 -> 03:38.200] Ac rydw i'n glir iawn bod Kelly wedi dod i'r lle o sylwi bod ddim yn rhaid i hi gofio beth mae pobl eraill yn meddwl amdano.
[03:38.200 -> 03:49.560] Mae'n rhaid i hi gofio beth mae'r rhai o'n i mewn ei gyrfa yn ei gilydd yn meddwl ac yn sicrhau bod eu cynnyrch yn bwysig. those in their own inner circle think and make sure that they matter. It's still a reminder though isn't it that all of us need to do more to work together
[03:49.560 -> 03:55.920] to fight any stigma for LGBTQ plus people, particularly in sport, and create a world
[03:55.920 -> 03:59.940] where they feel they can be themselves. Because I think at the moment, yes, you know, we've
[03:59.940 -> 04:05.500] seen Jake Daniels, we've seen aeld ychydig o bobl sy'n ymweld â'r sport profesiynol i ddod allan fel gyn-dyn,
[04:05.500 -> 04:13.500] ond mae llawer o bobl, o gwmpas neidio, heddiw, sy'n byw gyda'r un ffyrdd y bydd Dame Kelly Holmes wedi byw gyda nhw i 34 mlynedd.
[04:13.500 -> 04:26.000] Ie, rwy'n gofyn o'r arbenigwyr arbenigwyr, Arthur Schopenhauer, y ffilosofa Gymraeg, a ddwe cyfnod cyntaf yn newid, Jake. Mae'n dweud y byddai'r cyfnod cyntaf yn newid, Jake. Mae'n dweud y byddai'r cyfnod cyntaf yn newid, Jake. Y cyfnod cyntaf pan fydd newid yn digwydd, mae'r bobl yn
[04:26.000 -> 04:28.000] yn dweud, oh, mae'n ddiddorol,
[04:28.000 -> 04:30.000] dyna fyddai'n ddigwydd.
[04:30.000 -> 04:32.000] Y cyfnod cyntaf yw'r cyfnod o gyfrifol fwyaf
[04:32.000 -> 04:34.000] ac yna'r cyfnod cyntaf y gallwch chi
[04:34.000 -> 04:36.000] yw'r cyfnod cyntaf y gallwch chi
[04:36.000 -> 04:38.000] yw'r cyfnod cyntaf y gallwch chi
[04:38.000 -> 04:40.000] yw'r cyfnod cyntaf y gallwch chi
[04:40.000 -> 04:42.000] yw'r cyfnod cyntaf y gallwch chi
[04:42.000 -> 04:44.000] yw'r cyfnod cyntaf y gallwch chi
[04:44.000 -> 04:46.000] yw'r cyfnod cyntaf y gallwch chi yw'r cyimlo ein bod ni'n dod i'r stage 3 o'r stages o newid a'r
[04:46.000 -> 04:48.000] stageau o'r gweithdai, lle mae pobl yn cymryd
[04:48.000 -> 04:49.000] y cyfathrebu fel cyfathrebu.
[04:49.000 -> 04:51.000] Pa mor ddiddorol y byddwch chi'n teimlo
[04:51.000 -> 04:52.000] eich bod yn gallu dod allan a bod yn eich
[04:52.000 -> 04:54.000] eich eich eich hunain?
[04:54.000 -> 04:55.000] Ac rydych chi'n gwybod, mae Kelly wedi bod yn
[04:55.000 -> 04:57.000] pioner mewn nifer o ffyrdd gwahanol
[04:57.000 -> 04:58.000] i'r
[04:58.000 -> 04:59.000] i'r
[04:59.000 -> 05:00.000] i'r
[05:00.000 -> 05:01.000] i'r
[05:01.000 -> 05:02.000] i'r
[05:02.000 -> 05:03.000] y y
[05:02.000 -> 05:03.000] y
[05:03.000 -> 05:04.000] y
[05:04.000 -> 05:05.200] y y y y y y y y into athletics and the path that she's forged in her post-athletics career for
[05:05.200 -> 05:10.480] young athletes to go and achieve similar heights and I just hope that she again
[05:10.480 -> 05:14.600] can be a pioneer for people that may be in a similar position coming to terms
[05:14.600 -> 05:19.120] with their sexuality that feel they can just talk so freely and openly about it
[05:19.120 -> 05:24.000] without being judged. Right, should we play the episode Damien? Yeah this
[05:24.000 -> 05:25.000] is a few years old now, but I loved it.
[05:25.000 -> 05:29.000] I thought it was a real privilege to be in her company and hear her story
[05:29.000 -> 05:32.000] and I hope that people enjoy listening to it again.
[05:32.000 -> 05:36.000] Okay, well this was recorded in central London,
[05:36.000 -> 05:40.000] actually before we'd released a single episode of the High Performance Podcast.
[05:40.000 -> 05:42.000] So really when we recorded this with Dame Kelly,
[05:42.000 -> 05:44.000] this whole thing was something of an experiment really
[05:44.000 -> 05:46.880] and the conversation we had you
[05:46.880 -> 05:48.880] I know you are going to love
[05:50.400 -> 05:55.400] It's continued with a bit of sadness for me and Damien because in in the last couple of days Dame Kelly has come out and
[05:55.400 -> 05:57.500] Said, you know 2020 was the hardest year for her
[05:57.500 -> 06:03.000] You know, she went into a very dark and difficult place and important thing now is that Dame Kelly has come out
[06:03.200 -> 06:05.480] she's told the world the struggles
[06:05.480 -> 06:10.160] that she's had and let's hope that it's a positive and uplifting experience for her
[06:10.160 -> 06:13.120] from here on in because I'll tell you what, she absolutely deserves it.
[06:13.120 -> 06:22.160] Right, here we go then, this is Dame Kelly Holmes on the High Performance Podcast.
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[09:04.040 -> 09:08.360] you're listening to High Performance, the podcast that delves into the minds of
[09:08.360 -> 09:12.960] some of the most successful athletes, visionaries, entrepreneurs and artists on
[09:12.960 -> 09:16.800] the planet and aims to unlock the very secrets to their success. And look, you
[09:16.800 -> 09:19.920] can't do a job like this alone, thankfully. Damien Hughes, professor and
[09:19.920 -> 09:23.600] expert in the field of high-performing teams and cultures, is alongside me once
[09:23.600 -> 09:26.560] again. Yet today, professor, Professor,
[09:26.560 -> 09:28.640] nid ydym yn siarad am rhywun sy'n cymryd cymdeithas
[09:28.640 -> 09:30.720] yn y tîm, ond ydym yn siarad am rhywun
[09:30.720 -> 09:33.040] sydd, yn eithaf cynnydd,
[09:33.040 -> 09:34.240] yn eu bywydau,
[09:34.240 -> 09:35.520] fel glori unigol.
[09:35.520 -> 09:37.200] Mae'r person hwn yn ffasafol.
[09:37.200 -> 09:38.320] Pan dweud i fy mam,
[09:38.320 -> 09:40.480] a gyda ni'n gwrthod y diwrnod hwn,
[09:40.480 -> 09:41.680] roedd hwn yn y mwyaf hyderus.
[09:41.680 -> 09:43.120] Mae wedi bod yn ein gwestiwn o'r holl fath,
[09:43.120 -> 09:44.080] oherwydd
[09:44.080 -> 09:49.280] mae'n ddiddorol iawn o'r person hwn am ei gynnydd a'i gyflawni, this was the most excited she's been of all our guests because she really admires this person for both her strength and resilience but also for her
[09:49.280 -> 09:55.000] humility and just a quiet dignity so I'm really looking forward to exploring a
[09:55.000 -> 09:58.740] little bit more. Let's do it then let's dive into a conversation about living a
[09:58.740 -> 10:03.300] high-performance life with someone who suddenly is blushing. She conquered the
[10:03.300 -> 10:05.120] world from the British military to
[10:05.120 -> 10:08.640] the British Olympic team. Today's guest though didn't stop at Double Olympic
[10:08.640 -> 10:13.040] glory. She went on to form foundations, to take part in TV shows, to write books, to
[10:13.040 -> 10:17.440] become a Dame, to return to the military roots and so much more. So what has she
[10:17.440 -> 10:21.960] learned along the way and even if you can't run fast how can her high
[10:21.960 -> 10:26.640] performance life inspire you? Welcome to the podcast Dame Kelly Holmes.
[10:26.640 -> 10:27.600] Thank you.
[10:27.600 -> 10:28.400] Nice to see you.
[10:28.400 -> 10:29.200] Look at that intro.
[10:29.200 -> 10:29.840] There you go.
[10:29.840 -> 10:30.800] Where do we go from there?
[10:30.800 -> 10:32.080] That's it done.
[10:32.080 -> 10:34.000] It's Colonel Dame, isn't it?
[10:34.000 -> 10:35.040] Colonel now, yes.
[10:35.040 -> 10:35.680] Wow.
[10:35.680 -> 10:41.120] Colonel with the Royal Armoured Corps, which is really nice because you realize how, so I was in
[10:41.120 -> 10:45.920] the military for 10 years and then I continued my athletics
[10:45.920 -> 10:49.680] career and then obviously been out for a while but you realize I look back now and
[10:49.680 -> 10:53.880] realize the values that I had from the army still instilled through my other
[10:53.880 -> 10:58.360] role so you know about courage and discipline and respect and selfless
[10:58.360 -> 11:01.800] commitment all those things are very much what I probably up here to with
[11:01.800 -> 11:07.280] everything I do. Why did you feel the need to join the army at 18? What was the thinking behind that?
[11:07.280 -> 11:13.480] Well I was not academic at all at school, at all, and so you know being in
[11:13.480 -> 11:19.440] a classroom, getting exams, that didn't happen. And what happened was is I had a
[11:19.440 -> 11:23.360] careers officers came basically and they showed us like the army, navy and the
[11:23.360 -> 11:27.360] air force. I wasn't inspired by the Air Force because of you know it showed the
[11:27.360 -> 11:31.160] administration side. I couldn't swim when I was 14 so ships at sea was not going
[11:31.160 -> 11:34.080] to happen and then I saw these soldiers and they were just all they were doing
[11:34.080 -> 11:37.160] is screaming and shouting at all the other soldiers literally going underneath
[11:37.160 -> 11:40.520] the scramble net and over the 12 foot wall and I was like oh my god and it
[11:40.520 -> 11:46.000] felt like a sense of if I could get into the army I proved I could be someone and Ac roedd yn teimlo fel ystod... os oeddwn i'n gallu mynd i'r army, roeddwn i'n darparu bod yn rhywun.
[11:46.000 -> 11:48.000] Ac os oeddwn i'n gallu mynd i'r army,
[11:48.000 -> 11:50.000] roeddwn i'n mynd i'r army o ran disyplyn a chymorth gyda'r gwaith.
[11:50.000 -> 11:52.000] Roeddwn i'n teimlo fel y byddwn i o'n angen
[11:52.000 -> 11:54.000] y strwythur hwnnw, yn ystod fy mod i'n dyn.
[11:54.000 -> 11:56.000] Felly, ie, fe wnaethom i fynd i mewn
[11:56.000 -> 11:58.000] ac roeddwn i'n dod i mewn
[11:58.000 -> 12:00.000] yn 17 a 10 mlynedd.
[12:00.000 -> 12:02.000] Felly, a oedd y strwythur hwnnw
[12:02.000 -> 12:04.000] yn rhywbeth rydych chi wedi'i ddifrifio?
[12:04.000 -> 12:05.520] Oherwydd roedd eich mam yn eich bod chi ar y byd ychydig yn iawn ac yna
[12:05.520 -> 12:11.280] roedd gennych chi'n ymdrech ar gyfer ymdrech ar amserau'n aml yn eich blant. Iawn, dwi'n siŵr, yn y
[12:11.280 -> 12:17.280] ymdrech. A oedd y strwythur sy'n ymdrech i chi yna, oedd oedd hynny rhywbeth arall na hynny?
[12:17.280 -> 12:25.260] Ie, rwy'n credu bod yn strwythur, rwy'n credu bod yn ddiddorol yr hyn y gallai'r armyn ddod oherwydd I just I think I like the intensity of what the army could bring because
[12:26.120 -> 12:28.760] It had the sporting element, but I didn't join for the sport
[12:28.760 -> 12:34.340] I did join to meet people to be able to potentially travel to actually have a career because I never know
[12:34.340 -> 12:39.860] I never heard the word university when I was a kid. I didn't have no idea about what I would do and
[12:40.940 -> 12:44.260] So my early early days actually I you know
[12:44.260 -> 12:47.000] I got I did my work experience at a local leisure centre,
[12:47.000 -> 12:53.500] then I did some work over at a local army barracks, and then I was a nursing assistant, which was completely random,
[12:53.500 -> 13:04.000] but it was about helping people, and then I kind of just felt like that pull of army life would teach me about life,
[13:04.000 -> 13:08.320] and teach me to grow up quickly, and to do something that nobody else had done in my area, you know, yn dylunio i mi am fywyd, a'n dylunio i mi i fwyn yn gyflym ac i wneud rhywbeth nad oedd unrhyw un arall wedi'i wneud yn fy mhobl ardal.
[13:08.320 -> 13:13.200] Gwyddoch chi'n gwybod, roedd fy mhreinion yn ymwneud â'r swyddau a oedden nhw'n ei wneud pan oeddent wedi mynd allan o'r ysgol.
[13:13.200 -> 13:16.160] Doeddwn i ddim eisiau bod yn y swyddol oherwydd roeddwn i'n meddwl, well, beth yw yno i mi?
[13:16.160 -> 13:20.560] Roedd yn fy mhobl i wneud a chwisio rhywbeth nad oedd unrhyw un arall yn ei wneud i ddod yn dda.
[13:20.560 -> 13:22.160] Rwy'n credu bod yn fwy o ffynsed ar hynny.
[13:22.160 -> 13:26.000] Ond mae eich mam yn fy ffasyniadu, felly pan roeddwn i'n ysgrifennu am eich gwirionedd, ac rwy'n credu
[13:26.000 -> 13:28.000] rwy'n dweud yn y cyfieithu bod fy mam
[13:28.000 -> 13:30.000] yn eich lle ffyrdd iawn
[13:30.000 -> 13:32.000] i chi, oherwydd rwy'n credu
[13:32.000 -> 13:34.000] ei fod wedi gweld eich anoddiaeth, ond
[13:34.000 -> 13:36.000] y gofod i ddweud y gwirionedd.
[13:36.000 -> 13:38.000] Ond mae hynny'n llawer iawn
[13:38.000 -> 13:40.000] y sgriptiwn y byddwn i'n ei ddysgu am eich mam,
[13:40.000 -> 13:42.000] roedd e'n rhywun sydd wedi
[13:42.000 -> 13:44.000] gweithio ar amserau'n anodd iawn, ond
[13:44.000 -> 13:45.920] roedd hynny'n cyflawni ar gyfer chi, amserau anodd iawn ond oedd hwnnw'n ymdrech i chi'n cyfansoddol.
[13:45.920 -> 13:49.920] Ac roeddwn i ddiddorol o ran pa ffyrdd oedd gennych chi'n teimlo eich bod chi'n ymdrech o hwnnw.
[13:49.920 -> 13:53.760] Ie, roeddwn i'n defnyddio i edrych a chroesawu, roeddwn i'n dweud i mi,
[13:53.760 -> 13:56.960] ti, fy mab, dwi ddim yn meddwl oherwydd mae'n rhywbeth fel hynny, mae'n gwahanol yn un ffordd.
[13:56.960 -> 14:00.320] Roeddwn i'n dweud, mae'n hyfforddus, yn ymdrech, dwi ddim eisiau i mi ymswydd.
[14:00.320 -> 14:02.640] Roedd hi'n dweud, oh my god, mae'n dweud, dwi'n meddwl o'r clwb hwn.
[14:03.600 -> 14:05.120] Ond rwy'n credu dwi'n cymryd o hwnnw, felly roedd hi'n gyfansodd o mi pan oedd hi'n 17, it down and she was just like oh my god, go and book that club. But I think I took from
[14:05.120 -> 14:10.880] her, so she had me when she was 17, you know in the 70s when it was very taboo to be with
[14:10.880 -> 14:16.560] a mixed race guy who she'd had me with, I didn't know him. And when we went back to
[14:16.560 -> 14:23.200] Kent she was told by her dad and my grandad that she couldn't look after me until she
[14:23.200 -> 14:26.720] could look after herself because she was 17 having a kid, being
[14:26.720 -> 14:31.520] about whiter than white Kent and so I then got put in the care home
[14:31.520 -> 14:35.040] but before that we were in mum and baby units, you know, she'd have her own flat
[14:35.040 -> 14:39.440] and then when the adoption services came
[14:39.440 -> 14:42.480] literally to take me away that day with her family, she had to sign the papers
[14:42.480 -> 14:47.020] but she refused to sign the papers, you know, gonna make sure I get her back so what I had I
[14:47.020 -> 14:51.160] know is that fight you know that kind of know if I want to do something I'm gonna
[14:51.160 -> 14:56.000] do it and that I know that I've kind of picked up with her that kind of
[14:56.000 -> 15:00.860] resilience to when you get against all odds you can give up or you can go I'm
[15:00.860 -> 15:06.120] not gonna give up so I feel you know I'm really pleased that I've had that part of her in there.
[15:06.120 -> 15:09.960] Anything to do with sport or anything else, there was nothing.
[15:09.960 -> 15:10.960] There was nothing.
[15:10.960 -> 15:18.120] But yeah, so we had a, you know, very on and off relationship because when you're a teenager,
[15:18.120 -> 15:22.300] you know, I grew up with my stepdad Mick since I was five.
[15:22.300 -> 15:24.400] And then she sort of left him at 17.
[15:24.400 -> 15:28.460] So I've more got close to her, him rather than than her and then I went into the army and we didn't
[15:28.460 -> 15:32.460] speak and then you start getting back because she's your mum and I didn't know
[15:32.460 -> 15:37.020] any other bloods related people until I met my sister and brother when I was 16
[15:37.020 -> 15:43.420] in a supermarket but hey that's another story. Wow what a story. So yeah so it's
[15:43.420 -> 15:46.840] just those little I suppose elements of your background. So
[15:46.840 -> 15:51.240] I think the key for me is I didn't feel I had a really good identity when I was
[15:51.240 -> 15:56.920] younger. So I was in school, in both my primary school, my secondary school, the
[15:56.920 -> 16:03.760] only mixed-race person. I didn't have any sense of how I could connect
[16:03.760 -> 16:05.400] educationally. I think if they'd
[16:05.400 -> 16:06.960] actually looked into it like they do now
[16:06.960 -> 16:08.800] I probably was dyslexic you know I
[16:08.800 -> 16:11.040] couldn't read properly I didn't write
[16:11.040 -> 16:12.880] properly all of those things so I just
[16:12.880 -> 16:14.400] had to go through life fighting to be
[16:14.400 -> 16:16.160] good and then of course sport which we
[16:16.160 -> 16:18.720] talk about became my driver my identity
[16:18.720 -> 16:21.800] but back then you know I think I learned
[16:21.800 -> 16:24.760] quite early on and I don't know why when
[16:24.760 -> 16:29.660] you're different it doesn't mean you should then have that attitude that that's a
[16:29.660 -> 16:34.160] negative I was thought I'm different so I'm unique I don't want to be like
[16:34.160 -> 16:38.600] everybody else I want to stand out so I had a different in my head you know when
[16:38.600 -> 16:42.680] you're in the middle of a group of white kids and you're the only brown person
[16:42.680 -> 16:48.100] and boney M brown girl in the ring comes on you can take that two ways right when you're stuffed in the middle
[16:48.100 -> 16:53.720] you can either take it like the picking on you or you can go yeah I'm the sugar
[16:53.720 -> 16:57.220] in the plum plum plum you know and I had that attitude really young and I'm
[16:57.220 -> 17:00.600] really pleased that I did because I don't use one of that being in the life
[17:00.600 -> 17:04.840] that you've always yeah yeah you know to have an identity that actually if you're
[17:04.840 -> 17:05.000] different doesn't matter there is research on this that's been done with Mae'n bwysig bod yn y byd y byddwch chi wedi byw. Yn y byd, ie. I gael unigolhedd, a phosib, os ydych chi'n gwahanol,
[17:05.000 -> 17:06.000] nid oes mae'n bwysig.
[17:06.000 -> 17:07.000] Mae ymchwil ar hynny
[17:07.000 -> 17:09.000] a'i wneud gyda gynhyrchion cyhoeddus,
[17:09.000 -> 17:12.000] yn enwedig yn y ffyrdd o Olympiaid a chwaraeon,
[17:12.000 -> 17:15.000] yw bod y trauma yn cynnwys cymorth.
[17:15.000 -> 17:18.000] Y gwybodaethau anodd,
[17:18.000 -> 17:21.000] yn rhoi rhai o'r sylfaenau
[17:21.000 -> 17:23.000] i fynd ymlaen a gynhaliwyd ar lefel elit.
[17:23.000 -> 17:25.680] Pa mor ffordd byddwch chi'n cy ddefnyddio gyda'r cynnig?
[17:25.680 -> 17:28.000] Ie, mwy na hynny. Rwy'n credu,
[17:28.000 -> 17:30.480] rwy'n credu efallai y bydd y bobl chwaraeon yn eu cymryd
[17:30.480 -> 17:32.160] ac mae pobl yn dweud, yw'n y byd neu'n ymdrech?
[17:32.160 -> 17:33.520] Rwy'n credu, efallai, un o'r ddau,
[17:33.520 -> 17:34.320] ond rwy'n credu, o rai ffordd,
[17:34.320 -> 17:35.600] mae angen i chi gael ei gynhyrchu gyda chi
[17:35.600 -> 17:37.360] i gael y pwysau yn y gynllun,
[17:37.360 -> 17:38.320] y ffwrdd,
[17:38.320 -> 17:39.440] a'r ffordd o'r tyne,
[17:39.440 -> 17:40.800] rwy'n mynd i'w wneud.
[17:40.800 -> 17:41.760] A oes gennych chi unrhyw ddiwedd
[17:41.760 -> 17:43.280] lle rydych chi wedi penderfynu
[17:43.280 -> 17:44.960] y byddwch chi'n mynd i'r pwysau ffwrdd
[17:44.960 -> 17:46.240] yn ymdneud â'r
[17:46.240 -> 17:48.320] bod yn cael ei ystyried fel dyn.
[17:48.320 -> 17:54.000] Yn unig fel plant, rwy'n credu, mae'n anodd i'w ystyried, oherwydd pan ydych chi'n
[17:54.000 -> 17:57.840] unig yn y berson ifanc, sut mae gennych y sgiliau i'w wneud hynny? Ond roeddwn i'n teimlo
[17:57.840 -> 18:03.360] fel bod yr unig beth rydw i'n gwybod o'r ddiwedd yma oedd pawb rydw i'n gweld, fel y gwnawn
[18:03.360 -> 18:05.240] ni yn y staff yma nawr, roedd pawb yn gwleidyddol yn ystod fi, felly dydw i ddim wedi I knew back then was everybody that I see as we do in the room now everyone was white in front of me
[18:05.240 -> 18:07.240] So I never thought anything because I can't see myself
[18:07.440 -> 18:09.440] So I just thought I was the same as everybody else
[18:09.440 -> 18:16.040] There's only other people identifying that you're different but skin color doesn't mean that inside you how you're born how you brought up
[18:16.080 -> 18:20.600] How you're educated what you're told what you're taught is different to that next person
[18:20.600 -> 18:24.240] I wasn't brought up in a Jamaican family or in a black environment. I don't know it
[18:24.240 -> 18:26.000] I have no connection, but it's hard to articulate that to people that don't understand it person. I wasn't brought up in a Jamaican family or in a black environment, I
[18:23.600 -> 18:28.040] don't know it, I have no connection but
[18:26.000 -> 18:30.120] it's hard to articulate that to people
[18:28.040 -> 18:31.960] that don't understand it, whereas in my
[18:30.120 -> 18:33.800] youth it was just like they're all my
[18:31.960 -> 18:35.560] mates, you know, we were just friends. So
[18:33.800 -> 18:37.760] I think I was lucky that I didn't have
[18:35.560 -> 18:39.840] that kind of, you know, hard-hitting
[18:37.760 -> 18:41.400] bullying or anything when I was younger. So
[18:39.840 -> 18:44.640] I think then I took that into secondary
[18:41.400 -> 18:46.640] school where I just felt useless all the
[18:44.640 -> 18:45.440] time, I was outside
[18:45.440 -> 18:51.760] the classroom, I felt like I'm just a failure, no one give a shit because I was just like you know
[18:51.760 -> 18:59.200] just the girl with no name until athletics took its hold you know and then suddenly I'm winning
[18:59.200 -> 19:03.680] everything you know my PE teacher's saying like if you're going to be good if you want to be good
[19:03.680 -> 19:07.160] you've got to start focusing and believing you can be good because you're better than all of
[19:07.160 -> 19:11.400] these at this you might be outside the classroom you know you've got to sort that out but you're
[19:11.400 -> 19:15.400] better than everybody here and I was just like oh my god somebody's actually told me
[19:15.400 -> 19:16.700] I can be good.
[19:16.700 -> 19:22.520] So was sport the first time in your life that you experienced success?
[19:22.520 -> 19:26.720] Yeah in terms of a feeling within six months of starting
[19:26.720 -> 19:30.800] running I was All England school champion when I was 13 but then I won the
[19:30.800 -> 19:34.600] mini Youth Olympic Games when I was 17 so I actually won a gold medal in the
[19:34.600 -> 19:38.680] 800 meters when I was 17 years old. You see that is absolutely vital isn't it
[19:38.680 -> 19:44.320] because you've gone through between 13 14 15 years of being told you're
[19:44.320 -> 19:47.040] different, being the only mixed race person
[19:47.040 -> 19:52.040] in a white environment, being chucked out of classrooms, going into children's homes,
[19:52.040 -> 19:56.080] wondering what your family history is, wondering whether you'll ever have a relationship with
[19:56.080 -> 20:07.200] your family and then suddenly sport is the first moment where you go, that is what it feels like a to be successful but also
[20:07.200 -> 20:13.000] to be celebrated by other people yeah so when you look at it like that no wonder
[20:13.000 -> 20:18.480] that then determined your life because suddenly you related sport to feeling
[20:18.480 -> 20:22.880] like you've never felt before absolutely I mean when I won that first English
[20:22.880 -> 20:25.120] Schools Championships 1500m
[20:25.120 -> 20:28.760] I came back and there was all this bunting outside the house, you know the old-fashioned bunting
[20:28.760 -> 20:34.480] I've got a picture of it somewhere, you know, like a piece of white paper with a handwritten
[20:34.480 -> 20:41.000] Welcome home Kelly type thing and there's me and my stepdad outside, me with a big afro and then people in a slur
[20:41.000 -> 20:44.400] You know those little things just like wow and then
[20:48.080 -> 20:53.360] Sport literally took up my life because we didn't have a bus to go to school, so I used to cycle to school, do whatever at school, cycle to train and do train and come back.
[20:53.360 -> 20:56.880] That was my life as a teen. I didn't go out partying, didn't go out with mates,
[20:56.880 -> 20:59.680] I went round the house maybe a couple of times. I loved it.
[20:59.680 -> 21:01.680] So where did that mindset then come from?
[21:02.240 -> 21:05.440] I loved winning. Watching the Olympic games when I was 14,
[21:05.440 -> 21:08.040] I watched Sebastian Coe within 1500 meters.
[21:08.040 -> 21:09.520] And I was just 84, 84.
[21:09.520 -> 21:11.720] Yeah, 84, yeah, I'm that old.
[21:11.720 -> 21:16.720] 84, 84 Olympic games, Sebastian Coe won the 1500 meters.
[21:17.880 -> 21:20.760] I was already 1500 meter running by them.
[21:20.760 -> 21:24.960] I literally got goosebumps inside me, like in my core.
[21:24.960 -> 21:26.160] And I went back to school and
[21:26.160 -> 21:31.040] I told my best friends, Kerry, Lara and Kim, I am going to be Olympic champion.
[21:31.040 -> 21:36.720] And they said, yes, you probably are, because that's the only thing you're bloody good at.
[21:36.720 -> 21:38.920] Which was true.
[21:38.920 -> 21:44.560] But it was just that moment of, wow, I love the whole thing about the Olympics, you know,
[21:44.560 -> 21:45.640] kind of the Olympic
[21:45.640 -> 21:49.720] rings what it meant you know the history of it seeing success people on a
[21:49.720 -> 21:54.160] rostrum national anthem playing British flag flying like medal around the neck
[21:54.160 -> 21:57.880] and I was like oh my god you know I just felt it it was just something like
[21:57.880 -> 22:01.160] literally went through my body and I knew that day that's what I wanted to
[22:01.160 -> 22:07.200] be. But you used a lovely phrase before, quite a moving phrase, a lovely one where you said about I was the girl with no name
[22:07.200 -> 22:12.280] and how much of it was just having someone know your name that was the
[22:12.280 -> 22:15.820] appeal of that? Yeah all of it just having like that you're here you know I
[22:15.820 -> 22:19.320] always believe that one person can change somebody's life mine was my PE
[22:19.320 -> 22:23.280] teacher you know we're still friends to this day it's my PE teacher because it
[22:23.280 -> 22:26.640] was her that actually said to me, Kelly, you can be good.
[22:26.640 -> 22:28.920] Just having an identity is so important,
[22:28.920 -> 22:31.480] you know, for anybody, knowing where they're gonna go,
[22:31.480 -> 22:33.660] what they're gonna do, what they want to do,
[22:33.660 -> 22:35.460] finding passion.
[22:35.460 -> 22:38.240] I feel lucky that I had the upbringing I had,
[22:38.240 -> 22:40.680] lucky that I had those feelings inside me
[22:40.680 -> 22:42.120] at a very young age, you know,
[22:42.120 -> 22:44.320] because two dreams were to be in the army
[22:44.320 -> 22:47.240] as a physical training instructor and to be Olympic champion and I've done
[22:47.240 -> 22:51.580] both. You know who else at 14 can actually say I had these dreams they
[22:51.580 -> 22:54.880] were going to take forever they were the fluffy cloud up there. It might have taken 20
[22:54.880 -> 22:58.120] years for one of them you know and however many for the other one but I did
[22:58.120 -> 23:03.440] it. So actually everything before that period of time was probably that little
[23:03.440 -> 23:07.860] bit of grounding fight for it. If you want it don't give up. When you're an adult you start
[23:07.860 -> 23:12.380] thinking about all the little incidences that have happened along the way where
[23:12.380 -> 23:15.460] you could have just given up, you could have cried, you could have said I'm not
[23:15.460 -> 23:18.620] good enough yourself, you could have listened to what people said but I
[23:18.620 -> 23:22.580] believe that to become the Olympic champion I did was some of the
[23:22.580 -> 23:26.960] traits from being young, thinking no I'm going to do this, you think I can't, rydw i'n mynd i'w wneud hynny, rydych chi'n meddwl, rydw i'n mynd i,
[23:26.960 -> 23:29.360] ond roeddwn i mewn ymdrech, dyna'r unig peth rydw i'n gwybod y gallwn ei wneud,
[23:29.360 -> 23:30.720] dydw i ddim yn gallu ei wneud mewn unrhyw beth eraill.
[23:30.720 -> 23:35.840] Rwy'n cofio'r llyfr y gwneswch i'ch ddysgu diwrnodau ym mis I Genedlaethau 2004,
[23:35.840 -> 23:38.080] ac roedd yna ddod o'r ffordd yn mynd yn ymwneud â'r ffordd rydych chi'n ei ysgrifennu amdano,
[23:38.080 -> 23:40.480] rydw i wedi cymryd llawer iawn i ddod i'r hyn,
[23:40.480 -> 23:42.720] ac rydw i eisiau unrhyw flwyddyn lle gallaf ddod o'i gilydd
[23:42.720 -> 23:46.000] heb ymdrech a'i gynnal i'w gael i fynd i gael fy nghaer i'r cyfansoddau, i gael fy nghaer i'r cyfansoddau, i gael fy nghaer i'r cyfansoddau, i gael fy nghaer i'r cyfansoddau,
[23:46.000 -> 23:48.000] i gael fy nghaer i'r cyfansoddau,
[23:48.000 -> 23:50.000] i gael fy nghaer i'r cyfansoddau,
[23:50.000 -> 23:52.000] i gael fy nghaer i'r cyfansoddau,
[23:52.000 -> 23:54.000] i gael fy nghaer i'r cyfansoddau,
[23:54.000 -> 23:56.000] i gael fy nghaer i'r cyfansoddau,
[23:56.000 -> 23:58.000] i gael fy nghaer i'r cyfansoddau,
[23:58.000 -> 24:00.000] i gael fy nghaer i'r cyfansoddau,
[24:00.000 -> 24:02.000] i gael fy nghaer i'r cyfansoddau,
[24:02.000 -> 24:04.000] i gael fy nghaer i'r cyfansoddau,
[24:04.000 -> 24:07.960] i gael fy nghaer i'r cyfansoddau, i gael fy nghaer i'r cyfansoddau, still have my ones from when I was 13 so I wrote diaries. You were doing that at 13 as well though? Yeah just writing, well just notes about main training like how I felt
[24:07.960 -> 24:13.320] or... Where did that come from then? Because that's very smart to do that when you
[24:13.320 -> 24:17.000] when you talk about the fact that really everything was a bit of a struggle
[24:17.000 -> 24:20.560] apart from the sport so how did you suddenly apply such a kind of smart
[24:20.560 -> 24:27.200] scientific approach to your sport? I loved it, you know, literally it was my life back then.
[24:27.200 -> 24:29.200] So everything, I wanted to be an Olympic champion,
[24:29.200 -> 24:31.500] you can't just turn up and be an Olympic champion.
[24:31.500 -> 24:32.200] But who told you that though?
[24:32.200 -> 24:34.200] That you can't just turn up and be an Olympic champion?
[24:34.200 -> 24:38.200] Because I knew that to be able to get into Olympic games
[24:38.200 -> 24:39.900] you'd have to break two minutes, you know,
[24:39.900 -> 24:42.700] I was running 250 something as a kid, you know,
[24:42.700 -> 24:44.200] it's like, this isn't...
[24:44.200 -> 24:45.640] So I knew it was a long-term
[24:45.640 -> 24:52.000] piece but I suppose within, so that diary you referred to with the 2004, when I
[24:52.000 -> 24:56.680] wrote that passage in the diary which I then put in my autobiography, it was
[24:56.680 -> 25:00.280] really about everything that I felt like I just kept thinking I was cursed at
[25:00.280 -> 25:03.920] this time, I think and everything was knocking me back, so basically in 2003 for
[25:03.920 -> 25:08.020] the listeners that don't know, during my career I was already 12 years as an
[25:08.020 -> 25:13.140] international athlete, I'd left the army when I was 27, I'd been in there for 10
[25:13.140 -> 25:18.840] years, I had just a massive breakdown like literally to the point that I
[25:18.840 -> 25:23.280] didn't want to be here anymore and I was in a training camp getting ready for a
[25:23.280 -> 25:28.020] world championships, I'd already been injured for many years but won lots of medals you know I was having
[25:28.020 -> 25:32.360] highs and lows for all these years fighting back no one knew the story
[25:32.360 -> 25:36.540] behind half of my medals I'd be on the track and get a silver or bronze and
[25:36.540 -> 25:40.260] people like oh where's she like silver or bronze it wasn't you know wasn't
[25:40.260 -> 25:43.100] champion just like you have no idea shouldn't have even been at this track
[25:43.100 -> 25:45.760] you know there's all those things that was happening this period of time
[25:45.760 -> 25:49.760] I was getting ready for world champs we were in a camp and I went into the
[25:49.760 -> 25:55.580] bathroom and basically broke down crying inside screaming inside you know when
[25:55.580 -> 25:59.040] you see somebody in pain you see their heart breaking but you can't shout it
[25:59.040 -> 26:02.800] out because people were outside saw some scissors starting to cut myself became a
[26:02.800 -> 26:06.720] self-harmer that day didn't know anything about self-harm, didn't know about depression, didn't know about
[26:06.720 -> 26:10.840] breakdown, did not want to be there. I mean how I didn't do something else was
[26:10.840 -> 26:16.640] because I still had a dream. I try to articulate it on stage and half of you
[26:16.640 -> 26:21.840] is actually dying inside and half of you wants to be successful and driven as
[26:21.840 -> 26:25.000] that's the hardest fight.
[26:25.080 -> 26:27.480] It's not necessarily the fight of what you're doing
[26:27.480 -> 26:30.560] because at that time it's Red Mist, Black Dog,
[26:30.560 -> 26:33.080] Black Hole, Tunnel, whatever.
[26:33.080 -> 26:36.120] But I had such something inside me,
[26:36.120 -> 26:38.080] I always believed I'd be Olympic champion.
[26:38.080 -> 26:39.120] I don't know what it was.
[26:39.120 -> 26:41.000] Even through the depths of despair,
[26:41.000 -> 26:42.800] even through the injuries I had, ruptured calves,
[26:42.800 -> 26:44.760] torniculus, you know, distress patches,
[26:44.760 -> 26:47.800] scleroderma fever, all in my intellectual career I always woke up
[26:47.800 -> 26:51.560] thinking I'm gonna be an Olympic champion and I don't know why that was I
[26:51.560 -> 26:55.640] always believe in fate I mean you know there's a big thing in fate I believe
[26:55.640 -> 27:00.080] that went through the journey could have given up didn't then I get two gold
[27:00.080 -> 27:05.580] medals you know so payback but yeah there's little things which make you as a high
[27:05.580 -> 27:09.440] performer because also different I think something different in an individual
[27:09.440 -> 27:16.140] sport has to be some resolve inside you that can go through a pain barrier and
[27:16.140 -> 27:19.700] that's whether that's physical or emotional that kind of can push to that
[27:19.700 -> 27:23.660] next limit push to see how far you can get push to know where you can take
[27:23.660 -> 27:29.120] yourself and I think I just kept pushing those little milestones and obviously the
[27:29.120 -> 27:33.240] breakdown was because I never really reflected on everything before. It's a
[27:33.240 -> 27:38.040] different era back then, you know, you didn't talk about mental health when you
[27:38.040 -> 27:41.960] went on a physio bed, they're treating the injury. Did you feel it coming, the breakdown?
[27:41.960 -> 27:47.240] Did you sense it was on its way? No, because I just coped with the highs and lows for so long, you know
[27:47.240 -> 27:50.900] It was almost like I was going through the same old routine, you know
[27:50.900 -> 27:57.440] I'd get injured fight through it get back get a medal get injured fight through it. It's just like normal is becoming like
[27:58.200 -> 28:00.200] Thanks, you know, give me a break
[28:00.920 -> 28:07.760] When you talk about going through a breakdown for people that haven't suffered with mental health problems, is it you wake up in the
[28:07.760 -> 28:11.360] morning and something happens and that's it the breakdown has happened? Is it an
[28:11.360 -> 28:18.480] instantaneous moment? I think so, I think the actual breakdown part is
[28:18.480 -> 28:23.480] unexpected. Do you remember where you were when it happened? Yeah I was in France, I was in our
[28:23.480 -> 28:28.040] apartment and I went into the toilet because I had another
[28:28.040 -> 28:32.560] little liggle and I just literally exploded.
[28:32.560 -> 28:34.760] I mean I can't explain it anymore.
[28:34.760 -> 28:40.440] Looked in the mirror and everything inside me was just like this explosion of hatred,
[28:40.440 -> 28:41.440] emotion, disappointment.
[28:41.440 -> 28:46.520] I felt like somebody was literally wanting me to
[28:46.520 -> 28:50.560] fail, like literally saying you're not going to do this and I just couldn't cope.
[28:50.560 -> 28:56.120] But I think then that's the point is you can have you can have a bad day, you can
[28:56.120 -> 28:59.680] have stress, you can have anxiety, you can have depression, we can have all of those
[28:59.680 -> 29:03.800] emotions, we could just have a bad day. But the moment you have a breakdown
[29:03.800 -> 29:05.000] that's a different thing.
[29:05.000 -> 29:10.360] I think there's a chemical imbalance that's just gone and broken, you know, and I was
[29:10.360 -> 29:11.360] broken.
[29:11.360 -> 29:14.220] But in hindsight, is there anything that you think you could, any steps you could have
[29:14.220 -> 29:17.640] taken, you know, before you reach that moment of breakdown?
[29:17.640 -> 29:22.040] Maybe in sport, people recognizing that emotional rollercoaster, because when you give your
[29:22.040 -> 29:24.940] life to sport, there's no guarantees, is there?
[29:24.940 -> 29:26.400] You know, I had a, remember I had is there you know I had a remember I had
[29:26.400 -> 29:28.760] a secured job I had a pay packet each
[29:28.760 -> 29:31.080] month I had status in the army as a
[29:31.080 -> 29:33.400] sergeant by then I knew my roles my
[29:33.400 -> 29:36.260] expectations I was comfortable with that
[29:36.260 -> 29:39.080] when I left I was putting all my eggs
[29:39.080 -> 29:41.320] let's say in one basket to become an
[29:41.320 -> 29:43.700] Olympic champion so what happens then is
[29:43.700 -> 29:45.120] that every time you're doing
[29:45.120 -> 29:49.920] something you don't want negative around you, you don't want somebody saying you can't achieve
[29:49.920 -> 29:53.160] because I'm thinking I've got to get to the next games. You know you have Commonwealth
[29:53.160 -> 30:00.080] Games, European Champs, World Champs and Olympics in that four year cycle. So every year to
[30:00.080 -> 30:03.480] prove that you're one of the best in the world you've got to be at that championships and
[30:03.480 -> 30:06.120] you've got to win a medal. You know so you can't just go I'm
[30:06.120 -> 30:10.780] not going to go this year it's like no there's no no there's no not you know
[30:10.780 -> 30:15.360] and being paid as an athlete you only ever get paid if you get a sponsor or if
[30:15.360 -> 30:19.380] you compete I was injured so many times on the circuit I didn't get paid to run
[30:19.380 -> 30:24.620] because I was injured so much so I'm putting everything in the medal was
[30:24.620 -> 30:25.540] never about money
[30:25.540 -> 30:31.120] for me, never about fame, never about anything. It was about purely proving to myself I can
[30:31.120 -> 30:35.240] be good from back in the day. I didn't really care about the money at that stage, but you
[30:35.240 -> 30:37.880] are putting your life into a dream.
[30:37.880 -> 30:40.280] So did you mention your breakdown to anyone in British Athletics?
[30:40.280 -> 30:46.880] No, no, no. I didn't mention anyone. I didn't know how to. How do you explain that you've just gone through something you don't know you've had?
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[33:57.280 -> 34:04.200] mint mobile for details we talk often on
[34:02.040 -> 34:07.240] this podcast about fault versus
[34:04.200 -> 34:06.300] responsibility you are the
[34:06.300 -> 34:10.620] epitome of fault versus responsibility because it wasn't your fault that you
[34:10.620 -> 34:13.780] went into care homes, it wasn't your fault you didn't know your family, it
[34:13.780 -> 34:17.900] wasn't your fault that you weren't right at school and you suffered with dyslexia,
[34:17.900 -> 34:21.420] it wasn't your fault that you had a nervous breakdown, but through every
[34:21.420 -> 34:28.220] single step of the way you had to take on the responsibility and I think it's such a strong message for people listening to
[34:28.220 -> 34:33.900] this that you can't live a life of blame and live a life of looking at fault live
[34:33.900 -> 34:38.180] a life of being a victim you have no matter how bad it gets and you know
[34:38.180 -> 34:41.420] you're talking about you know contemplating the ultimate act and
[34:41.420 -> 34:49.440] self-harming no matter how bad it gets, trying to find a mindset of responsibility is so important.
[34:49.440 -> 34:54.640] It really is and I think if people listening get to those stages, I've always had this
[34:54.640 -> 34:58.120] thing around how do you turn a negative into a positive because I think there's
[34:58.120 -> 35:02.040] always positives into anything that we do so even at the brink of having a
[35:02.040 -> 35:08.680] breakdown, if in one side of me saying but you know I haven't given up on my athletics yet, I'm still, this is why I've
[35:08.680 -> 35:13.120] got to that point, my dream is still to come, I was able to change that
[35:13.120 -> 35:17.080] mindset through one bit, even though I'm emotionally still suffering because
[35:17.080 -> 35:22.200] you're a human being. As a sports person having that ability to snap into where's
[35:22.200 -> 35:25.140] those positives and I think when I was at the depths of
[35:25.140 -> 35:31.060] despair I kept thinking this is because I want it so much you know I could give
[35:31.060 -> 35:34.580] up I could give up tomorrow why am I going through this I want this so badly
[35:34.580 -> 35:39.500] only I can do that now so I can pick myself up and I used to think to myself
[35:39.500 -> 35:46.360] especially back then I looked back and go so I've won up until that point I'd won nine
[35:46.360 -> 35:51.600] major medals right and six years of those had been in having injuries yet I
[35:51.600 -> 35:57.840] still come back with medals I then go at the the lowest of the low I'm getting
[35:57.840 -> 36:00.520] ready for World Championships and I win a silver medal at that World
[36:00.520 -> 36:03.880] Championships and I still in Russia with that around my neck no one knew what was
[36:03.880 -> 36:08.160] going on no one knew what was happening each night, what I was going through.
[36:08.160 -> 36:10.820] And that you take as a strength of character.
[36:10.820 -> 36:16.200] So I think some people have to remember, they've always had happiness somewhere in their life.
[36:16.200 -> 36:18.560] They've always had things they know they can do.
[36:18.560 -> 36:21.660] They've always had experience that have been great and good.
[36:21.660 -> 36:29.200] So when you're at that depth of despair, there's a reason why you've got to that point. You know there's always a reason why we have a breakdown, there's always a reason why we
[36:29.200 -> 36:36.800] go to, people go to drugs, alcohol, self-harming, the way I do it's cut in. There's a reason for it.
[36:36.800 -> 36:47.800] So I knew at that time my reason was I was hard on myself because I wanted to be good. That's throughout my whole life.
[36:47.800 -> 36:54.320] Hard on myself because I believed that limpet dream was gonna come and I didn't
[36:54.320 -> 36:58.720] refuse to give up on it. You're the only person, no one else around you, the only
[36:58.720 -> 37:03.960] person who lives with that, if only I did. So when you say about this kind of
[37:03.960 -> 37:05.200] responsibility stuff and
[37:05.200 -> 37:10.360] you mentioned about did anyone help you in 2004 at the beginning in January I
[37:10.360 -> 37:15.440] set up a mentoring program called On Cam with Kelly and what this program was was
[37:15.440 -> 37:20.000] to help junior athletes learn what it takes to become world-class but
[37:20.000 -> 37:23.480] everything not just the running around a track because you're running around a
[37:23.480 -> 37:29.360] track you're on my program if you're good enough anyway it was can you go through hard times can you go for people
[37:29.360 -> 37:34.560] putting you down can you go through the pressures of education with your mates going out partying
[37:34.560 -> 37:38.880] and you've got the talent they haven't but they're coercing you to go off to there and I was like
[37:38.880 -> 37:42.800] I'm going to tell you teach you everything it's taken me to get to where I've got this is before
[37:42.800 -> 37:46.880] I won my two gold medals so I selected eight, was going to take them to South Africa in
[37:46.880 -> 37:50.480] October. Can you imagine they're going with an international athlete,
[37:50.480 -> 37:55.480] middle distance runner to South Africa, then I won two gold medals. And I
[37:55.480 -> 37:58.600] came back and everyone said to me it's no way you're going to take those eight
[37:58.600 -> 38:02.920] girls. You know I had all these jobs open to me, I could have done everything. And I
[38:02.920 -> 38:07.860] went do you know what my biggest value of anything I've learned is to take these girls to South Africa
[38:07.860 -> 38:13.820] now I've gone through highs lows success and I took them South Africa for a month
[38:13.820 -> 38:19.660] 15 16 17 year olds had two sort of helping helpers and in the end that
[38:19.660 -> 38:25.000] program developed 65 international athletes and these girls all stuck to a chael 65 o athletau gwleidyddol a chynnal y chwaraewyr i'w chwaraeon,
[38:25.000 -> 38:30.000] a chael eu trafod oherwydd, beth mae'n mynd i'w gynnal
[38:30.000 -> 38:33.000] i gael yr hyn rydych chi eisiau i'w gynnal.
[38:33.000 -> 38:37.000] Mae'n mynd i gynnal pobeth, mae'n mynd i gynnal anoddau, mae'n mynd i gynnal llwyr, mae'n mynd i gynnal gweithle,
[38:37.000 -> 38:41.000] gweithle, gweithredaeth, ddewis, bobl yn rhoi'r gwaith, mae'n mynd i gynnal yr holl bethau, nid?
[38:41.000 -> 38:42.000] I fod yn dda.
[38:42.000 -> 38:44.000] Felly, dyna'r cwestiwn, felly,
[38:44.000 -> 38:47.840] os oeddwn i un o'r chwarawyr ifanc yn mynd i'r camp hon,
[38:48.720 -> 38:55.920] beth byddwch chi'n rhoi i mi fel cyfathrebu o'r aml o'ch cyfansoddiad o'ch gallu i
[38:55.920 -> 39:00.240] ffwrdd yn gyffredinol a phethau fel hynny a pheth o'i gallu i'r holl bethau eraill, y gallu i
[39:00.240 -> 39:07.000] ymdrechu gyda'r broblemau ydych chi wedi'u ddweud. 20% o'r talent, oherwydd mae yna llawer o bobl ddifrifol
[39:07.000 -> 39:10.000] ac 80% o'r ffordd i fynd drwy pethau eraill i'w gael.
[39:10.000 -> 39:13.000] I mewn i'r trac, ym Mhleidleinwyr Olympiaidd,
[39:13.000 -> 39:16.000] 0.05 o sefydliad wedi'u separatio
[39:16.000 -> 39:18.000] ym mhob un o ni yn y 800m.
[39:18.000 -> 39:20.000] Rydym ni'n rhedegau'n dda.
[39:20.000 -> 39:22.000] A oeddwn i wedi'i ddod o'i gilydd,
[39:22.000 -> 39:24.000] dydw i ddim wedi bod yn rhan o hynny.
[39:24.000 -> 39:30.240] Felly mae yna ychydig o'r credu a'ch gallu What take, you know, had I given up I wouldn't have been part of that for, you know. So actually there's that inner bit, the belief and your ability to push and to trust yourself.
[39:30.240 -> 39:34.360] There's so many times, I'd probably say in my whole career, only four times out of 12 years
[39:34.360 -> 39:38.120] did I have that totally in the zone where I felt like I'm floating, you know.
[39:38.120 -> 39:43.120] Two of those were at the Olympics and one was in breaking the British record in 97, 1500 meters
[39:43.120 -> 39:45.400] and one was in Sydney when I
[39:45.400 -> 39:49.320] was told there's no way I'm going to get there. I'd got a 12 centimeter tear in my
[39:49.320 -> 39:54.440] calf in the January. I was told by everyone at your 30 you're not going to
[39:54.440 -> 39:57.920] get there you know you might as well just carry on wait through the next kind
[39:57.920 -> 40:01.480] of season to come and I'd already gone to the first Olympics when I was serving
[40:01.480 -> 40:09.000] in the British Army and I ended up getting a stress fracture. I still ran, I got into the heat semi-final, I came fourth, I got
[40:09.000 -> 40:13.020] pipped on the line by tenth of a second, running with a stress fracture, right, had
[40:13.020 -> 40:16.400] injections into the bone site to numb it, I was emotionally in pain, physically in
[40:16.400 -> 40:20.600] pain. I said to myself I'm not going to my next Olympics without coming back
[40:20.600 -> 40:24.800] with a medal. I told her I wasn't going to get there, had six weeks of running only
[40:24.800 -> 40:25.680] that year, everything else was in a pool, a stepper, cross trainer, bike, everything, i ddod yn ôl gyda meddal. Roeddwn i'n dweud na fyddaf yn mynd yno. Roedd gen i chwech o ffwrdd o ffwrdd yn y blynyddoedd honno.
[40:25.680 -> 40:26.880] Pethau eraill o'r pwll,
[40:26.880 -> 40:27.600] y stepper,
[40:27.600 -> 40:28.280] y croesdwyth,
[40:28.280 -> 40:29.280] y farch,
[40:29.280 -> 40:29.880] pob peth,
[40:29.880 -> 40:30.280] y gweithiau,
[40:30.280 -> 40:31.040] y gynhwys.
[40:31.040 -> 40:31.960] Roedd fy nghyfnod fel,
[40:31.960 -> 40:33.200] rydw i'n mynd i'w wneud hyn.
[40:33.200 -> 40:34.120] Roeddwn i'n dod yno
[40:34.120 -> 40:35.320] ac roeddwn i'n cael meddal bron.
[40:35.320 -> 40:36.160] Mae'n ffasafol clywed
[40:36.160 -> 40:36.960] dych chi'n ysgrifennu'r
[40:36.960 -> 40:37.840] Games Cymru,
[40:37.840 -> 40:38.640] oherwydd rwy'n cofio hynny.
[40:38.640 -> 40:39.360] Ond,
[40:39.360 -> 40:40.320] y ddau cyfansoddau
[40:40.320 -> 40:41.160] lle gafodd chi ychydig o goll
[40:41.160 -> 40:43.200] yn Athan,
[40:43.200 -> 40:43.800] fel,
[40:43.800 -> 40:44.880] y ffordd rwy'n cofio,
[40:44.880 -> 40:47.000] roedd yna ddiddorol o ddiddorol arnoch chi ar gyfer y cyfansoddau, oherwydd rwy'n cofio, fel, yn ymdhob arbennig lle gafodd chi ychydig o gyfnodau i gael y golau yn Athen. Y ffordd rwy'n ei cofio yw bod gennych ddiddorol o hyder arnoch chi
[40:47.000 -> 40:50.000] ar y rhan o'r rhan, oherwydd rwy'n cofio eich bod chi'n gwneud ymdrechion,
[40:50.000 -> 41:06.080] rydych chi'n gwneud i'r rhai arall fynd allan, a'ch bod chi'n ymdrech, a'ch bod chi'n ymdrech, a'ch bod chi'n ymdrech, a'ch bod chi'n ymdrech, a'ch bod chi'n ymdrech, a'ch bod chi'n ymdrech, a'ch bod chi'n ymdrech, a'ch bod chi'n ymdrech, a'ch bod chi'n ymdrech, a'ch bod chi'n ymdrech, a'ch bod chi'n ymdrech, a'ch bod chi'n ymdrech, a'ch bod chi'n ymdrech, a'ch bod chi'n ymdrech, a'ch bod chi'n ymdrech, a'ch bod chi'n ymdrech, a'ch bod chi'n ymdrech, a'ch bod chi'n ymdrech, a'ch bod chi'n ymdrech, a'ch bod chi'n ymdrech, a'ch bod chi'n ymdrech, a'ch bod chi'n ymdrech, a'ch bod chi'n ymdrech, ac yna, chwe blynedd nesaf, ddod a bod yn hyderus.
[41:06.080 -> 41:11.440] Roedd gen i ddifrif o ffyrdd yn 2004, oherwydd beth sydd wedi digwydd i mi yn 2003,
[41:11.440 -> 41:16.960] fel, yn unig, roeddwn i'n gwybod bod yr unig peth a oedd yn mynd i fy nghymryd oedd fy llyfr
[41:16.960 -> 41:20.640] a'r iechyd, felly, rydw i'n gwybod, oherwydd roeddwn i'n ddiddorol o'r holl bethau eraill.
[41:20.640 -> 41:23.520] Felly roeddwn i'n dweud, yn hytrach na ddweud i bobl o ran fi,
[41:25.400 -> 41:30.920] So I'd said to instead of telling people around me the emotional side what was happening I said my physio I need you to be the best physio you can be I want to
[41:30.920 -> 41:34.600] be the best in the world you're already good physio but you need to be great
[41:34.600 -> 41:38.080] like almost like it was selfish I said you need to live my life you know I need
[41:38.080 -> 41:41.640] to be stalking you that's literally what I did training partner who was a guy who
[41:41.640 -> 41:46.000] gave up his athletics career that year Anthony Whiteman he was a 1500 meter running for Great Britain he was lacking in motivation kind of wanted a bit of a a gafodd y gynllunio'n ffwrdd i'r gynllunio'n ffwrdd, a oedd y dynion yn ymwneud â'r gynllunio'n ffwrdd, a oedd y dynion yn ymwneud â'r gynllunio'n ffwrdd,
[41:46.000 -> 41:48.000] a oedd y dynion yn ymwneud â'r gynllunio'n ffwrdd,
[41:48.000 -> 41:50.000] a oedd y dynion yn ymwneud â'r gynllunio'n ffwrdd,
[41:50.000 -> 41:52.000] a oedd y dynion yn ymwneud â'r gynllunio'n ffwrdd,
[41:52.000 -> 41:54.000] a oedd y dynion yn ymwneud â'r gynllunio'n ffwrdd,
[41:54.000 -> 41:56.000] a oedd y dynion yn ymwneud â'r gynllunio'n ffwrdd,
[41:56.000 -> 41:58.000] a oedd y dynion yn ymwneud â'r gynllunio'n ffwrdd,
[41:58.000 -> 42:00.000] a oedd y dynion yn ymwneud â'r gynllunio'n ffwrdd,
[42:00.000 -> 42:02.000] a oedd y dynion yn ymwneud ag y gynllunio'n ffwrdd,
[42:02.000 -> 42:04.000] a oedd y dynion yn ymwneud ag y gynllunio'n ffwrdd,
[42:04.000 -> 42:09.160] a oedd y dynion yn ymwneud ag y gynllunio'n ffwrdd, a oedd y dynion yn ymwneud ag y gynllunio'n ffwrdd, run, I knew the times and he did and quickly the story goes on that after Athens he then broke the world record for the men's over 40s 1500 meters and
[42:09.160 -> 42:12.800] become world record holder for the miles. You know you raised the bar for him.
[42:12.800 -> 42:17.520] So what I did in 2004 I didn't feel at that time I could get any lower than I'd
[42:17.520 -> 42:22.560] been and because I was still there that made me even more thinking I can I can
[42:22.560 -> 42:29.680] do this you know because I can't go any lower, yet I'm still achieving, you know, so I changed my mindset, hence why I wrote that bit in my book.
[42:29.680 -> 42:34.960] And then so what happened was I decided that I need my legs to do the talking,
[42:34.960 -> 42:40.000] because when you go in sport and you recognize you end up getting, especially in your own sport,
[42:40.000 -> 42:44.240] people want to know how's it going, papers all after you, it comes to Olympic year,
[42:44.240 -> 42:46.160] they try to put people up on a pedestal.
[42:46.160 -> 42:49.360] And I just thought, I don't want that.
[42:49.360 -> 42:54.480] Do you know what? The only thing that's going to actually make me feel good is me being good.
[42:54.480 -> 42:58.400] So I ended up not doing any media that year until right before the Olympic Games.
[42:58.400 -> 43:03.280] Paula Radcliffe was put on the pedestal, you know, everyone was going to, she was going to be our golden girl,
[43:03.280 -> 43:08.040] which actually helped everybody else because no one else, no one was interested in us, you
[43:08.040 -> 43:11.780] know what I mean? So then what happened was, is the change around was that I had a different
[43:11.780 -> 43:17.120] attitude to high performance, like I knew I could do this. You know, when you've won
[43:17.120 -> 43:21.660] that many medals with that many setbacks, it's like for me fate and staying injury
[43:21.660 -> 43:29.740] free. So anyway, what happened was, is I went to a world championships fell in the indoors and I thought you know like banging down the thing and I thought
[43:29.740 -> 43:35.780] that's alright it's just a blip and I changed my attitude to feeling like everything's against
[43:35.780 -> 43:40.860] me to feeling pick yourself back up you're not injured. You took responsibility. I took
[43:40.860 -> 43:45.340] responsibility of my team I said this is what I expect
[43:45.340 -> 43:50.200] from you this is what I know I want to do and what I can do and then we got to
[43:50.200 -> 43:55.360] holding camp training was like literally going off the roof but I'd lost every
[43:55.360 -> 43:59.960] single 1500 meter run that year and I'd won every single 800 and that was a
[43:59.960 -> 44:06.640] psychological thing I was wanting 1500 meters so bad I run pants, 800m I didn't think I was
[44:06.640 -> 44:11.240] going to take part, I was running how I should. And that's how your brain, if you're good
[44:11.240 -> 44:15.480] at anything, one minute we can do it, the next minute it's like we feel like we're useless
[44:15.480 -> 44:20.120] at something because we haven't clicked that brain in the switch up. So anyway, I get to
[44:20.120 -> 44:29.020] the Olympic Games, training had gone brilliant, hadn't been injured for the rest of the year, I was eating better, sleeping better, happy, relaxed and I
[44:29.020 -> 44:33.320] could run and then when we got to the 800 meters because I only decided that I
[44:33.320 -> 44:36.480] was going to do both like two days before I went into Athens because I
[44:36.480 -> 44:40.240] thought well what have I got to lose? If I'll come back with two medals of any
[44:40.240 -> 44:44.560] color, what a great end to a season. I had a completely different approach, it wasn't
[44:44.560 -> 44:46.560] all I've got to, I've got to, I'vehaid, rydw i'n rhaid, rydw i'n rhaid,
[44:46.560 -> 44:51.360] roeddwn i'n ymwneud â'r brosiect a'i ddweud, gadael, sut rydych chi'n gadael.
[44:51.360 -> 44:54.880] Dyna'r cwestiwn rydw i eisiau gofyn i chi pan roeddech chi'n sôn am
[44:54.880 -> 44:58.880] bod yn y throfod yma yng Nghymru.
[44:58.880 -> 45:01.280] A oes gennych chi'n teimlo y gallech chi wneud mwy
[45:01.280 -> 45:05.880] os oeddwch chi'n dechrau fod yn fwy cynigol i chi'n fwy cynnig? Ie, rydw i'n dweud, gallai i gael yr Olympiaethau hynny yn fy nhrof olympaethau o'r cyntaf more if you'd have started to be be kinder to yourself much earlier? Yeah I
[45:05.880 -> 45:09.680] mean I could have won those Olympics in my first Olympic Games when I come forth
[45:09.680 -> 45:14.000] with stretcher I could have won in Sydney but I was always under pressure
[45:14.000 -> 45:18.320] almost because of like the injuries and then putting myself through that gotta
[45:18.320 -> 45:21.120] get back gotta get back I never reflected you know you don't reflect
[45:21.120 -> 45:25.560] when you're on a physio bed it It's all about get that injury. So I get that injury sorted
[45:25.560 -> 45:30.780] No one really sort of took you on on board and said, okay, so you're going for an injury
[45:31.400 -> 45:37.360] This is going to impact your anxiety. This is going to impact the stress that you're feeling you're going to be worried
[45:37.360 -> 45:41.800] You're going to this you're going to be that it's not just about the injury never had those conversations
[45:41.800 -> 45:44.360] I you also that was an era though where it was all about
[45:47.040 -> 45:49.280] Be brilliant push yourself be best, don't be weak.
[45:49.280 -> 45:50.960] No one in that era was kind to themselves.
[45:50.960 -> 45:51.960] No.
[45:51.960 -> 45:53.560] That was seen as a weakness I think in that era, wasn't it?
[45:53.560 -> 45:59.640] And I think now we're much more open to if you're good to yourself mentally, you, that's
[45:59.640 -> 46:00.640] not a weakness anymore.
[46:00.640 -> 46:03.400] Well in 2003, no one talked about it.
[46:03.400 -> 46:09.400] When I wrote my autobiography, nobody was talking about it in 2005, I hadn't even told my mum, friends, family, no one
[46:09.400 -> 46:12.800] even knew about what was going on in my life up until I wrote my book the year
[46:12.800 -> 46:16.760] after I retired, not one person. Your phone goes off the hook then when the book comes out I imagine.
[46:16.760 -> 46:20.240] Then it goes mental but then you know how many people remember me on the front
[46:20.240 -> 46:24.040] pages of the national newspaper saying I'd sold hard, hardly anyone because it
[46:24.040 -> 46:27.360] was just like fish and chip paper, you said something, let's, you know, next day it's
[46:27.360 -> 46:32.640] gone. And it was only sort of 2017 when I was on a TV show that we're talking about
[46:32.640 -> 46:36.080] it again and everyone's going, oh my god, really? And I said, yeah, I've been talking
[46:36.080 -> 46:41.000] about it since 2005. You're now listening. And sport has now changed. Sport has also
[46:41.000 -> 46:45.000] changed at a high level. Instead of just having a sports psychology focus where it's about, Mae'r sport hefyd wedi newid ar y lefel cyhoeddi. Yn hytrach na bod gennym ffocws o fysgoliaeth sport,
[46:45.000 -> 46:46.000] lle mae'n ymwneud â,
[46:46.000 -> 46:50.000] gallaf ddod i'r trac hwnnw heb fy modd yn teimlo'n anodd,
[46:50.000 -> 46:52.000] dwi ddim yn gallu mynd yno'n dda,
[46:52.000 -> 46:54.000] ac rhaid i rywun fy nghymryd dros y trac.
[46:54.000 -> 46:58.000] Mae'n gwybod nawr eu bod yn angen siarad yn ystod y cyfnod
[46:58.000 -> 47:01.000] o sut rydych chi'n mynd i ddod dros y trac honno.
[47:01.000 -> 47:03.000] Pa rydych chi'n ychwanegu'r rhan o hyn
[47:03.000 -> 47:06.880] o ran, rydych chi'n rhannu llawer o hyn o ran eich iechyd mental, ac rwy'n credu bod hynny'n ddifrif'r ffordd i'r brofod hwnnw. Pa rydych chi'n ei ddrau'r rhan o ran... Rydych chi'n rhanu'r rhan hwn o'ch iechyd meddwl
[47:06.880 -> 47:09.600] ac rwy'n credu bod hwn yn ddarluniaeth wir
[47:09.600 -> 47:11.840] oherwydd mae yna wirfoddolrwydd mewn yr hyn rydych chi'n ei rhanu
[47:11.840 -> 47:13.400] ond rwy'n credu ei fod yn ddangos yn ddefnyddiol.
[47:13.400 -> 47:14.560] Ond rydw i wedi bod yn ddiddorol
[47:14.560 -> 47:16.200] y byddwch chi'n rhanu'r rhan ar rhai pethau
[47:16.200 -> 47:17.280] lle dydych chi ddim yn ymwneud â'i chisgo
[47:17.280 -> 47:19.400] ac nid yw hynny i'r debat.
[47:19.400 -> 47:21.360] Ac rydw i'n ddiddorol o ran
[47:21.360 -> 47:23.400] lle rydych chi'n ddrau'r rhan
[47:23.400 -> 47:24.480] o ran yr hyn rydych chi'n ei rhan
[47:24.480 -> 47:26.000] yn ymhlith yr hyn rydych chi'n ei gael yn y bryd ac pa gwybodaeth byddwch chi'n ddiddorol o ran y lle rydych chi'n dewis ystyried y rhan o ran yr hyn rydych chi'n rhannu yn ymhlith yr hyn rydych chi'n dal i'w gael ar gael,
[47:26.000 -> 47:30.000] a pa gwybodaeth byddwch chi'n rhoi i'r rhai o'r ymdrechion ifanc y byddwn ni'n clywed?
[47:30.000 -> 47:38.000] Iawn, i bawb, wrth gwrs. Rydyn ni'n byw yn ein bywydau ein hunain, ac mae'n unig i ni y byddwn ni'n byw ein bywydau,
[47:38.000 -> 47:49.080] efallai y byddwn ni'n cael teulu a chyfrifyrwyr a phobl o'n gyfran o'n gilydd, ond yn y pwysicrwydd, mae'n ein bywydau, friends and people around us but essentially it's our life right we've all got this in a ability to want to be good at something or to drive and I feel
[47:49.080 -> 47:54.400] like when I share anything to do with the journey of athletics and the emotion
[47:54.400 -> 47:58.240] and the breakdown and that that's a human trait that lots of people will
[47:58.240 -> 48:01.520] come across barriers and setbacks like when I talked about bereavement with my
[48:01.520 -> 48:09.040] mum no one talks about these things but why? You're not happy just because they're now, you know, had the funeral. It's still freaking in you.
[48:09.040 -> 48:14.160] Like I breathed for 18 months, I was in a right state. I believe that there's things that will
[48:14.160 -> 48:19.520] help people by me sharing those things. There's other things, but I've chosen that most people
[48:19.520 -> 48:24.320] know me because I won two gold medals, right? They don't know me for any other reason really,
[48:24.320 -> 48:27.960] apart from what now they're getting to know, but essentially most people know me because I won two gold medals right they don't know me for any other reason really apart from what now they're getting to know but essentially most people know
[48:27.960 -> 48:32.680] me because I won two gold medals so I believe how do I inspire people not just
[48:32.680 -> 48:36.600] athletes anybody to get the best out themselves to be the best version of
[48:36.600 -> 48:41.000] themselves to work hard to be motivated to take responsibility to look at
[48:41.000 -> 48:45.080] yourself be respectful be respectful values. If I can pass
[48:45.080 -> 48:46.440] those that's going to help a lot of
[48:46.440 -> 48:48.640] other people with their mindset on
[48:48.640 -> 48:50.160] expectation that they should get
[48:50.160 -> 48:52.040] something back for it or actually should
[48:52.040 -> 48:53.960] be given to you easy or it's an easy way
[48:53.960 -> 48:55.880] to get to success. No it's freaking not.
[48:55.880 -> 48:58.400] So I shared my life and my journey and
[48:58.400 -> 49:00.040] what happened to me during those heights
[49:00.040 -> 49:02.400] of my season because most people have no
[49:02.400 -> 49:04.920] idea that I went through that. Yet I then
[49:04.920 -> 49:09.240] go even if you've had the worst time of your life ups downs barriers whatever
[49:09.240 -> 49:15.480] they perceive to be in your life and remember never never ever compare
[49:15.480 -> 49:20.400] yourself to someone else's life you know because what I've had happen to me might
[49:20.400 -> 49:23.400] not ever be as bad as somebody else but I'm not living their life I'm living
[49:23.400 -> 49:27.760] mine so what I've had happened to me is was hell for me and I always
[49:27.760 -> 49:32.040] believe if I can articulate that in a way that's motivating that people can
[49:32.040 -> 49:36.320] look at their life and go okay this might be happening or happen but I can
[49:36.320 -> 49:40.960] actually do something else with it or I can take the positives out of the
[49:40.960 -> 49:46.000] negatives see other people still being successful even though they've had bad time that has to be something that motivates others so I've chosen that is y negatifs, gweld pobl eraill yn dal i fod yn llwyr, er mwyn gweld eu bod wedi cael amser ddur,
[49:46.000 -> 49:48.000] mae'n rhaid i hynny fod yn rhywbeth sy'n cymryd ymdrech i'r rhai eraill.
[49:48.000 -> 49:50.000] Felly rydw i wedi dewis, dyna yw'r rhan rydw i'n mynd,
[49:50.000 -> 49:55.000] yw fy mod i a fy ymdrech a'r rhan ymdrechol
[49:55.000 -> 49:59.000] sy'n mynd i gael effaith i bobl fwyaf yn y cymdeithas.
[49:59.000 -> 50:01.000] Rwy'n hoffi'r dealltwriaeth o ble rydych chi'n dewis
[50:01.000 -> 50:03.000] ddraio'r rhan, ond rwy'n credu ei bod yn waith gwych
[50:03.000 -> 50:06.200] yn y dydd a'r byd, mae rhai pethau rydych chi'n eu sgwrs ac rhai dydych chi ddim, ac rydych chi'n eu ddewis hynny. you choose to draw the line though I think it's really powerful in this day and age that there's some things you'll discuss and some you won't and you
[50:06.200 -> 50:10.840] defend that. And people yeah and people have a decision to do it when they want
[50:10.840 -> 50:16.260] and you know as I've got older I never used to speak anything close to me like
[50:16.260 -> 50:20.640] nothing ever I was a closed book like literally always been a closed book and
[50:20.640 -> 50:25.880] now I'm a bit more me I show my personality more on TV I look how I want
[50:25.880 -> 50:28.120] to look now I don't conform I know you
[50:28.120 -> 50:29.280] know you come back from the Olympic
[50:29.280 -> 50:31.600] Games and everyone's going to these
[50:31.600 -> 50:33.200] events you know everyone's got women got
[50:33.200 -> 50:34.480] long hair they're all in their dresses
[50:34.480 -> 50:35.880] and I still wear dresses if I want to
[50:35.880 -> 50:38.120] dress up or whatever but I felt like I
[50:38.120 -> 50:40.600] didn't really again know my identity my
[50:40.600 -> 50:42.600] mum passed away the day she passed away
[50:42.600 -> 50:44.800] I had this hair shaved off my undercut
[50:44.800 -> 50:48.440] because I've been speaking about it for ages and I thought shall I shall I what people think
[50:48.440 -> 50:51.600] What will people say what will people think I look like and I thought I don't care
[50:51.880 -> 50:55.020] Because actually I've still got my values. I still respectful
[50:55.020 -> 50:59.100] I still am me as a person but I want to be who I actually want to be
[50:59.280 -> 51:04.500] So I'll show it in this way, but I don't have to then speak about every single part of my life
[51:04.400 -> 51:05.400] I'll show it in this way, but I don't have to then speak about every single part of my life.
[51:05.400 -> 51:10.360] There's a book by a man called Bob Iger, CEO of Disney, and in it he talks about the fact
[51:10.360 -> 51:15.960] that being completely you, 100% honest in everything you say and everything you do,
[51:15.960 -> 51:19.040] not putting on a front in any respect, is almost like a superpower.
[51:19.040 -> 51:24.720] And once you're brave enough to go, this is me, if you don't like it, fine, but this is
[51:24.720 -> 51:25.160] me and
[51:25.160 -> 51:28.360] that's all I can be it's a really liberating place to get to I think and
[51:28.360 -> 51:31.880] I'm so pleased that you feel that you're there and well I feel that I'm there you know
[51:31.880 -> 51:34.360] there's still things that I wouldn't choose to discuss but that's just
[51:34.360 -> 51:38.840] because you just why why why you know at what point you know you go you might get
[51:38.840 -> 51:42.600] to part in your life at a certain situation it's like when I started to
[51:42.600 -> 51:47.560] speak about this it was a point in my life it was right other Other things that I've come through, there's a point in my life
[51:47.560 -> 51:51.200] that it's right. The bereavement, I had to go through that to now talk about
[51:51.200 -> 51:55.320] bereavement. I didn't when my grandad's and my nan's died because it didn't have
[51:55.320 -> 51:58.480] that same thing. There'd be a point in my life somewhere else that something else
[51:58.480 -> 52:01.240] will come out because I think it's right. But at the moment you don't have to
[52:01.240 -> 52:06.400] shout. Anyone can do what they want in life. If you want to shout about something, shout. If you don't, don't.
[52:06.400 -> 52:11.240] And finally, having waited so long, did it feel how you hoped it would feel when you
[52:11.240 -> 52:15.720] crossed the line and won the gold? Oh my gosh, yeah, more than that.
[52:15.720 -> 52:21.440] A huge weight came off my shoulders. I felt on the 1500 metres, this tonne weight
[52:21.440 -> 52:27.760] literally fly up off my shoulders as I was going out literally felt the thing and I sat in the press conference
[52:27.880 -> 52:34.160] It's just before the four by one men won the gold medal for Great Britain and I said there I can now be me
[52:34.360 -> 52:36.160] That's the lit in my words
[52:36.160 -> 52:39.600] So powerful listen, we always finish with some real quick fire questions
[52:42.160 -> 52:46.880] Three non-negotiable behaviors that you and the people around you must buy into
[52:48.200 -> 52:52.200] Be kind don't judge somebody before you know them and
[52:54.240 -> 52:58.560] Be respectful what advice would you give a teenage Kelly just starting out?
[52:59.120 -> 53:10.160] Actually, I if I was writing the book to her I would would tell her that you're going to go through shit, hell, life, but don't give up because whatever you go through is going to be the making of
[53:10.160 -> 53:11.160] you.
[53:11.160 -> 53:15.360] I always used to say, and this is not football, I used to think that the Olympic Games was
[53:15.360 -> 53:16.360] my destiny.
[53:16.360 -> 53:17.360] I do not believe that now.
[53:17.360 -> 53:18.800] I believe it's my journey.
[53:18.800 -> 53:24.040] My destiny is to talk authentically to people about that period and all the things I've
[53:24.040 -> 53:30.440] gone through to help somebody else. How important is legacy? Legacy is important
[53:30.440 -> 53:34.040] when it's talked about in the right way at the right time. Legacy is only through
[53:34.040 -> 53:38.560] history and proof and things working not just because of you know something
[53:38.560 -> 53:43.040] happens. Example 2012 you know everyone said the legacy but legacy is only now
[53:43.040 -> 53:47.160] getting proven because somebody might have run there in 2012 or be inspired by 2012 and
[53:47.160 -> 53:51.040] then you can say there's a legacy and what's your one golden rule for our
[53:51.040 -> 53:54.840] listeners that want to live a high-performance life believe in
[53:54.840 -> 54:03.440] yourself that is the perfect way to end listen thank you so much for coming on
[54:03.440 -> 54:08.400] thank you being so honest and sharing a story that I know a lot of people still won't
[54:08.400 -> 54:14.240] Be fully across and they won't fully understand and hearing you sit here and talk about it in such an honest way
[54:14.240 -> 54:17.680] I think is without doubt gonna do exactly what you want
[54:17.680 -> 54:24.200] Which is to help people and when you talk about as an athlete 80% is in your head and 20% is in your body
[54:24.200 -> 54:25.520] I think that is
[54:25.520 -> 54:29.080] something that isn't just about athletics that is about life and it's a
[54:29.080 -> 54:32.560] great message. Thank you.
[54:32.720 -> 54:37.720] Damien. Jake. That was um far more emotional than I perhaps thought it
[54:37.720 -> 54:44.080] would be you know. Yeah I think that for somebody to be that open and make
[54:44.080 -> 54:45.160] themselves so vulnerable
[54:45.160 -> 54:52.320] I think is really courageous and that very much came through the big thing that stands out for me is when when you said how
[54:52.320 -> 54:56.840] Much was ability and how much was psychology and I sort of thought she'd go
[54:57.440 -> 55:01.200] What 60% natural ability 40% in the brain?
[55:02.320 -> 55:07.520] 20% ability and I what I love about that is that that is a message that can be applied to any walk of life
[55:07.520 -> 55:12.600] Any person listening to this if you can get the mental side of your life and your approach to life, right?
[55:12.940 -> 55:18.680] Then the rest will follow I wasn't so surprised that her answer to that because it's a question that I've asked
[55:18.840 -> 55:24.680] What I've worked with high-performing sports teams and I normally say how much of it is down to ability how much of it is down?
[55:24.680 -> 55:27.360] to attitude if you like and ym mhob ymdrechion y sportau'n hyfryd, ac rwy'n dweud y bydd y rhan fwyaf o hyn yn ymwneud ag ymdrechion, y rhan fwyaf o hyn yn ymwneud ag ymdrechion, os ydych chi'n hoffi.
[55:27.360 -> 55:30.880] Ac mae'r cyfansoddau'n hyfryd mewn ymdrechion cyffredinol yn 70-30,
[55:30.880 -> 55:34.160] 70% o hyn yw'n ymwneud ag ymdrechion a'r mentaliaeth a'r holl
[55:34.160 -> 55:36.000] y sgiliau'r holl eraill yn fwy llai.
[55:36.000 -> 55:38.560] Gall talent eich cymryd i'r bwrdd,
[55:38.560 -> 55:40.000] am y 30% o hyn.
[55:40.000 -> 55:42.640] Felly rwy'n credu eich bod yn ddweud, mae'n gweithio'n galluol iawn
[55:42.640 -> 55:43.840] i bawb sy'n clywed yma,
[55:43.840 -> 55:47.160] yw gall talent eich cymryd i'r bwrdd, So I think you're right. There's a really powerful message for anyone listening here that this you know talent gets you to the table
[55:47.600 -> 55:53.080] But it's other softer qualities that get you into that realm of high performance
[55:53.520 -> 55:55.520] Enjoyed it. I've loved it. Thanks
[55:56.240 -> 55:59.800] Well on behalf of myself and professor Damien Hughes, I hope that you enjoyed that
[55:59.920 -> 56:04.300] Don't forget you can also watch the interviews on high performance as well as listen to them
[56:04.300 -> 56:09.280] and if you've come to this episode today because there is something in your life that you're unable to accept or
[56:09.440 -> 56:14.880] something that you're hiding or a conversation you feel you need to have and you're struggling with the courage or
[56:15.480 -> 56:17.840] You're just finding it too hard to go there
[56:18.560 -> 56:23.240] There is so much information and help courtesy of high performance that we'd love to share with you
[56:23.240 -> 56:25.580] If you want to join the high performance circle
[56:25.580 -> 56:32.480] Then just go to the high performance podcast comm that's the high performance podcast comm click circle. You'll get your invite
[56:32.480 -> 56:38.300] It's totally free and there are keynote speeches. There are high performance boosts. There are newsletters
[56:38.300 -> 56:43.520] There is recommended reading if you're searching and struggling then there is so much there for you
[56:43.520 -> 56:45.280] So join our free members club,
[56:45.280 -> 56:47.180] the High Performance Circle
[56:47.180 -> 56:50.940] at thehighperformancepodcast.com.
[56:50.940 -> 56:52.440] Thanks to Finn from Rethink Audio,
[56:52.440 -> 56:54.700] to Hannah, to Will, to Eve, to Gemma,
[56:54.700 -> 56:57.880] but most of all, thank you very much to Dame Kelly Holmes
[56:57.880 -> 56:59.980] for coming on the High Performance Podcast
[56:59.980 -> 57:01.760] and sharing so much with us.
[57:01.760 -> 57:03.260] Of course, as we all know, though,
[57:03.260 -> 57:05.300] the news she shared in the last few days is the most important of all. Thanks for being with us and we'll much with us. Of course, as we all know, though, the news she shared in the last few days
[57:05.300 -> 57:07.220] is the most important of all.
[57:07.220 -> None] Thanks for being with us, and we'll see you soon. you