Podcast: The High Performance
Published Date:
Mon, 18 Dec 2023 01:00:28 GMT
Duration:
52:32
Explicit:
False
Guests:
MP3 Audio:
Please note that the summary is generated based on the transcript and may not capture all the nuances or details discussed in the podcast episode.
David reflects on a career spanning more than 20 years in the modelling industry, his experiences defying expectations, and how he has reshaped the industry.
David Gandy is known as one of the most successful male fashion models of all time, having worked with brands such as Hugo Boss, Dolce & Gabbana and Carolina Herrera. Taking a big risk when leaving university early with only 2 modules left to complete, David entered the modeling industry. Jake and Damian explore how David’s risk taking became a pivotal factor in shaping his successful career. Throughout his career, David sought advice from models such as Naomi Campbell on the best way to develop and to secure himself a global brand.
Challenging the negative perceptions of male models became a focus throughout David’s career. He shares with Jake and Damian how he combats imposter syndrome in new and demanding environments. Whilst delving into the darker elements of the industry, David reflects on his experiences with loneliness and depression during his most successful years, sharing his method for turning a negative situation into a positive.
This episode goes beyond the glamour of the fashion world, revealing the strategic thinking and resilience that fuelled David’s journey to redefine the male modelling landscape.
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Sure, here is a summary of the podcast episode transcript:
**Introduction**
* David Gandy, a successful male fashion model, shares his experiences and insights on redefining the industry.
* He discusses his journey from leaving university to pursue modeling, the challenges he faced, and the strategies he used to build his brand.
**Challenging Perceptions**
* Gandy highlights the negative perceptions associated with male models and the lack of recognition they receive compared to female models.
* He emphasizes the importance of self-belief and resilience in overcoming these challenges.
**Building a Brand**
* Gandy explains how he observed the strategies used by successful female models to build their brands.
* He realized the need for a business-oriented approach, involving a team of professionals and a focus on longevity.
**Collaboration and Longevity**
* Gandy discusses the importance of collaboration with brands and establishing long-term relationships.
* He emphasizes the value of providing creative input and working together to achieve shared goals.
**Overcoming Imposter Syndrome**
* Gandy acknowledges the prevalence of imposter syndrome, even among successful individuals.
* He suggests that challenging oneself and embracing new experiences can help overcome self-doubt.
**Dealing with Criticism**
* Gandy addresses the criticism and judgment that models often face regarding their appearance.
* He emphasizes the need for a thick skin and a focus on positive outcomes.
**Redefining the Industry**
* Gandy reflects on his contributions to reshaping the male modeling landscape.
* He highlights the importance of inclusivity and diversity in the industry.
**Conclusion**
* Gandy emphasizes the significance of perseverance, resilience, and a strong work ethic in achieving success.
* He encourages listeners to challenge themselves and pursue their goals despite obstacles.
**Additional Points**
* Gandy shares his experience of being bullied at school and how it shaped his mindset.
* He discusses the importance of observing and learning from others in the industry.
* Gandy highlights the role of his agent, Tandy Anderson, in supporting his career.
The episode provides valuable insights into the world of modeling, the challenges faced by male models, and the strategies for overcoming them. Gandy's personal journey and experiences offer inspiration and guidance for anyone seeking to achieve success in their chosen field.
# Podcast Summary: David Gandy – The High-Performance Podcast
## Overview
* David Gandy is a renowned fashion model, known for his successful career spanning over two decades.
* In this podcast episode, David shares his experiences of defying expectations, reshaping the male modeling industry, and his journey to redefine masculinity in the fashion world.
## Key Points:
### 1. Embracing Risks and Overcoming Challenges:
* David left university with only two modules remaining to pursue a career in modeling, demonstrating his willingness to take risks.
* He sought advice from established models like Naomi Campbell to develop his career and secure a global brand.
* David faced challenges related to his physique, being deemed too big for many fashion shows, but he remained persistent and turned these setbacks into positive opportunities.
### 2. Combating Imposter Syndrome:
* David discusses the prevalence of imposter syndrome, particularly in new and demanding environments.
* He emphasizes the importance of self-belief and perseverance in overcoming self-doubt and achieving success.
### 3. Dealing with the Darker Side of the Industry:
* David reflects on his experiences with loneliness and depression during the peak of his career.
* He shares his strategy of turning negative situations into positive ones, finding opportunities in unexpected places.
### 4. Redefining Masculinity in Fashion:
* David challenged the negative perceptions associated with male models, advocating for a more inclusive and diverse representation of masculinity in the fashion industry.
### 5. Strategic Thinking and Resilience:
* David highlights the importance of strategic thinking and resilience in navigating the fashion world.
* He emphasizes the need for adaptability, embracing change, and constantly seeking new opportunities.
### 6. The Importance of Collaboration:
* David stresses the value of collaboration and teamwork in achieving success.
* He acknowledges the contributions of his team and the challenges of being a founder and creative director.
### 7. Calculated Risk-Taking:
* David discusses his approach to risk-taking, emphasizing the need for careful consideration and planning.
* He highlights the importance of managing risks to ensure financial stability and minimize potential losses.
### 8. Learning from Failures:
* David emphasizes the significance of learning from failures rather than dwelling on successes.
* He believes that failures provide valuable lessons and opportunities for growth.
### 9. Trusting Intuition:
* David emphasizes the importance of trusting one's intuition and gut instinct in making decisions.
* He shares his experiences of making mistakes when ignoring his instincts.
### 10. The Power of Positivity:
* David advocates for maintaining a positive outlook, even in challenging situations.
* He believes that turning negatives into positives can lead to unexpected opportunities and growth.
**David Gandy's Journey in the Modeling Industry: From Risk-Taking to Redefining Male Modeling**
David Gandy, renowned as one of the most successful male fashion models, shares his experiences and reflections on a career spanning over two decades. He recounts his bold decision to leave university with only two modules remaining to pursue a career in modeling, a choice that proved pivotal in shaping his successful trajectory. Gandy highlights the importance of seeking advice from established models like Naomi Campbell and emphasizes the significance of overcoming imposter syndrome in new and challenging environments.
Throughout his career, Gandy faced the negative perceptions often associated with male models. He discusses his battle with loneliness and depression during the peak of his success, emphasizing the importance of turning negative situations into positive outcomes. Gandy's journey extends beyond the glamour of the fashion world, revealing the strategic thinking and resilience that fueled his mission to redefine the male modeling landscape.
**Key Insights:**
* **Risk-Taking and Adaptability:** Gandy's willingness to take risks, such as leaving university early, played a crucial role in his career success. He encourages embracing new challenges and adapting to changing circumstances.
* **Seeking Mentorship and Advice:** Gandy emphasizes the value of seeking guidance and advice from experienced individuals in the industry, highlighting the insights he gained from models like Naomi Campbell.
* **Overcoming Imposter Syndrome:** Gandy openly discusses his struggles with imposter syndrome and shares his strategies for combating self-doubt and insecurity in demanding environments.
* **Turning Negatives into Positives:** Gandy reflects on his experiences with loneliness and depression during his most successful years, emphasizing the importance of resilience and finding ways to transform negative situations into opportunities for growth.
* **Redefining Male Modeling:** Gandy's career has been marked by his efforts to challenge stereotypes and redefine the perception of male models. He emphasizes the need for male models to demonstrate intelligence, drive, and a commitment to their craft.
* **Strategic Thinking and Resilience:** Gandy's journey highlights the importance of strategic thinking and resilience in achieving success. He shares his approach to building a successful brand and his commitment to driving positive change in the industry.
**Conclusion:**
David Gandy's journey in the modeling industry is a testament to the power of risk-taking, resilience, and a commitment to challenging stereotypes. His experiences offer valuable insights for aspiring models and entrepreneurs, emphasizing the importance of seeking mentorship, overcoming self-doubt, and embracing new opportunities. Gandy's passion for his craft and his dedication to redefining the male modeling landscape have left a lasting impact on the industry, inspiring others to follow in his footsteps.
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[00:28.640 -> 00:33.680] Jake Humphrey Hi there, you're listening to High Performance,
[00:33.680 -> 00:37.840] the award-winning podcast that unlocks the minds of some of the most fascinating people
[00:37.840 -> 00:42.640] on the planet. I'm Jake Humphrey, and alongside Professor Damian Hughes, we learn from the
[00:42.640 -> 00:45.200] stories, successes, and struggles of our
[00:45.200 -> 00:51.360] guests allowing us all to explore, be challenged and to grow. Here's what's coming up today.
[00:52.720 -> 00:57.040] Of course there's still the connotations about a male model but often the conceptions are
[00:57.040 -> 01:02.400] completely wrong. If you have not got imposter syndrome you are not challenging yourself. If
[01:02.400 -> 01:06.200] you're sitting there every day going I'm very comfortable, I know what I'm doing.
[01:06.200 -> 01:08.320] Put yourself in a situation that's kind of scary.
[01:08.320 -> 01:09.680] And I've always kind of done that,
[01:09.680 -> 01:11.720] thinking what on earth am I doing here?
[01:11.720 -> 01:12.840] It's a massive challenge
[01:12.840 -> 01:14.520] and it scares the living daylights out of me.
[01:14.520 -> 01:17.120] But the feeling I get from taking,
[01:17.120 -> 01:19.600] you know, sort of achieving that is worth it.
[01:21.360 -> 01:23.960] So welcome to High Performance, David Gandy,
[01:23.960 -> 01:26.640] a man who turned the male modeling industry
[01:26.640 -> 01:31.280] on its head. One of the most recognized models on the planet, a man who's been at the top of his
[01:31.280 -> 01:37.680] game for over 20 years. But who actually is the man behind the good looks? The insecurities,
[01:37.680 -> 01:43.680] the ambition, the hard work, the rejections, the lessons. It's all on its way in this fantastic
[01:43.680 -> 01:46.320] episode of the High Performance Podcast.
[01:46.320 -> 01:50.120] And you can actually get even more from David Gandy on the High Performance app. He will
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[04:56.580 -> 05:01.540] David thank you very much for joining us. Thank you for having us Gary. What is high
[05:01.540 -> 05:07.640] performance to you? High performance is seeing something as maybe a success to people,
[05:07.640 -> 05:10.320] whether how you gauge that is up to you.
[05:10.320 -> 05:13.040] But I always, Winston Churchill said, you know,
[05:13.040 -> 05:15.840] success is defined by him from going from failure to failure
[05:15.840 -> 05:17.680] without lack of enthusiasm.
[05:17.680 -> 05:20.800] That to me is high performance, if you can keep doing that.
[05:20.800 -> 05:24.080] And we all know, even on a daily basis,
[05:24.080 -> 05:25.280] people think of a failure, a failure
[05:25.280 -> 05:31.420] of a business or financially, everything else, but there's failures every day. And you have
[05:31.420 -> 05:37.820] to sort of overcome those and still higher perform and still try and be the best and
[05:37.820 -> 05:42.440] it's problem solving. And I think if you can still have that enthusiasm and keep on going
[05:42.440 -> 05:45.160] and going and going and going. And you ever meet
[05:45.160 -> 05:50.120] some of the most successful people with a high performance is they're just overcoming
[05:50.120 -> 05:54.760] failures, failures, problems in the way, but they can see far enough in the future to go
[05:54.760 -> 06:01.000] and I'm going to keep plugging away at this. And to me, that sums up so much of my career
[06:01.000 -> 06:07.320] is just things have gone wrong, but it's still a belief and enthusiasm to high perform that you know you're going to get there
[06:07.320 -> 06:12.200] in the end so that's kind of what it is to me. So if we rewind as many years as
[06:12.200 -> 06:17.000] you like when did you first realize that actually success is keep on going
[06:17.000 -> 06:21.640] forwards despite challenges despite struggles despite failure? Probably
[06:21.640 -> 06:25.640] learnt it at school you know I don't this is going to be a big thing, I was bullied at
[06:25.640 -> 06:31.040] school and all these different things, but I didn't quite fit into school. Didn't fit
[06:31.040 -> 06:33.640] in with the people, always did different things. I had certain years.
[06:33.640 -> 06:34.640] What way?
[06:34.640 -> 06:43.840] I can't really tell you, but it put me in good stead, because I didn't worry about anyone
[06:43.840 -> 06:45.560] else. I didn't worry about what they said, I didn't try and fit in, I say, put me in good stead because I didn't worry about anyone else. I didn't worry about what they said.
[06:45.560 -> 06:48.260] I didn't join, you know, try and fit in.
[06:48.260 -> 06:49.700] I just kept myself to myself
[06:49.700 -> 06:53.120] and not trying to follow the crowd or do the same thing.
[06:53.120 -> 06:55.760] And I realised that was what people call now
[06:55.760 -> 06:57.080] is a little bit disruptive
[06:57.080 -> 06:58.680] because that's basically what I did in the fashion industry
[06:58.680 -> 06:59.720] and what I'm trying to do now.
[06:59.720 -> 07:01.440] So let's fast forward a little bit
[07:01.440 -> 07:04.320] to when you decided to eventually go to university
[07:04.320 -> 07:06.360] and then probably walk away from completing your university degree fast forward a little bit to when you decided to eventually go to university
[07:03.680 -> 07:08.360] and then probably walk away from
[07:06.360 -> 07:10.680] completing your university degree when
[07:08.360 -> 07:13.480] you got the opportunity to be a model. I
[07:10.680 -> 07:15.760] wonder whether that disruptive mindset was
[07:13.480 -> 07:17.320] present then as well and I think it'd be
[07:15.760 -> 07:19.760] interesting for people how you came to
[07:17.320 -> 07:21.400] what is a huge life decision when
[07:19.760 -> 07:23.840] you're when you're that sort of age to
[07:21.400 -> 07:25.440] quit university. Well at that point and I
[07:23.840 -> 07:26.160] had done I know two and three-quarter years at university,
[07:26.160 -> 07:29.480] and it's madness. I had a couple of modules to go. I was out and people were like, how
[07:29.480 -> 07:33.040] are you out? You've got a couple to stay. And I was like, no, there is an opportunity
[07:33.040 -> 07:37.840] here and I'm going to take it. And that's when I got the contract with Select Model
[07:37.840 -> 07:42.280] Agency. I wasn't the right look at the time, I wasn't the right build, I was very green
[07:42.280 -> 07:47.000] into the fashion industry, didn't have a clue how it worked, but there was an intriguing element to it.
[07:47.000 -> 07:50.060] And then started to observe.
[07:50.060 -> 07:53.400] And I always say it's five years of observing.
[07:53.400 -> 07:54.860] I didn't get many jobs.
[07:55.900 -> 07:57.280] I was doing okay,
[07:57.280 -> 07:58.800] but it wasn't particularly what I wanted to do,
[07:58.800 -> 08:00.840] but I could see where it could lead.
[08:00.840 -> 08:04.320] So that observation, I was looking at the female models
[08:04.320 -> 08:05.120] and we all knew the female
[08:05.120 -> 08:10.080] was a female supermodels. You don't need to know the surnames. You've got Chrissy, Cindy,
[08:10.080 -> 08:13.960] Naomi and I was like, you don't even need to know the surnames. This is how, but you
[08:13.960 -> 08:18.480] couldn't name a male model. And I was like, why is this? And I was intrigued by it. You
[08:18.480 -> 08:24.000] know, I'm curious of why this was. And you had big models at a time that you wouldn't
[08:24.000 -> 08:25.080] know names of, but
[08:25.080 -> 08:29.200] we knew them in the industry, and they would get to like a certain ceiling. And then that
[08:29.200 -> 08:33.080] was it. Almost like everyone went, oh, that's as far as you can go. You can't go any further
[08:33.080 -> 08:37.440] than that. So that's why a lot of models would then go into acting or music or something
[08:37.440 -> 08:42.800] else. So my curiosity was, well, how did the female models do it? And I was very fortunate
[08:42.800 -> 08:45.200] to work with Naomi and a couple of others,
[08:45.200 -> 08:46.200] and I asked them.
[08:46.480 -> 08:48.000] And they said, almost some ways,
[08:48.000 -> 08:50.560] you know, Kristen Turlington, you know, sort of came,
[08:50.560 -> 08:53.680] and I could see she came with not an entourage,
[08:53.680 -> 08:56.480] but just a couple of members of good teams, PRs,
[08:56.480 -> 08:58.800] and I said, ah, this is a business.
[08:59.520 -> 09:00.560] This is a brand.
[09:00.560 -> 09:01.840] You are a brand.
[09:01.840 -> 09:04.720] You've built, you know, that name is,
[09:04.720 -> 09:05.160] I mean, you just say, Kristi and Naomi, you instantly know it. You've built, you
[09:02.600 -> 09:07.520] know, that name is, I mean, you just say
[09:05.160 -> 09:09.360] Christiane Aimee, you instantly know it.
[09:07.520 -> 09:12.600] So it's that recognizable, and why hasn't
[09:09.360 -> 09:14.040] a guy done this? But you need a
[09:12.600 -> 09:16.280] platform to be able to do that. You needed
[09:14.040 -> 09:18.040] to, you know, be known outside the
[09:16.280 -> 09:20.200] industry. Yeah, so what were guys doing
[09:18.040 -> 09:21.760] then that was different to that? They
[09:20.200 -> 09:23.280] weren't running it as a business, and
[09:21.760 -> 09:24.960] they didn't have the PRs, they
[09:23.280 -> 09:27.600] didn't have the managers, they had agencies, but they didn't have a brand.
[09:27.600 -> 09:29.880] They didn't name, you know, so...
[09:29.880 -> 09:32.480] We then got light blue with Dolce & Gabbana.
[09:32.480 -> 09:35.520] There's a whole story of how we got that.
[09:35.520 -> 09:37.160] What?
[09:37.160 -> 09:39.600] I said to my agent, Tandy Anderson,
[09:39.600 -> 09:41.880] I said, I'm out. I'm done.
[09:41.880 -> 09:43.960] I don't want to do this, like, anymore.
[09:43.960 -> 09:45.840] I'm going to do
[09:44.560 -> 09:48.480] something else. At what stage was that?
[09:45.840 -> 09:49.960] That was a stage when actually I
[09:48.480 -> 09:53.880] was doing a lot of commercial catalogue
[09:49.960 -> 09:55.640] work. You are traveling the
[09:53.880 -> 09:56.880] world, you're earning good money, but it wasn't
[09:55.640 -> 09:58.680] what I wanted to do. How many years in
[09:56.880 -> 10:01.520] are you at this point? Four and a
[09:58.680 -> 10:04.440] half, five. Right. And what was that not
[10:01.520 -> 10:06.320] fulfilling then? Anything I wanted to do
[10:04.440 -> 10:07.120] in like the industry. It was, it was, you weren't working with the best
[10:07.120 -> 10:10.240] creatives, you weren't leaving any form of legacy, you're seeing these big campaigns,
[10:10.240 -> 10:13.360] you weren't part of it, you weren't working with, not insulting the photographers,
[10:13.360 -> 10:16.880] the greatest photographers. And that's what I wanted to do. And I always had in my head,
[10:16.880 -> 10:21.360] you know, I looked at the Levi's guys, or that was him and the Levi's commercials.
[10:21.360 -> 10:25.000] And I was like, imagine if you could be in one of those like commercials.
[10:25.000 -> 10:26.160] And that probably would have been enough
[10:26.160 -> 10:28.840] to leave that iconic commercial.
[10:28.840 -> 10:30.880] And I said, that's what I wanna do.
[10:30.880 -> 10:32.620] And she said, it's okay.
[10:32.620 -> 10:34.640] She said, guys would kill to be in your position
[10:34.640 -> 10:37.200] of what you're earning and what you're doing at the moment.
[10:37.200 -> 10:40.320] I was like, okay, but I see a different pattern here.
[10:40.320 -> 10:42.000] I think we can go bigger.
[10:42.000 -> 10:44.400] Now a lot of agents at that point would have gone,
[10:44.400 -> 10:45.540] you're mad
[10:50.820 -> 10:53.440] No, we're not, you know, we're not trying to a rock the boat here. Let's continue. She's earning her percentage They're earning you're earning good money. I'm in good money. She went, okay
[10:54.340 -> 10:56.980] I'm canceling all of your clients as of tomorrow
[10:56.980 -> 11:02.720] You're not gonna work for anyone because we need to change the perception of how you are in the industry from catalog commercial
[11:02.760 -> 11:04.760] to editorial fashion and
[11:04.560 -> 11:01.320] of how you are in the industry from
[11:06.600 -> 11:04.560] catalog commercial to editorial fashion
[11:09.480 -> 11:06.600] and starting branding and that's exactly
[11:10.560 -> 11:09.480] what she did. Scary? No, I didn't have
[11:12.760 -> 11:10.560] anything to lose, I didn't want to do it
[11:15.920 -> 11:12.760] anyway. Can I go back and just
[11:18.120 -> 11:15.920] explore that that first observation you
[11:20.480 -> 11:18.120] had of male models and not household
[11:22.440 -> 11:20.480] names and you're seeing females. So you've
[11:24.720 -> 11:22.440] left university, you've gone into an
[11:25.480 -> 11:28.280] industry that by your own confession, you don't know a lot about
[11:25.480 -> 11:31.640] and you're observing it, that willingness to
[11:28.280 -> 11:35.120] almost pit yourself against these
[11:31.640 -> 11:36.840] household names, these supermodels, as
[11:35.120 -> 11:38.840] opposed to just seeing it as how do I
[11:36.840 -> 11:41.240] survive in this industry, how do I get by,
[11:38.840 -> 11:43.400] is quite an interesting dynamic and I'm
[11:41.240 -> 11:45.440] interested as to what gave you the
[11:43.400 -> 11:46.600] confidence to
[11:44.080 -> 11:50.680] look that far ahead rather than just
[11:46.600 -> 11:52.200] look to make a living? No idea, it's once
[11:50.680 -> 11:54.120] I mean I look back now and go what were
[11:52.200 -> 11:55.360] you doing? Like that it's like to have but
[11:54.120 -> 11:57.280] I didn't have anything to lose and I
[11:55.360 -> 11:59.600] think that was, it's different now,
[11:57.280 -> 12:01.200] like once you you get to a point and
[11:59.600 -> 12:04.080] you've earned the money and you've built
[12:01.200 -> 12:06.160] your brand, to then take a chance of
[12:04.080 -> 12:05.200] losing that, you're losing a lifestyle. To me built your brand, to then take a chance of losing that,
[12:05.200 -> 12:06.120] you're losing a lifestyle.
[12:06.120 -> 12:07.600] To me, I was traveling the world,
[12:07.600 -> 12:09.120] but I didn't have,
[12:09.120 -> 12:11.280] no, it's not the lifestyle that you wanted.
[12:12.200 -> 12:14.200] But now I've got responsibilities.
[12:14.200 -> 12:15.600] That's how I didn't have responsibilities.
[12:15.600 -> 12:16.480] It was a lovely time.
[12:16.480 -> 12:17.320] It was one of my favorite times
[12:17.320 -> 12:18.200] and you can sort of imagine,
[12:18.200 -> 12:19.040] you can do anything.
[12:19.040 -> 12:21.640] My whole point to my early twenties,
[12:21.640 -> 12:23.240] even late twenties, was like,
[12:23.240 -> 12:24.320] what can you do?
[12:24.320 -> 12:26.520] It was a gorgeous thing, you had options.
[12:26.520 -> 12:27.760] And that still to me was an option
[12:27.760 -> 12:28.660] to go and do something else.
[12:28.660 -> 12:31.040] But it was near a Tandy who said,
[12:31.040 -> 12:33.280] and everyone's saying, oh, you're so Armani,
[12:33.280 -> 12:35.360] I remember this, Armani, Armani, Armani.
[12:35.360 -> 12:37.360] And Tandy went, you're Dolce & Gabbana,
[12:37.360 -> 12:38.280] you're Dolce & Gabbana.
[12:38.280 -> 12:40.640] Forget Armani, forget everything else, you're Dolce.
[12:40.640 -> 12:43.800] And I was like, all right, Tandy, I'm gonna listen to you.
[12:43.800 -> 12:46.600] And then she orchestrated this.
[12:46.600 -> 12:50.880] There was a party for Mariano, the Van Gogh photographer,
[12:50.880 -> 12:53.080] and Domenico and Stefano were going to be there.
[12:53.080 -> 12:54.520] So this was a party, and Tand said,
[12:54.520 -> 12:57.200] you're going to come to pretend to pick up an airline ticket
[12:57.200 -> 12:58.800] that you've got to have to travel to.
[12:58.800 -> 13:01.240] This was a complete orchestrated story.
[13:01.240 -> 13:04.680] So I went there, and I said, hi, Mariano, thanks for letting
[13:04.680 -> 13:06.600] me go. And there was a ticket that was produced. I
[13:06.600 -> 13:09.000] said, thanks so much. She said, let me just go and say
[13:09.000 -> 13:11.600] hello to, you know, come say hello to Domenico and Stefano.
[13:11.600 -> 13:13.800] I said, hi guys, how are you? And they looked and you
[13:13.800 -> 13:17.200] could see that it's went, okay. Week after I was on the
[13:17.200 -> 13:20.300] campaign to do the campaign out in LA with Steve Meisel.
[13:20.300 -> 13:23.700] So I did the campaign and then we went back to go and
[13:23.700 -> 13:26.840] do the show and in campaign and then we went
[13:23.000 -> 13:29.360] back to go and do the show and in Milan
[13:26.840 -> 13:31.640] and then Heidi called me, my agent said
[13:29.360 -> 13:33.840] there's a negotiation started with
[13:31.640 -> 13:35.640] fragrance and a fragrance is the pinnacle
[13:33.840 -> 13:38.120] of what you want in, you know, as a model.
[13:35.640 -> 13:39.720] Don't know what it is, it's Dolce. And we then
[13:38.120 -> 13:41.480] found out it was like, well I didn't know it
[13:39.720 -> 13:45.080] was light blue, it was light blue, Mario
[13:41.480 -> 13:45.600] Testino and then from there we, it was Light Blue, Mario Testino
[13:42.100 -> 13:48.760] and then from there we… that was the start of
[13:45.600 -> 13:51.080] everything. So can I ask you about the
[13:48.760 -> 13:53.280] world of modelling? Because my only frame
[13:51.080 -> 13:54.960] of reference for that is the film like
[13:53.280 -> 13:59.320] The Devil Wears Prada or something like
[13:54.960 -> 14:01.560] that. Which… I'm not a follower. Right, but I'm interested, I know
[13:59.320 -> 14:02.800] nothing about the culture of it. I wonder
[14:01.560 -> 14:04.800] if you could explain a bit about that
[14:02.800 -> 14:06.560] to us. I think there's something about
[14:04.800 -> 14:05.360] the fashion industry, is that mystery is the culture of it. I wonder if you could explain a bit about that to us. I think
[14:04.280 -> 14:08.400] there's something about the fashion industry
[14:05.360 -> 14:11.760] is that mystery is the appeal to it. I think
[14:08.400 -> 14:13.440] people get wrapped up in the culture. I've
[14:11.760 -> 14:14.720] never, again I'm going to say this now,
[14:13.440 -> 14:16.640] I never really fit in in school, never
[14:14.720 -> 14:20.720] really fit in university, never really felt I
[14:16.640 -> 14:23.680] fit in in the fashion industry. So I've
[14:20.720 -> 14:26.560] very much been my individual person to
[14:23.680 -> 14:26.000] within, within the industry.
[14:26.000 -> 14:29.800] And I think you can delve as much into that as you want,
[14:29.800 -> 14:32.000] or you can sort of stay quiet.
[14:32.000 -> 14:35.000] I always say, hopefully people say to me,
[14:35.000 -> 14:39.000] you're quite grounded, you're back to your Essex roots.
[14:39.000 -> 14:41.000] And I say, yeah, that's the way I've been brought up.
[14:41.000 -> 14:44.000] So it's an incredible industry.
[14:44.000 -> 14:49.440] And that's why I think there was a fascination to me to be more involved in it. But I always got
[14:49.440 -> 14:52.760] to a point where instead of the industry using you, which I think it does to a lot
[14:52.760 -> 14:57.320] of people, is I wanted to use the industry and be in complete control. And
[14:57.320 -> 15:02.240] that's where I saw it. I didn't want to be... I saw a lot of people who were
[15:02.240 -> 15:05.520] told where to be, what to do, what to wear, how to do their hair, how
[15:05.520 -> 15:10.040] to, where they should be. And I was like, you're not in control of anything. So again,
[15:10.040 -> 15:14.320] to turn it, a complete business, just turning it into a business model. So when we got Light
[15:14.320 -> 15:18.800] Blue, we then, that was it. It was, everyone knew me, they didn't know my name. They knew
[15:18.800 -> 15:23.600] me as the guy in the white swimming trunks. So then we started to build a team, PR, the
[15:23.600 -> 15:28.600] agencies, and to then build the name into a brand.
[15:28.600 -> 15:31.080] But you must have had to sell like the grand vision.
[15:31.080 -> 15:32.360] Like what were you thinking at that point?
[15:32.360 -> 15:35.240] Were you thinking, I want the David Gandy brand
[15:35.240 -> 15:37.240] to be here in five years or 10 years
[15:37.240 -> 15:40.080] or next week, next month?
[15:40.080 -> 15:41.640] Yeah, so I mean, we always, I mean,
[15:41.640 -> 15:42.640] I always work in my head.
[15:42.640 -> 15:45.520] I don't often tell people five year or 10 year plans.
[15:46.080 -> 15:51.920] Um, but that was, I think the underlying thing was build a brand, build a name,
[15:52.440 -> 15:53.360] be in control of it.
[15:53.520 -> 15:58.320] So my thought was, why do you want to work 350 days a year for different brands
[15:58.840 -> 16:02.480] earning this amount of money when you can work for two brands, work for six days a
[16:02.480 -> 16:05.680] year on quadruple the money.
[16:05.680 -> 16:07.120] That was literally my logical thing.
[16:07.120 -> 16:08.920] People, yeah, but that men can't get that.
[16:08.920 -> 16:10.360] You can't get exclusive contracts.
[16:10.360 -> 16:12.840] So that's what the female models were doing.
[16:12.840 -> 16:14.120] Yeah, yeah, of course they worked for,
[16:14.120 -> 16:16.440] and Cindy Crawford said,
[16:16.440 -> 16:17.640] you know, I want a marriage,
[16:17.640 -> 16:19.160] I don't want a one night stand with a brand.
[16:19.160 -> 16:21.200] So you work with a brand.
[16:21.200 -> 16:29.300] And that's where my longevity with M&S, Dolce & Gabbana, Jaguar, Vitabiotics, M&S,
[16:29.300 -> 16:32.040] that all came about, longevity, longevity.
[16:32.040 -> 16:33.040] And working with them,
[16:33.040 -> 16:34.860] working on working with them on a three year,
[16:34.860 -> 16:35.820] four year plan.
[16:37.260 -> 16:40.080] That those days, I mean, we still do that.
[16:40.080 -> 16:42.600] But if you look at those days have completely changed now,
[16:42.600 -> 16:44.940] like talking to brands about longevity,
[16:44.940 -> 16:46.500] above six months.
[16:46.500 -> 16:47.800] I mean, they're just about social.
[16:47.800 -> 16:49.300] The next, next, next, next.
[16:49.300 -> 16:51.300] And I try and go and explain to a brand,
[16:51.300 -> 16:54.560] look, this has to be a two year, three year collaboration.
[16:54.560 -> 16:56.460] So what do you take us into those meetings then?
[16:56.460 -> 16:59.420] Cause I'm interested of how you change minds
[16:59.420 -> 17:02.760] and get people to invest in that longer term relationship.
[17:03.660 -> 17:07.520] Some of it its management who
[17:04.960 -> 17:11.280] approach anyway, so you know, VitaBiotics
[17:07.520 -> 17:12.960] was sort of a meeting that came
[17:11.280 -> 17:14.680] about where they were walking out of a
[17:12.960 -> 17:16.640] meeting and they'd just come out of a
[17:14.680 -> 17:18.480] meeting saying we want to go, we want to
[17:16.640 -> 17:21.440] move away from just using sports people
[17:18.480 -> 17:24.280] to more lifestyle. I walked in, had been
[17:21.440 -> 17:25.800] using Wellman for a long time, it's
[17:24.280 -> 17:27.000] his own thing, I've been using Wellman since I was 20.
[17:27.000 -> 17:28.400] Not a lie, it's actually genuine.
[17:28.400 -> 17:30.700] And I said, Tej, nice to meet you, I'm David.
[17:31.600 -> 17:33.360] Your products are great, I really like, respect.
[17:33.360 -> 17:36.240] I use your proteins, I use Wellman since I was 20.
[17:36.240 -> 17:37.480] And of course that just came about
[17:37.480 -> 17:39.560] and they almost light bulbs went off
[17:39.560 -> 17:40.680] like around the room to management.
[17:40.680 -> 17:41.880] They went, oh, hang on a minute,
[17:41.880 -> 17:44.840] let's just go back and we'll have a quick conversation.
[17:44.840 -> 17:45.920] And they said, how do you see it? And I, so I said to them, I said, oh, hang on a minute, let's just go back and we'll have a quick conversation. And they said, how do you see it?
[17:45.920 -> 17:47.920] And I, you know, so I said to them, I said, look,
[17:47.920 -> 17:49.920] I love what you do.
[17:49.920 -> 17:52.920] I would love to go on and help you with the creative.
[17:52.920 -> 17:54.080] I think that can be improved.
[17:54.080 -> 17:55.800] And I think you'd like your life, you know,
[17:55.800 -> 17:56.880] if you're selling a lifestyle,
[17:56.880 -> 17:58.320] you need to sell it in shoots and creative.
[17:58.320 -> 17:59.140] That's what I do.
[17:59.140 -> 18:00.800] That's what we do to bring on a team.
[18:00.800 -> 18:02.720] And that, and we've collaborated together
[18:02.720 -> 18:04.280] and we've seen that, you know,
[18:04.280 -> 18:06.440] well, we do extremely, extremely well.
[18:06.440 -> 18:09.200] Hence, you know, we've been going six years with them.
[18:09.200 -> 18:12.480] Yet, the biggest thing for me was,
[18:12.480 -> 18:13.920] of course, there's still the connotations
[18:13.920 -> 18:15.400] about a male model.
[18:15.400 -> 18:18.040] Most people, the only, as you said,
[18:18.040 -> 18:20.640] you don't have anything, you don't know much
[18:20.640 -> 18:22.280] about the fashion industry,
[18:22.280 -> 18:24.080] about the culture, about the people,
[18:25.160 -> 18:28.240] but often the conceptions are completely wrong.
[18:28.240 -> 18:31.440] Like, you know, being that sort of Zoolander model,
[18:31.440 -> 18:32.920] that's what you're seen as.
[18:32.920 -> 18:35.520] Like not much of a brain being told what to do
[18:35.520 -> 18:36.340] and all those different things.
[18:36.340 -> 18:39.520] So when I had to, when I walked into meetings,
[18:39.520 -> 18:41.360] of course, I would hear it.
[18:41.360 -> 18:43.360] People would go, what, we're meeting the guy
[18:43.360 -> 18:48.400] in the white pants, this guy. So that was, I was like, right, so in the meeting I had to straight away
[18:48.400 -> 18:53.120] change that within the first five minutes. So there's a lot of people listening to this
[18:53.120 -> 18:57.600] that may be baffling stereotypes in different ways, it might be race, gender,
[18:57.600 -> 19:06.360] disability, religion. Yours is the stereotype of the dumb male
[19:03.000 -> 19:10.200] model. So how do you go about challenging that
[19:06.360 -> 19:14.000] stereotype? Well I've always said you
[19:10.200 -> 19:16.360] you take on the doubters by being
[19:14.000 -> 19:18.000] successful. That's the
[19:16.360 -> 19:19.440] biggest thing, anyone can insult
[19:18.000 -> 19:20.840] you. No one can insult me as much
[19:19.440 -> 19:23.280] as I can insult myself by the way. Like
[19:20.840 -> 19:24.760] that's my biggest critic. I can
[19:23.280 -> 19:26.480] imagine there's people
[19:23.960 -> 19:29.600] listening to this that think that in many
[19:26.480 -> 19:32.120] ways you, you won the genetic lottery, you
[19:29.600 -> 19:35.320] have got a distinctive look, but I'm
[19:32.120 -> 19:38.480] interested in the kind of self-talk that
[19:35.320 -> 19:40.000] you engage in. Do you see that, that there's
[19:38.480 -> 19:42.800] an element of look or do you beat
[19:40.000 -> 19:46.680] yourself up for what you haven't done or
[19:42.800 -> 19:46.720] what you can't done or
[19:42.800 -> 19:48.080] what you can't do? I didn't beat myself up I
[19:46.720 -> 19:49.880] don't think I did, I hope I worked my
[19:48.080 -> 19:51.520] strengths. I always sort of said to people
[19:49.880 -> 19:53.600] you work within, you know, there are sort
[19:51.520 -> 19:56.440] of limits to what you can do. There's a
[19:53.600 -> 19:58.400] lot of guys, and I don't think I don't
[19:56.440 -> 20:00.640] look in the mirror and go yeah you've got it
[19:58.400 -> 20:02.760] it's what it takes. Because there are
[20:00.640 -> 20:05.400] guys in every agency that are better
[20:02.760 -> 20:06.880] looking, better models Instafashion tree more than me
[20:08.640 -> 20:10.800] Always have been the difference was
[20:11.720 -> 20:15.640] I just did a bit different. I ran it as a business
[20:16.520 -> 20:22.440] And had the had the name of the branding that's that's the way I did it differently and I said, yeah
[20:22.440 -> 20:25.160] I'm definitely not the best model. I'm definitely not the best looking.
[20:25.160 -> 20:26.480] Never ever thought I was.
[20:27.520 -> 20:28.920] You know, if a well wear now,
[20:28.920 -> 20:32.800] is my team, you know, for which is my new clothing brand.
[20:32.800 -> 20:34.240] Yeah, my team literally have to force me
[20:34.240 -> 20:36.840] to go and like model for my own stuff
[20:36.840 -> 20:38.200] because I want to give the opportunity.
[20:38.200 -> 20:40.760] I think there are better models that can do it than me.
[20:42.120 -> 20:44.360] And I've kind of always thought that.
[20:44.360 -> 20:46.360] So it was always the business creative side that I've kind of always thought that. So it was always the business creative side
[20:46.360 -> 20:48.080] that I've probably loved more than,
[20:48.080 -> 20:51.920] I did more than actually being in front of the camera.
[20:51.920 -> 20:52.880] And I keep trying to come back.
[20:52.880 -> 20:55.120] Do you have doubts about how you look or not?
[20:56.920 -> 20:59.440] You know, you can probably call that,
[20:59.440 -> 21:01.480] in anything is like there's an imposter syndrome.
[21:01.480 -> 21:03.240] I think in anything, I think I've always had that.
[21:03.240 -> 21:05.040] I think a lot of people have it, a lot of successful,
[21:05.040 -> 21:08.000] if you talk to successful people, they've had it.
[21:08.000 -> 21:10.080] But I always try and put a positive on something
[21:10.080 -> 21:12.040] and said, you should have it.
[21:12.040 -> 21:13.360] And they were, what do you mean by that?
[21:13.360 -> 21:15.880] I said, because if you have not got imposter syndrome
[21:15.880 -> 21:18.280] and you are not challenging yourself,
[21:18.280 -> 21:19.520] if you're sitting there every day going,
[21:19.520 -> 21:22.280] I'm very comfortable, I know what I'm doing,
[21:22.280 -> 21:29.540] and that to a lot of people is absolutely fine, not for me, I'm like, right. I've done this. What's that next? Where am I going from there?
[21:29.540 -> 21:34.720] Put yourself in a situation that's kind of scary and I've always kind of done that today's putting yourself in again
[21:34.720 -> 21:36.280] What am I doing here?
[21:36.280 -> 21:40.720] Probably why don't really think you know, I go to the British Fashion Award and go what you doing here on the red carpet?
[21:41.200 -> 21:49.920] Someone's gonna pull you aside and go. yeah, you've had a good 20 years, like, let's forget this. But it's all those situations. And that goes for like challenging
[21:49.920 -> 21:54.560] other things in life as well, like, I don't know, powerboat racing that I've done and,
[21:54.560 -> 21:58.240] and, you know, racing the Mille Miglia and all these different things. I'm not having a
[21:58.240 -> 22:08.880] clue what I'm doing there. But no, it's a massive challenge and it scares the living daylights out of me. But the feeling I get from, you know, sort of taking,
[22:08.880 -> 22:11.720] you know, sort of achieving that is worth it.
[22:11.720 -> 22:13.500] There's always a bit of, you know,
[22:13.500 -> 22:15.600] a reward at the end for a couple of days.
[22:15.600 -> 22:18.640] Have you got comfortable with people having an opinion
[22:18.640 -> 22:22.240] about how you look, how you stand, the color of your eyes,
[22:22.240 -> 22:26.560] the waves in your hair, the size of your
[22:24.800 -> 22:28.760] pecs. It's like that's what the fashion
[22:26.560 -> 22:31.760] industry is like. You are just standing
[22:28.760 -> 22:33.720] there going, judge me. Yeah, you
[22:31.760 -> 22:36.880] have to have a thick skin but you
[22:33.720 -> 22:40.280] realize again, you know, I'm now, I've done
[22:36.880 -> 22:42.400] creatives and I have to cast models.
[22:40.280 -> 22:43.760] I've been in the worst castings ever, you
[22:42.400 -> 22:45.440] know, I'd like this and I probably
[22:43.760 -> 22:46.220] overcompensate, you know, I've been into where they look at your book,
[22:46.220 -> 22:47.060] they don't even speak to you,
[22:47.060 -> 22:48.360] and then they close the book and hand it to you,
[22:48.360 -> 22:50.680] and you walk out, never ever gonna be like that.
[22:50.680 -> 22:52.160] And when I say overcompensate, I'm like,
[22:52.160 -> 22:53.000] are you coming?
[22:53.000 -> 22:53.820] And they're like,
[22:53.820 -> 22:54.660] literally models are with me for half an hour,
[22:54.660 -> 22:55.980] because I'm chatting to them, getting to know them,
[22:55.980 -> 22:58.560] but they have to be an ambassador for my brand.
[22:58.560 -> 22:59.680] And I might like them,
[22:59.680 -> 23:01.000] and I might think they're great ambassadors,
[23:01.000 -> 23:04.160] but for that creative at that moment,
[23:04.160 -> 23:06.840] I have to visually, I have to
[23:04.480 -> 23:08.760] visually, you have to assess them, you
[23:06.840 -> 23:11.560] know, is that the best person for the
[23:08.760 -> 23:13.120] job? And you're assessing someone on the
[23:11.560 -> 23:15.160] way they look. If it isn't within the
[23:13.120 -> 23:16.640] industry, the people at home looking at
[23:15.160 -> 23:18.240] the magazines or the snipes on social
[23:16.640 -> 23:19.640] media, you know, let's be totally
[23:18.240 -> 23:23.520] honest, people look at you and think, born
[23:19.640 -> 23:25.440] gorgeous, had a really nice easy life,
[23:23.520 -> 23:26.280] people took his photo and paid him millions of pounds
[23:26.280 -> 23:27.440] for the privilege.
[23:27.440 -> 23:29.820] Like it's so easy to have an opinion about David Gandhi,
[23:29.820 -> 23:30.660] right?
[23:30.660 -> 23:31.480] Yeah, I suppose so.
[23:31.480 -> 23:33.000] But it happens like that, but it can happen like that.
[23:33.000 -> 23:36.040] You know, it's, there are people taken off the street
[23:36.040 -> 23:37.160] and the next week they're shooting
[23:37.160 -> 23:39.160] the Calvin Klein campaign or the Marnie campaign
[23:39.160 -> 23:41.880] and it continues, they don't have to work.
[23:41.880 -> 23:43.360] And we should celebrate that, right?
[23:43.360 -> 23:44.400] Human nature should go in.
[23:44.400 -> 23:47.680] Isn't that incredible that life can deal with that for someone? Would I have, maybe I wouldn't have to work. And we should celebrate that, right? Human nature should go in. Isn't that incredible that life can deal with that for someone?
[23:47.680 -> 23:52.280] Would I have, maybe I wouldn't have liked, but a slightly easier, you know, going into
[23:52.280 -> 23:54.120] the industry, yeah, I would have loved that.
[23:54.120 -> 23:57.200] It wasn't the funnest five years, you know, and there were constantly things where you
[23:57.200 -> 24:01.600] just thought you were going to get, one of them, I got the Ralph Lauren campaign, and
[24:01.600 -> 24:04.200] then I was on the way to the airport and they cancelled me.
[24:04.200 -> 24:05.560] And you had your, you're on the way to the campaign, you're on the way to the airport and they cancelled me and you
[24:04.440 -> 24:06.880] had your you're on the way to the
[24:05.560 -> 24:07.800] campaign you're on the way to the airport
[24:06.880 -> 24:10.480] and I said sorry go in different
[24:07.800 -> 24:12.960] direction that to come from that high to
[24:10.480 -> 24:15.960] that low you just went my god and to pick
[24:12.960 -> 24:16.960] yourself up yeah so then go okay and I
[24:15.960 -> 24:18.280] actually remember it's like
[24:16.960 -> 24:20.280] getting back home sitting on the stairs and
[24:18.280 -> 24:22.080] going what am I doing here like this is
[24:20.280 -> 24:24.120] tell us about that because that sounds
[24:22.080 -> 24:25.840] unbelievably brutal. Well that's something you have to
[24:24.120 -> 24:27.160] get used to as well that in that in the industry. There's lots of examples like that
[24:27.160 -> 24:29.200] I did a I won't mention the name
[24:29.200 -> 24:34.460] But this is actually when I was even had a little sort of a name and they brought me in to do a show
[24:36.720 -> 24:42.720] And I didn't fit the clothes clearly didn't fit the clothes too big yeah, I was always too big for a lot of stuff
[24:42.900 -> 24:45.560] They used to you know, Tom Ford used to go, here's a big guy.
[24:45.560 -> 24:46.840] I was like, am I really that big?
[24:46.840 -> 24:49.480] I'm a 40 chest and a 32 waist.
[24:49.480 -> 24:50.440] I'm not big.
[24:50.440 -> 24:52.040] I used to criticize the industry and go, look,
[24:52.040 -> 24:54.720] maybe make sample sizes bigger than 36 or 38
[24:54.720 -> 24:56.440] and a normal person will wear them.
[24:56.440 -> 25:01.440] And so, yeah, I again, put the clothes on.
[25:01.440 -> 25:02.400] They said, yeah, it doesn't matter.
[25:02.400 -> 25:03.440] Just get them on the runway.
[25:03.440 -> 25:06.440] And then they looked at me and I looked at myself and they went, yeah, you can't matter, just get them on the runway. And then they looked at me and I
[25:04.680 -> 25:07.880] looked at myself and they went, yeah, you
[25:06.440 -> 25:09.480] can't go on, literally pulled me off runway,
[25:07.880 -> 25:10.480] go out in front of everyone, in front of
[25:09.480 -> 25:12.600] all the guys, and where are you going?
[25:10.480 -> 25:16.200] I'm going home. So what do you do
[25:12.600 -> 25:21.680] at that moment though? Um, no, go have a
[25:16.200 -> 25:24.000] gin and tonic. And, and, which I like, as a
[25:21.680 -> 25:25.800] strategy, but I'm interested in, how do
[25:24.000 -> 25:26.640] you then pick yourself up to put yourself back in?
[25:26.640 -> 25:28.960] Okay, so I always say try and turn on a positive.
[25:28.960 -> 25:30.760] This was for a big brand.
[25:30.760 -> 25:33.720] So to me, I would have walked in that show
[25:34.620 -> 25:37.440] and you then would have been associated with that brand.
[25:37.440 -> 25:40.440] To me, I was taken away, not working with that brand.
[25:41.640 -> 25:43.200] There's other brands that are gonna work with you on that.
[25:43.200 -> 25:44.480] So if you're doing that brand,
[25:44.480 -> 25:46.040] it takes you away from working with a lot of other brands. So positive, I'm not doing that, other opportunities with other brands that are gonna work with you on that. So if you're doing that brand, it takes you away from working with a lot of other brands.
[25:46.040 -> 25:47.480] So positive, I'm not doing that,
[25:47.480 -> 25:49.300] other opportunities with other brands.
[25:49.300 -> 25:51.960] There was one time we were out in LA and we went to,
[25:54.080 -> 25:56.480] I'm not name dropping here, but I'm going to.
[25:56.480 -> 26:00.040] I just shot the makeup with her makeup,
[26:00.040 -> 26:01.960] Scarlett Johansson for Dolce.
[26:03.160 -> 26:06.880] And we then got flown to LA to do an alcohol brand with Scarlett Johansson. Butce. And we then got flown to LA to do an alcohol brand
[26:06.880 -> 26:08.160] with Scarlett Johansson.
[26:08.160 -> 26:09.120] But I didn't realize at the time,
[26:09.120 -> 26:10.320] and they didn't realize that we just went,
[26:10.320 -> 26:11.520] so we got to LA and she was like,
[26:11.520 -> 26:13.240] David, have you seen the Dolce pictures?
[26:13.240 -> 26:15.020] I have, they're amazing.
[26:15.020 -> 26:16.560] And you suddenly had this like loud room
[26:16.560 -> 26:18.160] when a little bit quiet,
[26:18.160 -> 26:19.000] and someone had picked up
[26:19.000 -> 26:21.500] with the weird works together before.
[26:21.500 -> 26:23.600] So there was like, okay, so you go off to make up, David,
[26:23.600 -> 26:24.920] why don't you just go and sit in that corner
[26:24.920 -> 26:26.720] over there for a second? I was like, okay, we sit there
[26:26.720 -> 26:30.120] for an hour and no one's there. You're going, should I be getting makeup and hair
[26:30.120 -> 26:34.520] or anything? And they go, no, no, just, just stay there. And you realise when no one
[26:34.520 -> 26:37.120] talks to you in the fashion street, something's wrong. You go, okay. So you, I
[26:37.120 -> 26:39.800] sit there and go, literally waiting for my phone to call me at four o'clock. I was like,
[26:39.800 -> 26:46.680] oh, there we go. Hi Hyde. Hi David. Yeah, they've pulled you because you've done the campaign with Scarlet.
[26:46.680 -> 26:48.640] And so, well, but they're not gonna pull Scarlet of course.
[26:48.640 -> 26:49.960] I went, no, I went, okay.
[26:49.960 -> 26:52.120] I said, what's happening with pay?
[26:52.120 -> 26:55.080] And they said, well, therefore you get full pay.
[26:55.080 -> 26:56.040] Don't have to do the campaign.
[26:56.040 -> 26:57.000] I was like, okay.
[26:57.000 -> 26:58.960] I went, I'm gonna take a couple of days off.
[26:58.960 -> 27:03.440] Went to hire a very fast car, not fastest car,
[27:03.440 -> 27:05.520] went up to Carmel, had a nice weekend, got
[27:05.520 -> 27:11.840] paid and didn't, and not associated with that brand. I saw it as a bonus and I,
[27:11.840 -> 27:16.000] that sounds, that sounds a bit egotistical and a bit sort of, I, there's not a
[27:16.000 -> 27:19.560] negative behind that to me. I was like yeah, absolutely great, saw the campaign, it was shit.
[27:19.560 -> 27:23.800] Glad I wasn't part of it. It was all win-win and I always say try and, try and
[27:23.800 -> 27:26.960] turn something into a positive for everyone. In that instance it's kind of easy to
[27:26.960 -> 27:29.760] turn it into a positive right because you've got paid for doing something that
[27:29.760 -> 27:32.880] you didn't need to do and you've come out well. There will definitely be times
[27:32.880 -> 27:38.400] where it's harder to try and find a positive. And I know you do a lot of work
[27:38.400 -> 27:41.560] for men's mental health campaigns and so I'm sure you understand where I'm going
[27:41.560 -> 27:46.180] with this. Like how challenging has it been at times
[27:46.180 -> 27:47.380] for your mental health?
[27:52.760 -> 27:55.300] Yeah, I mean, I've always said that there have been
[27:55.300 -> 27:57.720] dark times, and I don't think it's much to do
[27:57.720 -> 27:59.140] with being in the fashion industry, though.
[27:59.140 -> 28:00.340] I think that's just me.
[28:03.280 -> 28:05.000] It can be a very lonely, you are travelling the world.
[28:06.440 -> 28:10.380] I said sometimes you're going for days without really,
[28:10.380 -> 28:11.760] sometimes you're going from job to job,
[28:11.760 -> 28:13.640] but you're going, you might go from London
[28:13.640 -> 28:15.280] and then you're going to Barcelona
[28:15.280 -> 28:16.120] and then you're doing a job
[28:16.120 -> 28:17.400] and then you go from Barcelona to somewhere else,
[28:17.400 -> 28:20.560] but not just to get to another location.
[28:20.560 -> 28:23.420] And this is like a three or four day trip to get somewhere.
[28:23.420 -> 28:24.260] And if you don't know anyone,
[28:24.260 -> 28:26.920] you're going from airport to sitting in an airplane seat,
[28:26.920 -> 28:31.400] to going to a hotel, to going back to an airplane, you're not really speaking to anyone for days.
[28:31.400 -> 28:32.400] I think it's quite weird.
[28:32.400 -> 28:35.480] It is a strange concept.
[28:35.480 -> 28:38.800] Now if you speak to my other half, you'll realize that I don't talk that much, and she
[28:38.800 -> 28:39.800] kind of says that.
[28:39.800 -> 28:40.800] It's like, how was your day?
[28:40.800 -> 28:41.800] Yeah, it was fun.
[28:41.800 -> 28:47.280] You know, that's basically very men, as my father was, her father's the same.
[28:47.280 -> 28:49.640] You know, it's, men are very much like that.
[28:49.640 -> 28:51.320] I think you can be quite solitary,
[28:51.320 -> 28:52.160] and there's a difference, I always said,
[28:52.160 -> 28:55.320] there's a difference between lonely and loneliness.
[28:55.320 -> 28:58.200] And I was never lonely, and I used to enjoy that.
[28:58.200 -> 29:02.040] And actually, my other half has had to understand
[29:02.040 -> 29:05.240] that I need time to myself.
[29:05.240 -> 29:07.220] And that's with the dog and that can be with the children,
[29:07.220 -> 29:09.160] but it's, you know, there is a time where I like,
[29:09.160 -> 29:11.000] and she doesn't understand that.
[29:11.000 -> 29:13.360] You know, she's, if she's a part, you know,
[29:13.360 -> 29:16.400] her, she engulfs being at parties, events,
[29:16.400 -> 29:17.660] being around people.
[29:17.660 -> 29:21.640] To me, it drains me, and I need to be the exact opposite.
[29:21.640 -> 29:22.700] And she used to laugh at me, she goes,
[29:22.700 -> 29:24.600] do you get, like, what did you do last night
[29:24.600 -> 29:27.840] when we were first dating, we went to cinema. Who with? Myself. Where'd you
[29:27.840 -> 29:32.360] go? Went to dinner. Who with who? Myself. I was very much and
[29:32.360 -> 29:34.760] that's probably going back to school when I did. I was very
[29:34.760 -> 29:38.600] comfortable. I think you should be. It worries me if people
[29:38.600 -> 29:41.320] aren't comfortable in their own company. I always think there's
[29:41.320 -> 29:44.120] something wrong that they have to have other people's opinions
[29:44.120 -> 29:48.760] or other people to build their ego and I didn't need that.
[29:48.760 -> 29:52.840] So people criticise and build an ego. I never particularly needed that.
[29:52.840 -> 29:56.320] You have a dark time. So how have they, when you talk about a darkness, how does that
[29:56.320 -> 30:00.920] manifest itself? What have you learned to combat that?
[30:00.920 -> 30:05.000] I mean probably, I mean if you kind of think about it,
[30:05.000 -> 30:11.000] when I'm working, I do have so many projects on the go.
[30:11.000 -> 30:12.000] I drive people around the bend.
[30:12.000 -> 30:14.000] I'm finishing, not even finishing one, there's another idea,
[30:14.000 -> 30:16.000] and there's another idea, and there's something else I want to do.
[30:16.000 -> 30:18.000] There's loads of stuff going on.
[30:18.000 -> 30:20.000] And I realized I need to do that.
[30:20.000 -> 30:27.000] It's when you slow down sometimes, Because in my 20s and 30s,
[30:27.000 -> 30:29.800] it was just I want opportunities and work.
[30:29.800 -> 30:31.640] It wasn't selfishness,
[30:31.640 -> 30:33.140] but there was a point where I'm going to take,
[30:33.140 -> 30:36.100] hopefully, every opportunity, everything that comes about,
[30:36.100 -> 30:39.300] and I don't want to have to worry about anyone else
[30:39.300 -> 30:40.680] during that time.
[30:40.680 -> 30:42.880] It was me, and I need to build this career.
[30:42.880 -> 30:44.880] And it's put me in good stead to be able to, you know,
[30:44.880 -> 30:45.300] ease off a little bit now and be with my family and my girls and not worry so much. time. It was me and I need to build this career. It's put me in good stead to be able to ease
[30:45.300 -> 30:49.160] off a little bit now and be with my family and my girls and not worry so much. Still
[30:49.160 -> 30:54.460] got a million projects on but not to have to travel in. And I loved it. So, but if that
[30:54.460 -> 31:00.300] stopped then that's, my mind would start, you'd start probably thinking. And you would
[31:00.300 -> 31:05.240] always have to think, is this my last campaign? Is this my last job? Is this it?
[31:05.240 -> 31:06.080] You know, I'm on it like.
[31:06.080 -> 31:06.900] Did you get those thoughts?
[31:06.900 -> 31:08.480] Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
[31:08.480 -> 31:09.720] Because you never know.
[31:09.720 -> 31:10.600] You walk off everything.
[31:10.600 -> 31:12.640] You have a good one, you think, is this the last one?
[31:12.640 -> 31:14.040] Is this the last time I'm going to work for this brand?
[31:14.040 -> 31:16.000] But you then realize that you just,
[31:16.000 -> 31:17.800] that's why I suppose I have many projects
[31:17.800 -> 31:19.320] and many, working with many brands.
[31:19.320 -> 31:22.960] Because if one, you know, and you do stop eventually.
[31:22.960 -> 31:25.720] Every collaboration, everything eventually ends.
[31:25.800 -> 31:27.400] But you then just have to work on the next thing.
[31:27.480 -> 31:29.720] So that's why I sort of built it from my mind,
[31:29.800 -> 31:32.120] you know, my mindset in some ways.
[31:32.200 -> 31:35.520] Um, but yeah, it's, um...
[31:36.120 -> 31:37.600] I don't think the industry is...
[31:37.680 -> 31:39.640] I'd never really listened to them.
[31:39.720 -> 31:41.640] It was a thing of when I went in the industry
[31:41.720 -> 31:45.480] and I was... I wasn't a big guy when I was, you know, 20, 21, when I went in the industry, and I wasn't a big guy when I was 20, 21,
[31:45.480 -> 31:48.600] when I went into the industry in the year 22.
[31:48.600 -> 31:51.440] But I was bigger, and then I just built,
[31:51.440 -> 31:52.280] I got bigger and bigger,
[31:52.280 -> 31:56.640] because I took over the gym was my reset, was my escape.
[31:56.640 -> 31:59.020] So of course, if you're competitive,
[31:59.020 -> 31:59.860] then you want to get bigger,
[31:59.860 -> 32:01.280] and you want to get muscly, and you want to build.
[32:01.280 -> 32:05.520] And I always say that, that I was always, I was always training before and they go,
[32:05.520 -> 32:07.520] well, you have to be fit.
[32:07.520 -> 32:08.760] Don't have to be fit in the industry at all.
[32:08.760 -> 32:10.920] You don't have to have a great body.
[32:10.920 -> 32:12.800] But in my mindset, that made me,
[32:12.800 -> 32:14.600] I've always just done it for myself.
[32:16.920 -> 32:18.400] Today's high performance podcast
[32:18.400 -> 32:20.640] is in association with AG1.
[32:20.640 -> 32:22.320] And actually the last couple of weeks
[32:22.320 -> 32:24.880] has been a great reminder to me about why AG1
[32:24.880 -> 32:27.680] is so important for me. Cause I've been on the road. The fact I've been living out
[32:27.680 -> 32:32.320] of a suitcase, I haven't had my routine, means actually I have missed taking my AG1 in the
[32:32.320 -> 32:37.440] mornings and I've honestly noticed the difference. I've had a drop in energy. I haven't felt
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[33:14.760 -> 33:20.040] As a person with a very deep voice, I'm hired all the time for advertising campaigns, but
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[33:41.400 -> 33:44.280] Also small wigs, who are on the path to becoming big wigs.
[33:44.280 -> 33:48.320] Okay, that's enough about wigs. Also small wigs who are on the path to becoming big wigs. Okay, that's enough about wigs. LinkedIn ads allows you to focus on getting your
[33:48.320 -> 33:50.400] B2B message to the right people.
[33:50.400 -> 33:54.800] So, does that mean you should use ads on LinkedIn instead of hiring me,
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[34:10.100 -> 34:15.620] That's LinkedIn.com slash results. Terms and conditions apply.
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[35:56.640 -> 36:00.240] So can you tell us a little bit then
[35:58.760 -> 36:02.480] David, around one of our favorite
[36:00.240 -> 36:04.960] phrases we heard from, we interviewed
[36:02.480 -> 36:05.200] Mauro Itoji, the England rugby phrases we heard from, we interviewed
[36:02.480 -> 36:07.760] Mauro Itoji, the England rugby player
[36:05.200 -> 36:10.440] and at his club Saracens, they've got
[36:07.760 -> 36:12.640] a sign or an acronym stitched into the back
[36:10.440 -> 36:15.240] of their shirts that stands for the shit
[36:12.640 -> 36:17.920] that no one sees. So internally within
[36:15.240 -> 36:20.920] their world, they value all the stuff
[36:17.920 -> 36:23.000] that isn't in the spotlight, it's the
[36:20.920 -> 36:25.000] work that goes on behind the scenes and
[36:23.000 -> 36:26.600] I'm interested, can you give us a bit of
[36:24.980 -> 36:29.440] an insight then into the shit that no one
[36:26.600 -> 36:33.120] sees for you looking so good, doing these
[36:29.440 -> 36:36.000] great modeling campaigns and all the
[36:33.120 -> 36:38.280] other things around the brand? We've
[36:36.000 -> 36:42.680] probably touched on it, you know, about how
[36:38.280 -> 36:44.960] you, I just think we've strategically had to
[36:42.680 -> 36:46.520] work at that. And that's the meetings and the shit.
[36:46.520 -> 36:50.320] And no one hears about the campaigns
[36:50.320 -> 36:51.240] that you got pulled from
[36:51.240 -> 36:53.200] or the ones you got canceled from last minute.
[36:53.200 -> 36:54.040] That's a bit shit,
[36:54.040 -> 36:55.640] but if you make it positive, you make it positive.
[36:55.640 -> 36:57.040] There's always been a bit of a side to me
[36:57.040 -> 37:00.360] they talk about in the fashion industry as well.
[37:00.360 -> 37:03.800] Yes, you are very fortunate to look the way you do
[37:03.800 -> 37:09.720] and have the body you do, but it's not attainable. Like they say, well, you are very fortunate to look the way you do And have the body you do but it's not attainable. They say well, you know, are you creating images and isn't attainable?
[37:09.920 -> 37:15.680] So if I talk about in the physical form I go hang on wait a minute. I've gone from being a chubby teenager to
[37:16.840 -> 37:20.920] Quite skinny, you know, I shot up to like six, you know, six two six three. So it's quite skinny
[37:20.920 -> 37:24.720] I didn't like that for my mental health. I want to be bigger so I got bigger and
[37:21.000 -> 37:21.840] So it was quite skinny. I didn't like that.
[37:21.840 -> 37:23.960] For my mental health, I wanted to be bigger.
[37:23.960 -> 37:25.200] So I got bigger.
[37:25.200 -> 37:27.400] And every evening,
[37:27.400 -> 37:29.600] when probably everyone else is having dinner,
[37:29.600 -> 37:30.660] I'm at the gym.
[37:30.660 -> 37:31.500] So I put the yoga now,
[37:31.500 -> 37:34.020] with my two girls, I put the girls to bed,
[37:34.020 -> 37:35.840] half past nine at the gym,
[37:35.840 -> 37:37.520] I get home at half past 10,
[37:37.520 -> 37:38.480] I cook dinner.
[37:38.480 -> 37:40.200] I'm still working, my mobile phone's still on
[37:40.200 -> 37:41.800] all throughout this whole business.
[37:41.800 -> 37:44.400] And that's what I've been doing for 22 years.
[37:44.400 -> 37:47.560] So no one understands that, no one sees you doing that.
[37:47.560 -> 37:50.400] And of course now with social, a lot of people do put it on,
[37:50.400 -> 37:52.120] but I'm quite private in that respect.
[37:52.120 -> 37:54.220] So no one sees the work that goes into it.
[37:55.400 -> 37:57.720] And it's still a fascination in people when they say,
[37:57.720 -> 37:59.560] how do you get the body you do?
[37:59.560 -> 38:02.080] And you go, it's hard work, it's just training.
[38:02.080 -> 38:03.600] You know, that's all it is.
[38:03.600 -> 38:06.000] But I know a lot of, you know, female models,
[38:06.000 -> 38:08.000] the Victoria's Secret models and all those,
[38:08.000 -> 38:10.500] their training was incredible.
[38:10.500 -> 38:13.000] They train like athletes to get to where they're,
[38:13.000 -> 38:14.500] you know, to get the physique, you know,
[38:14.500 -> 38:18.000] the physique of what they have.
[38:18.000 -> 38:19.500] When I'm saying you train like athletes,
[38:19.500 -> 38:21.000] you really, really do.
[38:21.000 -> 38:26.480] So there's a lot of shit that goes on behind things but again like in any
[38:26.480 -> 38:31.440] any business you don't you don't hear about it you you see the good side of it
[38:31.440 -> 38:34.560] and people think about the good side. When someone comes to me and a guy says
[38:34.560 -> 38:39.440] how do I get to a young model how do I get to where you you've got to and I
[38:39.440 -> 38:43.320] it's an advice it looks an impossible thing for me to tell you but I've been
[38:43.320 -> 38:46.320] doing this for 21, 22 years.
[38:46.320 -> 38:50.080] And the one that always gets people is,
[38:50.080 -> 38:53.880] well, I didn't really have a big job for Dolce for six years
[38:53.880 -> 38:55.000] and you can see them switch off,
[38:55.000 -> 38:56.960] they're like switches, okay, six years,
[38:56.960 -> 38:57.880] not waiting six years.
[38:57.880 -> 38:59.400] I'm not saying you have to wait six years,
[38:59.400 -> 39:00.720] but that's how long it took me.
[39:00.720 -> 39:02.160] That's perseverance.
[39:02.160 -> 39:04.880] So, you have to believe in what your,
[39:04.880 -> 39:05.520] that my thought
[39:05.520 -> 39:11.960] or process of where I wanted to be was correct. And you can see like, so many young people
[39:11.960 -> 39:16.880] now like, oh yeah, no, I'm, when do you think, well, I want to go and be in supermodel tomorrow.
[39:16.880 -> 39:24.160] Okay, not going to happen. You have to be realistic. So, yeah, so it's, you don't,
[39:24.160 -> 39:25.000] but that goes, as I said,
[39:25.040 -> 39:27.040] in every business and every CEO I've met
[39:27.040 -> 39:29.400] and every successful person, athlete,
[39:29.400 -> 39:31.520] they've all been through, you know,
[39:31.520 -> 39:33.880] you don't see the shit at the end of the day.
[39:33.880 -> 39:36.600] You don't see, no one sees the hard work
[39:36.600 -> 39:39.520] of a senior, of a successful person.
[39:39.520 -> 39:41.320] Of course, there are shortcuts, right?
[39:41.320 -> 39:43.080] And you're now in your 40s.
[39:43.080 -> 39:45.640] I don't know whether you have fear
[39:45.640 -> 39:49.160] about aging and looking different or whether that excites you because it
[39:49.160 -> 39:56.380] moves you into a whole nother sphere? I don't worry too much about it but I've
[39:56.380 -> 40:07.420] been fortunate enough that starting I don't rely, yes I rely on looks, but not as much as I probably used to.
[40:07.420 -> 40:10.320] And it's just aging, you know, it's just I try my best.
[40:10.320 -> 40:11.440] Also if you look at a lifestyle
[40:11.440 -> 40:13.600] that is traveling the world on airplanes,
[40:15.400 -> 40:18.140] not much sleep for 22 years,
[40:18.140 -> 40:20.680] it's not, it's nothing, you know,
[40:20.680 -> 40:23.740] is good about that for aging, or for skin, or anything else.
[40:25.520 -> 40:30.440] So yeah, I'm believing, you know, growing's good about that for aging or for skin or anything else So, yeah, I'd like believing you know growing old gracefully I think I look alright to our kids
[40:32.120 -> 40:36.720] Happens to a kid but the kids is actually a relevant point here because I think you know
[40:36.720 -> 40:40.560] I like the fact that when people think of David Gandhi looks unattainable
[40:40.560 -> 40:45.480] You'll say no, that's not true. If you put the time and the work and
[40:43.680 -> 40:48.560] have the patience, you know, you can build
[40:45.480 -> 40:50.880] muscle, right? Anyone can do that, that's
[40:48.560 -> 40:53.520] basically it. But now, you could happily have
[40:50.880 -> 40:55.440] a filler here or a Botox there or an
[40:53.520 -> 40:57.640] injection here or there to make your
[40:55.440 -> 41:01.120] face look different. Would you do that? Or
[40:57.640 -> 41:02.400] is actually the, the sort of, the honesty
[41:01.120 -> 41:04.440] of this more important than that?
[41:02.400 -> 41:06.760] Because there is a, there is a sort of a
[41:04.440 -> 41:08.480] something toxic about that particularly for young people looking
[41:08.480 -> 41:13.480] at those in the public eye and seeing I don't know people that make that
[41:13.480 -> 41:19.300] decision I think the footer so if someone put this way without going too
[41:19.300 -> 41:23.640] far with Botox and all those different things is these days is people ask me
[41:23.640 -> 41:25.840] how long to get ready to red carpet.
[41:26.880 -> 41:29.120] I'm literally 20 minutes.
[41:29.120 -> 41:31.840] Now that's not boasting, it's like I don't have time.
[41:31.840 -> 41:33.880] I'm no rougher, I'm very fortunate
[41:33.880 -> 41:35.480] over the years built wardrobe.
[41:35.480 -> 41:40.200] But, you know, for young people to look at these people
[41:40.200 -> 41:43.240] on the red carpet nowadays, and they're famous stars,
[41:43.240 -> 41:45.720] the amount of work that's gone into,
[41:45.720 -> 41:49.080] that's a team of stylists, that's a grooming team.
[41:49.080 -> 41:53.940] That happens weeks before, you know, that event.
[41:55.400 -> 41:58.120] I'm sort of more genuine, like, yeah, I take,
[41:58.120 -> 42:00.360] I might get a suit made, but, you know,
[42:00.360 -> 42:01.680] I very rarely do anymore.
[42:01.680 -> 42:03.200] So how long did it take you?
[42:03.200 -> 42:04.760] Literally 20 minutes,
[42:04.760 -> 42:08.160] because that's just a lifestyle change. And then that's, but I've always kind of been that way.
[42:08.160 -> 42:13.040] So in some ways, it's like, I don't have the time. That's not, that doesn't interest me
[42:13.040 -> 42:17.200] whatsoever. And I see this sort of society that everyone's worried about what everyone else is
[42:17.200 -> 42:20.880] doing, what everyone else looks like, where everyone is aging, what everyone else is doing,
[42:20.880 -> 42:26.160] and following exactly the same as everyone else. Like globalization and fashion
[42:26.160 -> 42:33.040] has led to this. Everyone kind of dressing the same a bit. And it was it was Elmore Roosevelt
[42:33.040 -> 42:39.760] who once said, you know, great minds talk, talk about ideas. Medium minds talk about
[42:39.760 -> 42:46.400] events. Small minds talk about other people. Now you can adapt that a little bit now. Yeah.
[42:44.640 -> 42:48.720] But everything I want to get in the
[42:46.400 -> 42:51.280] company, in my, you know, in everything I
[42:48.720 -> 42:52.600] thought about is ideas. I don't really care
[42:51.280 -> 42:54.400] what anyone else is doing. I don't care
[42:52.600 -> 42:56.560] what, what are the ideas, what are the
[42:54.400 -> 42:58.720] ideas to, if there's problems, how can we
[42:56.560 -> 43:01.760] solve them? That's the big thinking of
[42:58.720 -> 43:03.960] everything. And that's what people
[43:01.760 -> 43:06.520] don't seem to be able to do these days.
[43:03.960 -> 43:05.040] How many years old is Wellware? Two. that's what people don't seem to be
[43:03.320 -> 43:08.840] able to do these days. How many years old
[43:05.040 -> 43:09.880] is Wellware? Two now. Okay, so you're two years
[43:08.840 -> 43:11.960] old and you've already got a
[43:09.880 -> 43:13.720] collaboration with Packit, which is, you
[43:11.960 -> 43:16.920] know, really recognizable around the
[43:13.720 -> 43:18.920] world, right? So we have many
[43:16.920 -> 43:21.920] entrepreneurs, many people building
[43:18.920 -> 43:23.760] brands, listening to this. How was, how
[43:21.920 -> 43:27.000] was it happened so quickly for WellWare? What collaborations?
[43:27.000 -> 43:29.000] I think just the growth.
[43:29.000 -> 43:33.000] Have you been clear from day one that this is something that you wanted that quickly?
[43:33.000 -> 43:36.000] My own brand's been something I wanted in my head.
[43:36.000 -> 43:39.000] I will not bend your bones about it guys.
[43:39.000 -> 43:41.000] This is the hardest thing I've done in 22 years.
[43:41.000 -> 43:43.000] Why?
[43:43.000 -> 43:46.080] It's just a whole different ball game,
[43:46.080 -> 43:49.960] only your whole thing being founder and creative director.
[43:49.960 -> 43:52.000] Let's get into that, come on.
[43:52.000 -> 43:52.840] What's hard?
[43:52.840 -> 43:54.720] Well, first, I would probably say that
[43:54.720 -> 43:56.560] when you've got your,
[43:56.560 -> 43:59.080] when people want you to do something
[43:59.080 -> 44:01.840] for their, to better their brand,
[44:01.840 -> 44:03.880] they're very enthusiastic about you coming on
[44:03.880 -> 44:07.320] and helping you and then, because they're getting something from it. When you
[44:07.320 -> 44:11.000] start your own brand, I learned this MNS as well, is that people stop talking to
[44:11.000 -> 44:15.760] you because you're a rival. And I heard this from brands, they were like, you
[44:15.760 -> 44:19.200] know, autograph is killing you, David Ganyard's autograph is killing us, you
[44:19.200 -> 44:22.280] know, at a brand and I didn't want to do it, but it's disruptive. You know, one
[44:22.280 -> 44:24.560] of the things we did in swimwear was pretty much, you know, I looked at all
[44:24.560 -> 44:25.960] about brown, I was at All About Brown.
[44:25.960 -> 44:27.160] I was on holiday and I thought,
[44:27.160 -> 44:29.640] I need to see something for the day we get into the autograph.
[44:29.640 -> 44:31.320] And I loved All About Brown is,
[44:31.320 -> 44:34.200] one of the pinnacle brands, incredible success.
[44:35.680 -> 44:37.040] I said, well, what if we did those swimwear,
[44:37.040 -> 44:38.800] but they're 150 quid?
[44:38.800 -> 44:41.080] What if we did them at MMS for 30?
[44:41.080 -> 44:43.160] And we put the side adjusters and the colors and did that.
[44:43.160 -> 44:45.000] We sold a pair every minute on launch.
[44:45.000 -> 44:49.000] That's why I kind of look at doing all the time.
[44:49.000 -> 44:54.000] But you are competition then.
[44:54.000 -> 44:58.000] You are competition in the industry you are in.
[44:58.000 -> 45:00.000] So I think that's the difference.
[45:00.000 -> 45:03.000] So where you could rely on people to help,
[45:03.000 -> 45:05.200] where you could rely on
[45:02.080 -> 45:07.720] people to help, or you ask favors, that's
[45:05.200 -> 45:10.160] now no longer. And businesses, there's some
[45:07.720 -> 45:12.440] really ruthless business people
[45:10.160 -> 45:13.680] around. And it's hard. It's really, really
[45:12.440 -> 45:18.840] hard. So what's been the biggest lesson
[45:13.680 -> 45:20.720] you've learned? Stupidly, to come back to
[45:18.840 -> 45:22.280] originally what I've done in my, in this
[45:20.720 -> 45:25.840] fashion industry, is do everything yourself.
[45:22.280 -> 45:25.560] Bring it all in house.
[45:29.880 -> 45:31.600] We've been promised the earth by other brands, creatives, all these different things.
[45:31.600 -> 45:34.640] And then you learn, yeah, you can't rely on,
[45:34.640 -> 45:36.280] terribly you can't rely on anyone.
[45:36.280 -> 45:39.280] That's where the team, well, where they are,
[45:39.280 -> 45:40.440] I mean, I can't thank them enough.
[45:40.440 -> 45:42.480] We are all doing three or four jobs each.
[45:42.480 -> 45:44.200] How big is the team?
[45:44.200 -> 45:46.720] Six people, not big.
[45:46.720 -> 45:49.400] And you wake up in the morning, go to sleep at night,
[45:49.400 -> 45:52.600] thinking of well aware, this is like laser.
[45:52.600 -> 45:53.680] Sometimes when you're asleep as well.
[45:53.680 -> 45:55.640] I think that's something to point out to people as well.
[45:55.640 -> 45:58.480] If you're gonna do the entrepreneurial thing,
[45:58.480 -> 45:59.880] I mean, it is all consuming.
[46:00.960 -> 46:04.360] Yeah, I mean, collaboration with M&S
[46:04.360 -> 46:05.000] and collaboration brands is different.
[46:05.000 -> 46:06.000] You can turn them on and off.
[46:06.000 -> 46:10.000] You can, you can be involved as much or as little as you like,
[46:10.000 -> 46:15.000] but I was massively involved with M&S and I still, to this day, love M&S.
[46:15.000 -> 46:17.000] Always did, that's why I worked with them.
[46:17.000 -> 46:22.000] But we had a kind of a collaboration for eight years.
[46:22.000 -> 46:26.880] That's a long time in the
[46:23.920 -> 46:28.480] industry and then you go and you need to... to
[46:26.880 -> 46:30.240] me this was the last thing, can I do it?
[46:28.480 -> 46:31.760] This was the last thing and I didn't
[46:30.240 -> 46:33.280] need to do it but it was the last thing
[46:31.760 -> 46:35.320] that was gonna... if I hadn't done it
[46:33.280 -> 46:37.480] 20 years, if this fails, if it
[46:35.320 -> 46:39.160] succeeds, I would have gone... I wonder what
[46:37.480 -> 46:43.280] if I haven't done it. What is it? Can I
[46:39.160 -> 46:45.280] do it? What to you is it? I suppose
[46:43.280 -> 46:47.400] it's a bit like anything, it's that risk and reward.
[46:48.240 -> 46:50.720] Everything I've done, I suppose, everything I've done,
[46:50.800 -> 46:52.280] there's a little bit of risk.
[46:52.480 -> 46:56.680] The risk of completely shutting down all my brands I worked with,
[46:57.160 -> 46:59.520] you know, when I said to Tandy in 2005,
[46:59.960 -> 47:00.960] there was a risk.
[47:01.040 -> 47:06.040] It wasn't a risk to me at the time, but it clearly was a risk.
[47:06.040 -> 47:07.900] So, but if you,
[47:11.080 -> 47:14.920] higher perform and get to that reward
[47:14.920 -> 47:16.480] for achieving that is worth it.
[47:17.560 -> 47:20.520] So can you expand on your,
[47:20.520 -> 47:22.320] on how you take risks?
[47:22.320 -> 47:27.840] Because I've heard this theme crop up a number of
[47:24.800 -> 47:29.880] times in, whether it's you walking away
[47:27.840 -> 47:32.400] from two modules left of the
[47:29.880 -> 47:33.920] university degree to go and pursue a
[47:32.400 -> 47:36.480] career in modeling, that's a risk, but you
[47:33.920 -> 47:38.080] said I had nothing to lose. You decide
[47:36.480 -> 47:41.040] that you're going to turn down brands to
[47:38.080 -> 47:42.560] focus on, rather than work for 20
[47:41.040 -> 47:44.160] brands, you'll work for two and build a
[47:42.560 -> 47:46.880] relationship, that's a risk. But again,
[47:44.160 -> 47:45.480] you said I had nothing to lose. Now you do work for 20 brands, you'll work for two and build a relationship, that's a risk.
[47:43.360 -> 47:48.720] But again, you said, I had nothing to lose.
[47:45.480 -> 47:51.400] Now you do have plenty to lose. So how has
[47:48.720 -> 47:54.360] your relationship with risk changed over
[47:51.400 -> 47:56.520] the years? Going back to sports and many
[47:54.360 -> 47:59.760] things, there's, you know, and in life there's
[47:56.520 -> 48:01.760] a 27 club. Apparently you, you have
[47:59.760 -> 48:03.160] self-deprecation after the age of 27.
[48:01.760 -> 48:05.280] Before that, I think we all know this as
[48:03.160 -> 48:05.720] guys, we're scared, living in there if I had a boy
[48:05.720 -> 48:07.360] because I knew he would try and kill himself
[48:07.360 -> 48:09.600] in cars or sports or skiing or something.
[48:09.600 -> 48:10.520] I used to.
[48:10.520 -> 48:12.360] How me and my friends,
[48:12.360 -> 48:13.680] since I've known them throughout all life,
[48:13.680 -> 48:14.800] I have no idea.
[48:14.800 -> 48:16.760] The stupid things that we used to do.
[48:16.760 -> 48:19.920] And then at 27, you don't think about the risks.
[48:19.920 -> 48:22.440] And after that, you start thinking about
[48:24.240 -> 48:25.760] the risks and what you're going to lose
[48:25.760 -> 48:26.720] or what you could lose.
[48:26.720 -> 48:29.040] And it changes, changing, you know, Formula One.
[48:29.040 -> 48:31.400] Those guys at 25 don't think about death,
[48:31.400 -> 48:32.960] don't think about the risk.
[48:32.960 -> 48:34.440] They just go for it.
[48:34.440 -> 48:36.760] 30-year-old be like, ooh.
[48:36.760 -> 48:39.720] And that, as a sportsman, you can't do that.
[48:39.720 -> 48:43.240] You cannot have that doubt, you've just gotta go for it.
[48:43.240 -> 48:47.520] And I think that changes the more, it's good. You have success, you've just got to go for it and I think that changes the more
[48:44.480 -> 48:49.440] it's good you know you have success you have
[48:47.520 -> 48:52.040] lifestyle you I have
[48:49.440 -> 48:54.160] responsibilities you know my children
[48:52.040 -> 48:56.400] need to go to school we have homes
[48:54.160 -> 48:58.400] everything needs to be paid for we have a
[48:56.400 -> 49:00.400] lifestyle we want I want to travel like
[48:58.400 -> 49:01.600] I did with my parents so of course
[49:00.400 -> 49:03.880] you're not risking but also that that's
[49:01.600 -> 49:07.200] management even if something happens
[49:03.880 -> 49:09.920] you've got you, you've planned for those problems to happen and still be able to live.
[49:09.920 -> 49:14.440] So it's not risking too much. Financially, you know, I wouldn't say I'm a big risk taker
[49:14.440 -> 49:21.320] because I don't know as much within that world. So we're talking, you know, a lot of people
[49:21.320 -> 49:25.960] who was, you know, put a lot of money into the stock market and trading and all these different things.
[49:25.960 -> 49:31.800] I've invested in 20 companies, and I've got, obviously, brands and companies of my own,
[49:31.800 -> 49:33.640] but I don't understand that as much.
[49:33.640 -> 49:35.800] I just couldn't take those risks, I don't understand that.
[49:35.800 -> 49:39.840] But there's something in me that, for some reason, I always said, gut feeling.
[49:39.840 -> 49:47.040] Any time I've ever not, you know, not gone
[49:44.520 -> 49:48.560] with my gut instinct, it's gone wrong. That's
[49:47.040 -> 49:50.880] honestly true. And I thought, yeah, you knew
[49:48.560 -> 49:52.440] this. Why did you do it? Right. And, you
[49:50.880 -> 49:54.200] know, we're going back to going from
[49:52.440 -> 49:56.200] failure to failure. I've learned more from
[49:54.200 -> 49:58.360] failure than I have from success. Sometimes
[49:56.200 -> 50:00.280] I don't trust success. Something comes
[49:58.360 -> 50:02.040] very easily, I don't trust it. I mean, that's
[50:00.280 -> 50:03.880] an anomaly. That, that, that, why did that
[50:02.040 -> 50:05.240] happen? But failure, if you keep on
[50:03.880 -> 50:05.060] going, you're learning alone,
[50:05.060 -> 50:07.560] long as you don't carry on those failures.
[50:07.560 -> 50:09.860] So what would you say has been your biggest failure then?
[50:09.860 -> 50:11.600] And what did you take from that?
[50:16.700 -> 50:19.700] If you go to well, where, as I just said,
[50:19.700 -> 50:20.800] trusting other people.
[50:22.100 -> 50:26.280] And that's, yeah, we bought everything in-house. Cost us a fortune to
[50:26.280 -> 50:32.000] do it. Ruined our business plan, everything else. If you don't know your purpose in life,
[50:32.000 -> 50:35.500] find your passion, your passion will lead you to your purpose. And there's a purpose
[50:35.500 -> 50:38.680] to this. There's got to be a purpose. It's not to make, it is to make, of course, every
[50:38.680 -> 50:45.880] business is to make money, to be successful. That's an ego thing. and I hope it will be but there is and taking
[50:45.880 -> 50:50.920] on the big boys in the industry I suppose that's my ego so like can I
[50:50.920 -> 50:54.940] take the guys on and and don't create this industry and disrupt a little bit
[50:54.940 -> 50:59.120] and but there's a purpose behind this and a serious purpose and we're all
[50:59.120 -> 51:01.600] serious about the environment then we need to talk about it and there's a
[51:01.600 -> 51:04.820] seriousness to it. And while Damien's interested in the purpose I'm interested
[51:04.820 -> 51:05.400] in the process because I'm interested in the process.
[51:05.400 -> 51:07.000] Because I think that's so helpful for other people.
[51:07.000 -> 51:10.200] Like, are you CEO of this brand? Are you running this day to day?
[51:10.200 -> 51:12.600] Founder and, yeah, creative director and, yeah.
[51:12.600 -> 51:15.400] As I say, we've all got about three hats on.
[51:15.400 -> 51:18.000] So how are you hiring people?
[51:18.000 -> 51:24.000] So my best friend, Charlie T, he started a creative branding agency.
[51:24.000 -> 51:25.600] And during lockdown, he said,
[51:25.600 -> 51:28.000] finally, I've got you in one place at one time.
[51:28.000 -> 51:28.800] Let's have a chat.
[51:28.800 -> 51:30.800] And I finished my M&S and we were in a point
[51:30.800 -> 51:32.800] where I had six months, I couldn't do anything.
[51:34.400 -> 51:36.800] And I said, wait, okay, let's start brainstorming.
[51:36.800 -> 51:40.800] And we did, and we came up with the concept of Wellware.
[51:40.800 -> 51:43.200] No one is bigger than anyone else.
[51:43.200 -> 51:44.000] No one is better.
[51:44.600 -> 51:45.880] And I encourage everyone.
[51:45.880 -> 51:48.420] And I never want to micromanage, never want to like,
[51:48.420 -> 51:51.480] everyone is there because they are the best at what they do.
[51:51.480 -> 51:53.240] And that's why I trust everyone.
[51:53.240 -> 51:54.840] I have to make those decisions at the end.
[51:54.840 -> 51:56.800] That's what I've done in the industry.
[51:56.800 -> 51:59.560] I still have to be, I said, but leave this with me.
[51:59.560 -> 52:01.440] And I say it to brands sometimes as well.
[52:01.440 -> 52:03.160] Or I say it to the creators within brands.
[52:03.160 -> 52:04.400] I said, blame me.
[52:04.400 -> 52:08.160] If this goes wrong, I'll take the blame for this because some of
[52:08.160 -> 52:10.960] this is a corporate above that is not believing in this. So if it goes wrong
[52:10.960 -> 52:15.120] blame me, but it's not going to go wrong. So that's why I always say to people, so
[52:15.120 -> 52:18.960] yeah I take that prompt but it's a team effort and they're just
[52:18.960 -> 52:23.480] incredible at the moment is what we are. You know it's what we are
[52:23.480 -> 52:25.480] achieved with not you know not very what we are achieved with not, you know, not
[52:25.480 -> 52:31.200] very little, hopefully. Yeah, you need a visionary and you need someone to come along to really,
[52:31.200 -> 52:36.080] you know, for our growth, but we are growing very, very well. But to take it to that next
[52:36.080 -> 52:42.240] stop, to really, really sort of take on the big boys, then that's the next round of financing
[52:42.240 -> 52:43.240] and everything else.
[52:43.240 -> 52:48.120] I wish you all the luck. I'm so excited for you to become a founder of a brand.
[52:48.120 -> 52:50.160] And I think you spent your career actually breaking
[52:50.160 -> 52:51.520] down doors for others to walk through,
[52:51.520 -> 52:54.480] like the first male model to do what you did with branding.
[52:54.480 -> 52:55.320] And now look what you do.
[52:55.320 -> 52:56.800] You're saying to all of those guys who are used
[52:56.800 -> 52:58.400] to just having their photo taken and being judged
[52:58.400 -> 53:01.480] from the outside as good looking, but not that bright.
[53:01.480 -> 53:03.600] You're saying just show the world what you can achieve.
[53:03.600 -> 53:05.360] And I think that's probably a big reason why this feels so passion driven for you. And hopefully thatlooking but not that bright. You're saying, just show the world what you can achieve. And I think that's probably a big reason
[53:05.360 -> 53:07.960] why this feels so passion-driven for you.
[53:07.960 -> 53:09.120] And hopefully that will continue.
[53:09.120 -> 53:09.960] Good luck.
[53:09.960 -> 53:11.440] Right, we've reached our quickfire questions.
[53:11.440 -> 53:12.960] The three non-negotiable behaviours
[53:12.960 -> 53:15.120] that you and the people around you should buy into.
[53:15.120 -> 53:19.840] Drive, commitment, kindness, honesty.
[53:19.840 -> 53:21.320] Great.
[53:21.320 -> 53:28.000] What's the best piece of advice you've ever received and why? No one's given me that much advice. That sounds a really strange thing.
[53:28.000 -> 53:31.000] So what advice would you give to a teenage David just starting out?
[53:31.000 -> 53:37.000] Enjoy the moment more. There's times like my best moments life I don't even think I can remember.
[53:37.000 -> 53:42.000] Because I was already on to the next element. What can this lead to? What are we working on next?
[53:42.000 -> 53:46.240] If you could go back to one moment of your life, what would it be and why?
[53:46.240 -> 53:49.200] I could go on both my daughters being born, it's a magical moment.
[53:49.200 -> 53:56.400] If I had to go on a work element, it was on a speedboat after shooting Light Blue,
[53:56.400 -> 53:59.600] coming back with Mario Testino on the team and going,
[53:59.600 -> 54:05.240] okay, so that's, this is what I've worked for. This is what I've, you know,
[54:05.240 -> 54:07.920] this is what I've put up with all this shit for five years.
[54:07.920 -> 54:10.640] I think this one, I think this one could be special.
[54:10.640 -> 54:12.880] It was the excitement of where this could lead.
[54:12.880 -> 54:15.840] And I don't think, yeah, I've had those moments,
[54:15.840 -> 54:18.960] but it was just that, that one was incredible.
[54:18.960 -> 54:21.600] Your biggest strength, your greatest weakness.
[54:21.600 -> 54:22.800] Greatest strength,
[54:25.800 -> 54:29.920] commitment, I suppose, I suppose, to people.
[54:29.920 -> 54:30.760] Yeah.
[54:30.760 -> 54:34.680] To brands, to work and drive.
[54:34.680 -> 54:36.720] And your greatest weakness?
[54:36.720 -> 54:37.760] Trusting people.
[54:38.640 -> 54:40.440] Lastly, your one golden rule
[54:40.440 -> 54:42.240] for living a high-performance life?
[54:44.280 -> 54:45.600] Think outside the box.
[54:47.720 -> 54:49.360] Which you have done again and again.
[54:49.360 -> 54:51.040] Listen, thank you so much for taking the time.
[54:51.040 -> 54:53.360] That has been such an interesting journey
[54:53.360 -> 54:54.880] from the beginning to here.
[54:54.880 -> 54:57.840] I'm so excited to see where Wellware goes in the future.
[54:57.840 -> 55:01.760] And it still feels like after all these years,
[55:01.760 -> 55:02.880] you're at the beginning of your journey,
[55:02.880 -> 55:04.840] which is the most exciting place to be.
[55:04.840 -> 55:08.840] Thank you. Cheers guys, Really, really enjoyed it.
[55:08.840 -> 55:09.840] Cheers David.
[55:09.840 -> 55:10.840] Thanks Damien.
[55:10.840 -> 55:11.840] Damien.
[55:11.840 -> 55:12.840] Jake.
[55:12.840 -> 55:19.320] Look, David spoke there about sort of being judged as a male model, but he is the antithesis
[55:19.320 -> 55:23.200] of what you'd imagine a male model to be. And it's a great reminder that we all exist,
[55:23.200 -> 55:27.000] putting people in boxes, framing people in this image that we believe.
[55:27.000 -> 55:30.000] And I love it when he comes on a podcast like this and challenges our thinking,
[55:30.000 -> 55:32.000] like, what a bright guy.
[55:32.000 -> 55:36.000] Absolutely, yeah, and I think it is a good reminder that sometimes
[55:36.000 -> 55:42.000] our brain naturally puts people into stereotypes that a male model,
[55:42.000 -> 55:47.520] as David said himself, has traditionally for years been mew and people
[55:47.520 -> 55:52.080] then attribute that they must be dumb because you don't hear them speaking, they rely on
[55:52.080 -> 55:58.520] their looks, and he's a great example that, not to judge a book by its cover, incredibly
[55:58.520 -> 56:06.840] handsome man, but also somebody that's got quite a lot of nuance, subtlety, and deep thinking that's going on as well.
[56:06.840 -> 56:08.480] I mean, you said it in the podcast,
[56:08.480 -> 56:10.280] I didn't belong at school,
[56:10.280 -> 56:11.840] I don't feel I belong in the modeling world,
[56:11.840 -> 56:13.760] I feel I've never belonged anywhere.
[56:13.760 -> 56:15.880] And I think that's a really powerful realization
[56:15.880 -> 56:17.000] for people listening to this,
[56:17.000 -> 56:20.400] not to think that they're struggling and nobody else is.
[56:20.400 -> 56:23.200] Even David Gandy has lived a life
[56:23.200 -> 56:25.360] wracked with self-doubt and imposter syndrome
[56:25.360 -> 56:27.200] and fear at times.
[56:27.200 -> 56:28.200] That's great to know.
[56:28.200 -> 56:29.200] Yeah, definitely.
[56:29.200 -> 56:32.440] I love that idea of marching to the beat of your own drum though.
[56:32.440 -> 56:37.480] The story told of sort of going in the library at school at lunchtimes because I didn't have
[56:37.480 -> 56:42.880] anyone else to speak to, so I learned to be comfortable in my own company.
[56:42.880 -> 56:45.680] You know, he's still doing that as a model now when he's going off and he says, I'll go and dine in restaurants on my own, I travel on my own company. You know he's still doing that as a model now when he's
[56:45.680 -> 56:48.760] going off and he says I'll go and dining restaurants on my own, I'll travel on my own.
[56:48.760 -> 56:52.480] I'm not afraid of being in my own company and I think there's something
[56:52.480 -> 56:57.200] that we can all learn there that we often distract ourselves with noise
[56:57.200 -> 57:03.160] around us but sometimes learning to be comfortable with our own thoughts, our
[57:03.160 -> 57:06.400] own actions and who we are ourselves gives us
[57:06.400 -> 57:10.680] that authenticity that in David's work really shines through.
[57:10.680 -> 57:11.960] Indeed. Thanks a lot, mate.
[57:11.960 -> 57:12.960] Thank you, mate.
[57:12.960 -> 57:17.920] I really hope you enjoyed this conversation with David Gandy. If you can hit subscribe
[57:17.920 -> 57:21.320] for these conversations, wherever you get your podcasts, it makes a massive difference
[57:21.320 -> 57:26.000] to us. But please continue to spread the learnings you're taking from these conversations.
[57:26.000 -> 57:32.000] Remain humble, curious, empathetic, and find your own version of high performance.
[57:32.000 -> 58:02.320] Take care. These days, every new potential hire can feel like a high-stakes wager for your small business.
[58:02.320 -> 58:05.080] You want to be 100% certain that you have access
[58:05.080 -> 58:07.200] to the best qualified candidates available.
[58:07.200 -> 58:09.840] That's why you have to check out LinkedIn Jobs.
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[58:13.520 -> 58:15.440] faster and for free.
[58:15.440 -> 58:19.720] Post your job for free at linkedin.com slash hardwork.
[58:19.720 -> 58:23.200] That's linkedin.com slash hardwork.
[58:23.200 -> 58:26.160] To post your job for free. Terms and conditions apply.
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[58:35.920 -> 58:38.040] Democracy is hanging on by a thread
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[58:53.720 -> 58:57.000] that there were multiple levels to our justice system,
[58:57.000 -> 58:58.720] to our injustice system.
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[59:01.760 -> 59:04.600] and flexible and stretch into being something new,
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