Will Hamilton win eighth world title? Does Norris regret staying at McLaren?

Matt Baker, Martin Brundle and Jess McFadyen join for our latest pod.

They discuss the problems facing Mercedes (2.17) and whether Lewis Hamilton will ever win his eighth world title (15.09).

The team dissect McLaren's difficult start to the season and whether Lando Norris will be regretting staying with the team (29.03).

They finish by previewing this weekend's Saudi Arabian Grand Prix (41.29).

### Podcast Episode Summary: Formula One's Uncertainties and Driver Discontent

**Mercedes and Lewis Hamilton's Conundrum:**

- Mercedes endured a challenging start to the season, finishing well behind Red Bull in Bahrain.
- Lewis Hamilton expressed frustration, claiming the team didn't listen to his concerns about the car's development.
- Martin Brundle believes Hamilton's public criticism is a sign of desperation, as he feels unheard within the team.
- Jess McFadyen finds Hamilton's comments unusual, given that he's typically a team player.
- Mercedes released an open letter to fans, acknowledging the team's struggles and seeking continued support.
- Brundle views the letter as an attempt to manage fan expectations and prevent a loss of support.

**Hamilton's Pursuit of Eighth World Title and Potential Departure from Mercedes:**

- Hamilton's primary goal is to secure his eighth world title, surpassing Michael Schumacher's record.
- Brundle believes Hamilton is determined to achieve this milestone, regardless of the team he drives for.
- A move to Ferrari or Red Bull seems unlikely due to various factors, including team dynamics and financial considerations.
- Hamilton may consider staying at Mercedes if the team can address his concerns and provide a competitive car.
- Brundle emphasizes the importance of Hamilton's unique relationship with Mercedes, including his involvement in initiatives like Accelerate 25 and Mission 44.

**Saudi Arabian Grand Prix Expectations and Mercedes' Prospects:**

- The upcoming race in Saudi Arabia presents an opportunity for Mercedes to assess their progress.
- Brundle cautions against expecting significant improvements, given the limited time for upgrades.
- Mercedes' focus should be on minimizing the gap to Red Bull and capitalizing on any opportunities that arise.
- Consistency and reliability will be crucial for Mercedes to remain in contention for race wins.

**Lando Norris' Struggles at McLaren:**

- Lando Norris experienced a disappointing start to the season, finishing last among the classified drivers in Bahrain.
- McLaren as a team faced difficulties, with Oscar Piastri retiring due to an electrical issue.
- Norris has been with McLaren for five years without securing a race victory, despite showing promise.
- Brundle suggests that Norris may be considering a move to another team if McLaren's struggles continue.
- Norris' contract with McLaren expires at the end of 2025, leaving open the possibility of a departure.

**Conclusion:**

The podcast highlights the challenges faced by Mercedes and Lewis Hamilton, as well as Lando Norris' uncertain future at McLaren. The upcoming Saudi Arabian Grand Prix will provide insights into Mercedes' progress and their ability to compete with Red Bull. Norris' situation at McLaren remains a topic of discussion, with his contract expiring in 2025 and the possibility of a move to another team looming.

In this podcast, Matt Baker, Martin Brundle, and Jess McFadyen discuss various topics related to Formula One racing. They begin by analyzing the struggles faced by Mercedes and speculate on whether Lewis Hamilton can achieve his eighth world title. The team then dissects McLaren's difficult start to the season and ponder if Lando Norris regrets staying with the team. Finally, they preview the upcoming Saudi Arabian Grand Prix.

The discussion about Mercedes centers around their current performance issues and the possibility of Hamilton securing his eighth world championship. The team acknowledges that Mercedes has work to do to provide Hamilton with a competitive car and questions whether he will remain patient enough to see it through.

Regarding McLaren, the team examines their poor start to the season and considers whether Norris made the right decision by staying with the team. They express concern about McLaren's reliability and lack of pace, emphasizing the need for significant improvements. The team also speculates on Norris's potential future moves, considering options such as joining a more competitive team or waiting for an opportunity at Mercedes.

The preview of the Saudi Arabian Grand Prix includes discussions about the Jeddah circuit, its unique characteristics, and the potential for exciting racing. The team highlights the importance of qualifying and the challenges drivers face on the track. They also express anticipation for Fernando Alonso's performance and the possibility of a closer battle between Ferrari and Red Bull.

Overall, the podcast provides insightful analysis and commentary on various aspects of Formula One racing, including team performances, driver strategies, and upcoming races. It engages listeners with expert perspectives and generates interest in the upcoming Saudi Arabian Grand Prix.

[00:00.000 -> 00:06.000] Two British drivers, Lewis Hamilton and Lando Norris, both spent the Bahrain Grand Prix
[00:06.000 -> 00:08.200] lamenting their lack of performance.
[00:08.200 -> 00:14.000] Are Mercedes in crisis and can they give Hamilton the car to win his eighth world title?
[00:14.000 -> 00:17.040] For Lando, is he running out of patience with McLaren?
[00:17.040 -> 00:24.000] This is the Sky Sports F1 Podcast.
[00:24.000 -> 00:28.640] Hello all, I hope you're well. It's race week. We've got the Saudi Arabian Grand Prix this
[00:28.640 -> 00:33.820] weekend so plenty to get our teeth into. And with me for this one is someone who needs
[00:33.820 -> 00:39.100] no introduction, the king of gridwalks and Sky F1 analyst Martin Brundle alongside Jess
[00:39.100 -> 00:43.980] McFadden, producer at Sky Sports. Martin, well it's both of your first time on the podcast
[00:43.980 -> 00:47.840] so welcome. Good to have you. Martin, we'll start with you. How's it going?
[00:47.840 -> 00:54.640] Good, really. Yes. Looking forward to Saudi next, this coming week, actually. Bahrain
[00:54.640 -> 01:00.760] served up quite a lot of good stories, big stories, and a lot of shocks for some of the
[01:00.760 -> 01:02.320] teams and drivers as well.
[01:02.320 -> 01:06.720] Yeah, it certainly did. And Jess, you're relatively new to Sky Sports,
[01:06.720 -> 01:08.280] so settling in all okay?
[01:08.280 -> 01:09.120] Good to see you.
[01:10.040 -> 01:13.520] Yes, it's a lovely bunch of people to work with.
[01:13.520 -> 01:15.860] I was out in Bahrain with Martin,
[01:15.860 -> 01:18.520] so first race with boots on ground,
[01:18.520 -> 01:20.340] which always just feels,
[01:20.340 -> 01:22.020] it just feels so good to get going.
[01:22.020 -> 01:22.860] I think, you know,
[01:22.860 -> 01:28.240] there's been so much chatter over pre-season and yet when it comes down to it,
[01:28.240 -> 01:30.040] it's when we see cars out on track
[01:30.040 -> 01:32.760] that we know that we've got something to talk about.
[01:32.760 -> 01:36.720] And as Martin said, some surprise storylines coming out.
[01:36.720 -> 01:37.840] I know on the last podcast,
[01:37.840 -> 01:41.520] you guys touched on Aston in quite some detail.
[01:41.520 -> 01:44.800] So no doubt we'll be following them through the season
[01:44.800 -> 01:45.560] and hopefully they're
[01:45.560 -> 01:51.760] going to give us a lot to talk about because the Red Bulls looked incredibly dominant,
[01:51.760 -> 01:58.160] which I guess leads into the lack of competitiveness that we saw in Bahrain. Is there going to
[01:58.160 -> 02:01.680] be more to get excited about this season? Obviously, we're going to hope the answer
[02:01.680 -> 02:05.040] is yes, but it led us into what we're going to be talking answer is yes, but it kind of led us into what we're going to
[02:05.040 -> 02:11.840] be talking about today. There were some incredibly disappointed drivers on Bahrain and some rather
[02:11.840 -> 02:14.840] related as well. So lots to talk about.
[02:14.840 -> 02:18.520] There really is. There really is. Let's get into it then. And I think the interesting
[02:18.520 -> 02:22.520] thing with talking about Lewis and Lando in tandem here is obviously they're in very different
[02:22.520 -> 02:29.040] situations. You know, Lewis seven time world champion, Lando yet to win a race, but they are kind of bound by these underperforming
[02:29.040 -> 02:34.240] cars for this season. And ultimately, you know, that could cost them as drivers going forward.
[02:34.240 -> 02:38.080] So I want to get into that. And also we'll obviously have a little look ahead to Saudi
[02:38.080 -> 02:43.360] as well at the end. But Martin, I want to start with you really and get your thoughts on Lewis
[02:43.360 -> 02:45.520] and Mercedes and where they
[02:45.520 -> 02:51.600] find themselves now. And just to remind everyone, of course, Hamilton P5 in Bahrain, Russell P7.
[02:51.600 -> 02:54.720] It was a disappointing weekend to say the least for them, wasn't it?
[02:56.000 -> 03:00.960] Yeah, I think more the time deficit than the positions, to be honest. I mean, they were
[03:00.960 -> 03:05.760] 50 seconds plus behind Mercedes-Benz and against a cruising
[03:05.760 -> 03:08.240] Vestappen out front because he wasn't under pressure.
[03:08.640 -> 03:11.280] And we know that Mercedes and Aston and Ferrari were pushing
[03:11.280 -> 03:12.800] quite hard, racing each other.
[03:12.800 -> 03:15.240] So that would have been a shocker.
[03:15.240 -> 03:20.600] They sort of massaged the W13 all through last year and ended up winning
[03:20.720 -> 03:23.160] Brazil, but it was a challenging car.
[03:23.680 -> 03:28.000] And I think many of us expected to see something quite different turn up in Bahrain at the
[03:28.000 -> 03:32.000] test and it wasn't really, it was an evolution of last year's car.
[03:32.000 -> 03:37.520] And I think Toto and Lewis are saying, look, we haven't, this is not right.
[03:37.520 -> 03:38.520] This doesn't feel right.
[03:38.520 -> 03:40.800] We're not going in the right direction here.
[03:40.800 -> 03:42.640] And the stopwatch never lies in that respect.
[03:42.640 -> 03:49.160] So you know, it is Bahrain, it's a specific layout that
[03:49.160 -> 03:53.640] challenges the rear tyres more than the front and it has its
[03:53.640 -> 03:58.920] own particular demands of a Formula One car, let's say, but
[03:59.400 -> 04:02.240] and that won't necessarily translate everywhere, but the
[04:02.240 -> 04:05.040] bottom line is they were six tenths of a second slow in
[04:05.040 -> 04:11.200] qualifying and probably a second elapsed slow in the race, which is forever in a Formula One car,
[04:11.200 -> 04:16.800] of course. So I think there's a lot of concern there and with other teams that just literally
[04:16.800 -> 04:26.720] got pulverised by Red Bull as to, hang on, what are we doing? But I don't think Lewis is in any different position to say Lando or
[04:26.720 -> 04:32.720] Charles Leclerc, Ferrari, of stamping their feet a little bit and saying, hang on, what are you
[04:32.720 -> 04:39.120] doing about this? Tell me what we're doing in terms of updates, in terms of personnel, in terms of
[04:39.840 -> 04:43.920] moving this game forward, because it looks an awful lot like last year at the moment.
[04:44.760 -> 04:50.240] moving this game forward because it looks an awful lot like last year at the moment. And I don't think it's all about I'm leaving, I'm, you know, I'm out of here. It's about,
[04:50.240 -> 04:54.920] look, we this sometimes you just have to stand up and go, this is not right, because the
[04:54.920 -> 04:59.760] mantra from Mercedes through the weekend was, we don't want to go to a different philosophy
[04:59.760 -> 05:13.200] on the aerodynamics, because we've got to learn that all over again. That's a step backwards to go forwards. We'd rather finesse what we know. And I think at the end of Bahrain, it's not good enough.
[05:14.000 -> 05:18.160] It's too much finessing to be done. Jess, I was going to ask you if you could just put into
[05:18.160 -> 05:23.760] context how, I mean, 50 seconds in Formula One, that's how far Lewis Hamilton was behind Max
[05:23.760 -> 05:26.520] Verstappen. That is so much time, isn't it?
[05:26.520 -> 05:34.080] Oh my God, like Martin said, it's forever. And the amount of development needed to be
[05:34.080 -> 05:41.440] able to close that gap is massive. And by the time you've caught up, Red Bull have probably
[05:41.440 -> 05:46.840] brought a few updates themselves. And so it's always kind of a,
[05:46.840 -> 05:49.960] how fast can you find the fix
[05:49.960 -> 05:52.240] that means that the gap can close?
[05:52.240 -> 05:55.680] And obviously, you know, we've had one race.
[05:55.680 -> 05:57.540] I think that's the other thing that we need to remember.
[05:57.540 -> 05:58.920] We've had one race.
[05:58.920 -> 06:01.040] Bahrain is, I don't know.
[06:01.040 -> 06:02.640] I mean, it's not as much of an outlier
[06:02.640 -> 06:03.720] as some of the other tracks
[06:03.720 -> 06:08.320] in terms of it being non-representative. There are things that we can take away from Bahrain
[06:08.320 -> 06:12.320] to say, okay, well, this might be the way that it pans out throughout the rest of the
[06:12.320 -> 06:18.760] season. And we know how good that Red Bull is and how dominant they were last year for
[06:18.760 -> 06:30.920] a lot of the season. We know that they're good, but we know Mercedes are good as well. I mean, you don't just forget how to be record breaking constructors. Like that's just, that doesn't
[06:30.920 -> 06:35.080] go away. But kind of as you guys touched on the, on the last podcast, Mercedes have gone
[06:35.080 -> 06:39.280] through a lot of changes. They've lost a lot of people, Red Bull have gained a lot of people.
[06:39.280 -> 06:45.840] So it is, it is kind of about right, finding what works and having to find it pretty damn quick
[06:45.840 -> 06:48.540] because you're gonna have a lot of people
[06:48.540 -> 06:53.320] that aren't happy with the way things are going.
[06:53.320 -> 06:55.320] But yeah, I think it's,
[06:56.440 -> 07:00.240] I think quite understandably from the fan's perspective,
[07:00.240 -> 07:01.800] the question has arose of,
[07:01.800 -> 07:04.560] well, how long does Lewis stick it out for?
[07:04.560 -> 07:06.480] Because as he told us
[07:06.480 -> 07:12.320] in the lie detector feature that we did, that came out on Sunday, he has said that he's going
[07:12.320 -> 07:18.560] to stay in Formula One until he gets his eighth world title. But will that be with Mercedes? I
[07:18.560 -> 07:23.600] mean, I think it's going to be interesting moving more and more through the season, listening to
[07:27.440 -> 07:33.760] interesting moving more and more through the season, listening to how Lewis reacts, because there was a particular piece of interview post-Bahrain that made the kind of later on
[07:33.760 -> 07:41.160] in the programming where he mentioned how they just didn't listen to me, which I thought
[07:41.160 -> 07:46.480] that was quite a different sounding Lewis Hamilton from what we've heard before.
[07:46.480 -> 07:49.880] So yeah, that's what I'm gonna be looking out for.
[07:49.880 -> 07:52.680] The way that he then talks to the media
[07:52.680 -> 07:55.160] and kind of positions himself within the team
[07:55.160 -> 07:57.960] when he's looking at another season
[07:57.960 -> 07:59.920] of not being very competitive.
[07:59.920 -> 08:01.960] Martin, what did you make of that comment?
[08:01.960 -> 08:03.880] I'll read it sort of in full.
[08:03.880 -> 08:05.520] Yeah, he said Mercedes didn't
[08:05.520 -> 08:10.400] listen to him over the development of their 2023 car. He said, last year there were things
[08:10.400 -> 08:14.720] I told them, I said the issues there are with the car, I've driven so many cars in my life,
[08:14.720 -> 08:19.840] I know what a car needs, I know what a car doesn't need, I think it's really about accountability.
[08:19.840 -> 08:28.400] Were you surprised that he so publicly called out the team? A little bit, but quite clearly Lewis feels that
[08:28.400 -> 08:34.640] he's not getting enough traction just chatting to them and he obviously feels they're not paying
[08:34.640 -> 08:39.920] enough attention and has had to go public with that. It is highly unusual because he is always
[08:40.560 -> 08:47.280] you know the team player, the ultimate team player really. And, you know, Formula One drivers are embedded in a team
[08:47.280 -> 08:48.400] in both directions.
[08:48.400 -> 08:51.040] You're comfortable with the people around you.
[08:51.040 -> 08:52.440] You get to know your engineer
[08:52.440 -> 08:55.800] and your performance engineers and strategists.
[08:55.800 -> 09:00.680] And on the other foot, you've got the team.
[09:00.680 -> 09:04.880] They design a car around you, your size in the cockpit,
[09:04.880 -> 09:06.240] your preferences of how the car
[09:06.240 -> 09:10.240] handles, marketing, sponsorship.
[09:10.240 -> 09:15.120] It's a long-term, very, as I said, the word I used was embedded.
[09:15.120 -> 09:20.440] So a driver like Lewis is not going to just want to go somewhere else in a hurry, and
[09:20.440 -> 09:24.000] it's not a tantrum.
[09:24.000 -> 09:27.960] It is, it just makes, he's obviously felt the need to go public with
[09:27.960 -> 09:32.360] something because he felt he wasn't being listened to closely enough within the team.
[09:32.720 -> 09:38.560] And also I think it's the start of a very, very long season.
[09:38.600 -> 09:42.980] And after the race in Bahrain, when you watched on Sky F1, there were a lot
[09:42.980 -> 09:50.520] of very disappointed drivers, the emotions, the sheer frustrations and disappointments there, I think were
[09:50.520 -> 09:55.520] pouring out because they realized that Red Bull were in a different race basically.
[09:55.520 -> 10:00.640] And I think you've seen quite a lot of comments from George and Charles and
[10:00.640 -> 10:05.000] Lewis and no doubt Lando about what we do.
[10:05.520 -> 10:08.960] Cause what they know is if the team just finds
[10:08.960 -> 10:11.860] a half a 10th there and a 10th there,
[10:11.860 -> 10:13.640] that's just a normal progression
[10:13.640 -> 10:16.240] for all the teams through a season.
[10:16.240 -> 10:20.920] So they know they need a leapfrog jump
[10:20.920 -> 10:25.000] with some kind of magical new upgrade.
[10:26.200 -> 10:30.000] And as Toto Wolf says, there's no silver bullet.
[10:30.000 -> 10:32.200] That doesn't happen very often these days.
[10:32.200 -> 10:35.720] They've got so much equipment and resource
[10:35.720 -> 10:38.280] to make sure the cars are pretty damn good
[10:38.280 -> 10:41.240] when they hit the track that you don't just suddenly
[10:41.240 -> 10:43.200] find half three quarters of a second per lap,
[10:43.200 -> 10:45.480] which is what they need really, at least.
[10:45.920 -> 10:49.360] And that's over and above what the other teams will find as well.
[10:49.360 -> 10:53.200] So I think there was an element of, yeah, frustration, disappointment,
[10:53.200 -> 10:55.360] resignation about some of those comments.
[10:55.840 -> 11:00.240] And I guess Jess, in the context of last year, having already had a disappointing
[11:00.240 -> 11:05.600] year, you know, they released a statement this weekend from the team, you know, again,
[11:05.600 -> 11:09.080] echoing what you just said, Martin, you know, there are no silver bullets in F1. There's
[11:09.080 -> 11:13.320] no quick fixes. This is a long term problem for Mercedes, isn't it?
[11:13.320 -> 11:22.160] It is. I mean, I found the letter, the open letter to the fans. If I'm honest, quite odd.
[11:22.160 -> 11:25.900] Because as we've tried to touch on here,
[11:25.900 -> 11:28.780] and I think as a lot of fans listening will be thinking,
[11:28.780 -> 11:30.900] like, it's only the first race.
[11:30.900 -> 11:33.440] We can't start making conclusions.
[11:33.440 -> 11:36.800] As Martin said, longest season ever.
[11:36.800 -> 11:38.020] We've just done race one,
[11:38.020 -> 11:39.660] and all of a sudden there are people going,
[11:39.660 -> 11:41.140] Lewis is going to leave Mercedes,
[11:41.140 -> 11:42.060] and it's all going to be over,
[11:42.060 -> 11:44.420] and he's going to jump to a Ferrari or whatever.
[11:44.420 -> 11:49.480] Now, I think it's an interesting topic to discuss, hence us doing a whole podcast
[11:49.480 -> 11:57.480] on it. But the letter to the fans, to me, was more of a knee-jerk reaction than anything
[11:57.480 -> 12:07.120] else about speculation about him moving on, just because of the fact that it is only the first race. Yes, there's a lot of disappointment.
[12:07.120 -> 12:12.040] Mercedes on their social, their digital, their branding,
[12:12.040 -> 12:14.560] they are very much trying to be,
[12:14.560 -> 12:16.480] they've always said like, we win, we lose together.
[12:16.480 -> 12:19.280] They're very fan centric.
[12:19.280 -> 12:21.880] They love to include the fans
[12:21.880 -> 12:24.840] as part of who they are and what they do.
[12:24.840 -> 12:28.600] But it just hit weird for me that already,
[12:28.600 -> 12:32.920] Mercedes is putting out an apology after race one.
[12:32.920 -> 12:35.880] Like, had this been a few races into the season,
[12:35.880 -> 12:39.880] maybe I would be a bit more like, okay, fine.
[12:39.880 -> 12:41.560] You know, they just want to cover off and say
[12:41.560 -> 12:44.740] they understand and they see the frustration of fans
[12:44.740 -> 12:48.520] and they see the frustration of their drivers and they know it's not good enough. But after race
[12:48.520 -> 12:57.000] one and the weirdest part of the whole letter to me was the final lines where it says, are
[12:57.000 -> 13:03.520] you ready to join us for the fight fight back? If not, then there are no hard feelings. So
[13:03.520 -> 13:09.320] almost like they're, they know that they might lose fans because they're not the out and out winners
[13:09.320 -> 13:10.320] anymore.
[13:10.320 -> 13:14.360] But I just found that very, very odd.
[13:14.360 -> 13:17.800] It's just not something I've ever seen a team do before.
[13:17.800 -> 13:22.840] And just the timing of it for me just is, yeah, it's not what, it's not, I mean, I'm
[13:22.840 -> 13:26.000] not the head of comms at Mercedes, and I'm not the head of comms at Mercedes, and I'm sure the
[13:26.000 -> 13:30.560] head of comms at Mercedes would have something to say to me in terms of, well, it's not your
[13:30.560 -> 13:31.560] strategy.
[13:31.560 -> 13:35.320] So I'm looking forward to having that conversation if I ever do.
[13:35.320 -> 13:42.160] But yeah, I just, it feels quite defeatist so early on that you must, they must have
[13:42.160 -> 13:45.000] known way, way before testing Bahrain
[13:46.640 -> 13:48.720] that this is what was gonna happen
[13:48.720 -> 13:51.160] because they've not played it out.
[13:51.160 -> 13:53.280] They've apologized for it straight away.
[13:53.280 -> 13:57.160] And yeah, I don't know what Martin thinks.
[13:57.160 -> 14:00.600] I don't know, did you get a chance to read the letter?
[14:00.600 -> 14:01.480] Yeah, I did.
[14:01.480 -> 14:04.680] And I do know the head of comms extremely well.
[14:04.680 -> 14:07.680] And how I viewed that, I think
[14:07.680 -> 14:12.040] there's some reverse psychology going on at the end there about, hey, look, if you don't
[14:12.040 -> 14:18.960] want to support us anymore to stir up, you know, the vibrant support that they have.
[14:18.960 -> 14:31.920] And I don't think any fans are going to desert their team, just because of a few bad results. But also because, let's say Toto, let's be kind, Toto and Lewis were less
[14:31.920 -> 14:33.920] guarded with their words than normal.
[14:34.440 -> 14:37.680] I think they had a bit of repair work to do, I think, of trying to calm down
[14:37.680 -> 14:42.280] the situation because we all jumped on it at Sky F1, so did other media.
[14:42.280 -> 14:45.800] I was like, whoa, this is so unusual for Toyota
[14:45.800 -> 14:50.400] and Lewis not to just be, I love the team at Bricksworth, I love the team at Brackley
[14:50.400 -> 14:53.680] and we race this together.
[14:53.680 -> 14:57.840] They were pretty punchy with their words.
[14:57.840 -> 15:01.120] So I think that was just managing that down really.
[15:01.120 -> 15:05.160] And I think that's all they could do because they can't redesign the car, they
[15:05.160 -> 15:09.120] can only do the words and the media and that's for somebody else to do.
[15:09.120 -> 15:14.160] Yeah, especially after one race and I think that's really key, isn't it? This might happen
[15:14.160 -> 15:19.200] at the end of a season and kind of a post-disappointing season letter to your fans, but to be off
[15:19.200 -> 15:22.720] to one race I think really shows the strength of feeling.
[15:22.720 -> 15:26.000] Alright, so that's kind of Mercedes as a team,
[15:26.000 -> 15:28.180] but specifically Lewis.
[15:28.180 -> 15:30.620] Martin, is going for that eighth title,
[15:30.620 -> 15:33.000] clearly that is the number one objective now,
[15:33.000 -> 15:34.620] I would say, for Lewis Hamilton.
[15:34.620 -> 15:36.180] I don't know if you agree with that.
[15:36.180 -> 15:39.140] And is it all about trying to get that to number eight?
[15:39.140 -> 15:42.420] He's 38 years old, obviously Alonso is 41,
[15:42.420 -> 15:44.420] and still at the very peak of his powers
[15:44.420 -> 15:45.760] and doing exceptionally
[15:45.760 -> 15:52.200] well. So where do you see or how do you see this playing out over the next couple of years?
[15:52.200 -> 15:56.800] I think Lewis feels he was absolutely robbed in Abu Dhabi 2021, along with a lot of other
[15:56.800 -> 16:05.280] people. I think it took him several months last year through 2022 to get over that. Then he was driving beautifully.
[16:05.440 -> 16:11.400] And I think it's absolutely clear that taking that eighth title is everything
[16:11.400 -> 16:18.400] to him now to move that high tide mark on and be right up there and considered
[16:18.400 -> 16:30.680] the greatest and to have one more than anybody else is important to him. And I think he will want to drive wherever he can achieve that.
[16:30.840 -> 16:34.680] Now, if you went to Ferrari, for example, would you be certain
[16:34.680 -> 16:36.200] you could achieve that better there?
[16:36.200 -> 16:39.320] You know, they've got a number of their own challenges at the moment.
[16:39.960 -> 16:42.440] Would he get in the door at Red Bull?
[16:42.480 -> 16:44.000] Could you possibly have?
[16:44.000 -> 16:46.120] Because that's the only team right now you'd think he
[16:46.120 -> 16:51.720] could go to, because, but could you have a Verstappen, Hamilton lineup?
[16:51.720 -> 16:52.680] Could you afford them?
[16:53.120 -> 16:54.520] You know, how would you manage that?
[16:54.520 -> 16:55.520] I mean, the fans would love it.
[16:55.520 -> 16:56.020] Yeah.
[16:56.400 -> 16:57.400] Do you need that?
[16:57.480 -> 17:00.500] Do you need that kind of, you know, because I think Red Bull are quite happy
[17:00.500 -> 17:05.160] with a sort of a number one and a number one and a half driver in their car.
[17:05.160 -> 17:11.100] So it's all very well saying he'll go somewhere else, but where at the moment?
[17:11.100 -> 17:15.880] So he's better to make what he's got in a magnificent team work.
[17:15.880 -> 17:23.700] So I think, you know, he did, when he moved from McLaren, I'll never forget him getting
[17:23.700 -> 17:26.200] out of the car in Singapore that
[17:26.200 -> 17:31.000] night and didn't even look back at the car when his McLaren had broken down again.
[17:31.000 -> 17:35.660] And I think I said in commentary, he's had enough of that.
[17:35.660 -> 17:39.520] Going to Mercedes looked like a risk at the time, but what we didn't know is all the things
[17:39.520 -> 17:44.280] that Ross Brawn and Andy Carroll and many others could tell Lewis, and look, have a
[17:44.280 -> 17:45.480] look at our hybrid
[17:45.840 -> 17:47.320] power unit that we've got coming.
[17:47.320 -> 17:48.960] We're miles ahead of anybody else.
[17:48.960 -> 17:50.960] So Lewis was able to see that.
[17:51.640 -> 17:57.080] He won't, I don't think he'll have that kind of head start if he moves at the moment, but
[17:58.360 -> 18:01.400] he's obviously in the latter part of his career.
[18:01.400 -> 18:03.400] I could easily see him having another five years.
[18:03.400 -> 18:06.680] Look at Fernando Alonso, for example, he's three years older than
[18:07.160 -> 18:10.400] Lewis and driving probably at his best or equal best.
[18:10.400 -> 18:14.880] So Lewis has got one more roll of the dice, hasn't he?
[18:15.160 -> 18:21.560] To join a team and make them world champions and get all the accolades
[18:21.600 -> 18:28.480] that he wants, so I think that's where he's at at the moment. But if in doubt,
[18:28.480 -> 18:33.760] stay put, I would have thought, will be what he's thinking. I want to make this, if I can
[18:33.760 -> 18:37.840] make this work, that's my best solution. If not, I may have to look elsewhere.
[18:37.840 -> 18:41.600] And also, I mean, I've got a few tweets here. Martin on Twitter said,
[18:41.600 -> 18:44.240] Lewis isn't going anywhere. All this Ferrari talk is laughable.
[18:44.240 -> 18:45.040] He is woven
[18:45.040 -> 18:50.080] in far beyond his position as a driver with Accelerate 25 and Mission 44. And I guess that's
[18:50.080 -> 18:54.560] kind of true, isn't it? Because he is such a he's been there so long that he's such a strong part of
[18:54.560 -> 18:59.360] that team. And Jess, I don't know if you've picked up on any other wild rumours online of where
[19:00.000 -> 19:04.480] Lewis could end up going. It's quite an exciting prospect, certainly garnering a lot of attention,
[19:04.480 -> 19:11.920] isn't it? Well, depending on how deep on Twitter and Reddit you go, I don't think any team is
[19:11.920 -> 19:18.480] without a rumour of him potentially going there for, I mean, that is good fun reading all the kind
[19:18.480 -> 19:24.480] of the weird theories that come out about where he could potentially go and find his eighth.
[19:24.560 -> 19:25.280] the weird theories that come out about where he could potentially go and find his eighth.
[19:31.760 -> 19:32.400] They make for great reading. But yeah, to your point, Lewis has quite a unique relationship
[19:42.080 -> 19:46.320] in that team. He is so core to it. It's almost like they co-exist. They're dependent on each other almost. And it would be quite unfathomable
[19:46.320 -> 19:48.480] to think of him anywhere else.
[19:48.480 -> 19:51.400] Like, you know, I've seen all the Photoshop's of him in red
[19:51.400 -> 19:52.720] and it just doesn't look right.
[19:52.720 -> 19:55.080] It's like, it just looks odd.
[19:55.080 -> 19:57.240] But I think, you know, in a similar way
[19:57.240 -> 20:00.400] that Max is into weaving himself into Red Bull,
[20:00.400 -> 20:04.840] like it'd be very difficult to imagine Max anywhere else.
[20:04.840 -> 20:09.280] But yeah, Lewis does have this very unique position that he's got so
[20:09.280 -> 20:11.760] much freedom as well with Mercedes.
[20:12.120 -> 20:15.880] Um, because of who he is and what he's achieved and the way that he likes to
[20:15.880 -> 20:21.340] operate, he gets this ability to do all these things, like the commission,
[20:21.340 -> 20:23.240] like Ignite, like Mission 44.
[20:23.580 -> 20:26.680] And, and to walk away from that would probably be
[20:26.680 -> 20:30.960] a lot more difficult for him than had he not got that.
[20:30.960 -> 20:35.200] So there's a multitude of things keeping him at Mercedes.
[20:36.280 -> 20:38.880] And I think I probably agree with Martin in that
[20:38.880 -> 20:41.200] it's better the devil you know right now,
[20:41.200 -> 20:47.800] but I wouldn't be surprised if he's open to hearing of opportunities.
[20:47.800 -> 20:51.960] I mean, any team up and down the grid would probably break off their arm to
[20:51.960 -> 20:54.240] have somebody like Lewis Hamilton driving for them.
[20:54.560 -> 20:59.440] But yeah, he's only going to move if he believes it's going to be competitive.
[20:59.520 -> 21:02.200] We have to remember Lewis is in the middle of a negotiation as well.
[21:02.240 -> 21:06.360] Now, I'm a hundred percent certain that Lewis would always follow the
[21:06.360 -> 21:09.600] performance and not the money, but who's going to turn down a big
[21:09.600 -> 21:11.780] paycheck if you can get it as well.
[21:11.780 -> 21:15.300] So, and there might be some pressure at Mercedes-Benz to
[21:15.300 -> 21:18.280] reduce his current pay as it were.
[21:18.280 -> 21:22.640] So, you know, there's a bit of negotiation and a bit of, you
[21:22.640 -> 21:24.480] know, gameplay in this as well.
[21:24.480 -> 21:26.160] But I would have thought a lot
[21:26.160 -> 21:31.120] of Lewis's initiatives that are very important to him and then very important initiatives
[21:31.120 -> 21:36.960] are transportable. So I don't, or you could recreate them somewhere else. I don't think
[21:37.520 -> 21:42.160] that would stop him moving. But I do, I do think overall, when you look at the picture,
[21:42.160 -> 21:45.160] and we talk about him, you know, the devil,
[21:45.160 -> 21:49.600] the devil, you know, or embedded or whatever, then there's a lot of good reasons to stay
[21:49.600 -> 21:50.600] at Mercedes.
[21:50.600 -> 21:55.440] He just needs them to tell him how they're going to sort this out.
[21:55.440 -> 22:03.260] But you know, Senna, you know, left McLaren to go to Williams, you know, Schumacher went
[22:03.260 -> 22:05.000] off to Ferrari, didn't he?
[22:05.000 -> 22:08.960] And it took a long time, but made that work.
[22:08.960 -> 22:13.960] And so these great drivers are not scared of going somewhere
[22:13.960 -> 22:17.160] and then galvanizing and getting a lot of new people
[22:17.160 -> 22:18.880] around them and making something happen.
[22:18.880 -> 22:22.400] And I think, there must be part of Lewis thinks,
[22:22.400 -> 22:24.920] I'd love to go to Ferrari and do a Michael Schumacher
[22:24.920 -> 22:28.040] and really turn that back into, if I can't
[22:28.040 -> 22:32.460] win my eighth or ninth right now, why don't I go and have some fun there?
[22:32.460 -> 22:36.900] But, um, I'm sure these are all playing in his mind and he'll be talking to his
[22:36.900 -> 22:42.340] dad about this as well and his management team about where do we go from here?
[22:50.760 -> 22:51.760] where do we go from here? And that will be exacerbated by the dismal performance in Bahrain really of the car.
[22:51.760 -> 22:57.240] I wonder then, this weekend in Saudi, because there is a lot of attention now on this story
[22:57.240 -> 23:03.240] and what Lewis is going to do, and I wonder Jess, what would a good weekend in Saudi Arabia
[23:03.240 -> 23:04.480] look like for Mercedes?
[23:04.480 -> 23:07.440] Oh gosh. Sitting here now. And I wonder, Jess, what would a good weekend in Saudi Arabia look like for Mercedes?
[23:14.160 -> 23:26.400] Well, I think as Martin alluded to, it's going to be about how big is the gap? How big is that gap? How big is that deficit? And how much can they glean through? But I mean, it's such a, that's quite a big ask at Saudi, um, especially, well,
[23:26.400 -> 23:29.860] and especially race two, like, you know, they had this, there's minimal time as we'll find
[23:29.860 -> 23:36.440] throughout this season. There's not as much time to be able to turn around upgrades. You
[23:36.440 -> 23:39.400] know, I don't think anybody, does anybody have anything planned for Saudi? Not that
[23:39.400 -> 23:46.720] I've heard. Um, it's, so I think it's, it's, it's, they're going to want to have, they're going to
[23:46.720 -> 23:51.280] want to have seen a reduce in pace, but I don't see how that's going to have be a, be massively
[23:51.280 -> 23:57.680] achievable. Um, and I think as they all just keep saying, just maximizing on, on positions, I mean,
[23:57.680 -> 24:07.760] what Mercedes were incredibly good at last season was picking up the opportunities, was turning up consistently finishing. George
[24:07.760 -> 24:12.880] was on a run of top five finishes for, what was it, the first seven or eight races of last year.
[24:13.760 -> 24:18.880] That consistency is something that they can achieve, that reliability and that consistency,
[24:19.760 -> 24:25.760] where Charles had a DNF in Bahrain. We know that that Ferrari reliability
[24:25.760 -> 24:28.840] was a bit on the edge last year.
[24:28.840 -> 24:30.840] So they're just gonna wanna make sure,
[24:30.840 -> 24:32.540] they are the opportunists.
[24:32.540 -> 24:34.440] When they're not challenging out the front,
[24:34.440 -> 24:35.940] they are the opportunists.
[24:35.940 -> 24:37.840] And that's what they're gonna wanna make sure
[24:37.840 -> 24:40.120] that they can still deliver
[24:40.120 -> 24:43.840] if the outright pace is not quite there just yet.
[24:43.840 -> 24:47.280] Yeah, you find young people, I think, less than half my age.
[24:47.840 -> 24:50.160] So you will notice that I choose my words.
[24:50.880 -> 24:51.120] That's not true.
[24:51.120 -> 24:56.080] I choose my words more carefully sometimes because my experience is,
[24:56.720 -> 24:59.360] we go to Saudi and Mercedes win the race.
[25:00.400 -> 25:04.400] And all the stuff comes caving in on your head.
[25:04.400 -> 25:06.840] So it is a different track layout.
[25:06.840 -> 25:10.400] And they might have found some things with it.
[25:10.400 -> 25:13.160] But the form book suggests not, doesn't it?
[25:13.160 -> 25:16.520] The form book suggests it's Red Bull comfortably,
[25:16.520 -> 25:19.560] Ferrari gamely chasing them, Aston Martin
[25:19.560 -> 25:22.200] have got all the upside potential on development,
[25:22.200 -> 25:24.560] and Mercedes in there as well somewhere.
[25:24.560 -> 25:25.080] Mercedes are a
[25:25.080 -> 25:29.160] mighty team, there's a lot of clever people there. They've lost some clever people, but
[25:29.160 -> 25:36.120] there were hundreds more left behind. So I wouldn't write them off. But it is absolutely
[25:36.120 -> 25:42.000] clear that they do need to find something pretty magical with that car. And as I said,
[25:42.000 -> 25:47.480] looking at it on the grid, on the basis of if it looks right, it is right. It's not right. It's not
[25:47.480 -> 25:51.080] a good looking car. It just looks lumpy. And when you look
[25:51.080 -> 25:55.040] at the side of a red bull, we're no aerodynamicists are we but it
[25:55.040 -> 25:58.840] just looks right somehow. And, and the same with the Aston and
[25:58.840 -> 26:02.280] what have you. So unless Mercedes I think have already
[26:02.280 -> 26:06.800] got some kind of change of the architecture,
[26:06.800 -> 26:12.080] of the fundamental aerodynamic architecture of their car in the pipeline, it might take some
[26:12.080 -> 26:18.400] time. But always leave a little bit spare because you just don't know what's going to happen at the
[26:18.400 -> 26:22.960] next race, which is what I love about Formula 1 and live sport in particular.
[26:23.280 -> 26:25.000] what I love about Formula One and live sport in particular.
[26:27.280 -> 26:28.320] And this is why we've got you on, Martin. You're the leveller.
[26:28.320 -> 26:33.320] You keep us honest and not going down too many rabbit holes.
[26:33.800 -> 26:37.260] But I think the cynic in me as well says,
[26:38.460 -> 26:42.440] to completely, I guess, just juxtapose my entire comment
[26:42.440 -> 26:43.760] about Martin being the leveller,
[26:43.760 -> 26:46.360] maybe you can level me again here, Martin.
[26:46.360 -> 26:50.320] But the cynic in me says that they just could not
[26:50.320 -> 26:56.680] have turned up in Bahrain with a copycat Red Bull.
[26:56.680 -> 26:59.880] Could you imagine Christian letting Toto off
[26:59.880 -> 27:04.000] if they dropped their no-side pod concept
[27:04.000 -> 27:06.360] and came out with what more and more of the teams
[27:06.360 -> 27:10.520] we've seen doing, which is more akin to the Red Bull,
[27:10.520 -> 27:13.440] Toto would not have heard the end of it
[27:13.440 -> 27:15.600] if they had abandoned that concept
[27:15.600 -> 27:20.600] and come back without their no side pod concept.
[27:20.780 -> 27:22.860] The cynic in me also says that whilst,
[27:22.860 -> 27:24.240] Martin, you're totally right,
[27:24.240 -> 27:26.840] development-wise, taking it back to square one
[27:26.840 -> 27:29.340] would just not have been tenable.
[27:29.340 -> 27:31.180] There is also that part of me that goes,
[27:31.180 -> 27:35.520] they love a tete-a-tete, our Horner and Toto wolf,
[27:35.520 -> 27:39.220] and I don't know if they could have survived a,
[27:39.220 -> 27:43.060] oh, so you have copied us then, kind of scenario.
[27:45.560 -> 27:47.920] Well, Christian would have loved it, wouldn't he?
[27:47.920 -> 27:52.920] And so he's having a good old poke at Aston Martin instead.
[27:54.360 -> 27:57.340] A man's ego is a very ugly thing,
[27:57.340 -> 28:00.840] but if it gets in the way of your Formula One car
[28:00.840 -> 28:03.240] performing, then you've definitely got the car
[28:03.240 -> 28:04.080] before the horse.
[28:04.080 -> 28:13.200] So I don't think, and it engineers in my experience, thinking in zeros and ones,
[28:13.200 -> 28:17.200] and they will have analyzed the whole situation to death.
[28:17.200 -> 28:19.360] They decided to stick with that.
[28:19.360 -> 28:24.240] I don't think it would have been based on what, uh, and what Christian might've said
[28:24.240 -> 28:26.480] on Sky F1, to be honest, or
[28:26.480 -> 28:36.800] Netflix about Toto. Engineers, designers, they're not hardwired like that at all. They're
[28:36.800 -> 28:44.880] sort of into what they do. So I'm pretty sure if the engineers and designers and aerodynamicists
[28:44.040 -> 28:47.080] So I'm pretty sure if the engineers and designers and aerodynamicists had gone to Toto
[28:47.080 -> 28:48.560] and went, look, if we do it like that,
[28:48.560 -> 28:51.680] we think we'll be three quarters of a second a lap faster.
[28:51.680 -> 28:54.960] I think Toto would have parked his ego, to be honest.
[28:54.960 -> 28:56.560] Hmm, I mean, he'd love that conversation
[28:56.560 -> 28:59.420] with Christian right now, given where they are on the grid.
[28:59.420 -> 29:02.080] I bet he's longing for that conversation.
[29:02.080 -> 29:06.000] Right, let's move on, I think to Lando. And
[29:06.000 -> 29:09.240] because obviously, we've got Lewis trying to trying to get his his eighth World Championship.
[29:09.240 -> 29:12.840] Bless him. Lando still hasn't actually won a race yet, which is still incredible to think.
[29:12.840 -> 29:17.600] I mean, he's been in the sport five years. It was a disappointing weekend for them for
[29:17.600 -> 29:23.980] McLaren. He finished P17, which was last of the finishes. And Piastri didn't didn't fare
[29:23.980 -> 29:25.880] any better having to retire after
[29:25.880 -> 29:31.480] 14 laps due to an electrical problem. I guess, Martin, this is a team at the other end of
[29:31.480 -> 29:36.560] the spectrum, but for Lando Norris, this is a hugely concerning start to the season.
[29:36.560 -> 29:46.520] Yeah, I'm seeing a few traits in Lando's career, in my own career, of being so close to winning races and then lucking out or just
[29:47.280 -> 29:48.440] making a mistake or whatever.
[29:48.440 -> 29:51.980] He could have won three on the bounce, couldn't he?
[29:51.980 -> 29:52.480] When was that?
[29:52.480 -> 29:53.760] 2021, wasn't it?
[29:53.800 -> 29:55.240] Russia and all of that.
[29:55.240 -> 29:59.920] He could have won three races on the bounce with a bit of luck and a following
[29:59.920 -> 30:03.800] wind, but he didn't and he's clearly a star of the future.
[30:03.800 -> 30:07.200] So McLaren at the moment is all about potential. When we get the
[30:07.200 -> 30:10.240] wind tunnel, we went the wrong way over the winter, when we get
[30:10.240 -> 30:14.200] the new upgrade in Baku, and there is a team that needs to
[30:14.200 -> 30:18.200] find double the normal amount from an upgrade. And that's a
[30:18.200 -> 30:21.400] big, that's a tall order. So they think they know where that
[30:21.400 -> 30:26.960] is. Yeah, to have a slow car in Formula One is one thing,
[30:26.960 -> 30:32.560] especially for McLaren, to have an unreliable one, and I'm having deja vu in 1994 here, but
[30:32.560 -> 30:39.600] to have an unreliable and slow McLaren is a terrible thing. So they need to get that sorted
[30:39.600 -> 30:45.840] out in a hurry. Reliability is, you know, it just shouldn't happen these days. So let's hope they
[30:45.840 -> 30:52.960] have a better weekend in Saudi Arabia. I, you know, I want all 10 teams up there challenging
[30:52.960 -> 30:59.360] for the lead. That's my dream. And so I don't like to see McLaren struggling. And Lando,
[31:00.000 -> 31:05.600] yeah, he's got time on his side, but the years start slipping past and he will be asking the
[31:05.600 -> 31:13.680] same questions as George, as Lewis, as Shar. Like, what are we doing about this? How, tell me how
[31:14.400 -> 31:20.720] you're going to close the gap to Red Bull and who's going to do that and why? Where are the
[31:20.720 -> 31:28.360] resources coming from and how does the cost cap affect this? And how, you know, it's a reasonable question from a driver.
[31:28.360 -> 31:34.080] And I think if he doesn't get the right answers at a suitable point, if he can
[31:34.080 -> 31:39.400] jump into what looks like a race or championship winning car, then he'll have to take it.
[31:40.040 -> 31:51.120] Jess, we've obviously put up our message and thanks to everyone who got back to us on Twitter and Instagram about this. It's Breezy, a great, great Twitter handle. It's summed it up quite
[31:51.120 -> 31:55.840] well I think. It said, looking to 2026 and beyond, what strategic career move would give
[31:55.840 -> 32:00.720] Lando the best chance of becoming a world champion? So four options, sticking out with McLaren,
[32:00.720 -> 32:08.960] heading a new project, E.D. Aldi, perhaps with Seidel, his old boss, waiting for Lewis's seat at Merc or being number two at Ferrari and Red Bull? I mean, those are
[32:08.960 -> 32:14.840] four options, all very realistic options, I guess, for Lando. What do you see him doing
[32:14.840 -> 32:17.360] over the next couple of years?
[32:17.360 -> 32:20.600] It's an interesting question, is it? Because a lot of people were saying how Lando and
[32:20.600 -> 32:26.320] Lewis's futures might be interlinked. And it's breezy touched on it there in terms of,
[32:26.320 -> 32:30.680] well, maybe Lewis retires, Lando takes his seat.
[32:31.800 -> 32:35.920] Which is an interesting one, because if we're saying
[32:35.920 -> 32:39.720] that Lewis potentially has five years,
[32:40.600 -> 32:44.200] I mean, I don't know how quickly Mercedes can turn it around
[32:44.200 -> 32:45.880] to give him his eighth title. Cause I mean, he's pretty much said quickly Mercedes can turn it around to give him his eighth
[32:45.880 -> 32:46.880] title.
[32:46.880 -> 32:49.760] Because, I mean, he's pretty much said he's going to stick around until his eighth and
[32:49.760 -> 32:51.400] then we'll see.
[32:51.400 -> 32:54.120] He doesn't really need, he's got nothing else to prove.
[32:54.120 -> 32:58.200] If he wins his eighth, he has nothing else to achieve in Formula One.
[32:58.200 -> 33:03.640] So whether or not he would just drop the mic and leave, or whether he would say, no, I've
[33:03.640 -> 33:05.840] probably got another season in me, remains to be seen.
[33:07.200 -> 33:10.160] But yeah, it'd be an interesting one to see Lando move there.
[33:12.160 -> 33:16.480] What I hope is that Lando doesn't panic now,
[33:17.280 -> 33:19.840] because we've seen the likes of,
[33:20.480 -> 33:23.200] and obviously this is a slightly different situation,
[33:23.200 -> 33:26.680] but Daniel Ricciardo making those snap judgments
[33:26.760 -> 33:30.680] to leave Red Bull and go off in search of his...
[33:32.220 -> 33:36.720] taking a different path away from the shadow of Max Verstappen,
[33:37.520 -> 33:40.360] it went catastrophically wrong.
[33:40.440 -> 33:42.820] Like, he now finds himself without a seat at all.
[33:43.240 -> 33:44.860] Okay, yes, he got a couple of podiums,
[33:44.940 -> 33:46.340] he got the race win with McLaren,
[33:46.440 -> 33:48.440] but that's all he has to show for it,
[33:48.540 -> 33:50.940] where Max is now a two-time world champion.
[33:51.340 -> 33:53.340] So, it's... it's...
[33:53.840 -> 33:57.580] You want to hope that he has the right people around him
[33:57.680 -> 34:00.920] that will give him good advice,
[34:01.020 -> 34:03.160] because we've seen so many people
[34:03.560 -> 34:05.240] have the wrong people around them,
[34:05.340 -> 34:08.240] get frustrated, get flustered, make snap decisions,
[34:08.340 -> 34:12.780] or what on the surface could be assumed to be snap decisions,
[34:12.880 -> 34:15.780] and end up with less than what they had before.
[34:15.880 -> 34:21.820] Now, tootling around dead last, there is obviously, uh...
[34:21.920 -> 34:24.260] That's definitely not where he wants to be.
[34:24.360 -> 34:27.440] Um, but McLaren have proven to him
[34:27.440 -> 34:33.760] that they can build a decent car, that wind tunnel project that Martin was referencing earlier,
[34:34.320 -> 34:38.400] the idea is that that will come into play and they'll be more competitive because they'll have
[34:38.400 -> 34:43.760] more resource, but they're already on the back foot a little now. And the rest of the teams,
[34:44.000 -> 34:50.560] you know, they're already on the back foot a little now and the rest of the teams, you know, like Aston are just throwing every level of investment at that team. You know, they've got
[34:50.560 -> 34:54.560] their new factory coming, they've got all these new facilities coming that are going to allow
[34:54.560 -> 35:01.840] them to stand on their own two feet, even if they are a Mercedes customer contingent. And you just,
[35:01.840 -> 35:05.980] you just hope that he's going to have those smart decisions that
[35:05.980 -> 35:09.740] mean if he is considering a move from McLaren, that it's, it is to the right place. Cause
[35:09.740 -> 35:15.060] there is so easy to get it wrong. You know, the likes of, again, I know we touched on
[35:15.060 -> 35:20.460] it briefly on the last pod, but, um, you know, people are now saying, again, it's only race
[35:20.460 -> 35:26.400] one, but Oscar, the drama that he went through, and he wasn't even in Formula One yet,
[35:27.120 -> 35:34.480] but decided to leave Alpine and go to McLaren, and he found himself not very competitive
[35:35.200 -> 35:44.880] in qualifying. And then DNF, with his teammate's car also having massive reliability issues. So
[35:44.840 -> 35:49.560] his teammates car also having massive reliability issues. So in terms of making decisions after race one,
[35:49.560 -> 35:52.240] you would argue potentially a bad call.
[35:53.160 -> 35:55.240] We've got a long season to go.
[35:55.240 -> 35:56.760] And I think, you know, Lando's come out
[35:56.760 -> 35:59.480] and he has been talking, you know, I'm here,
[35:59.480 -> 36:00.960] I know it's not competitive,
[36:00.960 -> 36:03.280] I'm kind of at peace with that.
[36:03.280 -> 36:05.760] I've been told that, you know, but he's also
[36:05.760 -> 36:14.080] very aware that to get as competitive as he wants is probably going to be post his contract.
[36:14.080 -> 36:18.400] And I don't know, I think, was he, was he ill-advised signing such a long contract?
[36:18.400 -> 36:23.200] I'd be interested to know what Martin thinks on this actually, in terms of he was so young,
[36:23.200 -> 36:26.160] he signed such a long contract and now
[36:26.160 -> 36:30.640] yet again, I mean I had similar feelings about this beginning of last season, but again after
[36:30.640 -> 36:37.040] Bahrain, McLaren did not look like in a good shape and he was looking at that point like
[36:37.040 -> 36:45.360] with five more years of this Paris contract. So was that know, was that ill advice
[36:45.360 -> 36:47.720] or did you think that was actually a smart move?
[36:49.240 -> 36:52.420] Formula One contracts tend to be about a hundred pages long
[36:52.420 -> 36:53.960] and there's lots in them now.
[36:53.960 -> 36:56.780] He ought to have an exit route out of there.
[36:57.560 -> 37:00.200] If, you know, to sign such a long deal,
[37:00.200 -> 37:01.600] there's got to be performance clause.
[37:01.600 -> 37:04.800] My concern if I was in team Lando
[37:04.800 -> 37:05.120] would be
[37:06.480 -> 37:10.960] that the performance is dropping away each season. It's not getting better and better,
[37:10.960 -> 37:16.480] is it? If you look at how he's been going, it looks like it's actually fading. And that's a
[37:16.480 -> 37:26.880] great concern in that respect. So if he's got a performance clause in there, I don't see Lando going anywhere as a number two, frankly.
[37:26.880 -> 37:30.640] I think he's, even if it's, contrast don't say that anyway,
[37:30.640 -> 37:34.040] but even if he were to be perceived that way,
[37:34.040 -> 37:36.960] it'd soon change that with his speed.
[37:36.960 -> 37:41.960] But he will need to see some light
[37:41.960 -> 37:46.000] at the end of a much shorter tunnel than he's got now, put it that
[37:46.000 -> 37:49.280] way, in terms of where it's all heading.
[37:49.280 -> 37:53.620] Otherwise he'll start getting frustrated, then he won't be any use to the team.
[37:53.620 -> 38:02.280] But I could see Lando dropping into Red Bull and Ferrari and Mercedes as a more easy fit
[38:02.280 -> 38:05.840] than what on earth does Lewis Hamilton do from here?
[38:05.840 -> 38:06.840] You know what I mean?
[38:06.840 -> 38:13.080] So I could see Lando being able to drive for the other three teams, frankly,
[38:13.080 -> 38:16.200] or Aston Martin for that matter.
[38:16.200 -> 38:18.600] They become race and championship contenders.
[38:18.600 -> 38:24.800] So on the face of it, it was a bit odd at his age to sign up such a long deal, yes.
[38:24.800 -> 38:28.720] It's interesting as well, isn't it, that, I mean, it's not quite the same,
[38:28.720 -> 38:36.400] but there is almost that slight mirroring of Lando being the frustrated Brit at McLaren,
[38:36.400 -> 38:42.480] potentially on what might be the last season of his patience before that starts to run out,
[38:42.480 -> 38:50.560] and he's looking elsewhere and sniffing elsewhere elsewhere and maybe he's going to make a, a side, well, a move that on the surface
[38:50.560 -> 38:56.000] looked iffy, but could, could pay out. I mean, it's not quite history repeating itself, but
[38:56.000 -> 39:02.460] it is, it is quite close. Um, which is to, to the point earlier, Lewis doesn't have as
[39:02.460 -> 39:05.920] much time to think Lando has the best part of his
[39:05.920 -> 39:11.360] career to think about, and he's definitely not going to want to see that fading away towards
[39:11.360 -> 39:15.840] the back of the grid. I mean, he's, he's somebody that we talk about as having world championship
[39:16.480 -> 39:21.440] material. Like he, he is a very competitive racer. He's very quick. Um, but it's all going to be
[39:21.440 -> 39:32.560] about how does he make the smart decisions now? How does he protect his career and make those right moves and those right decisions?
[39:32.560 -> 39:37.360] I was going to say, I mean, Micah Hackenen, we've heard Nico Rosberg say on Sky's coverage
[39:37.360 -> 39:39.480] that he sees him as a future world champion.
[39:39.480 -> 39:43.360] Micah Hackenen this week said he's on the same level as Max Verstappen.
[39:43.360 -> 39:48.480] And I think, you know, I guess even from a British perspective, we just want to see him fighting at the front. He was so
[39:48.480 -> 39:53.320] exciting. I mean, Martin, you referenced Russia, you know, those three races that he could
[39:53.320 -> 39:58.160] have won. It was exhilarating to watch him fight near the front. And yeah, I think, you
[39:58.160 -> 40:01.360] know, speaking on behalf of a lot of fans, he's a very popular member of the paddock
[40:01.360 -> 40:08.480] as well when we say we want to see him at the front, we want to see him battling. And yeah, I think that sentiment is felt, you know, throughout.
[40:08.640 -> 40:13.120] I just wonder on the on the on the future thing, is there is there any potential?
[40:13.120 -> 40:17.360] Do we think the relationship with Andrea Seidel, Martin, you know, do you think
[40:17.360 -> 40:19.960] do you think there's a strong enough relationship there with what he's doing?
[40:20.320 -> 40:22.920] Turning that into Aldi by by 2026.
[40:23.040 -> 40:25.720] Can you see them uniting at all at that project?
[40:25.720 -> 40:33.360] Maybe a long way down the road, but I don't think Lando's got the time or the patience or the need
[40:33.360 -> 40:38.880] to, you know, Audi will have to get their power unit up and running. It'll be, you know, very
[40:38.880 -> 40:48.160] much a new team in that respect. So it's not out of the question, but I think Lando will be looking for more certainty
[40:48.160 -> 40:54.400] than joining a fledgling manufacturer who are just coming into Formula One with a new power unit.
[40:54.400 -> 41:02.080] OK. That's Lando. That was Lewis. We've achieved the fact there of where we think they are at the
[41:02.080 -> 41:05.600] moment, where we think they'll end up. I want to end on
[41:05.600 -> 41:11.680] a couple of questions, a few tweets from listeners and viewers, and just get your guys' thoughts
[41:11.680 -> 41:17.120] really on Saudi Arabia. There's a tweet here from James. He says, looking ahead to Saudi,
[41:17.120 -> 41:25.000] time for race two of El Plan. Looking forward to seeing Fernando Alonso back on track and Blake on Instagram also agreeing
[41:25.000 -> 41:31.000] Alonso will dominate again. But Jess, I mean, let's look ahead to this circuit and I've
[41:31.000 -> 41:36.720] got an Instagram post here from F1CRLewis1. It says, where does Jeddah rank for you in
[41:36.720 -> 41:52.880] terms of the best circuits in F1 right now? Ooh, um, it's so I'm not, I'm historically not a fan of qualifying tracks just because I, I live
[41:52.880 -> 42:00.800] for the racing on Sunday. I love watching like, you know, that, that element for me is what made
[42:00.800 -> 42:06.100] me a formula one fan. Um, and I will admit growing up that there would be many occasions
[42:06.100 -> 42:08.320] where I wouldn't watch qualifying.
[42:08.320 -> 42:10.520] I would just tune in for the race on Sunday.
[42:11.660 -> 42:13.620] So because of that,
[42:13.620 -> 42:16.040] I think that I'm slightly more skewed away.
[42:16.040 -> 42:19.900] I mean, I can't believe I'm saying this to Martin Brundle,
[42:19.900 -> 42:23.360] but I'm not a fan of Monaco as a Grand Prix
[42:23.360 -> 42:25.680] because it's not a racing track.
[42:25.680 -> 42:26.720] It's a qualifying track.
[42:27.160 -> 42:32.760] Um, and so I think Jeddah Jeddah provides, I guess, a little bit of difference.
[42:32.760 -> 42:38.120] Like one of the things that I have enjoyed for better or worse with Jeddah is that
[42:38.120 -> 42:42.120] it seems to be quite a game playing track.
[42:42.520 -> 42:47.800] Uh, we've seen quite a few interesting on-track tactics
[42:49.280 -> 42:52.140] from drivers for better or worse.
[42:52.140 -> 42:55.440] Last year we had a kind of a continuation
[42:55.440 -> 43:00.440] of Charles and Max using DRS as a bit of a tactic,
[43:01.760 -> 43:03.980] as a ploy, you know, not wanting to be first
[43:03.980 -> 43:05.960] the DRS detection line
[43:05.960 -> 43:08.400] and kind of having a play around there.
[43:08.400 -> 43:11.120] And I love watching clever racing, you know,
[43:11.120 -> 43:14.360] when it's not just about pure speed, pure pace,
[43:14.360 -> 43:16.160] but actually how do you play the game?
[43:16.160 -> 43:18.240] How do you play the long game?
[43:18.240 -> 43:20.320] So that for me has been quite interesting,
[43:21.160 -> 43:24.240] an interesting addition from Jeddah.
[43:24.240 -> 43:26.480] But I mean, there's no denying that
[43:27.280 -> 43:31.920] it has delivered some incredible qualifying performances already, even though we're only
[43:31.920 -> 43:39.120] what on the third, the third round, um, you know, Max's lap that could have been was one of the most
[43:40.880 -> 43:47.440] impactful laps I think I've ever watched up there with Lewis Hamilton's Singapore 2018.
[43:47.440 -> 43:53.200] So that I enjoy, but is it in my top 10?
[43:53.200 -> 43:54.200] No.
[43:54.200 -> 44:00.640] But I do, again, because it's early on, I mean, they've made a lot of changes this year
[44:00.640 -> 44:05.000] already, which are there to kind of help
[44:05.420 -> 44:07.140] with the action.
[44:07.140 -> 44:09.940] So, you know, it's quite early days.
[44:09.940 -> 44:13.660] Maybe it will grow, maybe it'll grow on me.
[44:13.660 -> 44:16.380] But again, if we're looking at a track
[44:16.380 -> 44:20.740] that's kind of leaning on its spectacle being qualifying,
[44:20.740 -> 44:23.260] you're probably talking to the wrong fan.
[44:23.260 -> 44:24.180] Okay, fine.
[44:24.180 -> 44:26.080] Martin, I mean, it must be the kind
[44:26.080 -> 44:30.640] of track that keeps you on your toes in commentary let's say that perhaps we'll build on that Jess
[44:30.640 -> 44:36.800] and say it's definitely a track that delivers action. Yeah I like the elongated nature of it
[44:36.800 -> 44:42.800] and some of the corner sequences, I like the fact that if the drivers make mistakes there's a wall
[44:42.800 -> 44:46.440] there to greet them so there's jeopardy in making
[44:46.440 -> 44:53.240] an error and the skillful fast ones can get through and others don't quite make it.
[44:53.240 -> 44:57.480] I like, you know, variety is the spice of life as they say, so I like the street circuits,
[44:57.480 -> 45:03.800] the sprint weekends, the classics at Spa and Monza and Silverstone and Monaco, and
[45:03.800 -> 45:05.440] then we have the new venues.
[45:05.440 -> 45:07.640] I think for the overall show,
[45:07.640 -> 45:11.040] Jeddah looks incredible on the TV
[45:11.040 -> 45:14.480] with all the lights and razzmatazz going on.
[45:15.520 -> 45:17.120] I don't think it's in my top 10 either,
[45:17.120 -> 45:20.120] but I don't mind the circuit.
[45:20.120 -> 45:23.000] And I think there are some elements of it
[45:23.000 -> 45:26.880] that when I go trackside in FP2, make me
[45:26.880 -> 45:31.600] stand back and gasp a little bit. And that's happened there. There's no doubt about that.
[45:31.600 -> 45:35.920] I want to, maybe I won't be as harsh to ask you both for predictions this weekend, but
[45:35.920 -> 45:41.120] maybe let's say one thing we're really looking forward to this weekend. I'll start by saying
[45:41.120 -> 45:48.240] the drone. Does anyone remember the drones? I mean, Martin, you just mentioned the lighting. Incredible. They had a brilliant drone show last year.
[45:48.240 -> 45:52.080] I don't know what everyone else is looking forward to. Jess?
[45:52.080 -> 45:57.080] I mean, yeah, I think I'm just I just I'm just hungry for some more action. Like we've
[45:57.080 -> 46:03.160] only had one race. So at this point in the season, I'm definitely wanting just to see
[46:03.160 -> 46:05.520] as much as possible. It would
[46:05.520 -> 46:12.560] be amazing to see if Alonso is going to come out swinging just as much as he had done in
[46:12.560 -> 46:19.120] Bahrain. That is going to be one of the storylines, I think, that keeps us interested. I guess
[46:19.120 -> 46:26.600] Ferrari, there is hope there. Fred Vasseur was quite sure that it was a setup issue,
[46:26.600 -> 46:27.880] so if they can get on top of that,
[46:27.880 -> 46:31.280] then we could see a bit more of a battle towards the front.
[46:31.280 -> 46:36.040] So I think there's plenty to be excited for,
[46:36.040 -> 46:40.680] but yeah, I guess to kind of, again,
[46:40.680 -> 46:44.960] contradict my own points, Saturday looks like it's gonna be,
[46:44.960 -> 46:46.880] it could be a magical day
[46:48.080 -> 46:53.440] in terms of qualifying. So if you're into that kind of thing, make sure you tune in on Saturday
[46:53.440 -> 46:59.520] as well as Sunday. So yeah, I think that's kind of what I'm looking forward to anyway.
[47:00.640 -> 47:02.960] Final word from you, Martin, what are you looking forward to?
[47:03.880 -> 47:10.640] Final word from you, Martin, what are you looking forward to? I'm looking forward to Verstappen seeing as many cars in his visor as his mirrors. I'd
[47:10.640 -> 47:17.960] like his mirrors to be worn out by the end of the race and need replacing.
[47:17.960 -> 47:23.000] We never know, it might be Fernando Alonso in those mirrors. You never know. Okay, cool.
[47:23.000 -> 47:25.840] Thank you. Thank you very much. Thank you, Martin. Thank you, Jess. And thank you
[47:25.840 -> 47:28.760] everyone, home for your comments. We really appreciate
[47:28.760 -> 47:32.480] them. And if you keep an eye out every Monday, before we record
[47:32.480 -> 47:34.480] the podcast, we'll put out a little post about what we're
[47:34.480 -> 47:37.560] going to be talking about. So we really do appreciate all your
[47:37.560 -> 47:40.600] comments. That's it for this week. We hope you enjoy the
[47:40.600 -> 47:44.040] Saudi Arabian Grand Prix and we'll be back next Tuesday to
[47:44.040 -> 47:48.480] discuss all the biggest talking points from the weekend. We hope you can join us then. Bye for now.