What does a strategist REALLY do? | Q&A with Bernie Collins!

Matt Baker is joined by former Head of Race Strategy at Aston Martin F1 Team and newly appointed Sky Sports pundit Bernie Collins to discuss what a strategist REALLY does (01:14), what it's like working with Sebastian Vettel (10:50), how less practice sessions can create more drama (25:36) and her bold predictions for the future of Formula 1 (43:09).

In the realm of Formula One racing, strategy plays a pivotal role in determining the outcome of a race. Bernie Collins, a former Head of Race Strategy at Aston Martin F1 Team and now a Sky Sports pundit, offers valuable insights into the intricacies of race strategy and her experiences working in the fast-paced world of Formula One.

**The Essence of a Strategist's Role:**

- A strategist's primary responsibility is to plan and adapt to the ever-changing dynamics of a race weekend, from qualifying to the main race.
- They analyze various factors such as tire degradation, pit stop times, overtaking opportunities, and weather conditions to formulate the optimal strategy for their drivers.
- The goal is to maximize the team's points by securing the best possible finishing positions for both cars.

**The Nitty-Gritty of Race Strategy:**

- Race strategies are continuously recalculated throughout the race, often every lap, based on real-time data and changes in track conditions.
- A combination of human expertise and software tools is used to analyze data and make strategic decisions.
- Tire degradation, pit stop losses, and overtaking thresholds are key parameters that influence strategy formulation.

**The Challenges of Working in Formula One:**

- The demanding schedule of a Formula One season requires strategists to be highly adaptable and flexible.
- The intense travel involved in attending races worldwide can be both exhilarating and exhausting.
- The high-pressure environment and the responsibility of making crucial decisions that can impact the outcome of a race can be mentally taxing.

**Bernie's Reflections on Working with Sebastian Vettel:**

- Bernie describes Sebastian Vettel as a relaxed and open-minded driver who welcomed new ideas and strategies.
- Their working relationship was characterized by respectful discussions and a shared commitment to achieving the best possible results.
- Vettel's extensive experience and historical knowledge of the sport often led to valuable insights and strategic discussions.

**The Evolution of Strategy in Formula One:**

- Bernie observes that teams have become more collaborative in developing strategies, with engineers and mechanics rotating to manage the workload.
- The use of advanced software tools has enhanced the efficiency and accuracy of strategy calculations.
- Teams are placing greater emphasis on driver involvement in strategy discussions, recognizing the importance of their input.

**Bernie's Predictions for the Future of Formula One:**

- Bernie anticipates that the introduction of new regulations and technologies will bring about significant changes in race strategies.
- She believes that teams will need to adapt to shorter race distances and the increased likelihood of safety car periods.
- The growing popularity of Formula One in new markets could lead to more diverse strategies and a wider range of race outcomes.

Bernie Collins' insights provide a comprehensive understanding of the complex world of Formula One strategy, highlighting the challenges, dynamics, and evolving nature of this critical aspect of the sport.

**Navigating the Complex World of Formula One Strategy: A Discussion with Bernie Collins**

Bernie Collins, former Head of Race Strategy at Aston Martin F1, joins Matt Baker to delve into the intricate world of Formula One strategy. Bernie offers a comprehensive and engaging exploration of the role of a strategist, delving into the challenges, complexities, and rewards of this crucial position.

**The Essence of Strategy in Formula One**

Bernie emphasizes that strategy in Formula One is a dynamic and ever-changing landscape. No race ever unfolds precisely as planned due to unforeseen circumstances such as safety cars, traffic, or unexpected tire performance. Strategists must remain adaptable and prepared to adjust their plans on the fly to optimize their team's chances of success.

**The Impact of Reduced Practice Sessions**

The recent trend of reducing practice sessions in Formula One has sparked debate among strategists. Bernie believes that limiting practice time can enhance the excitement of the sport by placing a greater emphasis on the team's ability to analyze data, adapt to changing conditions, and make quick decisions during the race. However, he acknowledges that engineers prefer more data to refine their race plans.

**Bernie's Bold Predictions for the Future of Formula One**

Looking ahead, Bernie envisions a future where Formula One embraces sustainable fuels and continues to push the boundaries of technology. He believes that the sport has the potential to play a significant role in addressing global challenges by developing innovative solutions for green energy and reducing the reliance on fossil fuels.

**Bernie's Reflections on Her Time at Aston Martin**

Bernie expresses her pride in the progress Aston Martin has made since her departure. She acknowledges that the team has faced difficulties in the past but is thrilled to see them achieve success this season. Bernie credits the hard work and dedication of the team members and is excited to witness their continued growth.

**Bernie's Advice for Aspiring Women in Formula One**

Bernie encourages young women interested in Formula One to pursue their dreams. She emphasizes the importance of gaining experience in various roles within the sport, such as working with junior teams or race tracks. She also stresses the value of networking and building relationships within the industry.

**Bernie's Transition to Sky Sports**

Bernie shares her excitement about her new role as an analyst with Sky Sports. She finds it refreshing to learn about the intricacies of television production and enjoys the opportunity to provide a different perspective on the sport. However, she admits to missing the team element and the satisfaction of working towards a common goal on the pit wall.

**Bernie's Thoughts on the Driver-Strategist Dynamic**

Bernie acknowledges the unique dynamic between drivers and strategists, recognizing that drivers may sometimes question the decisions made by the pit wall. She emphasizes the importance of mutual respect and understanding between the two parties, appreciating the drivers' expertise and recognizing the challenges they face behind the wheel.

**Bernie's Bold Predictions for the Future of Formula One**

Bernie envisions a future where Formula One embraces sustainable fuels and continues to push the boundaries of technology. She believes that the sport has the potential to play a significant role in addressing global challenges by developing innovative solutions for green energy and reducing the reliance on fossil fuels.

**Bernie's Reflections on Her Time at Aston Martin**

Bernie expresses her pride in the progress Aston Martin has made since her departure. She acknowledges that the team has faced difficulties in the past but is thrilled to see them achieve success this season. Bernie credits the hard work and dedication of the team members and is excited to witness their continued growth.

**Bernie's Advice for Aspiring Women in Formula One**

Bernie encourages young women interested in Formula One to pursue their dreams. She emphasizes the importance of gaining experience in various roles within the sport, such as working with junior teams or race tracks. She also stresses the value of networking and building relationships within the industry.

**Bernie's Transition to Sky Sports**

Bernie shares her excitement about her new role as an analyst with Sky Sports. She finds it refreshing to learn about the intricacies of television production and enjoys the opportunity to provide a different perspective on the sport. However, she admits to missing the team element and the satisfaction of working towards a common goal on the pit wall.

**Bernie's Thoughts on the Driver-Strategist Dynamic**

Bernie acknowledges the unique dynamic between drivers and strategists, recognizing that drivers may sometimes question the decisions made by the pit wall. She emphasizes the importance of mutual respect and understanding between the two parties, appreciating the drivers' expertise and recognizing the challenges they face behind the wheel.

# **Bernie Collins: Unveiling the Role of a Formula One Strategist**

Bernie Collins, the former Head of Race Strategy at Aston Martin F1 Team and newly appointed Sky Sports pundit, joins Matt Baker to shed light on the intricate world of Formula One strategy.

**Demystifying the Role of a Strategist:**

Collins delves into the multifaceted role of a strategist, emphasizing the significance of making split-second decisions that can profoundly impact a race's outcome. He describes the strategist's responsibility for analyzing data, understanding the car's performance, and communicating effectively with the driver.

**Working with Sebastian Vettel: A Driver's Perspective:**

Collins shares his experience working with four-time world champion Sebastian Vettel, highlighting Vettel's exceptional ability to adapt to different strategies and provide valuable feedback. He emphasizes the importance of trust and open communication between the strategist and the driver.

**The Impact of Reduced Practice Sessions:**

Collins examines the consequences of the reduced practice sessions in Formula One, suggesting that it can lead to more unpredictable and exciting races. He explains that with less time for teams to gather data and fine-tune their strategies, there is a greater scope for surprises and upsets.

**Bold Predictions for the Future of Formula One:**

Collins offers his bold predictions for the future of Formula One, envisioning a scenario where teams collaborate to develop more sustainable and environmentally friendly cars. He also speculates about the potential for driverless cars in Formula One, acknowledging the challenges and ethical considerations associated with such a development.

**Key Insights and Controversies:**

**Key Insights:**

* The role of a strategist is crucial in Formula One, as they make split-second decisions that can significantly impact the race outcome.
* Trust and open communication between the strategist and the driver are essential for effective strategy execution.
* Reduced practice sessions can lead to more unpredictable and exciting races, increasing the likelihood of upsets.

**Controversies:**

* The potential for driverless cars in Formula One raises ethical and safety concerns, sparking debates among fans and experts.
* The sustainability of Formula One cars and the sport's environmental impact have been subjects of ongoing discussion.

**Overall Message:**

Bernie Collins provides a comprehensive insight into the world of Formula One strategy, emphasizing the importance of collaboration, communication, and quick decision-making. He also offers thought-provoking predictions for the future of the sport, highlighting the potential for technological advancements and the need for sustainable practices.

[00:00.000 -> 00:06.320] Hello everyone, I hope you're well. Welcome to this week's episode where we've got a fascinating Q&A with Bernie Collins.
[00:06.320 -> 00:09.560] Now Bernie has joined our team on Sky Sports F1 for this season.
[00:09.560 -> 00:16.080] She was previously at Aston Martin as a head of race strategy and a performance engineer at McLaren.
[00:16.080 -> 00:21.200] It was a really, really interesting chat, loads of great questions. So thank you very much for those. I hope you enjoy it.
[00:26.160 -> 00:27.160] Hi Bernie.
[00:27.160 -> 00:28.160] Hello Max.
[00:28.160 -> 00:29.160] Hello, welcome to the podcast.
[00:29.160 -> 00:30.160] Thank you for having me.
[00:30.160 -> 00:36.240] Good to have you. We have received so many questions for this Q&A, so I am super excited.
[00:36.240 -> 00:40.440] We will try and get through as many as possible. They're an awful lot. I've tried to separate
[00:40.440 -> 00:47.320] them as best I can into kind of different sections. So I want to talk to you about your role as a strategist and you want to get into all
[00:47.320 -> 00:50.460] of the nitty-gritty of that. Then I want to ask you a little bit about starting out,
[00:50.460 -> 00:54.720] how you got into the industry and then also about your new role with us on Sky
[00:54.720 -> 00:58.380] Sports on camera, which I imagine is quite different but you know I'm sure there's some
[00:58.380 -> 01:02.620] similarities. It's very different. It's very different, well there we go. I guess first
[01:02.620 -> 01:05.280] question is what is a strategist?
[01:05.280 -> 01:07.960] And I think I ask that because I think as viewers
[01:07.960 -> 01:10.880] and fans of F1, we think we know what a strategist does.
[01:10.880 -> 01:12.280] But I want to hear it from you.
[01:12.280 -> 01:14.320] What does a strategist do on a race weekend?
[01:14.320 -> 01:16.200] So the main job that a strategist does,
[01:16.200 -> 01:17.360] and I think what everyone thinks about
[01:17.360 -> 01:18.480] is the Sunday race day.
[01:18.480 -> 01:22.120] So what you're trying to do is plan how the race might go.
[01:22.120 -> 01:24.120] So you've got in your head, maybe at the start of the race,
[01:24.120 -> 01:27.600] how many stops you think it's going to be, what tyres you're going to use, but
[01:27.600 -> 01:30.200] then during the race you're reacting to everything that happens around you,
[01:30.200 -> 01:35.160] safety cars, weather conditions, other drivers etc. Ultimately your goal is to
[01:35.160 -> 01:39.400] get the best possible finish position for your two cars and generally the
[01:39.400 -> 01:42.560] strategies that we see on the pit wall work across both of the cars in that
[01:42.560 -> 01:50.920] team. So you're trying to get the best possible points for the team, for those drivers. But it's a lot more than
[01:50.920 -> 01:54.840] that in that we do a lot of planning before we get to the event of what we think it might
[01:54.840 -> 02:00.160] be. We start to look at how we want Friday to go, what we want to learn from the tyres,
[02:00.160 -> 02:04.480] what other information we're trying to gain like pit losses or overtaking thresholds.
[02:04.480 -> 02:05.680] And then through qualifying you're trying to gain, like pit losses or overtaking thresholds. And then through qualifying,
[02:05.680 -> 02:07.880] you're trying to get good track positions,
[02:07.880 -> 02:09.360] which the driver has the best chance
[02:09.360 -> 02:11.080] of getting a clean lap in,
[02:11.080 -> 02:13.920] or trying to decide if you need to run again
[02:13.920 -> 02:16.320] or a new set of tires or all these sorts of things.
[02:16.320 -> 02:18.640] So yeah, it's throughout the whole weekend,
[02:18.640 -> 02:20.480] then post-weekend, a lot of analysis.
[02:20.480 -> 02:22.400] So how did your weekend go?
[02:22.400 -> 02:23.440] What can we do better?
[02:23.440 -> 02:24.280] What can we learn?
[02:24.280 -> 02:28.000] So everyone thinks about the race bit of it, but there's a lot before and after as well
[02:28.100 -> 02:30.280] It's quite a full-on job by the sounds of it
[02:30.280 -> 02:32.860] It's it's I mean if you if you look at your week
[02:32.860 -> 02:36.520] Does it start somewhat like a Monday or Tuesday of a race week and goes all the way through to?
[02:36.840 -> 02:39.680] When Wednesday of the post race? Yeah, exactly
[02:39.680 -> 02:43.340] And I think for all of us it depends on whether it's a double header or triple header
[02:43.340 -> 02:50.040] But yeah for like a single header you're starting the Monday Tuesday before you have your pre-event briefings in the factory
[02:50.040 -> 02:52.040] We are discussing with the team what your plan is
[02:52.880 -> 02:57.520] You get into the race weekend then do post race against you. Yeah, it's about
[02:58.160 -> 03:02.100] Few days before a few days after physically being on the track. Yeah full-on
[03:02.100 -> 03:08.820] Okay, Matt on Twitter wants to know on average how many times or how often are race strategies recalculated during a
[03:08.820 -> 03:12.680] race? Are they predominantly done by human calculation or do you use software?
[03:12.680 -> 03:17.600] And what aspects of a race cause a race strategy to be recalculated? Yeah, so we
[03:17.600 -> 03:22.140] recalculate really a lot, like every lap sort of or every sort of change of
[03:22.140 -> 03:26.960] position. Really, that often? Yeah, you're doing it a lot. And it's a mix of strategy and human,
[03:26.960 -> 03:28.840] the software and human calculation.
[03:28.840 -> 03:30.160] So there's lots of things.
[03:30.160 -> 03:32.080] If you think of the real simple things that might change,
[03:32.080 -> 03:33.840] a strategy's built up of,
[03:33.840 -> 03:35.400] we just think of the fastest race
[03:35.400 -> 03:37.200] with no interaction of cars.
[03:37.200 -> 03:39.440] You've got a tire model we're looking at,
[03:39.440 -> 03:42.520] the tire degradation, so how quickly the lap time
[03:42.520 -> 03:44.600] gets slower as you like through the run.
[03:47.560 -> 03:50.560] The pit loss, what the pit stop is going to be, the life of the tyre, so how many laps you can do on it,
[03:50.560 -> 03:52.560] and the P is delta between the tyres,
[03:52.560 -> 03:55.560] so what's the difference between a soft and a medium tyre.
[03:55.560 -> 03:57.560] So all that makes up your model,
[03:57.560 -> 04:01.560] and through the race the software's maybe giving you some indication
[04:01.560 -> 04:03.560] that the degradation's higher than you expected,
[04:03.560 -> 04:10.400] so the lap time's getting slower more quickly than you expected it to. Or the life of the tyre is shorter,
[04:10.400 -> 04:14.000] that might come from the tyre engineers in the garage. So there's lots of different inputs
[04:14.000 -> 04:19.920] to the model, but as humans across the factory and the pit wall, we're discussing what changes
[04:19.920 -> 04:24.280] we want to add to the model at that stage. So we might reduce the life by a few laps
[04:24.280 -> 04:26.360] and the model will quickly recalculate
[04:26.360 -> 04:28.540] what the fastest race is to the end.
[04:29.400 -> 04:30.920] But we're debating it all the time
[04:30.920 -> 04:33.480] whether we think the driver can manage a bit more
[04:33.480 -> 04:35.460] and stretch out that life or whatever it might be.
[04:35.460 -> 04:38.060] So there's a lot of discussion going on
[04:38.060 -> 04:41.440] and it's a mix of the software and the human element of it.
[04:41.440 -> 04:42.280] Interesting.
[04:42.280 -> 04:45.760] And Dan on Twitter would like to know what
[04:45.760 -> 04:49.000] software do teams use to calculate strategy? You know does each team have
[04:49.000 -> 04:53.440] their own or is this shared between all the teams? It's very bit much a
[04:53.440 -> 04:57.440] mix. The majority of teams have now moved to some standard software and
[04:57.440 -> 05:02.360] interestingly that standard software I realized post leaving F1 is also used
[05:02.360 -> 05:07.280] for things like football and rugby so there's a lot of different trackers in terms of,
[05:07.280 -> 05:10.480] you know, for football, like where people are playing on the pitch or
[05:10.480 -> 05:12.720] how many runs people have made, all those sorts of things.
[05:12.720 -> 05:16.000] Because a lot of it's the same if you're tracking like GPS of the car
[05:16.000 -> 05:19.520] versus GPS of a player, it's sort of similar interactions.
[05:19.520 -> 05:21.040] So I find that interesting.
[05:21.040 -> 05:29.280] But a lot of the software is there to help us do our job more easily. So some of the calculations like in qualifying is your lap going to
[05:29.280 -> 05:33.160] be fast enough? You're just taking what lap time we're currently doing away from
[05:33.160 -> 05:37.160] your fastest. It's very simple like subtraction calculation but the software
[05:37.160 -> 05:40.760] is helping you to do that really quickly and without any errors. I'd say
[05:40.760 -> 05:48.000] there's maybe seven, eight teams use the same software now, and two or three that do their own bespoke in-house software.
[05:48.000 -> 05:52.000] A lot of it you might question why a team uses the same software as someone else
[05:52.000 -> 05:54.000] as they're not a competitive advantage there.
[05:54.000 -> 05:57.000] But the software we put lots of inputs into.
[05:57.000 -> 06:01.000] We put our tyre model in, we put what we think the pace of the cars are going to be in.
[06:01.000 -> 06:05.280] So I think the intelligence in the software is the parameters
[06:05.280 -> 06:09.040] that you put into the software and that's different for each team. So that's why it's
[06:09.040 -> 06:12.320] okay to use the same software as a direct competitor.
[06:12.320 -> 06:17.040] And presumably if you develop that software as a team, that's a huge cost, right?
[06:17.040 -> 06:23.840] Yeah, exactly. And one of the things is, as you have this off-the-shelf software as we
[06:23.840 -> 06:25.760] think of it it you can suggest
[06:25.760 -> 06:29.840] improvements to them and their team can go away and work with that when your software team's
[06:29.840 -> 06:35.920] working on something that's more fundamental to the the pace of your car. Yeah very interesting
[06:35.920 -> 06:40.880] I'm so fascinated that it's used by other sports as well. I guess there is a lot of crossover
[06:40.880 -> 06:49.840] between Formula One and other sports. There's an Instagram question here from Skenny04. What was it like working for a Formula One team? Just, yeah,
[06:49.840 -> 06:55.200] I want to get into how did you enjoy the travel? How did you enjoy all the other aspects around
[06:55.200 -> 06:56.200] being a Formula One team?
[06:56.200 -> 06:59.920] Yeah, so I think it's weird because you've worked in it for so long that you think it's
[06:59.920 -> 07:04.480] a normal job. That's the first bit that I find weird. So you've been working in Formula
[07:04.480 -> 07:07.420] One, talking to people at Formula One, all of your friendship group is
[07:07.420 -> 07:10.940] people that work in Formula One and it's only really when you step back from that
[07:10.940 -> 07:14.720] that you realise it's a really special job and the people are really interested
[07:14.720 -> 07:18.040] and people really want to go and do it but it's really easy to become like
[07:18.040 -> 07:23.200] that's just normal to you. Doing the travelling bit specifically is very
[07:23.200 -> 07:28.040] odd because we do 23, 22 races a year.
[07:28.040 -> 07:30.820] That traveling group becomes like your family.
[07:30.820 -> 07:32.740] So you travel out with them on a Wednesday,
[07:32.740 -> 07:33.860] you spend all week with them,
[07:33.860 -> 07:36.660] you travel back with them on a Sunday night or a Monday.
[07:36.660 -> 07:38.740] So you spend loads of times with this group of people
[07:38.740 -> 07:42.260] that you've not necessarily chosen to be with.
[07:42.260 -> 07:43.100] But you become really-
[07:43.100 -> 07:43.920] It's a very diplomatic way of saying it.
[07:43.920 -> 07:44.760] Yeah, exactly.
[07:44.760 -> 07:46.560] You know, it's people say like you choose your friends,
[07:46.560 -> 07:49.280] well you don't choose your colleagues.
[07:49.280 -> 07:51.440] But it was really nice atmosphere,
[07:51.440 -> 07:52.920] everyone really helped each other.
[07:52.920 -> 07:54.800] Sometimes it's tough because of the environment
[07:54.800 -> 07:56.600] or the heat or whatever.
[07:56.600 -> 07:59.920] So yeah, it was really lovely community.
[07:59.920 -> 08:01.880] And it's weird, I think the thing that people
[08:01.880 -> 08:03.720] maybe don't realize is when you travel,
[08:03.720 -> 08:07.640] a lot of us get on that flight on a Wednesday going to wherever it might be in the world.
[08:07.640 -> 08:11.160] And all the other teams also get on a very similar flight or in the airport at a similar
[08:11.160 -> 08:12.160] time.
[08:12.160 -> 08:15.760] So you get to know lots of people from the other teams as well that you chat to.
[08:15.760 -> 08:21.000] And it becomes like this big circus travelling community together where you see lots of people.
[08:21.000 -> 08:22.720] So yeah, I really enjoyed that.
[08:22.720 -> 08:28.080] There's a lot of pressure obviously. You're trying to do a really important job when it comes to Sunday.
[08:28.400 -> 08:31.480] You're trying to get it right for the whole team, especially on the pit wall.
[08:31.840 -> 08:35.080] You feel like if we make the wrong call on a pit stop,
[08:35.480 -> 08:38.600] you know, the hundreds of people in the factory that have worked
[08:38.600 -> 08:41.240] to get this car as quick as it is really affected by that.
[08:41.800 -> 08:44.760] And so it is like this sort of pressure environment.
[08:45.740 -> 08:49.380] But I really enjoyed working in it and I enjoyed the traveling around the world,
[08:49.380 -> 08:54.760] seeing the different communities and embracing the different tracks and a lot
[08:54.760 -> 08:59.440] of tiredness, a lot of grumpiness at times but yeah it was really good.
[08:59.440 -> 09:04.000] Do you think it's something spoken enough about in the sport, the impact on
[09:04.000 -> 09:11.200] people's lives? Obviously you know, 23 races away from families, from loved ones at home, that's a lot of pressure, isn't it, to put on people?
[09:11.200 -> 09:17.600] And I guess, you know, perhaps as people get older, maybe when you're young, you know, just starting out in a Formula One team, it's the most exciting thing in the world.
[09:17.600 -> 09:22.200] But as you get older, it must change your perception of that part of the industry.
[09:22.200 -> 09:23.600] Yeah, it definitely does.
[09:23.600 -> 09:25.040] Like, I think when I was
[09:25.040 -> 09:28.880] young I did it and you did all the holidays around it so you know you go to Australia and
[09:28.880 -> 09:32.800] you decide to stay out for a week and it was great you know and there's definitely that sort
[09:32.800 -> 09:38.160] of branch of people in the paddock that enjoy all the traveling and the time away and I definitely
[09:38.160 -> 09:41.760] did that for a long time and then you get to a point where you just sort of think you know maybe
[09:41.760 -> 09:45.200] it's not but then I think there's a branch of people as well,
[09:45.200 -> 09:49.120] then older guys that their family are a bit more growing at home,
[09:49.120 -> 09:51.200] so they don't necessarily need to be at home so much.
[09:51.200 -> 09:52.880] And that's quite a nice environment.
[09:52.880 -> 09:56.480] I think teams are starting to do a much better job at it.
[09:56.880 -> 09:59.760] You know, when I started, there was 18, 19 races,
[09:59.760 -> 10:01.160] and that felt like quite a good number.
[10:01.160 -> 10:03.480] You were never away for really more than two weeks at a time.
[10:04.080 -> 10:09.360] Now it's got more and more intense as time has gone on, particularly the triple headers.
[10:09.360 -> 10:15.960] I personally felt really difficult. But teams are starting to do a bit more rotation with
[10:15.960 -> 10:22.200] engineers or mechanics. There's a lot more help at the track for a start than we used
[10:22.200 -> 10:25.180] to. We travelled with a physio that was there all the time
[10:25.180 -> 10:27.000] that could help us with whatever it was.
[10:27.000 -> 10:29.580] There's a load of team doctors, there's a paddock doctor,
[10:29.580 -> 10:33.000] so there's always people there to look after you.
[10:33.000 -> 10:35.080] So I think that side of it has got a lot better
[10:35.080 -> 10:36.800] than a few years ago.
[10:36.800 -> 10:38.400] And it is getting better all the time.
[10:38.400 -> 10:40.800] Yeah, especially if we go up more and more races,
[10:40.800 -> 10:42.360] 25 being talked about.
[10:42.360 -> 10:43.800] Okay, tweet from Sarah.
[10:43.800 -> 10:47.360] Hi Bernie, which driver that you've worked with was your favourite and why?
[10:47.360 -> 10:50.880] Brackets, go on, say Jensen.
[10:50.880 -> 10:51.880] I can't say Jensen.
[10:51.880 -> 10:56.440] The unfortunate thing with Jensen is I only worked with him for the one year at McLaren,
[10:56.440 -> 10:58.360] so I worked with him for 2014.
[10:58.360 -> 11:04.040] And I really enjoyed that because I was learning so much and Jensen at that stage had loads
[11:04.040 -> 11:05.240] of time to teach me stuff.
[11:05.240 -> 11:08.160] So it was really interesting and dynamic but it only was the one year.
[11:08.160 -> 11:11.360] Obviously I'll get a chance to work with him again soon hopefully through Sky.
[11:11.360 -> 11:11.960] Yeah, with Sky.
[11:11.960 -> 11:13.560] Yeah, so I'm really looking forward to that.
[11:13.560 -> 11:17.560] I think the drivers have all been really different characters for various reasons.
[11:17.560 -> 11:22.160] And yeah, I've really enjoyed a lot of what they brought.
[11:22.160 -> 11:27.920] The person probably that I was, you know, the friendliest was maybe Sebastian last year, you know,
[11:27.920 -> 11:31.000] and again, I guess that's the stage he was in his career.
[11:31.000 -> 11:33.400] It was really nice to just, yeah, have that friendship.
[11:33.400 -> 11:35.040] Yeah, what was it about Sebastian
[11:35.040 -> 11:36.440] that you enjoyed most about?
[11:36.440 -> 11:38.140] I think he was quite relaxed, you know,
[11:38.140 -> 11:41.760] I think the car wasn't as good as we would have hoped
[11:41.760 -> 11:45.920] through that time, so it was more of a learning process across us,
[11:45.920 -> 11:47.880] what we could improve and the other aspects of it.
[11:47.880 -> 11:51.080] So it wasn't necessarily the pressure of,
[11:51.080 -> 11:52.600] we're going to try and get a podium every week
[11:52.600 -> 11:54.400] because we weren't in that position.
[11:55.480 -> 11:57.640] And yeah, I think he's been there, done that.
[11:57.640 -> 11:59.640] So I felt like he'd sort of,
[11:59.640 -> 12:01.520] the pressure was off a little bit,
[12:01.520 -> 12:03.520] but through that relationship it was good.
[12:03.520 -> 12:04.800] Very interesting.
[12:04.800 -> 12:09.280] Tweet from Carl, which driver was the hardest to get your point over strategy-wise
[12:09.280 -> 12:13.120] and the one during the race who needed convincing a different strategy was best?
[12:15.280 -> 12:21.520] I've been very lucky, it's a very diplomatic answer but I think I've been very lucky in that
[12:21.520 -> 12:28.360] we've had some very heated debates in the office. So we actually spend maybe an hour on a Saturday night debating what we think
[12:28.360 -> 12:31.820] the strategy is going to be for Sunday and again maybe another hour on a Sunday
[12:31.820 -> 12:35.520] morning. So actually a lot of the permutations that are possible during
[12:35.520 -> 12:39.600] the race have been like well debated in advance. So although we go in with a plan
[12:39.600 -> 12:43.600] A, we've got a lot of this might happen or that might happen already lined up.
[12:43.600 -> 12:47.640] So thankfully nine times out of ten, maybe more than that, when we've got a lot of this might happen or that might happen already lined up. So thankfully, nine times out of 10,
[12:47.640 -> 12:48.800] maybe more than that,
[12:48.800 -> 12:50.560] when we've made a call to do a pit stop,
[12:50.560 -> 12:52.140] it has been acted upon.
[12:52.140 -> 12:55.120] Maybe an advance has been a bit of, I'm not sure.
[12:55.120 -> 12:57.120] The one that sticks out in my mind
[12:57.120 -> 12:59.960] was it was a wet Russia a few years ago.
[12:59.960 -> 13:04.240] And both drivers actually decided that they knew best
[13:04.240 -> 13:06.440] and would stay out on track when it was wet.
[13:06.440 -> 13:07.920] And then both got around the first corner
[13:07.920 -> 13:09.520] and was like, oh, it was quite wet around there.
[13:09.520 -> 13:11.320] And we're like, oh, that's what we're trying to say.
[13:11.320 -> 13:13.080] So I think you've always got those incidents,
[13:13.080 -> 13:16.040] but you try and go back afterwards
[13:16.040 -> 13:19.680] and review what you knew at the time
[13:19.680 -> 13:21.200] and how you could have conveyed that
[13:21.200 -> 13:22.800] more clearly to the driver.
[13:22.800 -> 13:24.720] And what we did in that instance was actually
[13:24.720 -> 13:26.600] they came back to us and said,
[13:26.600 -> 13:29.200] well, this is what the information I didn't have from you
[13:29.200 -> 13:30.640] or what you could have told me better.
[13:30.640 -> 13:33.720] Or we looked at the information that they had as well.
[13:33.720 -> 13:34.880] And that was a very famous use
[13:34.880 -> 13:36.960] because lots of, you know, I went through the radio columns,
[13:36.960 -> 13:39.040] lots of people didn't listen or-
[13:39.040 -> 13:40.000] Or on the Lando.
[13:40.000 -> 13:42.000] Exactly, yeah, there was a lot of discussion.
[13:42.000 -> 13:45.120] So it's just a learning process,
[13:45.120 -> 13:47.040] like any working relationship,
[13:47.040 -> 13:50.760] how you can best understand what they hear and know,
[13:50.760 -> 13:52.840] because they actually hear reasonably little in the car.
[13:52.840 -> 13:54.200] Yeah, and I guess trust, right?
[13:54.200 -> 13:58.160] You build it up, and that's why you see strategists,
[13:58.160 -> 14:00.120] but also engineers' relationships develop
[14:00.120 -> 14:02.280] and stay, what, for five, six, seven years,
[14:02.280 -> 14:04.480] because you have that trust that you can work together well.
[14:04.480 -> 14:06.600] Exactly, and it's just, it's almost like the,
[14:06.600 -> 14:08.400] you know that relationship you get to where
[14:08.400 -> 14:10.400] you say something and someone can finish your sentence?
[14:10.400 -> 14:11.600] Like, that's the ultimate goal.
[14:11.600 -> 14:13.200] You want to be at that point where they understand.
[14:13.200 -> 14:16.200] So, yeah, I've been very lucky, I think, generally.
[14:16.200 -> 14:17.800] I just want to ask you on Seb.
[14:17.800 -> 14:20.600] Did he, was he someone who had a,
[14:20.600 -> 14:22.200] or who enjoyed hearing about the strategy?
[14:22.200 -> 14:23.800] Was he someone who took an active role
[14:23.800 -> 14:25.360] in really getting into it
[14:25.360 -> 14:27.120] and being a part of that discussion?
[14:27.120 -> 14:27.960] Yeah, I think so.
[14:27.960 -> 14:30.640] And I think when he was first joining the team,
[14:30.640 -> 14:32.680] obviously we've had years of listening
[14:32.680 -> 14:34.320] to Sebastian at Ferrari,
[14:34.320 -> 14:35.480] questioning the strategy,
[14:35.480 -> 14:37.340] arguing the strategy, whatever.
[14:37.340 -> 14:39.720] So I was a bit apprehensive when he joined
[14:39.720 -> 14:41.760] of how hard he was going to be to work with.
[14:41.760 -> 14:44.000] And actually then I was pleasantly surprised.
[14:45.020 -> 14:47.980] But I think the funny thing with drivers is,
[14:47.980 -> 14:49.420] generally on a Thursday or Friday,
[14:49.420 -> 14:52.400] they're not too bothered with the strategist.
[14:52.400 -> 14:53.900] And then by Saturday night, Sunday,
[14:53.900 -> 14:56.180] you become the most important person in the room,
[14:56.180 -> 14:57.260] and everyone wants to talk to you,
[14:57.260 -> 14:58.220] both drivers want to talk to you,
[14:58.220 -> 15:00.580] both drivers are interested in their strategies.
[15:00.580 -> 15:02.060] So I would say, yeah,
[15:02.060 -> 15:04.460] Sebastian definitely spent a lot of time on it himself,
[15:04.460 -> 15:09.000] and he would come up with, oh, there was a race in 2000 or whatever,
[15:09.000 -> 15:11.000] where this happened, go and have a look at that one.
[15:11.000 -> 15:13.000] And I go away and research that race.
[15:13.000 -> 15:14.000] A historian of the sport.
[15:14.000 -> 15:15.000] Yeah, exactly.
[15:15.000 -> 15:18.000] He knows a lot more historically than I would know.
[15:18.000 -> 15:22.000] But I think all of the drivers are so involved in their strategy on Sunday morning.
[15:22.000 -> 15:25.400] I think much more than people in the outside world maybe see.
[15:25.400 -> 15:27.360] We go through it with them both individually.
[15:27.360 -> 15:29.920] We go through their start tyre a lot.
[15:29.920 -> 15:32.480] So they both need to have bought into it
[15:32.480 -> 15:33.880] when they leave that room on Sunday morning
[15:33.880 -> 15:35.000] or it won't work.
[15:35.880 -> 15:37.880] Even if there's a slightly different reason
[15:37.880 -> 15:39.320] they want a start tyre to you,
[15:39.320 -> 15:40.720] you need to really take that on board
[15:40.720 -> 15:43.480] because if they're not fully in the zone
[15:43.480 -> 15:44.800] when the lights go out,
[15:44.800 -> 15:47.560] then you're not gonna get the right answer out of them at the end of
[15:47.560 -> 15:51.360] the race. You said when you first worked with Seb you were maybe a little bit
[15:51.360 -> 15:55.040] nervous, a little apprehensive about it. How long did that last very long or was he
[15:55.040 -> 15:58.520] super warm and super friendly with you? Yeah I think he was really good
[15:58.520 -> 16:02.480] straight away and straight away he was really open to the ideas that the team
[16:02.480 -> 16:06.320] had. I sort of expected, you know, recent point
[16:06.320 -> 16:11.600] and Force India, whatever. When he came from Ferrari, I thought, here's someone who's,
[16:11.600 -> 16:17.960] you know, four-time world champion coming to a team lower down the grade, less resource,
[16:17.960 -> 16:23.440] we have less people on the ground, less in the strategy department, etc, etc. You know,
[16:23.440 -> 16:25.760] is he going to really be thinking,
[16:25.760 -> 16:27.600] oh, these guys are joking about...
[16:27.600 -> 16:29.920] And actually, he was really open to our ideas
[16:29.920 -> 16:31.200] and our perception of things.
[16:31.200 -> 16:34.000] And I guess over the years, we had had podiums
[16:34.000 -> 16:35.760] when we maybe shouldn't have had,
[16:35.760 -> 16:37.600] or we've had good results we maybe shouldn't have had.
[16:37.600 -> 16:39.520] So I guess he'd taken that on board as,
[16:39.520 -> 16:41.520] these guys know what they're doing,
[16:41.520 -> 16:44.160] so I'm going to take some of their ideas
[16:44.160 -> 16:47.680] and input some of my own so yeah it was much more
[16:47.680 -> 16:52.480] an interaction between both sides of trying to get the best from both
[16:52.480 -> 16:56.600] ideas than I thought it was going to be so yeah it was quite quickly
[16:56.600 -> 17:00.200] very easy. Nice yeah never too old to learn. Never too old to learn yeah
[17:00.200 -> 17:13.280] even if you're Sebastian Vettel.
[17:15.280 -> 17:19.280] Okay, a tweet from GullyNat. Is it common for teams to have code words to secretly relay strategy?
[17:19.280 -> 17:23.360] For example, we often hear of some drivers falsely saying their ties are good or bad
[17:23.360 -> 17:25.440] when the inverse seems to be the case.
[17:25.440 -> 17:26.880] Yeah, so there's a few points in that.
[17:26.880 -> 17:30.120] So it used to be, and the rules have changed in this,
[17:30.120 -> 17:33.160] that people had like switches on their dash
[17:33.160 -> 17:34.720] so you would have like a tire switch
[17:34.720 -> 17:37.280] where you could mark how good or bad your tire was.
[17:37.280 -> 17:39.280] So actually you could say to the pit wall
[17:39.280 -> 17:40.800] without ever saying anything on the radio
[17:40.800 -> 17:42.400] how good or bad it was.
[17:42.400 -> 17:45.560] But the radio information is shared amongst all the teams.
[17:45.560 -> 17:47.280] So all the teams hear the radio
[17:47.280 -> 17:48.840] that all the other drivers are doing.
[17:48.840 -> 17:51.780] So there is a little aspect at times of that.
[17:51.780 -> 17:54.120] I think my experience has been in the past
[17:54.120 -> 17:56.880] that potentially that leads to more errors
[17:56.880 -> 17:57.960] than it does to the good.
[17:57.960 -> 18:00.620] So if a driver incorrectly remembers
[18:00.620 -> 18:02.920] what your code word is, then it can be potentially wrong.
[18:02.920 -> 18:06.520] As they're driving a car at quite extraordinary speeds.
[18:06.520 -> 18:09.540] Yeah, well I'm always really impressed
[18:09.540 -> 18:10.960] with how well they do.
[18:10.960 -> 18:14.780] Like, to all of the switches in the steering wheel,
[18:14.780 -> 18:16.180] everything that you're asking with them,
[18:16.180 -> 18:18.180] as well as getting the fast lap done.
[18:19.560 -> 18:21.940] And then sometimes the driver will come in and go,
[18:21.940 -> 18:23.200] oh I see it on the TV.
[18:23.200 -> 18:25.800] It's like, how do you have the margin or the overhead
[18:25.800 -> 18:28.560] to watch any of the TVs as you're going around the track?
[18:28.560 -> 18:30.120] But you will get drivers that ask questions
[18:30.120 -> 18:32.120] they've picked up from whatever's going on
[18:32.120 -> 18:33.220] on the big screens.
[18:34.160 -> 18:35.720] But yeah, the communication stuff.
[18:35.720 -> 18:38.020] But then you also get,
[18:38.020 -> 18:40.400] you've had so many instances over the years
[18:40.400 -> 18:45.000] of a team telling a driver a box in code words.
[18:46.100 -> 18:49.560] They might not say box a slap, they might say a code word.
[18:49.560 -> 18:51.040] And then the driver just responds with,
[18:51.040 -> 18:52.680] yeah, box a slap.
[18:52.680 -> 18:56.480] Or the person on the pit wall says it in such a voice
[18:56.480 -> 18:58.560] that it's obvious just from the tone of the voice
[18:58.560 -> 18:59.400] what they mean.
[18:59.400 -> 19:02.480] So they might say like, yellow four,
[19:02.480 -> 19:03.960] but they'll say it like, yellow four, yellow four,
[19:03.960 -> 19:08.720] yellow four, and it's just like the excitement is so much that it's obvious what they're trying to do regardless of what the
[19:08.720 -> 19:14.720] words are. So yeah it's real I find the code words thing really interesting dynamic but I think
[19:14.720 -> 19:20.080] majority of teams I tend not to use them. Yeah tweet from Rob how fine is the art of inputting
[19:20.080 -> 19:27.100] potential safety cars etc in to cut down weight, and is the risk worth it?
[19:27.100 -> 19:29.240] So, yeah, that's a really interesting question.
[19:29.240 -> 19:30.080] There's a few things.
[19:30.080 -> 19:32.660] So on the fuel, it generally is worth it,
[19:32.660 -> 19:35.580] because if you think that for most circuits,
[19:35.580 -> 19:40.360] like an average circuit, 10 kg is around 3 tenths of fuel,
[19:40.360 -> 19:42.820] a lap, or 3 tenths of lap time.
[19:43.920 -> 19:45.840] Over 50 laps, that's massive, you know,
[19:45.840 -> 19:47.320] that's a lot to carry.
[19:47.320 -> 19:50.920] You're not talking 10 kg generally for a safety car,
[19:50.920 -> 19:52.760] you're talking about two or three.
[19:52.760 -> 19:55.600] But every lap for 50 laps to carry that extra weight
[19:55.600 -> 19:58.640] is massive and your launch off the line
[19:58.640 -> 20:00.760] is dramatically affected because you're carrying
[20:00.760 -> 20:03.000] that extra weight at that point.
[20:03.000 -> 20:06.480] So you'll tend to find that even ignoring safety cars
[20:06.480 -> 20:08.400] just for straightforward race,
[20:08.400 -> 20:10.200] people will under fuel the car.
[20:10.200 -> 20:12.120] So starting off, there's not enough fuel
[20:12.120 -> 20:13.880] to make it to the end of the race.
[20:13.880 -> 20:16.520] And then you add an allowance for safety cars.
[20:16.520 -> 20:19.000] And the reason for that is you try and race
[20:19.000 -> 20:21.120] to get to your first or second pit stop
[20:21.120 -> 20:22.480] if it's a two-stop race.
[20:22.480 -> 20:24.760] And then in the last, generally,
[20:24.760 -> 20:25.360] you can start
[20:25.360 -> 20:30.080] to save a little bit more fuel. So you've spent your fuel at the start and you're saving
[20:30.080 -> 20:34.760] a little bit towards the end because you've nailed down your track position or you can
[20:34.760 -> 20:40.080] just manage enough for the overtaking. It's always difficult. We tend to look a lot at
[20:40.080 -> 20:45.520] the percentage chance of safety cars, you know, the Bakus of this world, higher chance of Silverstone.
[20:45.520 -> 20:52.880] So it is generally worth the risk. Teams look as well as, if we're taking out two or three laps of safety car,
[20:52.880 -> 20:57.600] teams look at how hard that will be to win back should there not be a safety car
[20:57.600 -> 21:09.440] and how detrimental that would be in lap time to win back. So there is a lot of analysis goes into that possibility. The other thing is that if your safety car comes very late in the race, so in
[21:09.440 -> 21:13.360] the closing laps, you can't guarantee it's coming. So you've started to win
[21:13.360 -> 21:17.760] back the fuel already anyway and then often the safety car comes and you end
[21:17.760 -> 21:22.480] up with too much fuel in the car and you've had 20 laps of saving. So they
[21:22.480 -> 21:26.120] tend to look at the lift and coast required and we just mean
[21:26.120 -> 21:30.200] time off, throttle off, brakes going into the corner, required to save the fuel for
[21:30.200 -> 21:34.080] whatever you take out at that point. So there's a lot of analysis goes into that actually.
[21:34.080 -> 21:38.800] Such a fine balance isn't it? Yeah. Does it often go wrong? I think quite regularly you
[21:38.800 -> 21:43.520] see, I think a few years ago Alpine were always really aggressive on it, so their second stint
[21:43.520 -> 21:46.440] was always much slower and they were always pushing the drivers really hard
[21:46.440 -> 21:51.800] to save fuel. I'd say more often than not teams are more on the cautious
[21:51.800 -> 21:56.720] side and so you often find that teams will end up with a bit extra fuel in the
[21:56.720 -> 22:01.980] car but yet it's not gone let's say dramatically wrong recently I think
[22:01.980 -> 22:08.880] teams are really nailed down the art of it and you know which races you can sort of get away with it. All on that very clever software. Formula Cracked on
[22:08.880 -> 22:13.120] Twitter wants to know what was the most exciting race you've seen from a strategic opportunity
[22:13.120 -> 22:18.480] viewpoint and what race do you reckon your strategic input had the most influence on the outcome?
[22:19.920 -> 22:25.200] The race where my input had the most influence, there's two that spring to mind that's easy.
[22:25.200 -> 22:27.040] I'll answer that bit first because that's an easier question.
[22:28.400 -> 22:31.440] There's the Bari and Wynn with Tcheko in 2020,
[22:32.000 -> 22:35.760] where he actually crashed on lap one.
[22:36.480 -> 22:40.000] And through that lap, it's Bari and that circuit layout,
[22:40.000 -> 22:42.480] it's a very quick lap, so you've got a lot of decisions to make very quickly.
[22:43.120 -> 22:47.440] But we'd started on the soft tyre and we knew the medium would be a quicker tyre
[22:47.440 -> 22:48.760] for the first stint.
[22:48.760 -> 22:52.360] So even though Tcheko didn't need to change tyres, his tyres were actually fine
[22:52.360 -> 22:55.360] after the shunt, which is very unusual.
[22:55.360 -> 22:57.560] Normally, you definitely need to change tyres when you've had a spin.
[22:58.120 -> 23:01.320] We knew that the other tyres were quicker, so we made the call
[23:01.320 -> 23:03.920] to stop under the safety car and change to the other tyres
[23:04.240 -> 23:06.000] because we knew it was the fastest race strategy.
[23:06.000 -> 23:09.000] So that's actually one of the easiest decisions I've made,
[23:09.000 -> 23:12.000] but also one of the ones that had the biggest effect on the race, I think.
[23:12.000 -> 23:14.000] Because he won.
[23:14.000 -> 23:15.000] Because he won, yeah.
[23:15.000 -> 23:16.000] Because, you know, there was lots of other things.
[23:16.000 -> 23:18.000] The car was fast, Mercedes had a bad weekend.
[23:18.000 -> 23:20.000] There was lots of other things that made the win,
[23:20.000 -> 23:25.000] but that made us be in that position to take it up.
[23:25.480 -> 23:28.400] And that was just all planning in advance.
[23:28.400 -> 23:30.780] I knew which tire was quicker at that point.
[23:30.780 -> 23:34.180] I knew that we were last anyway, so it was easy money.
[23:34.180 -> 23:37.440] And I do remember his race engineer beside me going,
[23:37.440 -> 23:38.280] are you sure?
[23:38.280 -> 23:41.260] And I was like, yeah, I'm so sure on this one.
[23:41.260 -> 23:42.420] So that was the one.
[23:42.420 -> 23:44.640] The other one that was a Brazil, I can't remember the year,
[23:44.640 -> 23:48.200] but it was a wet race in Brazil, again with Chaco. We
[23:48.200 -> 23:52.320] actually made no pit stops, but it got wetter and a little bit drier throughout
[23:52.320 -> 23:56.240] the race and there was a few red flags where we changed tyres, but that was
[23:56.240 -> 23:59.160] really difficult because every lap you're looking at the radar, you're
[23:59.160 -> 24:02.920] trying to decide what the weather is going to be, deciding not to stop is
[24:02.920 -> 24:09.780] equally as difficult as deciding to stop. And we were in the very closing laps in a podium position when I
[24:09.780 -> 24:15.460] think it was Verstappen overtook us. But actually Verstappen should have never
[24:15.460 -> 24:18.840] been where he was. We'd made some better decisions I believe than those guys on
[24:18.840 -> 24:23.220] that day. So those are ones where even though we had no pit stops I feel like
[24:23.220 -> 24:26.000] all the decisions we did make were for the right reasons.
[24:26.000 -> 24:32.000] The strategic races that I think are interesting are like Bahrain this year I really enjoyed watching
[24:32.000 -> 24:40.000] because it's one of those races where it's about trying to hit the optimum strategy, it's a multiple stop race, easy to overtake.
[24:40.000 -> 24:44.000] So those are the ones that I think are really interesting from a strategic point of view.
[24:44.000 -> 24:47.800] Joshua on Twitter, how often does a race pan out just like you thought it would
[24:47.800 -> 24:51.760] strategy wise? I'm going to guess probably very few, very few times. And how much do
[24:51.760 -> 24:56.080] you think less practice sessions and testing would have an effect on this number?
[24:56.080 -> 25:00.520] I would say that a race never, I don't think has ever panned out. We've never done the
[25:00.520 -> 25:05.240] plan A stop lap exactly right. And there's loads of reasons why it doesn't pan out.
[25:05.240 -> 25:08.320] You know, it could be a safety car, it could be traffic,
[25:08.320 -> 25:11.200] it could be your tyre model's wrong, whatever it is.
[25:11.200 -> 25:13.400] Like the Monaco, for example, the tyre model
[25:13.400 -> 25:15.520] very rarely changes, because it's not that important
[25:15.520 -> 25:18.080] to the race, but the traffic and the safety cars
[25:18.080 -> 25:20.840] mean your race plan changes.
[25:20.840 -> 25:22.680] So yeah, it always changes quite a lot.
[25:22.680 -> 25:23.680] What was the second part of the question?
[25:23.680 -> 25:26.760] It was, if we, because obviously in Baku we're talking about potentially reducing the amount of Oh yeah, it always changes quite a lot. What was the second part of the question? It was, if we, because obviously in Baku
[25:26.760 -> 25:28.640] we're talking about potentially reducing the amount of
[25:28.640 -> 25:31.160] practice time, you know, we might only get
[25:31.160 -> 25:33.200] one practice session in FP1.
[25:33.200 -> 25:34.520] Do you think that would have an effect
[25:34.520 -> 25:36.400] on how you guys work as strategists?
[25:36.400 -> 25:39.680] Yeah, I would really like to see
[25:39.680 -> 25:42.520] not, no practice, like a one practice session
[25:42.520 -> 25:43.360] straight into qualifying.
[25:43.360 -> 25:48.880] But now that you're on this side of the fence? So on this side of the fence. Well, on the other side, I always thought it was more interesting
[25:48.880 -> 25:53.840] from a strategy point of view, because actually it's the team that does the best analysis,
[25:53.840 -> 25:58.640] the best setup, the drivers that are more on it when they get to the first session.
[25:58.640 -> 26:05.400] That's going to be interesting. But from an engineer point of view, you always want more data.
[26:05.400 -> 26:07.480] The more that you have a tyre model,
[26:07.480 -> 26:10.520] the better nailed down your race is gonna be.
[26:10.520 -> 26:13.340] So I find it really good when we have a wet Friday,
[26:13.340 -> 26:15.760] nobody gets a good amount of data,
[26:15.760 -> 26:18.180] then you go into Saturday and it's really like
[26:18.180 -> 26:21.060] everyone's reacting live to what's going on,
[26:21.060 -> 26:22.960] reacting live to the tyre model.
[26:22.960 -> 26:24.560] Those I think are much more interesting races.
[26:24.560 -> 26:28.060] So I would quite like to see less of the practice session,
[26:28.060 -> 26:30.780] but all of my engineering colleagues will say,
[26:30.780 -> 26:32.260] please don't take away the practice session.
[26:32.260 -> 26:33.100] We love data.
[26:33.100 -> 26:35.660] Yeah, you would want as many hours as you could
[26:35.660 -> 26:36.740] on that track, wouldn't you?
[26:36.740 -> 26:38.340] Andrea on Instagram, hi Bernie,
[26:38.340 -> 26:40.540] if you could make one rule change in F1,
[26:40.540 -> 26:42.220] what would it be and why?
[26:42.220 -> 26:44.660] I am just gonna say I would get rid of the practice,
[26:44.660 -> 26:46.160] I would get rid of, in a standard weekend,
[26:46.160 -> 26:47.440] I'd get rid of Friday.
[26:47.440 -> 26:50.760] And I'd just have the FP3 quali race
[26:50.760 -> 26:52.240] over a two day weekend.
[26:52.240 -> 26:54.840] I think that would just make it much,
[26:54.840 -> 26:56.280] I know why we do the Friday,
[26:56.280 -> 26:59.580] and I get that it's like more running for everything.
[26:59.580 -> 27:01.560] And I think the Friday's probably good at the minute
[27:01.560 -> 27:03.460] because we give the young drivers an opportunity
[27:03.460 -> 27:05.880] throughout the year to drive in that session.
[27:05.880 -> 27:10.880] But I would quite like to see less and more reaction
[27:11.760 -> 27:14.680] on the ball during the race to what's going on.
[27:14.680 -> 27:16.680] Yeah, I think everyone would like to see that,
[27:16.680 -> 27:17.960] fans as well.
[27:17.960 -> 27:21.600] Con on Instagram, which is your favorite circuit to go to?
[27:21.600 -> 27:22.920] Ah, right.
[27:22.920 -> 27:24.280] I think there's favorite circuits
[27:24.280 -> 27:31.200] for a load of different reasons. I think for the fans, probably Japan, but not for the jet lag.
[27:31.200 -> 27:36.120] Struggle with the jet lag. From a circuit itself I think Brazil,
[27:36.120 -> 27:42.440] Sao Paulo's amazing circuit, it's really nice to see. Great elevation as
[27:42.440 -> 27:46.000] well for fans, you can get to points on the track on you and see the entire circuit.
[27:46.000 -> 27:50.000] You always do the track walk and you think wow I've forgotten how steep or bad this is.
[27:50.000 -> 27:56.000] So yeah there's a few different reasons why certain circuits or certain countries that I love, you know I love going to Canada for example.
[27:56.000 -> 28:00.000] So yeah there's a few interesting ones.
[28:00.000 -> 28:06.120] Dan, who you might know as Engine Mode 11 on Twitter, says, it's probably a bit niche, but with the rise of AI,
[28:06.120 -> 28:09.160] has that affected the strategic decisions made by the teams,
[28:09.160 -> 28:11.920] or is it not mature enough yet to be considered?
[28:11.920 -> 28:15.320] I would imagine that AI is mature enough yet
[28:15.320 -> 28:19.000] to be considered, but F1 or maybe a little bit,
[28:19.000 -> 28:21.920] they've not embraced it as a mode yet,
[28:21.920 -> 28:24.280] or not that I've experienced.
[28:24.280 -> 28:28.760] I think AI, the power is gonna come in AI predicting
[28:28.760 -> 28:31.320] what you think your competitors are likely to do.
[28:31.320 -> 28:34.920] So the more sophisticated we can build our model
[28:34.920 -> 28:36.960] of another team, the better I think
[28:36.960 -> 28:38.760] for our own strategy decisions.
[28:38.760 -> 28:40.080] And that's loads of things.
[28:40.080 -> 28:42.520] So, you know, are they likely to be aggressive,
[28:42.520 -> 28:43.440] trying to undercut us?
[28:43.440 -> 28:46.560] Are they likely to extend their tire further?
[28:46.560 -> 28:49.640] What their radio comms mean in terms of what they're thinking
[28:49.640 -> 28:51.760] or, you know, when they talk to a driver
[28:51.760 -> 28:53.840] about front way angle, like how many laps is that
[28:53.840 -> 28:54.680] to the stop?
[28:54.680 -> 28:56.040] There's loads of things that we could start
[28:56.040 -> 28:57.240] to train a model on.
[28:58.080 -> 29:00.680] Simple things like what likelihood they are
[29:00.680 -> 29:02.240] of doing a certain start tire.
[29:02.240 -> 29:04.960] So, you know, if the stop is starting at the back,
[29:04.960 -> 29:06.600] is he likely to go for the harder start tyre?
[29:06.800 -> 29:12.360] So the more that we can build those models around other teams,
[29:12.560 -> 29:14.720] I think is going to be really interesting.
[29:14.920 -> 29:18.680] I, you know, selfishly, probably as a strategist, wouldn't like to see them
[29:18.680 -> 29:22.000] replace the strategist on the pit wall, because I think there's always going to be
[29:22.000 -> 29:26.760] that human interaction. But I think we'd really love to model a strategist in another team.
[29:26.960 -> 29:28.480] And the question that I've not quite got
[29:28.680 -> 29:32.760] to the answer of yet is, for example, when I left the pit wall,
[29:32.960 -> 29:37.440] did fundamentally some aspect of Aston Martin's strategy change?
[29:37.640 -> 29:39.320] And actually, does your AI need to be
[29:39.520 -> 29:44.360] modeling Aston Martin's strategy or the individual strategists?
[29:44.560 -> 29:47.360] So it's an interesting question of,
[29:47.360 -> 29:51.800] because some teams switch strategists week on week.
[29:51.800 -> 29:54.560] So do you need to model which strategy it is
[29:54.560 -> 29:56.440] on the pit wall or do both of them react
[29:56.440 -> 29:57.280] in a very similar way?
[29:57.280 -> 29:58.560] So it's a really interesting problem.
[29:58.560 -> 30:00.360] I think as well it's something that everyone's
[30:00.360 -> 30:01.440] gonna have to grapple with is,
[30:01.440 -> 30:04.520] because it's live sport, right?
[30:04.520 -> 30:07.600] The whole point of us tuning in on a Sunday afternoon is because we don't know the
[30:07.600 -> 30:10.360] outcome that's what makes it so exciting we definitely don't want to get to a
[30:10.360 -> 30:13.400] stage with the sport where you turn it on the Sunday afternoon and you've got
[30:13.400 -> 30:16.960] the little bars along the bottom saying there's a 99% chance for Stappan's gonna
[30:16.960 -> 30:20.480] win this weekend that's not what you want to see is it? Yeah no exactly and I
[30:20.480 -> 30:24.480] think I don't think it will get there because I think we all love the human
[30:24.480 -> 30:26.640] interaction but it's gonna be interesting to see how they can use them Exactly, and I don't think it will get there because I think we all love the human interaction,
[30:26.640 -> 30:29.220] but it's going to be interesting to see how they can use it.
[30:29.220 -> 30:32.280] Maybe limiting technology, maybe limiting that development.
[30:32.280 -> 30:35.680] Okay, I think that's everything on being a strategist.
[30:35.680 -> 30:38.500] Not everything, but a lot of being a strategist.
[30:38.500 -> 30:43.040] So I want to ask you a little bit about your own career and how you started out in Formula
[30:43.040 -> 30:44.040] 1.
[30:44.040 -> 30:45.760] Just try and, if you can can give us the abridged version
[30:45.760 -> 30:50.240] of from being a youngster to getting where you are now.
[30:50.240 -> 30:54.740] Yeah, so I didn't know what I wanted to do at school.
[30:54.740 -> 30:56.520] So I decided to do mechanical engineering
[30:56.520 -> 30:58.420] because I like mathematics and physics.
[30:58.420 -> 31:00.400] So I thought that's quite a sea of fruit
[31:00.400 -> 31:02.960] and there's lots of different jobs you can do at the end.
[31:02.960 -> 31:04.000] And then even through that,
[31:04.000 -> 31:06.380] I didn't know what I wanted to do as a mechanical engineer, I just
[31:06.380 -> 31:11.040] thought but I enjoyed it so it was fine and then an opportunity came up to join
[31:11.040 -> 31:16.100] the McLaren graduate scheme. I thought well yeah that's really cool and it was
[31:16.100 -> 31:19.140] really interesting because I went there thinking oh even if I just get to see
[31:19.140 -> 31:23.940] around McLaren that's fine I'll go home happy. It's a free tour. Yeah exactly, it's a free tour.
[31:23.940 -> 31:25.040] So I
[31:25.040 -> 31:28.440] joined them as a graduate which I did a lot of work in design and then I joined
[31:28.440 -> 31:34.080] the design office I spent my first five or six years in design office and then I
[31:34.080 -> 31:38.360] moved to performance engineer with Jensen and then moved from McLaren to
[31:38.360 -> 31:42.480] Aston Martin or Ford's India as it was then and that was really interesting
[31:42.480 -> 31:46.860] move because I moved as half performance, half strategy.
[31:46.860 -> 31:49.580] But as I moved, I'd never done strategy before.
[31:49.580 -> 31:50.980] As I moved, the strategist left.
[31:50.980 -> 31:53.500] It was like, oh, can you just do a bit more strategy?
[31:53.500 -> 31:54.420] And then since I've been there,
[31:54.420 -> 31:56.580] I've only ever done strategy.
[31:56.580 -> 31:58.460] So it's been like evolving.
[31:58.460 -> 32:00.140] But yeah, I was an engineer,
[32:00.140 -> 32:01.980] which is just why I've got into it.
[32:01.980 -> 32:03.100] Yeah, that's really interesting.
[32:03.100 -> 32:06.400] What I find fascinating is you've done a lot of the different roles
[32:06.400 -> 32:08.480] that I guess as a strategist you're calling on, right?
[32:08.480 -> 32:09.840] You're calling on your performance engineer,
[32:09.840 -> 32:12.960] you're calling on the design team at all the points throughout a weekend.
[32:12.960 -> 32:16.320] And is it a case of you kind of have to do everything below you
[32:16.320 -> 32:19.120] to be able to kind of go in above, would you say?
[32:19.120 -> 32:21.200] I think, well, I think that's not common.
[32:21.200 -> 32:24.000] I think lots of people like join the Rius engineering team
[32:24.000 -> 32:26.120] or the strategy team as juniors
[32:26.120 -> 32:27.680] and then work up through that team.
[32:27.680 -> 32:30.240] So I think my route's been a bit uncommon.
[32:30.240 -> 32:31.920] Like a lot of strategists on the pit wall
[32:31.920 -> 32:33.160] are mathematicians actually,
[32:33.160 -> 32:35.760] or have done a degree in math and not in engineering.
[32:36.920 -> 32:38.680] But I feel like I've really benefited
[32:38.680 -> 32:40.920] from understanding a bit of what's going on around,
[32:40.920 -> 32:42.320] a bit more of what's going on around me
[32:42.320 -> 32:44.320] in terms of those engineering roles.
[32:47.440 -> 32:50.340] So yeah, it's a bit of a mix, I would say. What were the main differences between, so you obviously left McLaren, went to Force
[32:50.340 -> 32:55.000] India, quite different teams, what were the main differences between them?
[32:55.000 -> 32:59.480] I think at that time, Force India was a very, very small team, obviously lots changed since
[32:59.480 -> 33:05.320] then and McLaren were this massive powerhouse of F1. So there were some like real obvious
[33:05.520 -> 33:10.880] difference. You left this really shiny, you know, lovely factory for this much older,
[33:11.080 -> 33:13.120] not so shiny and lovely factory.
[33:13.320 -> 33:15.880] The size difference was massive at that time.
[33:16.080 -> 33:21.480] You know, I left and I remember thinking the suspension group in McLaren,
[33:21.680 -> 33:24.080] there was like 10 people, there was like front and rear group.
[33:24.280 -> 33:26.780] And then I moved to Force India,
[33:26.780 -> 33:29.780] and there was an office, the whole office seemed tiny.
[33:29.780 -> 33:31.160] I was like, well, for example,
[33:31.160 -> 33:33.240] where's the suspension design group?
[33:33.240 -> 33:34.440] And they were like, it's that guy.
[33:34.440 -> 33:36.880] I was like, that guy, that one guy?
[33:36.880 -> 33:40.440] Okay, so just the whole sizing of it was different.
[33:40.440 -> 33:42.840] I think actually as a young engineer
[33:42.840 -> 33:44.700] starting out in the track side road, that was brilliant,
[33:44.700 -> 33:48.260] because there just wasn't enough people to do all the work.
[33:48.280 -> 33:50.480] So you instantly got involved in loads of
[33:50.500 -> 33:53.740] things that you would have never been given before because there was no one else
[33:53.760 -> 33:57.300] to do it. And it was really good for prioritizing what was important.
[33:57.320 -> 33:59.060] Like you only worked on the stuff that was
[33:59.080 -> 34:02.500] really going to make a difference and you just ignored everything else.
[34:02.520 -> 34:05.840] So, yeah, there was huge differences.
[34:05.840 -> 34:07.820] And it's over the years,
[34:07.820 -> 34:10.620] I'm sure they've got much closer together.
[34:10.620 -> 34:12.700] And the resource restriction, the budget cap,
[34:12.700 -> 34:15.260] will help that across all of the teams now.
[34:15.260 -> 34:18.140] So I'd imagine now, the Aston Martin I left
[34:18.140 -> 34:20.180] is much closer to the McLaren that I left,
[34:20.180 -> 34:22.100] and definitely with their new factory and stuff.
[34:22.100 -> 34:24.980] But yeah, that's been an evolution.
[34:24.980 -> 34:25.000] Yeah, I bet. Gemma wants to know, what do you think from your experience and definitely with their new factory and stuff. But yeah, that's been an evolution.
[34:25.000 -> 34:26.040] Yeah, I bet.
[34:26.040 -> 34:27.120] Gemma wants to know,
[34:27.120 -> 34:28.700] what do you think from your experience
[34:28.700 -> 34:30.280] as a very successful woman in F1
[34:30.280 -> 34:32.360] is needed to encourage more girls to take part
[34:32.360 -> 34:35.040] and support them once they've got their foot in the door?
[34:35.900 -> 34:36.740] What's different?
[34:36.740 -> 34:39.880] Well, when I was watching F1 when I was younger,
[34:39.880 -> 34:42.160] there was a lot of like drivers on TV
[34:42.160 -> 34:43.320] and you only ever seen a driver
[34:43.320 -> 34:44.920] and I knew I was never gonna be a driver
[34:44.920 -> 34:47.200] and they were all guys, which they're still all guys. But I think we've got a lot of like drivers on TV and you only ever seen a driver. And I knew I was never going to be a driver. And they were all guys, which they're still all guys.
[34:47.400 -> 34:51.880] But I think we've got a lot better now at promoting all the other roles within the
[34:51.880 -> 34:55.200] engineering department, all the other roles on the pet wall, all the other roles
[34:55.400 -> 34:59.360] in the team, and there's a lot more understanding that females can do any of
[34:59.360 -> 35:02.160] those roles. So I think that has got a lot better, I think.
[35:02.360 -> 35:04.680] So there's a lot more understanding of what you can do.
[35:04.880 -> 35:05.000] There's a lot better image of engineering. It there's a lot more understanding of what you can do.
[35:05.000 -> 35:07.000] There's a lot better image of engineering.
[35:07.000 -> 35:10.000] It used to be like dirty overalls and stuff,
[35:10.000 -> 35:13.000] so people really didn't think of designers or creative.
[35:13.000 -> 35:15.000] I think that's got better.
[35:15.000 -> 35:17.000] And I find that the opportunities have been there,
[35:17.000 -> 35:19.000] like very equally there.
[35:19.000 -> 35:23.000] So it's just been restriction that maybe people have placed upon themselves
[35:23.000 -> 35:28.720] thinking they can't do it or it's a male role or whatever. But everything that I've applied for, I went for, the opportunities
[35:28.720 -> 35:34.300] have been there. And it's just about showing representation, I guess. So being fit to do
[35:34.300 -> 35:38.620] things like this and say, you know, females are there doing it, so there's no reason why
[35:38.620 -> 35:41.860] you can't. So we're getting there, I think.
[35:41.860 -> 35:46.520] Yeah. A tweet from Nerida. as a female and an aspiring aerospace engineer,
[35:46.520 -> 35:48.760] how can I work trackside in Formula One?
[35:48.760 -> 35:50.660] What opportunities will get me there?
[35:51.600 -> 35:54.420] So I get asked this type of question loads,
[35:54.420 -> 35:56.880] but the first thing is,
[35:56.880 -> 35:58.120] it's good that you're doing your degree,
[35:58.120 -> 35:59.580] that's really good.
[35:59.580 -> 36:02.240] Try and get some experience that either leads you
[36:02.240 -> 36:04.500] to teamwork or trackside environment.
[36:04.500 -> 36:05.040] So I did
[36:05.040 -> 36:09.480] things like Formula Student, which is like an IMechE run programme where you build a
[36:09.480 -> 36:13.760] single-seater race car, and that showed sort of some teamwork elements and some trackside
[36:13.760 -> 36:20.280] elements. There's loads and loads of race teams out there, junior teams, GT3 teams,
[36:20.280 -> 36:21.760] karting teams, race tracks.
[36:21.760 -> 36:24.360] You'd be desperate to have some help.
[36:24.360 -> 36:28.160] Yeah, exactly. Need good volunteers, need good people to help out.
[36:28.160 -> 36:30.700] So I did a load of time when I was at McLaren,
[36:30.700 -> 36:32.860] working for the GT3 teams,
[36:32.860 -> 36:34.840] getting some trackside experience,
[36:34.840 -> 36:36.140] and just really like,
[36:36.140 -> 36:38.560] one, I wanted to learn that I enjoyed being at the track,
[36:38.560 -> 36:40.040] but it was good for me to prove
[36:40.040 -> 36:41.280] that I wanted to be at the track
[36:41.280 -> 36:43.900] and was prepared to put in the hours and stuff.
[36:43.900 -> 36:45.280] Apply for everything that's going on.
[36:45.360 -> 36:51.440] All of the teams have summer internships, year placements, whatever it might be.
[36:51.800 -> 36:53.480] Apply for all of that sort of stuff.
[36:53.760 -> 36:56.720] And if you don't get it, which, you know, there's more people than jobs available,
[36:57.000 -> 36:59.200] just get some feedback, like, why didn't you get it?
[36:59.240 -> 37:00.680] What could you do differently next year?
[37:00.680 -> 37:01.760] Just just keep trying.
[37:01.960 -> 37:02.240] Yeah.
[37:02.760 -> 37:03.600] Sound advice.
[37:04.240 -> 37:04.560] Okay.
[37:04.600 -> 37:05.320] I want to move on to
[37:05.320 -> 37:09.520] your new life and your new role as an analyst with us here at Sky Sports. What
[37:09.520 -> 37:13.360] was the main reason why you left Aston Martin and why you're
[37:13.360 -> 37:17.880] sort of moving into this different role in your life? I think maybe
[37:17.880 -> 37:22.120] like a lot of my decisions it's not necessarily been well planned out but I
[37:22.120 -> 37:27.040] the 23 races became really difficult and I wanted to achieve more
[37:27.040 -> 37:32.720] of a home-life balance. And that's actually, and particularly I think post the Covid years,
[37:32.720 -> 37:38.000] you sort of had a bit of a reset and a think about things. And I just thought, I really enjoyed what
[37:38.000 -> 37:41.120] I did before, I really enjoyed working for Aston Martin, I loved working for the team.
[37:41.920 -> 37:46.680] It was just an opportunity to have a bit of a reset and try and do something a little bit different.
[37:46.680 -> 37:51.320] So I decided at the end of 21
[37:51.320 -> 37:52.400] that I was gonna step back
[37:52.400 -> 37:53.800] and then I worked my six months notice
[37:53.800 -> 37:55.360] to bring me the middle of 22.
[37:56.700 -> 37:59.160] And yeah, I just sort of thought,
[37:59.160 -> 38:02.480] I can't continue to live life like I'm 21
[38:02.480 -> 38:03.760] when I'm not 21.
[38:03.760 -> 38:06.640] So let's try and do something
[38:06.640 -> 38:13.120] different. Yeah well all power to us we've got you here at Sky Sports.
[38:20.560 -> 38:24.080] Tweet from Rob I'm loving your input on Sky this season it's great to get a
[38:24.080 -> 38:28.160] different more technical perspective on what's going on, but what would you rather be doing, behind
[38:28.160 -> 38:32.640] the camera or behind the pit wall? What gives you the most satisfaction?
[38:32.640 -> 38:36.040] First of all, thank you for the positive feedback, the feedback's been really lovely, which is
[38:36.040 -> 38:41.200] really good. It's really hard to say what I'd rather be doing currently, because I've
[38:41.200 -> 38:49.520] only done sort of the one event, I'm getting another run out in Baku. I'm enjoying, like I'm learning so much about an industry that I've worked
[38:49.520 -> 38:54.880] in for so long, like how the guys put the production together, like how it makes,
[38:54.880 -> 38:59.680] it's stupid, like before I didn't think about what happened to make the stuff on
[38:59.680 -> 39:03.520] screen, it just came to me and I listened, whatever. And now I'm learning so much
[39:03.520 -> 39:07.440] about the technicalities of how they build a program together, how it goes.
[39:07.440 -> 39:09.600] So I feel like I'm learning loads.
[39:09.600 -> 39:13.160] I feel like I'm really enjoying this aspect of learning,
[39:13.160 -> 39:14.120] which I'm loving.
[39:14.120 -> 39:16.200] I'm enjoying watching the race again,
[39:16.200 -> 39:18.200] because before when you're on the pit wall,
[39:18.200 -> 39:20.920] you're very focused on your own race.
[39:20.920 -> 39:23.520] And now I'm really enjoying seeing what everyone's doing
[39:23.520 -> 39:25.280] and trying to guess what they're doing.
[39:25.280 -> 39:27.040] I'm missing having all my data,
[39:27.040 -> 39:28.900] so I'm missing having all the interaction
[39:28.900 -> 39:32.060] or knowing what's happening from a racing side.
[39:32.060 -> 39:34.600] So yeah, there's definitely aspects that I miss.
[39:34.600 -> 39:35.960] And I miss the team element,
[39:35.960 -> 39:39.720] like trying to pull together
[39:39.720 -> 39:41.080] and really make the best of the car,
[39:41.080 -> 39:42.200] so I'm sort of missing that.
[39:42.200 -> 39:44.480] So undecided at the minute.
[39:44.480 -> 39:46.720] That's come back to me at the end of the year. That's fine we'll come back to you
[39:46.720 -> 39:50.720] at the end of the season in Abu Dhabi. Rob would like to know now you've seen
[39:50.720 -> 39:55.040] F1 through the lens of Sky F1 what stands out as an observation that you
[39:55.040 -> 39:57.640] didn't maybe think about when you were when you were on the pit walls or
[39:57.640 -> 40:01.200] anything that you've seen perhaps in the way that we do things in TV that has
[40:01.200 -> 40:04.840] kind of changed your perspective on the sport? Yeah I think well like I say just
[40:04.840 -> 40:06.400] how much goes into the TV,
[40:06.400 -> 40:09.960] because the teams are sort of 50 people limited at the track,
[40:09.960 -> 40:11.920] a few more with the marketing guys,
[40:11.920 -> 40:14.000] and the TV crew is massive, you know,
[40:14.000 -> 40:16.120] all the cameras all around the track,
[40:16.120 -> 40:18.460] everyone back in London or in the studios
[40:18.460 -> 40:19.800] listening to everything goes on,
[40:19.800 -> 40:23.640] so that aspect of just a huge volume of people involved
[40:23.640 -> 40:25.600] in making a TV production has been very
[40:25.600 -> 40:32.960] new to me. And the, you know, the dynamic you have where we're all walking up and down the Petley and
[40:32.960 -> 40:36.800] Nye and you're trying to get a little piece of information from someone. Trying to be everyone's
[40:36.800 -> 40:42.160] best friend. Yes, you're trying to like get a little bit of, so I find that odd that you weren't
[40:42.160 -> 40:48.280] doing before and I guess before I was on the other side of it of trying to give a little piece of information but not so
[40:48.280 -> 40:53.800] much information so that's a really interesting dynamic now. Yeah ideas and
[40:53.800 -> 40:56.400] knowledge is your currency in Formula One. Exactly.
[40:56.400 -> 41:00.520] Sian would like to know if you could have done any other role in an F1 team
[41:00.520 -> 41:05.480] aside from the ones you've had, what would you choose and why?
[41:05.480 -> 41:09.960] I would really love to have a go at being a race engineer, so on the pit wall, speaking
[41:09.960 -> 41:14.640] of the driver, that aspect of it. I think that would be, well, it's tough, it's a tough
[41:14.640 -> 41:19.440] gig because we all know the abuse that they get, but I think that would be a really interesting
[41:19.440 -> 41:26.720] role to try for a little bit. Part of me, I've only done it in practice, but part of me loves the idea of giving
[41:26.720 -> 41:27.960] like a proper pit stop a go,
[41:27.960 -> 41:30.000] but I know that I'd be really terrible at it.
[41:30.000 -> 41:31.240] So it would be really bad.
[41:31.240 -> 41:32.480] Why would you be terrible?
[41:32.480 -> 41:34.500] Well, because I think when you watch those guys do it,
[41:34.500 -> 41:36.920] like their reaction and their calmness
[41:36.920 -> 41:38.840] is like another level.
[41:38.840 -> 41:41.520] And even to the point where I can stand in the pit lane
[41:41.520 -> 41:44.760] and listen to a pit stop or watch a pit stop
[41:44.760 -> 41:46.900] and go, oh, that's not very good,
[41:46.900 -> 41:49.000] just because something's been slightly out of sync.
[41:49.000 -> 41:50.800] And then you turn around and it's like three seconds
[41:50.800 -> 41:53.500] and you think, oh, there's no way I'd be able to do that.
[41:53.500 -> 41:56.540] So I'd like, I've only done it on like the practice ones,
[41:56.540 -> 41:59.620] but I'd love, I think the competitiveness of me
[41:59.620 -> 42:01.900] would really have me over there.
[42:01.900 -> 42:04.420] I'm intrigued that you haven't said driver.
[42:04.420 -> 42:07.120] Oh yeah, well, so I have previous of trying haven't said driver. Oh yeah well so I have
[42:07.120 -> 42:11.840] previous of trying to be a driver and I'll be very good. So in McLaren I got an opportunity
[42:11.840 -> 42:17.920] to run in the simulator when I was Jensen's performance engineer and just so Jensen knows
[42:17.920 -> 42:22.080] this I tried to get in his seat and I couldn't because his seat was too narrow so first of all
[42:22.080 -> 42:25.480] they had to take the seat out because I couldn't fit in, which is embarrassing.
[42:25.480 -> 42:27.940] But then, it was in the years
[42:27.940 -> 42:30.360] where you needed to press the button for curves
[42:30.360 -> 42:32.200] and you needed to use your battery yourself.
[42:32.200 -> 42:34.240] So I was pressing the button and the guy's like,
[42:34.240 -> 42:35.080] yeah, it's not working
[42:35.080 -> 42:37.080] because you've not actually achieved full throttle yet.
[42:37.080 -> 42:38.280] I was like, oh, okay.
[42:38.280 -> 42:39.200] So I need to try harder.
[42:39.200 -> 42:40.840] So I don't think I'd be very good at that.
[42:40.840 -> 42:42.320] Yeah, interesting.
[42:42.320 -> 42:45.560] I mean, is there any part of the...
[42:45.560 -> 42:48.600] I guess I'm curious to know as a strategist, obviously, you're asking an awful lot from
[42:48.600 -> 42:49.600] the drivers.
[42:49.600 -> 42:53.040] And it is kind of a really interesting dynamic in the fact that you, you know, none of the
[42:53.040 -> 42:57.040] strategists as far as I'm aware, or no one else really on the pit wall has driven a Formula
[42:57.040 -> 42:58.760] One car apart from the drivers.
[42:58.760 -> 43:00.640] So that is quite an interesting dynamic, isn't it?
[43:00.640 -> 43:04.080] Because ultimately, I guess a driver, if they're really annoyed with you, could be like, oh,
[43:04.080 -> 43:06.560] just, you know, you haven't driven an F1 car, you don't know what you're talking about.
[43:06.560 -> 43:10.560] Yeah, there is like, don't get me wrong, if someone said to you, you gotta go,
[43:10.560 -> 43:14.480] go for it. I would definitely give, I would definitely try. I just don't think I would be
[43:14.480 -> 43:19.760] any good at it. There is that aspect, I think a lot of the guys and girls that are on the pit wall
[43:19.760 -> 43:25.840] have experience in other series or, know junior formulas whatever and not to
[43:25.840 -> 43:30.440] anywhere near the same level of course or anywhere but I think what they do is
[43:30.440 -> 43:35.040] impressive how they work it out their computing power you know we've all heard
[43:35.040 -> 43:39.440] you know typically it's the Alonzo's of the world or the Vals where they say
[43:39.440 -> 43:42.840] something that sounds so intelligent from the car given everything that
[43:42.840 -> 43:47.920] they're taken in and it's really impressive what they can do and all of you know what they need to
[43:47.920 -> 43:52.320] remember. But then I think they have respect for us in a different way in
[43:52.320 -> 43:56.240] terms of the challenges that we face. So I think there is a mutual understanding
[43:56.240 -> 44:02.200] there. Yeah. Yeah I'm sure I'm sure there is. Jacob would like to know if you've
[44:02.200 -> 44:06.960] got any bold predictions for the future FF1 and could that could be either driver based or
[44:06.960 -> 44:08.960] on the sport itself.
[44:09.840 -> 44:14.720] I think I'd love to see we're getting that direction, but we're really pushing the sustainable fuels
[44:15.440 -> 44:17.360] and I think that
[44:17.360 -> 44:20.660] F1 in the past has been really good at leading the way in technology.
[44:21.120 -> 44:26.400] You know, this is my mechanical engineering background, I want to see the technology develop.
[44:26.400 -> 44:31.160] So I think we need to be careful between the resource restriction and the budget cap and
[44:31.160 -> 44:36.960] actually still developing cutting edge technologies. So if we can push the sustainable fuel, the
[44:36.960 -> 44:44.600] biofuels, to a point where we're not using fossil fuels anymore, overnight you can imagine
[44:44.600 -> 44:45.340] it solves the
[44:45.340 -> 44:48.640] whole crisis that we have in the world of not needing to change our cars
[44:48.640 -> 44:54.400] because we can run them on green fuel. So that's what I'd love, I'd love to
[44:54.400 -> 44:57.400] see us move in that direction rather than the electrical direction. I'd love
[44:57.400 -> 45:02.400] to see us say about how do we make this engine green and that's one thing I'd
[45:02.400 -> 45:09.840] like to see. Yeah and just just those continuous the technology is the bit that really interests me, you know the engineering side of it
[45:09.880 -> 45:16.220] So what we can do in those developments is really interesting. Yeah, everyone's always been a leader hasn't it? Yeah in technology
[45:17.040 -> 45:20.640] Yvonne would like to know are you proud of what happened to Aston Martin?
[45:20.640 -> 45:23.380] And do you regret not being part of this year's success?
[45:23.380 -> 45:27.640] So I guess it's quite interesting because obviously, you know, last year wasn't as successful as
[45:27.640 -> 45:31.760] I'm sure the team would have hoped, but this year we're seeing Alonso and Lance absolutely
[45:31.760 -> 45:32.760] killing it, aren't we?
[45:32.760 -> 45:35.880] Yeah, it feels like from my left the team's just been off and up, like the end of last
[45:35.880 -> 45:38.360] year was really good as well.
[45:38.360 -> 45:42.600] So it's really, obviously you would love to be there as a strategist when you're getting,
[45:42.600 -> 45:45.560] you know, they've had three podiums from three so far.
[45:45.560 -> 45:47.920] So yes, of course, it would be lovely to be there.
[45:47.920 -> 45:49.480] It would be lovely to do that.
[45:49.480 -> 45:51.520] But wow, I'm so happy for those guys.
[45:51.520 -> 45:54.760] You know, that team has gone through so much.
[45:54.760 -> 45:59.400] You know, a lot of people have been there for 20 plus years, their whole lives, working
[45:59.400 -> 46:03.320] through the not having enough money, not having the resources, not having the upgrades, not
[46:03.320 -> 46:04.320] having the factory.
[46:04.320 -> 46:09.680] And I was, you know, I helped them design the new mission control of the new factory and you think
[46:09.680 -> 46:15.520] wow this is going to be so fantastic compared to what they currently have. I'm still always say we
[46:15.520 -> 46:21.680] but what they currently had. So I'm just so happy that it's coming together. You know, so many people
[46:21.680 -> 46:28.760] have put in so much work. The whole race team there worked tirelessly over the last few years and there's loads of examples
[46:28.760 -> 46:32.360] of people in the factory that have never really had a car that's going to see the
[46:32.360 -> 46:36.920] success that they're going to see this year. So I'm really happy for them and
[46:36.920 -> 46:40.760] it was really lovely being there in Jeddah with Sky because you could speak
[46:40.760 -> 46:43.560] to everyone, it was like first day back at school, you caught up with everyone in
[46:43.560 -> 46:49.500] the pit lane. So yeah, those guys are going to have a really good year and I'm really excited to see where it goes.
[46:49.500 -> 46:54.500] I'm really happy for Lance and Lawrence, the work they've put in to get that team where it is.
[46:54.500 -> 47:00.000] And Lance is really driving it with Alonso, so I think it's going to be a really good year for them.
[47:00.000 -> 47:03.000] We're excited to see where they can bring it.
[47:03.000 -> 47:06.680] Could you feel that last year, as you were leaving the team you could you feel that last year you know when as you as you were leaving the team could you
[47:06.680 -> 47:10.600] feel that the big things and good things were coming? I think that you've had so
[47:10.600 -> 47:16.760] many years of hoping the next year is going to be the next big thing and we've
[47:16.760 -> 47:19.440] don't get me wrong we've had years of the cars been pretty good it's been the
[47:19.440 -> 47:23.400] fourth fastest car whatever I didn't really when I left in the shutdown get
[47:23.400 -> 47:25.720] the sense that that was going to, get the sense that it was
[47:25.720 -> 47:27.840] going to be the massive step that it was.
[47:27.840 -> 47:31.640] And you know, maybe others didn't too, there's been a lot of talk of, you know, if Val would
[47:31.640 -> 47:36.880] have done the same thing as well, but I didn't, I don't think the team even were really sure
[47:36.880 -> 47:38.600] that it was going to be the massive step.
[47:38.600 -> 47:41.480] And that's the problem with F1, you do all of this development, but you don't know what
[47:41.480 -> 47:43.700] the others are bringing to the fore as well.
[47:43.700 -> 47:49.720] So I wasn't, obviously the new factory, the new wind tunnel, I could see, it was clear
[47:49.720 -> 47:55.200] that in a few years time the team would be very good. I just didn't think it would be
[47:55.200 -> 47:59.200] this year. But I don't think that would have changed my decisions because my reasons for
[47:59.200 -> 48:03.720] leaving weren't because the car wasn't doing good and weren't because I didn't love the
[48:03.720 -> 48:06.440] team, I did truly love working with the team.
[48:06.440 -> 48:09.640] So it's still the calendar, the work-life balance,
[48:09.640 -> 48:10.480] that wasn't gonna change.
[48:10.480 -> 48:12.560] And yes, for sure, it's easier to stick it out
[48:12.560 -> 48:15.280] when you're on the podium every weekend.
[48:15.280 -> 48:17.320] So yeah, I'm really happy for those guys.
[48:17.320 -> 48:18.760] Yeah, yeah.
[48:18.760 -> 48:20.520] We move on to Baku next,
[48:20.520 -> 48:22.920] where you're gonna be with us with SkyF1.
[48:22.920 -> 48:25.400] Was that a race you looked forward to as an engineer?
[48:25.400 -> 48:27.380] Well, yeah, for several reasons.
[48:28.400 -> 48:30.440] Force India always did reasonably well in Baku,
[48:30.440 -> 48:31.280] so we had a number of podiums there,
[48:31.280 -> 48:33.480] so it was always a very happy hunting ground.
[48:34.580 -> 48:36.800] I really enjoy the city.
[48:36.800 -> 48:38.840] I enjoy the street circuit.
[48:38.840 -> 48:40.200] It's really interesting dynamic
[48:40.200 -> 48:41.960] of the old time of the castle
[48:41.960 -> 48:44.080] and then the big long streets at the end.
[48:44.080 -> 48:45.760] So narrow at points around the castle section.
[48:45.760 -> 48:51.520] Yeah, exactly. It was one that was a new event, you know, in recent years. So there was always
[48:51.520 -> 48:54.960] somewhere interesting to go in the city or somewhere, you know, a very interesting culture
[48:54.960 -> 49:01.920] there as well. I love races, it's a very selfish engineering point of view, but I love races
[49:01.920 -> 49:05.080] where you can walk in and out to the track, because you can have this
[49:05.080 -> 49:07.520] sort of moment of calmness walking in and out
[49:07.520 -> 49:09.920] on your own time, at your own speed.
[49:09.920 -> 49:13.240] You get a feel for the wind conditions, the ambience,
[49:13.240 -> 49:16.400] all these things around you, so I did really enjoy it
[49:16.400 -> 49:19.480] often as an event, so I thought it was really lovely city.
[49:19.480 -> 49:20.720] Well, Benny, thank you very much for your time.
[49:20.720 -> 49:22.040] Really appreciate it.
[49:22.040 -> 49:24.440] We've got Gunter Steiner joining us on next week's podcast,
[49:24.440 -> 49:26.420] so if you haven't seen the post on Twitter get your
[49:26.420 -> 49:31.720] questions in for him, he'll be joining us but until then bye for now.