'The Red Bull junior team is not successful anymore' | Alguersuari on why de Vries was sacked by AlphaTauri?

Matt Baker is joined by former Toro Rosso driver Jaime Alguersuari for our latest pod.

They discuss the Red Bull junior programme and how it is not as successful as it used to be at promoting drivers to the senior team.

They review Nyck de Vries’ sacking from AlphaTauri and why his results against teammate Yuki Tsunoda left him in a vulnerable position.

Jaime also speaks about Max Verstappen’s special talent and how his education from karting days has led to his domination at Red Bull.

**Overview of the Podcast**

- Matt Baker and former Toro Rosso driver Jaime Alguersuari discuss the Red Bull junior program and its diminished success in promoting drivers to the senior team.
- They analyze Nyck de Vries' dismissal from AlphaTauri and the impact of his results against teammate Yuki Tsunoda.
- Alguersuari highlights Max Verstappen's exceptional talent and how his karting background has contributed to his dominance at Red Bull.

**Red Bull Junior Program**

- Alguersuari joined the Red Bull Junior Program at 14 years old after impressing Helmut Marko in a driver selection event.
- He emphasizes the strict and demanding nature of the program, which aims to identify and develop future champions.
- Alguersuari acknowledges that the program's approach can be unfair at times, but he respects its goal of delivering results.

**Nyck de Vries' Dismissal from AlphaTauri**

- Alguersuari believes that de Vries' lack of improvement and growth throughout his 10 races with AlphaTauri justified his dismissal.
- He stresses the importance of beating one's teammate and delivering results, especially in a car that is not expected to perform well.
- Alguersuari also acknowledges the pressure on AlphaTauri to find drivers who can challenge for wins and contribute to the team's success.

**Max Verstappen's Dominance**

- Alguersuari praises Verstappen's extraordinary talent and his ability to maximize the performance of his car.
- He credits Verstappen's karting background for developing his exceptional car control and racecraft.
- Alguersuari believes that Verstappen's dominance is a result of his natural ability, hard work, and the support of a strong team.

**Red Bull's Junior Program and Its Recent Struggles**

- Alguersuari observes that Red Bull's junior program is no longer as successful as it once was in promoting drivers to the senior team.
- He points out that Sergio Perez, a driver from outside the program, is currently partnering Verstappen at Red Bull Racing.
- Alguersuari suggests that Red Bull's focus on short-term results and its strict approach to driver development may have contributed to this decline.

**Alguersuari's Reflections on His Time with Red Bull**

- Alguersuari admits that he did not enjoy his time in the Red Bull junior program due to the intense pressure and the lack of opportunities for advancement.
- He believes that he was unfairly dropped from Toro Rosso at the end of the 2011 season despite delivering strong results.
- Alguersuari expresses regret for not signing with Lotus when he had the chance, a decision that could have potentially extended his Formula One career.

**Alguersuari's Transition to Music**

- After leaving Formula One, Alguersuari pursued a successful career in music as a DJ and producer.
- He credits his passion for music and his desire to express himself creatively as the driving forces behind his transition.
- Alguersuari emphasizes the importance of following one's passions and finding fulfillment outside of traditional career paths.

<b>Podcast Episode Summary:</b>

**Jaime Alguersuari, a former Toro Rosso driver, joins Matt Baker to discuss various topics related to Formula One racing.**

<b>Red Bull Junior Program:</b>

- The Red Bull junior program is not as successful as it used to be in promoting drivers to the senior team.
- Nyck de Vries was sacked from AlphaTauri due to his results against teammate Yuki Tsunoda, leaving him in a vulnerable position.

<b>Max Verstappen's Talent:</b>

- Max Verstappen possesses a special talent that sets him apart from other drivers.
- Verstappen's rigorous preparation and education in karting have contributed to his dominance at Red Bull.

<b>Ferrari's Struggles:</b>

- Ferrari's lack of success is attributed to a lack of structure and the right mentality within the team.
- The team needs to improve its human dynamics and align its efforts to achieve a winning mentality.
- Carlos Sainz is a talented driver but needs a better team structure to reach his full potential.

<b>Red Bull's Dominance:</b>

- Red Bull's success stems from their focus on winning and their relentless pursuit of improvement.
- The team's mechanics are known for their efficiency, as evidenced by their fast pit stops.
- Max Verstappen's exceptional talent and preparation have made him nearly unbeatable.

<b>Jaime Alguersuari's Transition to Music:</b>

- After retiring from Formula One, Alguersuari pursued a career in music.
- His passion for music started in Ibiza, where he was exposed to electronic music and DJing.
- Alguersuari enjoys the creative freedom and self-expression that music offers.

<b>Formula One's Evolution:</b>

- Formula One has undergone a transformation in recent years, becoming more entertaining and accessible.
- The Netflix series and upcoming film have contributed to the sport's growing popularity.
- The incorporation of elements like driver intros and music-based events has enhanced the fan experience.

<b>Alguersuari's Current Life:</b>

- Alguersuari now focuses on his music career as a DJ and producer.
- He runs a record label called Anims, which releases music from various artists worldwide.
- Alguersuari enjoys the creative process and the challenge of finding unique and engaging music.

<b>Conclusion:</b>

Jaime Alguersuari's journey from Formula One driver to successful DJ showcases his versatility and passion for different pursuits. The podcast provides insights into the challenges faced by drivers in the Red Bull junior program, the reasons behind Ferrari's struggles, and the factors contributing to Red Bull's dominance in Formula One. Alguersuari's transition to music highlights the diverse career paths that athletes can take after their sporting careers.

[00:00.000 -> 00:08.880] Hello, everyone. Welcome to this week's episode of the Sky Sports F1 podcast with me, Matt
[00:08.880 -> 00:13.040] Baker. And this week I'm joined by a guy who's had a fascinating career in Formula One at
[00:13.040 -> 00:18.680] Toro Rosso and is now a hugely successful DJ and music producer. Please welcome Jaime
[00:18.680 -> 00:21.800] Alguersuari. Jaime, how are you?
[00:21.800 -> 00:23.880] I'm very good, thanks.
[00:23.880 -> 00:26.120] Very good. Where are you joining us from?
[00:26.120 -> 00:27.120] I'm in Barcelona.
[00:27.120 -> 00:31.120] This is my home place and where I was born.
[00:31.120 -> 00:33.560] And yeah, very happy to be living here.
[00:33.560 -> 00:40.520] You know, it's an excellent city, full of sunshine and good food and nice people.
[00:40.520 -> 00:41.520] Yeah.
[00:41.520 -> 00:42.520] Sounds fantastic.
[00:42.520 -> 00:46.920] Jaime, there's so much I want to talk to you about. So I'm just
[00:46.920 -> 00:49.280] going to try and give our listeners a bit of an overview of what we're going to talk
[00:49.280 -> 00:53.600] about in the discussion. So I want to get into your career, your Formula One career,
[00:53.600 -> 00:56.840] time with the Red Bull family. And I think there's just some interesting conversations
[00:56.840 -> 01:00.960] to have around what's happening at AlphaTauri or Toro Rosso, your former team with Nick
[01:00.960 -> 01:04.200] de Vries being replaced by Daniel Ricciardo at the moment. So I want to get your thoughts
[01:04.200 -> 01:08.040] on that. I want to also talk about junior programs in Formula One, your
[01:08.040 -> 01:11.960] thoughts on if they work or not, and if there's still a place for them in Formula One. And
[01:11.960 -> 01:15.280] also, we have to talk about your music career as well, because, yeah, I was listening to
[01:15.280 -> 01:19.160] some of your tracks before we start the interview, and I was really, really good, really enjoying
[01:19.160 -> 01:27.120] them. So yeah, we'll get into those as well. But Jaime, take us back to the start of your career and how did the
[01:27.120 -> 01:31.040] relationship with Red Bull come about? Where were you and who approached who?
[01:32.800 -> 01:41.120] Well, it's actually interesting. You know, what happened was that I was in my last year of
[01:41.120 -> 01:50.680] karting. I did this contract. it was actually my first contract with this karting manufacturer called Intrepid in Italy so I was only
[01:50.680 -> 01:58.040] 14 years old and I was racing ICA category international category of
[01:58.040 -> 02:02.920] karting it went really well I won a couple of championships and came vice
[02:02.920 -> 02:10.080] world champion and basically well I here in my family, we never thought about Formula 1 or being a racing driver.
[02:10.080 -> 02:14.960] We just... I was just doing my thing in karting like many other drivers, you know, if you ask
[02:15.440 -> 02:17.440] like Alonso and all these guys,
[02:18.000 -> 02:24.080] they never thought of becoming Formula 1 drivers. They were just professionals at what they did and it was
[02:24.560 -> 02:25.600] karting by then.
[02:26.160 -> 02:28.600] And this is where we all came from, you know?
[02:29.320 -> 02:32.440] So, you know, my heroes were all these...
[02:32.800 -> 02:35.160] Alessandro Manetti, David de Fauré,
[02:35.440 -> 02:37.680] all these guys that they had, like, long careers
[02:37.760 -> 02:39.680] and very successful careers in karting.
[02:40.120 -> 02:42.440] But at some point, you know, I received this phone call
[02:42.520 -> 02:44.000] from this...
[02:44.080 -> 02:46.160] Danny Sullivan and Helmut Marko.
[02:46.160 -> 02:49.360] They were doing this Red Bull Junior selection,
[02:50.200 -> 02:54.960] the driver selection in Portugal, in Estoril in 2005.
[02:55.600 -> 03:00.200] And basically they were doing this 45, 50 driver selection
[03:01.320 -> 03:04.920] and they were selecting like four or five drivers out of 50.
[03:05.040 -> 03:05.960] And it was like a test of two days. and they were selecting like four or five drivers out of 50 and
[03:08.160 -> 03:08.840] It was like a test of two days
[03:13.100 -> 03:13.480] And the test was very simple you had to do like five or six laps with one car
[03:16.880 -> 03:17.280] Then you put new tires without knowing the track and anything
[03:21.120 -> 03:24.040] So, you know, they didn't have much time that they had to test every single driver so there was like very little testing time for every driver and
[03:28.800 -> 03:40.240] I guess by the end of the day, they were selecting all these five drivers. It was like a kind of a master chef kind of casting thing. The test went really well. I topped the times
[03:40.240 -> 03:46.640] before putting new tires so I put new tires and then I went even quicker
[03:46.640 -> 03:50.460] and they, you know, Helmut already like
[03:50.460 -> 03:53.280] wanted me to sign the contract of the, you know,
[03:53.280 -> 03:54.640] getting in the junior team.
[03:54.640 -> 03:56.800] I wasn't really aware of what happened at that time.
[03:56.800 -> 03:58.200] You know, I was like too young.
[03:58.200 -> 04:00.720] It was just like, I didn't even understand
[04:00.720 -> 04:02.000] what was going on.
[04:02.000 -> 04:06.400] And then, yeah, I started to drive for them and started
[04:06.400 -> 04:08.680] my single-seater career, basically.
[04:08.680 -> 04:12.840] What were your first impressions of the likes of Helmut Marker and Christian Horner once
[04:12.840 -> 04:18.000] you got into that Red Bull family? Were they welcoming? What were the first impressions?
[04:18.000 -> 04:26.840] I actually didn't know Christian since Formula One, and I actually didn't really have a very extended long relation
[04:26.840 -> 04:31.680] with Christian Horner to be honest. Everything was managed by Helmut,
[04:31.680 -> 04:36.480] everything was going through Helmut and all the phone calls were coming from Helmut.
[04:36.480 -> 04:43.200] So I had a good relation with Dr. Marco even though many people don't think about it.
[04:43.200 -> 04:47.280] He's the policeman of the junior team, but it's his job.
[04:47.280 -> 04:51.840] I mean, the junior team program is a very strict
[04:51.840 -> 04:55.280] and very demanding program, but it has to be, you know,
[04:55.280 -> 04:57.120] they pay for your career.
[04:57.120 -> 04:59.520] They have been sponsoring,
[04:59.520 -> 05:02.120] like they sponsored many, many drivers.
[05:02.120 -> 05:05.000] Like if you guys study and make a list
[05:05.000 -> 05:08.240] of how many drivers they sponsor, you would be surprised.
[05:08.240 -> 05:11.800] It's a huge amount of money they have invested in drivers.
[05:11.800 -> 05:13.720] And of course, you know, if you have more drivers
[05:13.720 -> 05:16.760] to sponsor, to test, and to try,
[05:16.760 -> 05:19.880] you get very good drivers out of them,
[05:19.880 -> 05:22.280] you know, like champions, like really,
[05:22.280 -> 05:24.800] really amazing drivers.
[05:24.800 -> 05:29.600] The way they act and the way they sometimes is not fair, but it's the way it is.
[05:30.400 -> 05:34.360] Sometimes it's not like in my opinion on how they
[05:36.080 -> 05:40.360] what they did for for me with with me, with Buemi,
[05:40.840 -> 05:43.760] is not like really a sporting,
[05:44.480 -> 05:49.000] say, a very generous sporting manner
[05:49.000 -> 05:53.000] to get rid of two drivers because it was not decided on results,
[05:53.000 -> 05:58.000] it was decided on other things like commercial and political,
[05:58.000 -> 06:02.000] interesting, you know, things.
[06:02.000 -> 06:07.000] But that's the way Formula 1 sometimes works and you have to accept it, you know,
[06:07.000 -> 06:15.800] you are part of it. But I had a good time with them and I enjoyed every single moment,
[06:15.800 -> 06:20.600] even the pressure moments were fine because if you cannot deal with that pressure, you
[06:20.600 -> 06:26.520] cannot deal with the moment that you have a winning car and you are about to become world champion or you have to deliver
[06:26.520 -> 06:30.220] You know, so, you know, I agree with the way they work
[06:30.220 -> 06:36.860] I just don't agree with how sometimes they apply things to some drivers, but just
[06:37.940 -> 06:40.840] to to get things, you know to
[06:41.380 -> 06:46.840] To be very very sure of what we say is that if you don't if you don't if you don't
[06:47.480 -> 06:48.560] deliver
[06:48.560 -> 06:50.560] results if you don't
[06:51.000 -> 06:54.160] If you are not in the right performance or where you should be
[06:54.920 -> 06:56.920] they have the right to get you out because
[06:57.480 -> 07:00.280] You know, they are asking you for the best
[07:00.360 -> 07:05.040] So do you think that reflects I mean what you just say there kind of does reflect Formula
[07:05.040 -> 07:09.360] One in general, doesn't it? Ultimately, there's only 20 drivers. There's only well, I mean,
[07:09.360 -> 07:15.360] 24 races is quite a few races per season, but you don't get many opportunities in Formula One to
[07:15.360 -> 07:19.040] prove yourself. I guess it's a good opportunity to talk maybe a little bit about what happened
[07:19.040 -> 07:24.640] to Nick de Vries. And he only had 10 races in the Alpha Tauri. And we must also remember,
[07:24.640 -> 07:26.600] this is not the fastest car on the grid.
[07:26.600 -> 07:28.600] This is one of the slowest cars on the grid.
[07:28.600 -> 07:32.200] It is true, but you have to see a line of improvement.
[07:32.200 -> 07:38.000] If there is no line of improvement, they have the right to get rid of you.
[07:38.000 -> 07:45.840] You have to show at least, I mean, he had very little races to show his total performance.
[07:45.920 -> 07:48.080] I'm sure there was much more coming from Nick.
[07:49.680 -> 07:54.560] But if there was no line of no growth of performance
[07:54.640 -> 07:57.200] from the first race to the last race,
[07:58.120 -> 07:59.600] they have the right to do that.
[07:59.880 -> 08:01.040] At the end of the day, listen,
[08:01.120 -> 08:03.080] Formula 1 is about killing your teammate.
[08:03.680 -> 08:06.400] You know, he has the same tools as you.
[08:06.840 -> 08:11.440] And my whole goal when I was in Toro Rosso,
[08:11.520 -> 08:13.880] and I can, of course, tell you my example,
[08:14.080 -> 08:15.280] because that's where I lived,
[08:15.640 -> 08:17.280] it was about beating my teammate.
[08:17.760 -> 08:20.680] Making sure I was ending the season
[08:20.760 -> 08:23.800] with more points on the scoreboard than him.
[08:24.320 -> 08:27.680] That was the only way I could provide money to my team.
[08:28.240 -> 08:31.760] You know, so money means delivering results.
[08:32.640 -> 08:34.640] When you beat your teammate, you have the right to stay.
[08:35.640 -> 08:37.600] You cannot compare against anyone.
[08:37.600 -> 08:41.080] You know, they were asking us to win races in Formula One, and we were not
[08:41.120 -> 08:47.240] able to beat Mercedes at that time with Schumacher and Rosberg or
[08:47.240 -> 08:51.880] Lotus or Renault or Force India. They had much more budget than us and they were teams
[08:51.880 -> 08:56.640] more developed than Toroso. It was only the second year of the car. So, you know, asking
[08:56.640 -> 09:03.280] for miracles is not possible, but asking to deliver the maximum out of it, it is possible.
[09:03.280 -> 09:05.920] So if you beat your teammate and you're doing well
[09:05.920 -> 09:12.400] and you're putting the car in the points when it's not a car where it's supposed to be in the
[09:12.400 -> 09:17.120] points, then you're delivering, you're doing a good job, you know what I mean? Yeah, absolutely.
[09:17.120 -> 09:22.560] Well, just to compare a couple of, you know, for example, Yuki Tsunoda at the moment, you know,
[09:22.560 -> 09:25.680] you in your final season before you were let go by Toro Rosso
[09:25.680 -> 09:30.560] You got seven top tens, which was which was a good season and Yuki at the moment
[09:30.560 -> 09:34.600] He's got two tenth place finishes. We're halfway through the Formula One season
[09:34.600 -> 09:42.040] So do you maybe perhaps see that the Red Bull or the Red Bull program as it were has maybe got a bit more lenient on drivers?
[09:42.040 -> 09:46.680] Do you think that maybe looking back that was that was obviously very harsh with what happened with with yourself
[09:47.160 -> 09:50.480] But where do you see that example with Sonoda sitting?
[09:51.120 -> 09:58.860] For me right now, and I'm gonna be very clear with you the fact that Checo Perez is driving for the Red Bull Racing team
[09:59.440 -> 10:01.000] is
[10:01.000 -> 10:04.500] Quite clear that the Red Bull Junior team is not any more successful
[10:03.340 -> 10:04.820] is quite clear that the Red Bull Junior team is not any more successful.
[10:05.760 -> 10:07.960] Because the whole idea, and that's what they told us,
[10:07.960 -> 10:10.120] and that's what they told to the media and everyone,
[10:10.120 -> 10:13.700] is that we're building up champions,
[10:13.700 -> 10:16.060] or we're building up the best drivers we can,
[10:16.060 -> 10:18.860] and give them an opportunity to drive for Toroso,
[10:18.860 -> 10:23.860] nowadays Alfa Tauri, in order that they get experience
[10:23.860 -> 10:29.560] in Formula One, so we can upgrade them to the bigger team,
[10:29.560 -> 10:30.840] which is Red Bull Racing.
[10:30.840 -> 10:33.840] The fact that they had to go somewhere else
[10:33.840 -> 10:38.840] to find a driver to be driving for them at Red Bull Racing
[10:39.400 -> 10:43.200] is already, you know, a controversy.
[10:43.200 -> 10:50.880] It doesn't make sense, you know what I mean? So you're spending millions for many many years like and I'm telling you like a lot of money
[10:50.880 -> 10:56.480] Yeah, huge amount of money for many drivers to become champions at junior categories
[10:57.000 -> 11:00.840] To then put them into Formula One give them a very little chance
[11:02.160 -> 11:07.600] Crossing the fingers that they get a good car because otherwise you do nothing in Formula One if you don't have a good car, you're in
[11:07.600 -> 11:12.000] the back and you can show nothing but winning your teammates and then crossing
[11:12.000 -> 11:14.760] the fingers that you get a chance to drive for a winning car which is the
[11:14.760 -> 11:18.560] Red Bull Racing Team. Just by the fact that they are going somewhere else to
[11:18.560 -> 11:22.880] find and my huge respect to Techo you know I've raced with him in Formula
[11:22.880 -> 11:25.160] Three in other racing series, so I know
[11:25.160 -> 11:29.580] him really, really well and I know the job that he has now. It's a very difficult job
[11:29.580 -> 11:36.320] because Max is an extraordinary driver, probably the best driver in the world right now. He
[11:36.320 -> 11:41.560] knows the team, the car, and Checo is struggling big time and I know there's much more to come
[11:41.560 -> 11:46.360] from him, but we have to be very clear, you know, like, Teuku was never in the junior team.
[11:46.520 -> 11:53.640] And if he was, considering how Helmut Marco judges drivers,
[11:53.800 -> 11:55.560] he would have not lasted a year.
[11:55.720 -> 11:58.400] He would have given him a second chance in GP2,
[11:58.560 -> 12:02.080] he would have not given him a second chance in British Formula 3.
[12:02.240 -> 12:03.760] Like, we know these things, you know.
[12:03.920 -> 12:05.200] I know nowadays there's a lot of new fans to Formula 1, like we know these things, you know. I know
[12:05.200 -> 12:09.440] nowadays there's a lot of new fans to Formula 1 but they have to understand the history
[12:09.440 -> 12:14.480] about where they come from and how the Red Bull Junior team works, you know what I mean?
[12:14.480 -> 12:19.520] Yeah, well to build on your point there, the fact that Liam Lawson, for example, one of
[12:19.520 -> 12:24.040] the Red Bull Junior drivers was overlooked for the seat that Ricciardo has now eventually,
[12:24.040 -> 12:29.080] obviously Ricciardo's got, but Ricciardo's 34. You know, no disrespect to him, he's 34. Liam Norson
[12:29.080 -> 12:34.400] is 21. So you would argue that, you know, if you're not going to put Liam in there,
[12:34.400 -> 12:39.840] then yeah, perhaps your theory that it's not a system that's necessarily working very well
[12:39.840 -> 12:45.520] is correct, because surely you'd want to put youth to develop them in Alpha Tauri and then bring
[12:45.520 -> 12:47.060] them into the Red Bull team.
[12:47.060 -> 12:51.980] That's the thing that is sometimes surprising and I'm actually thinking, well, who's taking
[12:51.980 -> 12:57.860] decisions there? Is it Helmut really? Is it Helmut with Christian? Is it somebody else
[12:57.860 -> 13:06.800] behind and acting like a board of interest and considering who is the best to put at that time or, and playing with,
[13:06.800 -> 13:13.600] with that. I've, I've no idea. Listen, when Helmut called me, I was in the, I was doing
[13:13.600 -> 13:21.860] the test for the European KZ championship in Germany. It was 2009. He called me one
[13:21.860 -> 13:27.040] week and a half before the Hungary the Hungarian Grand Prix of 2009.
[13:27.040 -> 13:32.600] He said, OK, you will drive next week and you're going to be our official driver.
[13:32.600 -> 13:33.720] I was 19 years old.
[13:33.720 -> 13:35.720] I never tested a Formula One car before.
[13:35.720 -> 13:41.200] And I was like, OK, how am I going to deal and how am I going to cope with a two-hour
[13:41.200 -> 13:49.160] race in a car that I've never driven? So this is going to be like going to the cemetery, you know, already.
[13:49.640 -> 13:53.160] Uh, I have very little tools to defend myself.
[13:53.160 -> 13:54.320] You know, it's going to be really hard.
[13:54.840 -> 13:58.280] They had to make sure they were putting, you know, like the
[13:58.280 -> 13:59.720] youngest ever driver in there.
[14:00.040 -> 14:02.320] So it was, it was very difficult for me that year.
[14:02.320 -> 14:05.440] It was, I suffered a lot, but they took that decision, you know,
[14:05.440 -> 14:06.600] and I could cope with that.
[14:06.760 -> 14:11.800] There was a, I believe, like a little grow line, you know, like, like
[14:11.820 -> 14:15.400] developing line from results and I was delivering a little bit better.
[14:15.400 -> 14:18.560] And then the year after, the following year was definitely much better.
[14:18.560 -> 14:21.040] And obviously 2011 was my best season.
[14:22.320 -> 14:28.000] But yeah, sometimes they just make things that don't make sense, you know, and
[14:28.000 -> 14:34.560] they take decisions without really a strategy behind. But it's what it is, you know, and
[14:35.840 -> 14:42.320] yeah, it's like that. Well, 2009 at the Hungaroring, it's kind of funny that we're
[14:42.320 -> 14:45.000] talking to you, the week of the Hungarian Grand Prix,
[14:45.000 -> 14:48.000] the week that Daniel Ricciardo comes into Alfa Tauri,
[14:48.000 -> 14:50.000] your former team, halfway through the season.
[14:50.000 -> 14:52.000] What were the challenges of coming?
[14:52.000 -> 14:55.000] I mean, obviously, I appreciate you hadn't driven a Formula 1 car before,
[14:55.000 -> 14:58.000] as you just said, but what do you think your challenges were
[14:58.000 -> 15:00.000] coming in mid-season to a team?
[15:00.000 -> 15:03.000] I just wanted to finish the race.
[15:03.000 -> 15:06.960] Yeah, that was the main goal. We already talked about it
[15:06.960 -> 15:11.680] before. I was not looking for performance, I was just trying to be as consistent as possible
[15:11.680 -> 15:16.640] through the weekend, learning especially the tires, different compounds. It was the first time
[15:16.640 -> 15:28.760] in my life that I was using different compounds. Before going to Formula 1, you only drive one type of tyre and you're only used to drive
[15:28.760 -> 15:35.880] this tyre. So for me it was all about gaining experience through the weekend and making
[15:35.880 -> 15:50.960] sure that I was doing all the laps possible and learning of how a Formula One weekend looked like with my team, mechanics, different engineers, so much data. Formula One is so much different to other
[15:50.960 -> 15:57.020] racing series, huge difference. And when you look at the job Daniel's now got to do
[15:57.020 -> 16:01.480] obviously he's you know he's very experienced but what would you deem a
[16:01.480 -> 16:06.800] successful second half of the season for Daniel Ricciardo right now at Alfa Tauri?
[16:06.800 -> 16:09.600] The thing is that the car doesn't look very quick.
[16:09.600 -> 16:15.200] So, you know, performance of the car is probably 80% of the final result,
[16:15.200 -> 16:19.800] unless it rains and, you know, things happen during the race.
[16:19.800 -> 16:23.800] But it looks like Alfa Tauri are struggling with aerodynamics.
[16:23.800 -> 16:26.520] It has always been the main element in Formula 1.
[16:26.600 -> 16:30.200] Nowadays, the modern Formula 1, it's all about finding performance
[16:30.280 -> 16:34.240] on aero downforce, efficient downforce.
[16:35.640 -> 16:38.760] And it looks like AlphaTauri are struggling with that.
[16:39.320 -> 16:44.520] And you can see Yuki's performance,
[16:44.600 -> 16:46.240] how it was last year and how it is now
[16:46.440 -> 16:52.880] It is true that all the teams have been developing very well and have you know been doing the step forward and they've moved forward
[16:53.720 -> 16:58.520] So it's gonna be difficult for Daniel now because I'm sure it's
[16:59.280 -> 17:03.560] The car is gonna feel quite, you know similar to what he has in his head
[17:03.560 -> 17:05.040] Of course, because it's a Formula
[17:05.040 -> 17:12.580] 1, modern Formula 1 where he has a lot of experience. So we will have to see a closer
[17:12.580 -> 17:21.920] battle between Juki and Daniel on what's remaining of the year, I believe. That's what Red Bull
[17:21.920 -> 17:27.120] expects from Daniel. Yeah. Were you surprised when he took that job?
[17:27.120 -> 17:34.520] No, not really. I mean, I think Red Bull loves Daniel. I think Christian loves Daniel. All
[17:34.520 -> 17:41.360] in all, you know, Daniel is a nice guy. He's a fun guy. He's a professional driver. He's
[17:41.360 -> 17:50.000] definitely, he knows how to deal with all the things, you know, and he's a very intelligent guy, smart guy.
[17:50.000 -> 17:52.000] And also he's a quick driver.
[17:52.000 -> 17:55.000] I don't know what happened in McLaren.
[17:55.000 -> 18:05.640] I think we've seen the very best of Daniel, you know, like he, when he was in Toro Rosso at the time,
[18:05.640 -> 18:13.240] he did two years in Toro Rosso. I think he did a good job. He didn't beat us like me
[18:13.240 -> 18:22.800] and Buemi on points, but for some reason he was upgraded to Red Bull Racing. When he was
[18:22.800 -> 18:27.280] upgraded to Red Bull Racing, he beat Sebastian and he came third in the world
[18:27.280 -> 18:32.800] championship. So that's some big numbers out there and he didn't have a winning car, you know,
[18:32.800 -> 18:39.280] at that time Mercedes had it. So he's a winning driver, you know, he drove for a winning car
[18:39.840 -> 18:46.400] and he did some amazing results. So I think he's definitely a very good driver. We have to see what's happening
[18:46.400 -> 18:48.640] on his second chance to Formula One.
[18:49.480 -> 18:53.200] But I think he has a new challenge and he's well-prepared.
[18:54.200 -> 18:58.440] He's looking forward for this new challenge, yeah.
[18:58.440 -> 19:00.160] Yeah, you mentioned earlier, obviously,
[19:00.160 -> 19:03.520] that you know Sergio well, that you've raced against him.
[19:03.520 -> 19:09.360] Do you think that bringing Daniel in has now put more pressure on Sergio in that second Red Bull
[19:09.360 -> 19:14.480] seat? Do you think ultimately the goal for Daniel is to move from Alpha Tauri to the second Red Bull
[19:14.480 -> 19:20.640] seat to partner Max? It could happen. I mean, I think Checo has to focus on being closer to Max.
[19:21.200 -> 19:24.000] Listen, I'm going to say something. It's very simple. And I don't want to,
[19:25.600 -> 19:30.640] closer to max. Listen, I'm going to say something, it's very simple and I don't want to, I wouldn't like that anyone feels offended. You know, Checo is a good friend of mine and I wish
[19:30.640 -> 19:37.040] him the very best, but you cannot really accept to be half a second off your teammate. Even
[19:37.040 -> 19:42.280] if it's God coming to the best winning car, I know how it works, you know, it's Formula
[19:42.280 -> 19:45.200] 1. You have a winning car, you have to use it.
[19:49.200 -> 19:53.680] You know, and I know many people would think like, oh, who are you, what are you saying? Like, you've, your best place was a seventh place, like, where are you coming from? You know, I didn't have
[19:53.680 -> 20:01.760] a chance to drive a winning car, but I'm just saying, listen, your first, your first rival is
[20:01.760 -> 20:06.080] your teammate. When you have a winning car, you have to use it. You know, you have to go for it
[20:07.480 -> 20:08.520] so
[20:08.520 -> 20:12.720] It's not acceptable that you're always like half a second seven tenths slower
[20:12.720 -> 20:19.280] If your teammate is winning all the races race after race at least you have to be in the podium
[20:19.280 -> 20:23.800] You know, it's not like your best day. You're in the podium. No like you have to be closer to him
[20:24.000 -> 20:27.320] Otherwise they have it they have the right to replace you.
[20:27.320 -> 20:28.320] You know what I mean?
[20:28.320 -> 20:33.560] There are many drivers on the grid, many, many drivers that could be definitely much
[20:33.560 -> 20:36.520] closer to Max.
[20:36.520 -> 20:41.440] We can say, yeah, but Max doesn't want a driver who's close to him because he's the leading
[20:41.440 -> 20:43.100] driver whatsoever.
[20:43.100 -> 20:45.440] But I guess every single team wants to make sure
[20:45.440 -> 20:50.180] they have a balanced pair that can deliver results
[20:50.180 -> 20:51.100] and at the end of the day,
[20:51.100 -> 20:54.800] can win the World Constructors' Championship,
[20:54.800 -> 20:57.280] which means more money for the team.
[20:58.960 -> 21:00.820] The funny thing with Max, I think, at the moment,
[21:00.820 -> 21:01.860] is that by himself,
[21:01.860 -> 21:04.660] he could be leading the Constructors' Championship,
[21:04.660 -> 21:08.320] you know, with the amount of points he's amassed, he doesn't even need a second driver. And
[21:08.320 -> 21:10.960] that is such is the dominance that we're seeing from Max.
[21:10.960 -> 21:17.080] So, you know, maybe, maybe it doesn't happen next year. You know what I mean? Like the
[21:17.080 -> 21:23.480] dominance that Red Bull has now with Max, it might not last forever. You know what I
[21:23.480 -> 21:28.000] mean? Like you cannot, you cannot act in a way that thinking,
[21:28.000 -> 21:30.320] you know, when you were winning all the time,
[21:30.320 -> 21:35.160] there will be a time where you won't be that dominant.
[21:35.160 -> 21:36.800] You know, it happened to Ferrari,
[21:36.800 -> 21:40.760] it happened to Ross Braun with Braun GP,
[21:40.760 -> 21:44.080] it happened to Mercedes, like it doesn't last forever.
[21:44.080 -> 21:46.120] And there's one day that things change.
[21:46.120 -> 21:47.360] Formula One is about to change
[21:47.360 -> 21:48.940] in two, three years time, right?
[21:48.940 -> 21:51.600] So, you know, you cannot act like that.
[21:51.600 -> 21:54.280] You need two very good drivers.
[21:54.280 -> 21:56.460] That's how I would see it, you know.
[21:56.460 -> 21:58.920] Back to your own career and your time
[21:58.920 -> 21:59.760] with the Red Bull family.
[21:59.760 -> 22:01.460] I mean, how, looking back on it now,
[22:01.460 -> 22:04.520] how do you reflect your time in the junior programme
[22:04.520 -> 22:06.000] and then into your career?
[22:06.000 -> 22:09.500] Did you enjoy it? Was it a part of your life that you look back fondly?
[22:09.500 -> 22:28.500] No, I didn't enjoy it. Definitely. I didn't have the gift to enjoy it because I only had one chance, you know, if I was not winning at my first year on Formula 3 I was getting dropped off.
[22:29.320 -> 22:34.140] I only had one chance. For some reason, I don't know, maybe other drivers or chances, I didn't have one chance.
[22:34.140 -> 22:41.940] I wasn't the favorite. Favorite at that time was Brendan Hartley. He was the favorite driver in Red Bull.
[22:41.940 -> 22:47.000] I was very sure about that. When I won British Formula 3, things changed.
[22:47.000 -> 22:56.400] Then I was lucky that there was a free seat in Toro Rosso from Sébastien Bourdais.
[22:56.400 -> 23:01.400] They dropped him mid-season and they called me to replace him in the middle of the season,
[23:01.400 -> 23:04.400] which was completely crazy.
[23:04.400 -> 23:07.160] But I coped the best I could.
[23:07.360 -> 23:11.120] I finished the season, then 2010 looked a bit better.
[23:11.320 -> 23:14.840] I was definitely much happier and much prepared for Formula One.
[23:15.040 -> 23:16.840] And there was a growth.
[23:17.040 -> 23:23.320] You know, like we started being in the points in my second race of the season in Malaysia.
[23:23.520 -> 23:27.040] We scored a couple of points then and then 2011 was
[23:27.040 -> 23:32.880] very difficult, the first beginning of the season with new Pirelli tires and then the second half
[23:32.880 -> 23:39.760] was the best moment of my life and the biggest mistake was me not signing with Lotus and leaving
[23:39.760 -> 23:44.000] Red Bull but what are you going to expect? You're consistently beating your teammates,
[23:42.040 -> 23:45.240] Red Bull, but what are you gonna expect? Like you're consistently beating your teammates,
[23:45.240 -> 23:48.080] you're expecting to be upgraded to Red Bull,
[23:48.080 -> 23:51.320] you know, you're all the time consistently in the top 10,
[23:51.320 -> 23:54.020] knowing that your car is not able to be in the top 10.
[23:55.080 -> 23:57.800] So how are you gonna expect that they're gonna drop you
[23:57.800 -> 24:00.000] the 18th of December, you know,
[24:00.000 -> 24:04.360] in the last day of December, I already launched,
[24:04.360 -> 24:07.360] I already, you know, we did like this event in Madrid
[24:08.440 -> 24:10.720] for the media and the Spanish press
[24:11.960 -> 24:14.080] with a new car from 2012.
[24:14.080 -> 24:16.680] We had James Key as a main engineer.
[24:16.680 -> 24:18.880] So all the project was done.
[24:18.880 -> 24:21.980] One day after, they called me and they just dropped me
[24:21.980 -> 24:24.280] in a one minute phone call.
[24:24.280 -> 24:28.080] Extraordinary. Why this has happened
[24:28.080 -> 24:35.280] like one day after we launched the car? Who was that phone call with? How did that phone call go?
[24:35.280 -> 24:42.240] It was from Franz Tost. He was just a message, you know, he was just a messenger. This was coming
[24:42.240 -> 24:47.480] from the very top and I'm not even sayingmut Marko, it was just definitely coming from
[24:47.720 -> 24:51.040] somewhere else because I know Helmut would have not dropped me.
[24:51.960 -> 24:55.840] If there was someone to drop, there was like someone who lost the battle,
[24:55.960 -> 24:59.600] you know, from the teammates, because in Formula One, what we said, you know,
[24:59.600 -> 25:00.600] you have to beat your teammate.
[25:00.640 -> 25:03.280] You have to make more points than your teammate. Then in Red Bull,
[25:03.280 -> 25:05.440] at least you have something to defend yourself. And then they came with this story saying, yeah, you have to make more points than your teammate. Then in Red Bull, at least you have something
[25:05.440 -> 25:06.640] to defend yourself.
[25:06.640 -> 25:08.520] And then they came with this story saying,
[25:08.520 -> 25:11.920] yeah, we have dropped them because they are very good
[25:11.920 -> 25:13.560] drivers, but they are not winning drivers.
[25:13.560 -> 25:16.160] And I'm like, well, how do you know we're not winning
[25:16.160 -> 25:19.040] drivers if we've never had a winning car?
[25:19.040 -> 25:22.560] So everything was so strange and difficult.
[25:22.560 -> 25:25.520] And I know for real, it was not based on results.
[25:25.520 -> 25:29.840] Like shit no chance. We were beating teams that they had like doubled the amount of
[25:29.840 -> 25:37.240] money and I was very... I did my best with what we had. I was... I'm sleeping like
[25:37.240 -> 25:43.600] really really well at home because I know if we had a machine of going back like
[25:43.600 -> 25:46.320] we could have not definitely done any better.
[25:46.320 -> 25:49.840] We extract the maximum juice out of the car,
[25:49.840 -> 25:50.880] out of the team.
[25:50.880 -> 25:53.060] It was a very good human team
[25:53.060 -> 25:54.360] and they did really, really well.
[25:54.360 -> 25:59.040] So I was really, really proud of this 2011 season, honestly.
[25:59.040 -> 26:02.160] Do you ever think back and if things had gone differently,
[26:02.160 -> 26:03.960] if you had been kept on, you know,
[26:03.960 -> 26:09.080] obviously because that was the last time you raced in Formula One and then you've obviously gone on to have a successful career in music,
[26:09.080 -> 26:13.280] but do you ever look back and go, if you had have stayed on for that extra season,
[26:13.280 -> 26:16.920] then it had have been a very good season and maybe you might still be in Formula One now, you know.
[26:16.920 -> 26:18.920] Do you ever think like that?
[26:19.680 -> 26:27.000] I always thought on why didn't I take that contract that Eric Boullier was, you know, offered me in Abu Dhabi.
[26:27.000 -> 26:34.000] I only had that weekend to sign, so everything was like, why should I sign and go and leave my team?
[26:34.000 -> 26:42.000] Which is not just my team, you know, they were my family for six years, like Helmut believed in me in 2005, you know, in Portugal.
[26:42.000 -> 26:46.880] And we were together for so long. I was doing well in Formula 1 so I thought why would they drop me?
[26:46.880 -> 26:50.000] I'm doing good here, Red Bull Racing is a winning car,
[26:50.000 -> 26:53.040] they were winning the third title with Sebastian
[26:53.040 -> 26:56.720] and I thought well, I want to stay here, I'm doing well, I'm beating my
[26:56.720 -> 27:02.000] teammate, I'm on my peak time, peak moment of my racing career,
[27:02.000 -> 27:06.320] why would I leave? It's so risky. So sometimes I do regret why I
[27:06.320 -> 27:11.680] should have not, I shouldn't, I've signed with them, but it was a difficult call.
[27:14.560 -> 27:19.360] Yeah, just hearing you talk about that, I do get the impression with Red Bull,
[27:19.360 -> 27:24.720] certainly in those days, from your experience, they were pretty brutal, pretty cutthroat with
[27:24.720 -> 27:25.160] their young
[27:25.160 -> 27:30.140] drivers and would you agree with that? Would you agree that that was the kind of atmosphere
[27:30.140 -> 27:32.900] and culture within Red Bull at that time?
[27:32.900 -> 27:39.580] Yeah, they've never done this with anyone else. Like what they did to us, they've never
[27:39.580 -> 27:47.640] done this to anyone else and I think they would never do it again. We delivered, that's the thing, we delivered.
[27:47.640 -> 27:52.800] We delivered points, we delivered the best out of it.
[27:52.800 -> 27:57.280] They have the right to drop any single driver when they don't deliver, when they are not
[27:57.280 -> 28:02.300] in the point, when they don't deliver results, even if the car is not good, but you're being
[28:02.300 -> 28:10.320] beaten consistently by your teammate, they have right because they have they have the you know the reason they have the
[28:10.320 -> 28:15.480] right reason so that's what I'm saying with Nick they have a reason there's no
[28:15.480 -> 28:19.920] line of improvement there's no growth between the first race and the tenth
[28:19.920 -> 28:26.400] race they have the right to drop you off that's's how Red Bull works. And it's fair.
[28:26.400 -> 28:29.600] They have been paying for your career since you were a kid, or at least for me.
[28:30.480 -> 28:37.040] But what I don't understand is what when you deliver results, when you're being better than
[28:37.040 -> 28:42.960] your teammate, when you're beating world champions, when you're beating teams that are bigger than
[28:42.960 -> 28:47.200] your team, and they have double as budget as your team,
[28:47.200 -> 28:49.200] and then they drop you off.
[28:49.200 -> 28:51.200] Just because they say they're not winning drivers.
[28:51.200 -> 28:53.200] Well, what on earth?
[28:53.200 -> 28:54.200] Why?
[28:54.200 -> 28:56.200] You know, based on what?
[28:56.200 -> 28:58.200] You know what I mean?
[28:58.200 -> 29:01.200] Like, give me the chance of driving a winning car
[29:01.200 -> 29:07.560] and then you judge us if we are not winning drivers.
[29:07.560 -> 29:12.000] Sebastian Buemi, he is a good friend of mine, he was my teammate back then, would not be
[29:12.000 -> 29:17.040] as clear as me talking like that because he has a different mindset.
[29:17.040 -> 29:22.320] But he's a very nice guy and he thinks the same as I do.
[29:22.320 -> 29:28.260] But sometimes in Formula 1 you have to shut your mouth, you know, to be very smart on how to deal with the press,
[29:28.260 -> 29:30.640] what to say, but listen, I have nothing to lose.
[29:30.640 -> 29:31.480] I make music now.
[29:31.480 -> 29:33.320] Well, it wouldn't be a very good podcast, would it?
[29:33.320 -> 29:34.160] No, exactly.
[29:34.160 -> 29:36.320] I am super happy where I am.
[29:36.320 -> 29:38.800] I release music as a squire.
[29:38.800 -> 29:39.820] I love my music.
[29:39.820 -> 29:43.200] I love people being happy and sharing love
[29:43.200 -> 29:46.480] and sharing music and dancing to music. I'm in a very
[29:46.480 -> 29:51.480] different atmosphere right now. I am so grateful that Red Bull gave me the possibility to drive
[29:51.480 -> 29:55.640] Formula One and, you know, help me out to be in Formula One. Without them, it would
[29:55.640 -> 30:00.320] have not been possible. But listen, I'm just going to be crystal clear with you guys. So
[30:00.320 -> 30:06.400] this is what happened. This is the real story. So it's that Yeah, do you?
[30:06.440 -> 30:11.400] Have you seen helmet Marco since I mean have you been in the paddock much since yeah, what's it like?
[30:11.400 -> 30:15.640] Was it in Silverstone last weekend or two week? Okay. No, I went I
[30:16.320 -> 30:22.040] Saw I saw him. He was not very happy. I keep trying to avoid me, but I was going
[30:22.680 -> 30:26.540] Through it. Yeah, I think he was not expecting, I think he
[30:26.540 -> 30:31.040] he didn't know what to expect really. You know if he was, if I was in a good mood
[30:31.040 -> 30:36.900] or I was just gonna give him like so much you know I don't care. I always had
[30:36.900 -> 30:41.960] a healthy good relation with him and make jokes so I was like hey Dr. Marko
[30:41.960 -> 30:47.040] like do you do you remember me? Because it was like 11 or 12 years ago.
[30:47.040 -> 30:48.800] And he's, yeah, of course, of course,
[30:48.800 -> 30:51.280] I remember the famous Alger Suarez,
[30:52.520 -> 30:53.360] famous DJ.
[30:53.360 -> 30:54.940] I'm like, no, no, not famous yet,
[30:54.940 -> 30:57.780] but not doing bad, not doing bad.
[30:57.780 -> 31:00.400] No, it was just a brief talk.
[31:00.400 -> 31:02.060] Yeah, yeah.
[31:02.060 -> 31:03.360] Do you still, I mean, when, you know,
[31:03.360 -> 31:05.680] do you still enjoy Formula One? Is it
[31:05.680 -> 31:10.320] something that you're able to watch now and enjoy and actively watch?
[31:10.320 -> 31:19.200] I'm a very good friend of Carlos. I support him massively. I've been really with our families,
[31:19.200 -> 31:23.440] my family and Carlos' family have been very close together since the Red Bull days. You
[31:23.440 -> 31:25.440] know, Carlos was in the junior team.
[31:25.840 -> 31:27.960] He saw, they saw everything,
[31:28.040 -> 31:30.480] or what happened to me and to Buemi.
[31:31.800 -> 31:38.000] We have very internal, serious talks about everyone's position
[31:38.080 -> 31:41.600] and I'm really, really happy he's now where he is.
[31:41.880 -> 31:46.320] And I think the best of Carlos is yet to come.
[31:46.320 -> 31:53.080] He's a really, really mature, excellent, super dynamic driver, performing on every
[31:53.080 -> 31:58.160] single kind of circumstance and I really wish him the best.
[31:58.160 -> 32:03.280] He's a really nice kid, an excellent driver again and I hope he has a bright and long
[32:03.280 -> 32:05.680] future in Formula 1.
[32:05.680 -> 32:10.400] What do you think is next for Carlos in terms of, is it the car, at Ferrari, what needs
[32:10.400 -> 32:14.680] to happen for him to take that next step because I think we all agree that he's a phenomenal
[32:14.680 -> 32:19.160] talent, phenomenal driver, what will just take him to the next level?
[32:19.160 -> 32:27.180] Honestly, I think Ferrari is a team that is made to win historically, you know, it's like
[32:27.940 -> 32:32.680] Real Madrid or Barcelona or even like Paris or
[32:33.560 -> 32:37.040] Manchester City like they are teams that they have to win
[32:37.460 -> 32:41.720] Like you have to win you have to go for the Champions League and you have to win it
[32:41.800 -> 32:45.400] If you don't go if you don't get these results, it's
[32:45.400 -> 32:49.680] a fail. Well, it's not really a fail, but that's what it's supposed to be because you
[32:49.680 -> 32:57.520] have this big structure, you have all the facilities, and you have to your disposition
[32:57.520 -> 33:07.240] all these right people to do it. At the moment, Ferrari is not doing a good job. It's not just the car, it's just the human team.
[33:07.240 -> 33:12.000] Formula 1 is not just about having the best car, it's about having the right people.
[33:12.000 -> 33:15.840] It's a company, you know, it's a football team.
[33:15.840 -> 33:19.040] A football team is not just about having the best players.
[33:19.040 -> 33:23.960] You see the Paris team, they have the best players in the world and they didn't do anything on Champions League.
[33:23.960 -> 33:25.000] So what's the problem? It's the mentality, it have the best players in the world and they didn't do anything on Champions League. So what's the problem?
[33:25.000 -> 33:26.520] It's the mentality, it's the attitude.
[33:26.520 -> 33:31.200] How do you form a team with the right attitude
[33:31.200 -> 33:32.800] to becoming a winning team?
[33:32.800 -> 33:36.240] Mentality, you know, Red Bull have the best mechanics.
[33:36.240 -> 33:39.520] They have, they still have the best timing
[33:39.520 -> 33:42.400] on tire change, you know, pit stops.
[33:42.400 -> 33:45.680] I think they did 1.82 or something like that.
[33:45.680 -> 33:48.440] And if you see the average timing on pit stops,
[33:48.440 -> 33:49.840] they still are the fastest.
[33:50.840 -> 33:53.220] You know, many other teams could beat that,
[33:53.220 -> 33:55.120] but they don't, so why?
[33:55.120 -> 33:57.320] Because Red Bull are on a state of flow
[33:57.320 -> 33:58.800] between the mechanics, between,
[33:58.800 -> 34:01.520] they have like this order inside the team
[34:01.520 -> 34:04.360] that makes it work, makes it being
[34:04.360 -> 34:05.440] and becoming a winning team
[34:05.600 -> 34:10.260] They want to win they give their very best and it doesn't seem to happen this in Ferrari
[34:10.320 -> 34:17.460] They mess up with strategies with tire selection. It's all a drama. It looks like a junior team, you know, it looks like
[34:19.260 -> 34:25.240] You cannot perform like that so there has to be a change in structure, like internally.
[34:30.280 -> 34:36.440] It's a human. It's not just having the best aero engineer and designing the best downforce efficient car in the world. It's just about making sure that
[34:36.760 -> 34:41.840] your team is ordered and has the right mentality to becoming a successful team.
[34:42.560 -> 34:46.160] If you see the days with Ferrari with Ross Braun, they had
[34:46.160 -> 34:51.840] that, they had this structure. You have to have a structure and an aligned team that
[34:51.840 -> 34:57.840] you know, works with the same mentality and for the same goal. And I think that's the
[34:57.840 -> 35:03.320] lack of performance of Ferrari, you know, they don't have this structure. It's missing.
[35:03.320 -> 35:08.120] Well, time will tell if Fred Vasseur is the right man to bring that structure back.
[35:08.400 -> 35:12.040] Just before we move on to talk about your music career, I'm just intrigued to get your
[35:12.040 -> 35:14.840] thoughts on Red Bull's domination this season.
[35:14.840 -> 35:20.760] And obviously Max Verstappen was the driver who replaced you as the youngest driver to
[35:20.760 -> 35:21.800] start a Formula One race.
[35:21.800 -> 35:26.460] You did it at 19 years and 125 days, pretty much 14 years ago to the day
[35:26.740 -> 35:31.140] at the Hungaroring as I discussed. Max was 17 years and 166 days.
[35:31.380 -> 35:36.460] So when you think that he was almost two years younger than you were, and I think back to when I was 19,
[35:36.460 -> 35:42.140] I was pretty young at 19, so I can't imagine how, you know, driving a Formula One car at the age of 17 must just be
[35:42.380 -> 35:49.360] ridiculous. But how do you reflect on what Max is doing at the moment, how he's dominating, how Red Bull are dominating the
[35:49.360 -> 35:50.360] sport?
[35:50.360 -> 35:55.320] So I think Max, if we have to look at his performance and the actual status of Max right
[35:55.320 -> 36:06.920] now, we have to go back to the karting days and analyse that because everything is happening for a reason. Max has a special talent
[36:06.920 -> 36:12.880] already, he was born with a special talent but talent is not just enough. To
[36:12.880 -> 36:16.880] become the world's best driver in the world talent is not just enough. Talent
[36:16.880 -> 36:22.080] has to be worked, talent has to be trained, you have to work on talent big
[36:22.080 -> 36:26.040] time and Max has something that nobody else has.
[36:26.040 -> 36:30.040] He had a preparation and an education that nobody else had.
[36:30.040 -> 36:34.760] A tough and strict preparation from karting days.
[36:34.760 -> 36:36.480] And nobody did that.
[36:36.480 -> 36:40.760] You know, he was at Genk, testing more than anyone else,
[36:40.760 -> 36:44.680] on slick tires, on wet tires, on, you know,
[36:44.680 -> 36:45.000] track being wet on slick tires, on wet tires, on, you know,
[36:50.000 -> 36:54.000] track being wet on slick tires and going and going and running and running and running. His father being so involved in his karting program,
[36:55.000 -> 37:02.000] tuning up his engines, just going for it with huge,
[37:10.000 -> 37:16.000] with a very strict mind of performing at the very, very high end level. Winning was not enough, which if you look at it, it's a very similar education,
[37:16.000 -> 37:23.000] it's a very similar mentality of Red Bull, of the junior team.
[37:23.000 -> 37:25.460] Winning is not enough. What happened was
[37:25.460 -> 37:30.320] when I was an intro Rosso scoring and beating Michael Schumacher and
[37:30.320 -> 37:35.760] scoring you know like six points per race or doing eighth, ninth, seventh, which it
[37:35.760 -> 37:41.720] was a win for us, it was not enough for them. Everyone was happy around my team
[37:41.720 -> 37:46.600] you know like the press, Spanish press, other teams were even congratulating our results,
[37:46.600 -> 37:48.000] but Helmut was not.
[37:48.500 -> 37:51.000] It was just, okay, this is what you have to do.
[37:51.500 -> 37:56.600] So, that's what, that's the mentality that Josh and Max had in mind,
[37:56.600 -> 38:00.200] and I've raced only once against Max.
[38:00.500 -> 38:04.800] It was the World Cup in karting in Bahrain, KZ, Q100.
[38:04.800 -> 38:05.000] I came ninth, it was obviously my cup in karting in Bahrain, KZ, he won it.
[38:05.000 -> 38:10.000] I came 9th, it was obviously my return to karting, I just did it for training and so on.
[38:10.000 -> 38:14.000] Obviously I was not really a professional in that term, but it went really well,
[38:14.000 -> 38:18.000] because being in the top 10 was for me an achievement at that time.
[38:18.000 -> 38:27.560] Max won the race, and I remember it was the time where I met Max and yeah
[38:27.560 -> 38:32.680] you know he had to do this like there is no margin for becoming second like
[38:32.680 -> 38:38.720] there's no happy faces to go back at home so I think his dad had a huge
[38:38.720 -> 38:48.760] influence on Max's performance at the moment. So if you have to analyze what Max is doing now,
[38:48.760 -> 38:51.520] it's becoming from many, many, many years ago.
[38:51.520 -> 38:54.480] Like, you have to analyze what happened in the karting days when he started.
[38:54.480 -> 39:00.520] Like, it was huge, huge, like, strict programs
[39:00.520 -> 39:02.840] and dedication to what he did.
[39:02.840 -> 39:05.280] It was a never-ending
[39:09.620 -> 39:10.880] Training program on it's just here mental wise but also
[39:15.620 -> 39:16.260] Testing testing racing and racing and never stopping of doing that. So
[39:17.400 -> 39:24.520] Yeah Like hands up, you know, it worked. Nobody beats him like sees that he's on a state of flow. He's doing it easy
[39:26.080 -> 39:28.580] Nobody beats him like he's on a state of flow. He's doing it easy. He's not even pushing He's not even you know, of course the car is very quick
[39:28.880 -> 39:36.880] But I can I'm very very sure if you put Lewis in this car or Fernando or whatever driver you want
[39:36.880 -> 39:38.880] I don't think they would beat him
[39:39.780 -> 39:43.360] You think yeah, I don't think they would beat him. Yeah
[39:44.080 -> 39:45.760] Be good to try though, wouldn't it? Yeah, I don't think they would beat him. Yeah, it'd be good to try though, wouldn't it? Yeah.
[39:47.920 -> 39:52.560] I think if we got three Red Bulls and put Max Lewis and Fernando in there, I think that'd be
[39:52.560 -> 39:57.360] box office. That's really a fascinating insight, Jaime, it really is about what's happening at
[39:57.360 -> 40:01.200] Red Bull at the moment. I want to just finish by talking about what you're up to now.
[40:01.200 -> 40:08.880] And obviously you mentioned that, so obviously you left Formula One and then you raced in Formula E for a bit and then retired at 25 and then how did
[40:08.880 -> 40:13.520] the music element to your career come about? Was that always something you wanted to do or
[40:13.520 -> 40:20.480] or when did that start? Well it all started in Ibiza. My parents used to go on holidays
[40:20.480 -> 40:26.920] since the 70s and obviously they took me there. I met a lot of friends. Ibiza has
[40:26.920 -> 40:34.120] been always the center of, let's say, summer parties and electronic music in the summer.
[40:34.120 -> 40:39.440] And all my friends were into DJing, really. It was the vinyl era at that time and we had
[40:39.440 -> 40:47.000] to, you know, find the right music in the right stores. It was not as today, you know, like where you find music on the internet everywhere.
[40:47.000 -> 40:52.000] So, it was just a challenge to who had the best record and, you know,
[40:52.000 -> 40:57.000] what's the best record sounding like, showing us music, sharing music between us.
[40:57.000 -> 41:00.000] It all started like a game. And then, obviously, they were mixing
[41:00.000 -> 41:02.000] and they were playing records and this placement.
[41:02.000 -> 41:06.840] So I started to do that and I really found it really good fun.
[41:06.840 -> 41:11.800] And we started throwing our own parties, like obviously just for us and our friends.
[41:11.800 -> 41:16.640] And I thought, OK, one day, why shouldn't I start trying to make this,
[41:16.640 -> 41:20.960] you know, like a little beat on my software, in the computer.
[41:20.960 -> 41:24.240] And then maybe when I finish this beat, I add some melodies
[41:24.240 -> 41:30.640] and I do like very, you know essential like really basic stuff and I started to release my
[41:30.640 -> 41:37.280] first records in 2009 2010 like very like independent labels from New York
[41:37.280 -> 41:41.200] this was this was as you got your chance in Formula One this all happened at the same time
[41:41.200 -> 41:48.240] yeah wow. Brad was worried because he saw that I was putting a lot of time in my computer and downloading
[41:48.240 -> 41:54.400] plug-ins and buying sound libraries and recording weird stuff.
[41:55.040 -> 41:57.360] And then he was like, well, what are you on about?
[41:58.560 -> 42:03.120] You just became a Formula One driver and you're really putting all your time on music.
[42:03.120 -> 42:06.000] But for me, music has always been like a disconnection point
[42:06.000 -> 42:08.000] of feeling free, you know.
[42:08.000 -> 42:12.000] Every time I feel sad, I make music or I listen to music.
[42:12.000 -> 42:15.000] Every time I want to train hard, I listen to music.
[42:15.000 -> 42:19.000] Every time that I'm motivated about something or passionate about something,
[42:19.000 -> 42:20.000] I listen to music.
[42:20.000 -> 42:23.000] So music for me brings me to life and connects me to life.
[42:23.000 -> 42:25.960] So it's a language that it's universal.
[42:25.960 -> 42:28.040] And even if we don't speak the same language,
[42:28.040 -> 42:30.200] you understand yourself with music.
[42:30.200 -> 42:33.240] All these frequencies that are just about to be made
[42:33.240 -> 42:36.640] and to be composed are there, you know,
[42:36.640 -> 42:40.280] and it's, art is something different, you know.
[42:40.280 -> 42:41.800] It's different to driving a car,
[42:41.800 -> 42:50.880] but it's just like freedom of expression. And when it works and people feel it, obviously then being successful in music, it's something
[42:50.880 -> 42:55.360] completely different. But when you make music and somebody feels it, even if it's one person
[42:55.360 -> 43:02.480] to 1,000, it's magic, you know, it's like pure state of connection. And this is just incredible.
[43:03.680 -> 43:06.600] Yeah, it seems slightly trite to ask
[43:06.600 -> 43:08.120] if there's similarities between music
[43:08.120 -> 43:10.280] and being a Formula One racing driver.
[43:10.280 -> 43:11.940] Was there any crossover that you felt,
[43:11.940 -> 43:14.280] was there anything that Formula One prepared you
[43:14.280 -> 43:16.080] to do well in music,
[43:16.080 -> 43:17.920] or do you see them as completely separate things?
[43:17.920 -> 43:20.840] You know, this is actually an escape from Formula One,
[43:20.840 -> 43:22.080] from competitive sport,
[43:22.080 -> 43:24.360] from all of the pressure that came with that.
[43:24.360 -> 43:31.040] Yeah, I think I've learned a lot from my, not just my Formula One career, especially to becoming,
[43:31.040 -> 43:36.080] you know, like to being in Red Bull for many, many years, to have this level of,
[43:38.320 -> 43:43.120] I would say, like being so strict with yourself, like just trying to push yourself forward and
[43:43.120 -> 43:47.980] beyond on everything, like training hard every day, like being on your best and always
[43:47.980 -> 43:52.300] asking for more. This is something that I think is helping me in music because
[43:52.300 -> 43:56.540] you're never happy with what you have, you know, you just want to go further and
[43:56.540 -> 44:01.300] you want to, you put this record where you are happy but you are always
[44:01.300 -> 44:04.540] listening to what other people's, other people are doing and you're always
[44:04.540 -> 44:26.200] analyzing other records like how did this guy did this sound or this other, what kind of work yourself and becoming a better producer,
[44:26.200 -> 44:28.200] a better professional in what you do,
[44:28.200 -> 44:29.540] is what moves you forward.
[44:29.540 -> 44:32.540] And I think Formula One has helped me massively on that,
[44:32.540 -> 44:33.620] you know, like always pushing
[44:33.620 -> 44:35.860] and trying to push yourself forward
[44:35.860 -> 44:39.280] and going and moving beyond of that course.
[44:39.280 -> 44:40.280] Fascinating.
[44:40.280 -> 44:42.640] I think what's Formula One seems to have changed quite a lot
[44:42.640 -> 44:47.200] in the last maybe five years or so, It seems to be moving much more towards entertainment.
[44:47.200 -> 44:50.320] I don't know if you agree with that and I'm intrigued to get your thoughts about,
[44:50.320 -> 44:56.000] you know, for example in Miami we had Will.i.am making a track just for Formula One specifically.
[44:56.000 -> 44:59.680] We had the big driver intros. It feels like Formula One, we're going to Vegas this year.
[44:59.680 -> 45:02.320] There are lots of elements of Formula One that are now becoming
[45:02.960 -> 45:05.840] more and more entertainment-, even more music based.
[45:05.840 -> 45:06.840] Would you agree with that?
[45:06.840 -> 45:07.840] Yeah, yeah.
[45:07.840 -> 45:08.840] I think it's fantastic.
[45:08.840 -> 45:14.760] I mean, I was in Silverstone two weeks ago and I saw a completely different scenario
[45:14.760 -> 45:19.360] of what Formula One looks like or what it looked like back in the past.
[45:19.360 -> 45:22.080] And I was so happy to see that.
[45:22.080 -> 45:26.480] People from all around the world, I felt like Formula One has finally opened
[45:27.680 -> 45:34.560] their eyes and everything looks more easy to understand, it looks much more entertaining.
[45:35.280 -> 45:43.040] There's much more around Formula One. I think the Netflix film series helped a lot, the TV show,
[45:43.040 -> 45:45.680] and I think the film that is about to come out
[45:45.680 -> 45:50.680] is going to be amazing as well. So, hands down to that and to the new era of Formula
[45:50.680 -> 45:53.680] One, yeah, it's nice to see that.
[45:53.680 -> 45:57.680] And just finally, give us an overview of how your life has changed. Obviously, you were
[45:57.680 -> 46:02.400] a Formula One racing driver, you were, you know, how many weekends of the year you were
[46:02.400 -> 46:05.360] driving, now you're a DJ. What does your week look like?
[46:05.360 -> 46:07.120] How does it compare to Formula One?
[46:08.080 -> 46:09.520] Well, it's very different.
[46:09.520 -> 46:14.320] I don't see the press very often right now.
[46:14.320 -> 46:16.120] But it's fine.
[46:16.120 -> 46:17.900] I mean, I travel a lot.
[46:19.440 -> 46:22.160] I'm in a very different circle of people.
[46:23.040 -> 46:24.240] I make a lot of music.
[46:24.240 -> 46:25.760] Every day I'm on my computer,. I make a lot of music every day, I'm on my computer,
[46:25.760 -> 46:35.200] so I listen to a lot of music. It's important for me to have to bring something different and
[46:35.200 -> 46:41.680] offer something different to every DJ set. Like you cannot really base a set that has been working
[46:41.680 -> 46:48.880] for you in the last, let's say, two, three months and always trying to repeat tracks. That's not challenging for me. Many DJs do that.
[46:48.880 -> 46:54.320] But it's important to... it's important to risk. Like, you have to risk on your DJ
[46:54.320 -> 46:59.040] sets. Like, I find it's super interesting and sometimes it just doesn't work. But
[46:59.040 -> 47:03.120] just the fact that you risk and you put something different, extravagant,
[47:03.120 -> 47:10.080] avant-garde, like, something that nobody would would try and when you make it work it's just amazing you know and I
[47:10.080 -> 47:16.340] think that's how creative DJs and I think that's what you should look for
[47:16.340 -> 47:20.340] you know and it's challenging because this requires you a huge amount of hours
[47:20.340 -> 47:26.040] to research for music, dig into music and get a big knowledge of music from the
[47:26.040 -> 47:29.760] 70s to the actual moment.
[47:29.760 -> 47:35.000] I'm running a label called Anims, which I'm really, really happy and proud of.
[47:35.000 -> 47:36.520] It started last year.
[47:36.520 -> 47:38.800] Anims is a Catalan word.
[47:38.800 -> 47:39.800] It's like cheer up.
[47:39.800 -> 47:41.360] It means cheer up.
[47:41.360 -> 47:44.480] It's like a positive word.
[47:44.480 -> 47:49.240] We had already like six references. I'm releasing other
[47:49.240 -> 47:53.280] artists from all around the world. I've released two records of mine. We're
[47:53.280 -> 47:59.000] doing remixes as well. And yeah, just just, you know, enjoying my life as a
[47:59.000 -> 48:06.400] you know, as a DJ as a producer, a traveler as well. well and yeah just having fun with it which is all about
[48:06.400 -> 48:10.720] I think in life it's about enjoying your job, feeling connected with what you do and just
[48:10.720 -> 48:16.240] trying to deliver your very best. Yeah very well said. Where can people find your music?
[48:16.800 -> 48:27.000] And are you touring at any point? Like if people want to check you out? So Spotify is probably the best platform to find music nowadays You just type my name squire
[48:27.700 -> 48:29.700] squire
[48:30.020 -> 48:34.200] This is actually my second surname in English. So I really I
[48:35.120 -> 48:39.960] Choose that name. I've started a duo at the moment with a friend called pole position
[48:40.160 -> 48:44.600] So we may we play together and we have like we did that. Yeah
[48:43.000 -> 48:45.000] So we play together. Like what you did there.
[48:45.000 -> 48:51.000] We had good picks already and we had excellent dates for the coming summer.
[48:51.000 -> 48:55.000] So yeah, you can find me on Spotify as Squire.
[48:55.000 -> 48:59.000] Nice one. Well, it's been brilliant to chat to you, Jaime. Thank you so much for your time.
[48:59.000 -> 49:00.000] Thank you, Matt.
[49:00.000 -> 49:06.880] And yeah, really appreciate it. Fascinating insight to what it was like at Red Bull and glad to see you're doing so well now.
[49:06.880 -> 49:09.720] We will be back next Tuesday after the Hungarian Grand Prix
[49:09.720 -> 49:10.560] to look back at that.
[49:10.560 -> 49:12.600] We'll be joined by Niko Rosberg for that.
[49:12.600 -> 49:13.440] Hope to see you then.
[49:13.440 -> 49:14.260] Bye for now.