EXPLAINED! How to fix Track Limits! | Sky Sports F1 Podcast

Matt Baker, Karun Chandhok and F1 content creator Tom McCluskey join for our latest pod.

They review the Austrian Grand Prix (3.28) and debate the fiasco surrounding track limits around Red Bull Ring (4.47).

Max Verstappen's dominant season with Red Bull is discussed (23.21) as is the improvements made at McLaren with their upgrades in Austria (27.57).

They finish by talking about the upcoming upgrades some of the teams will be making as the year progresses (41.05).

**Navigating the Austrian Grand Prix and the Controversial Track Limits Saga: A Comprehensive Discussion**

**Race Review:**

- **Matt Baker:** The race was competitive, with captivating battles throughout the field. Max Verstappen's dominance continued, but the midfield provided plenty of action.
- **Karun Chandhok:** The chaos caused by over 1,200 track limit transgressions overshadowed the entertaining race, leading to a four-hour delay in finalizing the results.
- **Tom McCluskey:** The race had everything except a close fight at the front. The competitive nature of the midfield made up for the lack of a thrilling battle for the lead.

**Track Limits Controversy:**

- **Chandhok:** The excessive track limit violations and the lengthy delay in resolving them were detrimental to Formula One's image. He advocates for a solution to prevent such issues in the future.
- **McCluskey:** The track limit saga highlighted the need for accurate and consistent enforcement. He believes that implementing a clear deterrent system, such as gravel or grass on the track's edge, could help resolve the problem.
- **Baker:** He emphasizes the importance of finding a consensus between the FIA, FIM, and circuits to establish clear track limits and minimize the reliance on stewards' decisions.

**Max Verstappen's Dominance:**

- **Baker:** Verstappen's performance in Austria was remarkable, showcasing his ability to extract the maximum from his car and maintain focus even under pressure.
- **Chandhok:** Verstappen's impressive consistency and ability to deliver exceptional lap times, even when warned about track limits, highlight his exceptional talent.
- **McCluskey:** Verstappen's dominance in Austria, coupled with his impressive record this season, has solidified his position as one of the greatest drivers in Formula One history.

**Upcoming Silverstone Race:**

- **Chandhok:** The Silverstone race will be an exciting opportunity for British fans to witness a pre-Grand Prix reception at Downing Street. He hopes to raise awareness about track limits and road safety issues during his meeting with transport officials.
- **Baker:** Silverstone will provide a unique challenge for teams, as they will have limited practice time due to the sprint format. He anticipates that the race will be closely contested, with several teams capable of challenging Red Bull's dominance.
- **McCluskey:** The upgrades that teams will bring to Silverstone could potentially shake up the competitive order. He believes that McLaren's recent improvements and the potential for rain could make the race unpredictable.

**Overall Takeaway:**

The Austrian Grand Prix was a tale of two halves: an entertaining race overshadowed by the track limits controversy. Verstappen's continued dominance and the upcoming Silverstone race provide intriguing storylines for Formula One fans.

# Formula One Austrian Grand Prix Review and Analysis

## Overview:

- In this podcast episode, Matt Baker, Karun Chandhok, and F1 content creator Tom McCluskey discuss the Austrian Grand Prix, track limit controversies at the Red Bull Ring, Max Verstappen's dominance, McLaren's improvements with upgrades, and upcoming team upgrades.

## Austrian Grand Prix Review:

- Max Verstappen secured another dominant victory, extending his championship lead.
- McLaren's Lando Norris finished fourth after being promoted due to Sergio Perez's penalty.
- Ferrari's Carlos Sainz and Charles Leclerc finished third and fifth, respectively.

## Track Limit Controversies:

- Drivers faced challenges with track limits at the Red Bull Ring, resulting in numerous penalties.
- The strict enforcement of track limits sparked debates about the fairness and consistency of the rulings.

## Max Verstappen's Performance:

- Verstappen's continued dominance highlights his exceptional skills and the strength of the Red Bull package.
- His commanding lead in the championship standings solidifies his position as the favorite for the title.

## McLaren's Improvements:

- McLaren's upgraded package showed promising results, with Norris finishing in the top four.
- The team's improved performance raises hopes for a more competitive season.

## Upcoming Team Upgrades:

- Teams are expected to introduce upgrades throughout the season to improve their cars' performance.
- McLaren, Mercedes, and Aston Martin are among the teams planning upgrades for the upcoming races.

## Challenges of Developing and Implementing Upgrades:

- Developing and implementing upgrades involves a complex process, including design, testing, and manufacturing.
- Teams must balance the need for innovation with the constraints of time, resources, and cost limitations.

## Conclusion:

- The Austrian Grand Prix provided excitement and controversy, with Verstappen continuing his dominance and McLaren showing signs of progress.
- The upcoming team upgrades promise to shake up the competitive landscape as the Formula One season continues.

[00:00.000 -> 00:08.060] Hello everyone, a very warm welcome to this week's episode. I hope you're well. Joining
[00:08.060 -> 00:13.680] me for this one is our very own Karun Chandhok and F1 content creator Tomo. And Karun, before
[00:13.680 -> 00:19.840] we start, if you're watching this, you might see a little bit of a strange camera filter
[00:19.840 -> 00:22.920] on Karun. We've been trying to work out why he's so purple, but we might be able to get
[00:22.920 -> 00:29.280] rid of that in the edit. But you're also in a shirt and tie. So come on explain why you've joined this podcast in a shirt and tie.
[00:29.800 -> 00:31.800] I thought that was the dress code
[00:35.200 -> 00:41.020] No, I I'm heading to Downing Street, which sounds like a very pompous thing to be saying but I'm heading to Downing Street for a
[00:41.920 -> 00:45.360] bit of a British Grand Prix, pre-British Grand Prix reception.
[00:45.360 -> 00:47.600] So I dressed up for the occasion
[00:47.600 -> 00:49.480] and then my computer appears to have had
[00:49.480 -> 00:52.600] some weird purple IT failure.
[00:52.600 -> 00:54.080] And now I look like some form of alien.
[00:54.080 -> 00:56.680] So I apologize to anyone who's watching.
[00:57.640 -> 00:58.680] I don't know what to fix it.
[00:58.680 -> 01:03.080] And Matt helpfully offered the classic grandma solution.
[01:03.080 -> 01:05.260] Why don't you turn it off and turn it back on
[01:05.260 -> 01:06.600] and see what happens?
[01:06.600 -> 01:08.280] Look, often works for my grandma.
[01:08.280 -> 01:09.120] He didn't fix it.
[01:09.120 -> 01:13.080] Oh, I'm sorry.
[01:13.080 -> 01:13.920] Well, you never know,
[01:13.920 -> 01:15.120] we might be able to get rid of it at the end.
[01:15.120 -> 01:16.580] Very exciting you're going to Downing Street.
[01:16.580 -> 01:17.420] So who's going?
[01:17.420 -> 01:20.960] It's like an invited guest list from Formula One.
[01:20.960 -> 01:21.800] Is that correct?
[01:21.800 -> 01:25.360] Yep, yeah, just seeing, it's team bosses,
[01:25.360 -> 01:27.720] I think Stefano Domenicali,
[01:27.720 -> 01:31.760] Stuart Pringle from the Service and Circuit, obviously,
[01:31.760 -> 01:34.520] and David Richards, who's chairman of Motorsport UK.
[01:34.520 -> 01:37.200] I'm a board member of Motorsport UK.
[01:37.200 -> 01:38.360] So yeah, there's a bunch of us.
[01:38.360 -> 01:40.880] And Simon Lazenby, who I'm meeting
[01:40.880 -> 01:42.420] at Westminster Station, apparently.
[01:42.420 -> 01:46.860] So the key will be, and Tomo you may not know this
[01:46.860 -> 01:50.120] about Simon, but one of his fabulous habits
[01:50.120 -> 01:52.460] is he manages to get stains on himself.
[01:52.460 -> 01:55.140] So I'm trying to see if in that 300 yards
[01:55.140 -> 01:57.800] between Westminster Station and Downing Street,
[01:57.800 -> 02:01.000] what he could spill on himself basically.
[02:01.000 -> 02:02.600] I hope he's not wearing a white shirt.
[02:02.600 -> 02:07.420] Maybe he's gone black, gone dark just to save himself clumsy man
[02:07.420 -> 02:10.740] Simon I'll tweet I'll tweet a picture so we find out
[02:12.700 -> 02:15.440] Yeah be something in the local supermarket where they're getting a drink
[02:15.440 -> 02:19.120] Um, I guess I can I tell you can you can I tell you a fun fact on that very by the way?
[02:19.360 -> 02:21.360] Yeah, Austrian Grand Prix
[02:21.700 -> 02:25.120] Simon managed to get toothpaste on his shirt. He was found in the
[02:25.120 -> 02:31.080] TV compound washing his shirt on Saturday for his Sunday race shirt was covered in toothpaste.
[02:31.080 -> 02:37.080] He was washing it and then had a hanger to hang dry it in the TV compound. I'm talking
[02:37.080 -> 02:43.080] about level of entertainment. Glamorous TV. Yeah, this is the side of TV that you don't
[02:43.080 -> 02:47.320] see. Well, look, very good. Karina. We're going to get this done in good time,
[02:47.320 -> 02:49.400] so you can get off to meet Simon.
[02:49.400 -> 02:51.800] But yeah, I mean, I'm fascinated to hear how it goes.
[02:51.800 -> 02:53.440] And anything you want to raise
[02:53.440 -> 02:55.600] with our current transport secretary,
[02:55.600 -> 02:57.720] thinking potholes, all that kind of,
[02:57.720 -> 03:00.240] you know, maybe you can put in the good word.
[03:00.240 -> 03:01.360] So.
[03:01.360 -> 03:03.640] Yeah, maybe you can import some kerbs from Austria.
[03:03.640 -> 03:04.480] Hey, hey.
[03:04.480 -> 03:06.640] Hey, track limits. Right, that's perfect. So yeah, maybe you can import some curb from Austria
[03:13.000 -> 03:15.340] Right, let's that's perfect we will segue nicely into what's coming up so we can do our one-word race reviews first up We're then going to talk about the track limit saga
[03:15.520 -> 03:19.400] Which I'm gonna call it a saga which happened on Sunday after the race and then we're gonna look ahead
[03:19.520 -> 03:22.760] Silverstone sort of through the lens of what happened in Austria and who's gonna be
[03:23.600 -> 03:25.640] Who's gonna to have a good
[03:25.640 -> 03:30.680] chance going into Silverstone. So, one word race review. Tommo, let's start with you.
[03:30.680 -> 03:32.680] What are you going to go for?
[03:32.680 -> 03:37.640] So, which might sound a bit, oh, what's he talking about at first? But I'm going to say
[03:37.640 -> 03:46.400] competitive. As much as Max did lead and was comfortable at the front, I think throughout the field,
[03:46.400 -> 03:52.000] this, for me, the Grand Prix had everything but that fight at the very front. You had
[03:52.000 -> 03:57.760] fantastic scraps throughout the field, whether it was Carlos and Checo, whether it was, you know,
[03:57.760 -> 04:02.080] DeVries and Magnussen towards the back and multiple cars. I remember last season we saw
[04:02.080 -> 04:05.440] that five-car battle and it was a big deal and I think
[04:05.440 -> 04:11.360] this year we got again throughout the field where qualifying was you had a few drivers you obviously
[04:11.360 -> 04:16.240] had Checo coming through the field I think it had it was a super competitive race and it had a bit
[04:16.240 -> 04:21.440] of everything apart from again that fight at the front so I think it was pretty competitive.
[04:22.000 -> 04:26.000] Okay, competitive. And a dog.
[04:26.000 -> 04:28.000] Let me actually grab him quickly.
[04:28.000 -> 04:30.000] He's very...
[04:30.000 -> 04:32.000] The people will want to see my sausage dog.
[04:32.000 -> 04:34.000] This is Minton.
[04:34.000 -> 04:36.000] He joins me on my YouTube channel
[04:36.000 -> 04:38.000] and he's the one who's barking on the Sky Sports.
[04:38.000 -> 04:40.000] Very cute.
[04:40.000 -> 04:42.000] It's nice to put a face to the bark.
[04:44.000 -> 04:46.720] Karun, competitive, do you agree?
[04:47.860 -> 04:49.700] I'm gonna go with chaotic.
[04:50.920 -> 04:55.920] Honestly, the fact we had over 1,200 track limit
[04:56.540 -> 04:59.320] sort of questions or queries or investigations,
[04:59.320 -> 05:00.680] transgressions, whatever you wanna call it,
[05:00.680 -> 05:02.420] potential transgressions,
[05:02.420 -> 05:07.420] in 1,353 racing laps that were completed in the race,
[05:07.420 -> 05:11.260] it's bonkers, you know, nearly one per lap.
[05:11.260 -> 05:14.900] And I hate having results decided
[05:14.900 -> 05:17.980] four hours and 16 minutes after the chequered flag,
[05:17.980 -> 05:19.340] which is what it was on Sunday.
[05:19.340 -> 05:21.660] And I think that's just way too chaotic
[05:21.660 -> 05:23.780] and not good for Formula One.
[05:23.780 -> 05:24.620] We're going to get onto that,
[05:24.620 -> 05:27.160] because you did tweet that, and I'm intrigued to understand
[05:27.160 -> 05:29.440] why a bit in a bit more detail.
[05:29.440 -> 05:32.200] Just before we move on, I'm going to go for action, kind of similar to you, Tom Owen,
[05:32.200 -> 05:35.320] that I think we had across the sprint weekend as well.
[05:35.320 -> 05:39.360] If you think back to Baku, what we would have done to have some of the battles that we had
[05:39.360 -> 05:41.960] in Baku that we had this weekend in Austria.
[05:41.960 -> 05:48.160] I thought there were, you know, I mean, you've got like like three four cars going into turn four it was it was really really exciting
[05:48.160 -> 05:53.260] I think particularly the sprint race as well Crofty barely caught his breath throughout that commentary
[05:53.260 -> 05:57.820] There was so much going on and yeah look if we get more sprint races like that
[05:57.820 -> 06:00.340] I think they could be here to stay because I think they're absolutely brilliant
[06:00.340 -> 06:05.120] Um, but yes, let's move on to talk about track limits. Karine, you were keen to put a
[06:05.120 -> 06:09.840] little time limit on this, so we're going to try and keep this as succinct as we can because,
[06:09.840 -> 06:14.960] you know, I don't know if we're going to class this as tyre chat, similar kind of, you know,
[06:14.960 -> 06:19.680] non-racing elements that we don't really want to be spending that long talking about. But I think
[06:19.680 -> 06:23.440] it is important to get into because it had a massive impact on the final race result, could
[06:23.440 -> 06:28.560] have had an impact even on the podium, you know, if things had gone in a different way. So
[06:28.560 -> 06:32.360] I'm just going to go through how this all unfolded for people at home who might have
[06:32.360 -> 06:37.120] not might have not seen this on Sunday or just just a refresher for people who did.
[06:37.120 -> 06:42.640] So the race finished. Aston Martin launched a protest against the race result, suggesting
[06:42.640 -> 06:49.520] a number of cars were not penalised for exceeding track limits. We were about to board a plane home from Austria on Sunday
[06:49.520 -> 06:53.120] evening and we learned that that protest was upheld, that a number of track limit infringements
[06:53.120 -> 06:58.880] had not been previously referred to the stewards for a potential penalty. In fact, it was revealed
[06:58.880 -> 07:04.680] that there were in excess of 1,200, as you said earlier, Karim, 1,200 reports of violations
[07:04.680 -> 07:06.560] by drivers. And this, after
[07:06.560 -> 07:10.480] all the penalties were applied, five hours after the race, this is what happened. So
[07:10.480 -> 07:17.920] Sainz dropped two places to P6, Norris moved up to P4, Alonso to P5, Hamilton, who had
[07:17.920 -> 07:24.040] a 10-second penalty, swapped with Russell to P8, Gasly swapped with Stroll down to P10,
[07:24.040 -> 07:26.360] Ocon, that's the end of the points, and then
[07:26.360 -> 07:30.820] Ocon, who was the biggest defender of them all, four separate penalties to combine to
[07:30.820 -> 07:37.200] 30 seconds, went from P12 to P14, there were also penalties for Albon, Sargent, De Vries,
[07:37.200 -> 07:42.560] Sonoda as well. Final thing from me before I want to hear from you guys, the most pertinent
[07:42.560 -> 07:45.040] line at the end from the stewards,
[07:45.040 -> 07:51.980] the stewards very strongly recommend that a solution be found to the track limit situation
[07:51.980 -> 07:58.480] at this circuit. Karun, why did you think it wasn't good for F1 apart from the obvious?
[07:58.480 -> 08:03.320] Why this why this happened so long after the race? Because I take Tomo's point that it
[08:03.320 -> 08:05.280] was a really competitive race. It was entertaining,
[08:05.280 -> 08:10.960] there was so much going on. I wanted to just, because I was at home, not in Austria, I wanted
[08:10.960 -> 08:15.680] to just sit there with my family and a couple of mates and just enjoy watching the Grand Prix.
[08:15.680 -> 08:22.320] And instead, all I kept waiting to hear and was hearing was these investigations and drivers
[08:22.320 -> 08:25.280] complaining on the radio and drivers being told and it sort
[08:25.280 -> 08:31.080] of overshadowed what actually was a really good Grand Prix and there was a lot of, you know,
[08:31.080 -> 08:36.000] to Tomo's point, you had great action, three, four cars together up and down the field, okay,
[08:36.000 -> 08:41.040] Max disappeared off, but otherwise, even strategically with the different, you know,
[08:41.040 -> 08:46.480] two versus the one stops and or three stops, cetera. So there was a lot going on.
[08:46.480 -> 08:49.000] And I just thought that was bad for F1.
[08:50.280 -> 08:54.240] Yeah, I think part of it as well, Matt,
[08:54.240 -> 08:56.160] is that, you know,
[08:56.160 -> 08:59.160] all the sport reporting that this was flagged as an issue
[08:59.160 -> 09:00.760] before the race had even begun.
[09:00.760 -> 09:02.740] Like there was already an awareness
[09:02.740 -> 09:05.480] that track limits could be a fundamental issue
[09:05.480 -> 09:08.720] and I'm all for enforcing it at the line, okay?
[09:08.720 -> 09:11.400] I don't, you know, I'm sitting here as a fan,
[09:11.400 -> 09:13.000] I don't know, maybe I'm Ron Caroon,
[09:13.000 -> 09:15.220] but I'm not buying the drivers complaining
[09:15.220 -> 09:17.640] about it's track limits, it's the line's the line
[09:17.640 -> 09:19.320] and it's the same rules for everyone.
[09:19.320 -> 09:21.920] I'm fine with them enforcing it solid
[09:21.920 -> 09:25.160] and giving out penalties, I think that could in part you
[09:25.160 -> 09:29.580] know almost be something that makes this track a bit more unique that there is
[09:29.580 -> 09:36.220] this this extreme risk of track limit penalties but you can only do that if
[09:36.220 -> 09:40.520] you can guarantee you can be able to enforce it accurately and clearly they
[09:40.520 -> 09:44.820] they couldn't and whether it was because Aston Martin lodged the appeal or they
[09:44.820 -> 09:48.000] were going to do it anyway I think the FIA claimed that they were already looking into it.
[09:48.000 -> 09:53.000] At the end of the day, exactly, no one wants to see results changing after the fact.
[09:53.000 -> 09:57.000] So imagine if the podium had changed. I mean, Lando P4 from P5.
[09:57.000 -> 10:05.340] I think getting podiums after the fact, would have been a shocker. And again, Ocon 30 seconds penalties.
[10:05.340 -> 10:08.180] If Ocon's not being told of the transgressions,
[10:08.180 -> 10:10.340] yes, it's still his fault, and there were other drivers,
[10:10.340 -> 10:12.460] I think Joe and George didn't get a single one.
[10:12.460 -> 10:16.380] But, I mean, if you don't know your exceeding track limits,
[10:16.380 -> 10:18.420] you're not gonna adjust your driving to compensate.
[10:18.420 -> 10:20.920] So again, Ocon getting 30 seconds penalty,
[10:20.920 -> 10:23.380] which was a system, I think they just kind of made up,
[10:23.380 -> 10:29.600] because they gave him 5.10 and then another 5-10 and it's just unheard of it's crazy.
[10:29.600 -> 10:33.240] No I think it's unprecedented but I don't think I actually think what they
[10:33.240 -> 10:37.000] applied was all correct if I'm honest when you go through what he did and the
[10:37.000 -> 10:40.520] number of times because you get a reset effectively after your fifth strike so I
[10:40.520 -> 10:45.160] actually think I have no problem with what was applied
[10:49.020 -> 10:49.800] but I think the reality is it's been an issue at this track for a while, right and
[10:54.060 -> 10:54.720] So maybe Matt just it might be worth for a second just looking into
[10:59.100 -> 10:59.880] Some of the reasons right why we have these issues some tracks and not others. So
[11:02.080 -> 11:03.160] one of the common things that most people have talked about is
[11:10.560 -> 11:11.280] The tracks are compromised because they're running bikes and cars. So as you know, I do some work in track design and we did
[11:16.240 -> 11:23.200] Abu Dhabi and we've got various other projects going on at the moment. So I looked into this and to what the FIM want for the bikes versus the cars because that's the most commonly used excuse
[11:23.200 -> 11:28.400] by circuits is that we can't fix it, we can't change it, you guys just have to lump it. So it is actually
[11:28.400 -> 11:31.480] quite a complicated situation. So if you imagine, and I'm going to use my phone
[11:31.480 -> 11:37.280] here as the edge of the track, and so you've got the white line, there's the
[11:37.280 -> 11:43.200] track, there's a white line, you've got a curb. Now I personally believe behind that
[11:43.200 -> 11:46.800] curb you need to have five meters of what I call
[11:46.800 -> 11:48.440] a natural deterrent.
[11:48.440 -> 11:54.200] So grass, gravel, something like that, that is a deterrent, which means that cars won't
[11:54.200 -> 11:55.680] go there because guess what?
[11:55.680 -> 11:56.760] It's not going to be quicker.
[11:56.760 -> 11:58.000] So drivers won't go there.
[11:58.000 -> 12:04.600] So then basically that means that the issue gets solved on the track and not in the steward's
[12:04.600 -> 12:05.500] room.
[12:05.500 -> 12:07.180] And that's to Tomo's point, right?
[12:07.180 -> 12:09.500] We don't want things decided and discussed upstairs
[12:09.500 -> 12:10.340] and debated.
[12:10.340 -> 12:11.900] So then that's fixed it.
[12:11.900 -> 12:13.260] But then you go to the bikes and they say,
[12:13.260 -> 12:17.000] hang on a second, we don't want grass and gravel
[12:17.000 -> 12:18.380] on the edge of the track because guess what?
[12:18.380 -> 12:19.820] We've only got two wheels.
[12:19.820 -> 12:21.740] We haven't got these big wings and floors
[12:21.740 -> 12:24.700] producing the downforce that Formula One cars have.
[12:24.700 -> 12:29.760] And if a rider makes a small mistake, just dips a little bit of the tyre off, it can be pretty
[12:29.760 -> 12:30.760] catastrophic for them.
[12:30.760 -> 12:34.560] And obviously, bike racing is much more dangerous in many ways.
[12:34.560 -> 12:40.840] So what F1 needs is five metres of grass or gravel on the edge of the kerb, and then you
[12:40.840 -> 12:42.760] can have acres of tarmac.
[12:42.760 -> 12:47.600] What the bikes want is five meters of tarmac
[12:47.960 -> 12:49.760] and then a load of gravel afterwards.
[12:49.760 -> 12:52.340] So they actually want the exact opposite.
[12:52.340 -> 12:56.080] They actually say they want 30% of the runoff area
[12:56.080 -> 12:59.480] to be tarmac and the other 70%, they actually want gravel.
[12:59.480 -> 13:01.720] So it's not like the bike people don't want gravel,
[13:01.720 -> 13:03.200] they just want it the other way around.
[13:03.200 -> 13:06.700] And that's the problem for circuits like the Red Bull Ring,
[13:06.700 -> 13:08.920] like Silverstone, you know, circuits that host
[13:08.920 -> 13:11.320] both MotoGP and Formula One.
[13:12.800 -> 13:15.500] I think the solution, in my opinion, sorry to go on,
[13:15.500 -> 13:18.260] but just to offer a solution, my solution is,
[13:18.260 -> 13:20.640] I think what they have on the outside of Turn 1
[13:20.640 -> 13:22.840] is quite a good answer in Austria,
[13:22.840 -> 13:24.840] where they've got that little yellow sausage kerb,
[13:24.840 -> 13:30.400] which is a bolt-down kerb, and we never saw track limits transgressions at turn one is it because
[13:30.400 -> 13:36.400] if you end up on the top of that yellow curb the car the fro will get beached and you'll lose time
[13:36.400 -> 13:41.600] all the way up the hill or you end up on the other side and you lose time anyway um and i think
[13:41.600 -> 13:47.220] running some sort of sort of curb parallel to the circuit, not perpendicular like we
[13:47.220 -> 13:50.700] had in Monza, which fired that F3 car up into the fence.
[13:50.700 -> 13:55.420] It needs to run along the side of the track in parallel like it does a turn one.
[13:55.420 -> 14:00.300] And so if we can't have the natural deterrent that I've talked about, then I think this
[14:00.300 -> 14:04.500] could be a solution because they're just bolt-on and then you take them off for the MotoGP
[14:04.500 -> 14:07.840] so you're not knocking off the kneecaps of the riders.
[14:09.120 -> 14:13.360] I was going to ask Kareem, sorry, one more question on that. How are track limits measured
[14:14.000 -> 14:20.400] in the race? Because to my mind, given how advanced Formula 1 is as a sport, is there not
[14:20.400 -> 14:29.840] a way that we can, I mean I think I was speaking to Bernie about this and she was saying GPS wouldn't be accurate enough, but can you not map cars onto a circuit to such a like
[14:29.840 -> 14:33.840] I'm thinking Hawkeye with tennis or something like that, can you not map them so you actually
[14:33.840 -> 14:39.280] have a definitive one millimetre in one millimetre out, it just is what it is and we move on and
[14:39.280 -> 14:45.840] that's the you know you know the penalty you know the infringement. Yeah, I think you've sort of answered your point
[14:45.840 -> 14:48.200] in your question, because the trouble is the speed
[14:48.200 -> 14:52.880] of the cars means that today the sensors aren't yet
[14:52.880 -> 14:54.280] accurate enough to read it.
[14:54.280 -> 14:56.320] So you can, even if you've got sensors
[14:56.320 -> 14:58.040] just on the outside of the curb,
[14:58.040 -> 14:59.800] they're not accurate enough to pick up each and every one.
[14:59.800 -> 15:04.000] So they are still relying on CCTV, on onboard cameras,
[15:04.000 -> 15:06.280] on television cameras, etc., etc.,
[15:06.280 -> 15:08.840] to pick up those last little details.
[15:08.840 -> 15:13.040] They have got sensors in there, but it does need to be verified with the cameras just
[15:13.040 -> 15:18.600] because the sensors in today's world, and I know that the FIA are doing a lot of work
[15:18.600 -> 15:29.040] with various technology companies to try and develop a higher frequency, higher, what's it called, more precise sensor basically,
[15:29.440 -> 15:31.740] to be able to trigger when a car goes over it.
[15:31.740 -> 15:35.280] But I think the reality is that the issue can be fixed
[15:35.280 -> 15:36.880] on the tracks, right?
[15:36.880 -> 15:41.080] I think a cop's corner next weekend is always a nightmare.
[15:42.160 -> 15:44.480] We're gonna have the same discussion there.
[15:44.480 -> 15:51.800] And to me, I think this is where somehow the FIA and the FIM and the circuits need to come
[15:51.800 -> 15:59.140] to some sort of consensus and agree, okay, we don't want to be relying on sensors and
[15:59.140 -> 16:01.620] stewards and timing systems.
[16:01.620 -> 16:05.120] We want to just sort it out on track track and then it's clear for everyone to see
[16:05.120 -> 16:08.720] whether somebody's on or off the track right. If you're in the dirt you're off and you're losing
[16:08.720 -> 16:12.960] time and and I really want to take the decision away from the stewards room.
[16:18.160 -> 16:26.400] Tomo I was going to say you were actually at. So, when you're watching a Formula One race,
[16:26.400 -> 16:28.120] as a fan at the circuit,
[16:28.120 -> 16:30.520] how are these penalties being communicated
[16:30.520 -> 16:32.140] to people in the stands?
[16:34.360 -> 16:35.760] They're not.
[16:35.760 -> 16:38.400] I think, to be fair, even watching the TV broadcast,
[16:38.400 -> 16:41.360] so I flew back Sunday morning,
[16:41.360 -> 16:43.120] so I was there Friday, Saturday,
[16:43.120 -> 16:46.100] sat at turn three, incredible view, like, so good was there Friday, Saturday, sat at turn three, incredible view,
[16:46.100 -> 16:48.400] like so good, saw the obviously,
[16:48.400 -> 16:50.560] the squeeze into turn three
[16:50.560 -> 16:52.840] between Checo and Max in the drizzle.
[16:52.840 -> 16:54.920] And it was amazing, but yeah,
[16:54.920 -> 16:57.040] in terms of the penalties being communicated,
[16:57.040 -> 17:00.200] again, I don't even think that the full TV broadcast
[17:01.240 -> 17:03.340] does that, you know, anywhere near enough.
[17:03.340 -> 17:06.080] I think there is, there should be some kind of,
[17:06.080 -> 17:08.360] especially obviously Austria highlights it
[17:08.360 -> 17:10.800] because there's such a propensity
[17:10.800 -> 17:12.600] to get penalties around there,
[17:12.600 -> 17:15.120] but just communicate it in the graphics.
[17:15.120 -> 17:16.380] I mean, yeah, when you're there,
[17:16.380 -> 17:19.240] there's literally none at all.
[17:19.240 -> 17:20.240] You've got the little screen.
[17:20.240 -> 17:23.480] Even at Austria, the screen,
[17:23.480 -> 17:29.600] I remember for qualifying on Friday, they only have to 1 tenth of a second,
[17:29.600 -> 17:35.000] so the gaps between drivers, so for example Charles Leclerc was half a tenth behind Max,
[17:35.000 -> 17:39.800] so it was just 0.0, and I didn't know exactly what the gap was, because 1 tenth is not enough.
[17:39.800 -> 17:45.000] Because that's huge, so no communication of that at all, unfortunately.
[17:45.000 -> 17:47.800] I think that is a solution that I feel like
[17:47.800 -> 17:49.860] the broadcast needs to, because then you,
[17:49.860 -> 17:53.240] it's hard enough anyway, to have context of
[17:53.240 -> 17:56.560] how many times has this car stopped relative to this car,
[17:56.560 -> 17:58.560] or is this car pushing?
[17:58.560 -> 18:00.160] We're not going to get all the information,
[18:00.160 -> 18:01.880] but I think with something like penalties,
[18:01.880 -> 18:04.480] I feel like there's just a little something to know,
[18:04.480 -> 18:08.160] oh, there's still five seconds in hand for this car, so that at least you can
[18:08.160 -> 18:13.520] look at it and draw some kind of more accurate conclusion, I guess.
[18:13.520 -> 18:19.120] Karim, from a driver's point of view, obviously these are the best drivers in the world, you
[18:19.120 -> 18:21.280] know, 20 of the best drivers in the world going at it.
[18:21.280 -> 18:27.320] So clearly, they're very, very good at what they do. Just try to explain to us how difficult it is
[18:27.320 -> 18:29.800] when you're in the cockpit and you're going through
[18:29.800 -> 18:33.100] those corners, nine and 10, to see physically
[18:33.100 -> 18:35.440] where your car is on the track.
[18:35.440 -> 18:37.760] It is difficult because if you imagine
[18:37.760 -> 18:40.360] when you're in the cockpit, your eye line,
[18:40.360 -> 18:43.880] you can't see the tyres, basically.
[18:43.880 -> 18:46.160] You see the tops of the tyres, but you can't see what tires basically, you see the tops of the tires,
[18:46.160 -> 18:48.160] but you can't see what's immediately in front of you
[18:48.160 -> 18:49.520] because you're sitting so low down
[18:49.520 -> 18:53.840] and just your point of view is such
[18:53.840 -> 18:57.840] that you can only see something probably 10 meters in front.
[18:57.840 -> 19:00.320] So for example, if you're right up
[19:00.320 -> 19:02.360] behind somebody's gearbox,
[19:02.360 -> 19:04.280] you can't actually see if you're tapping them.
[19:04.280 -> 19:08.240] You can't see if the edge of your nose is touching their diffuser.
[19:08.240 -> 19:13.420] So it's probably two, three car lengths in front that you can actually see where the
[19:13.420 -> 19:15.360] ground is.
[19:15.360 -> 19:18.320] And therefore it's about judgment.
[19:18.320 -> 19:23.640] Over the weekend you build up your experience and go, okay, I've gone through this corner
[19:23.640 -> 19:28.680] at this speed, I've used this much of the edge of the track hmm got away with it okay a
[19:28.680 -> 19:32.080] bit more bit more and then you'll end up going a bit over in practice and you
[19:32.080 -> 19:35.720] okay there's where the limit is and you try and bring it back it's hard to judge
[19:35.720 -> 19:41.600] in a race because you've got fuel loads changing, tires changing, wind changing
[19:41.600 -> 19:45.080] etc etc but to your point it is the best drivers in the world,
[19:45.080 -> 19:46.880] and I fully accept that.
[19:46.880 -> 19:50.800] I just think, you know, some of those transgressions
[19:50.800 -> 19:53.720] we're talking were centimeters,
[19:53.720 -> 19:55.820] you know, absolutely centimeters.
[19:55.820 -> 19:57.840] And that's, it's very hard to see.
[19:58.960 -> 20:01.460] So, you know, I have to say,
[20:02.720 -> 20:05.000] George and Joe Guan Yu,
[20:05.900 -> 20:07.780] you know, they were the only two drivers,
[20:07.780 -> 20:10.980] obviously, as Tomo said, who didn't go off the track.
[20:10.980 -> 20:13.620] And to do that, it means you're having
[20:13.620 -> 20:16.700] a slightly more conservative race, basically.
[20:16.700 -> 20:19.740] You know, if you're in a Lewis versus Lando battle
[20:19.740 -> 20:21.680] and you're absolutely ragging it
[20:21.680 -> 20:26.960] through turns nine and 10 every lap. It's very hard. And you
[20:26.960 -> 20:29.920] know what, it's a frustrating thing as well. I remember I did a sports car race,
[20:29.920 -> 20:34.840] a European Le Mans race in Austria, and I got a drive-through penalty for... they
[20:34.840 -> 20:38.400] were quite strong there, it wasn't just five seconds, it was a drive-through for
[20:38.400 -> 20:43.200] track limits there. And it's like you're coming through the corner and you're
[20:43.200 -> 20:45.560] like, oh, got away with it, oh, got away with it.
[20:45.560 -> 20:48.320] And actually, I don't like that.
[20:48.320 -> 20:50.660] Like, you know, it's not a fun way
[20:50.660 -> 20:51.900] to be driving a motor race.
[20:51.900 -> 20:54.080] You want to be able to just be driving
[20:54.080 -> 20:57.120] and watching the other people and be in the battle,
[20:57.120 -> 21:00.520] not thinking about, oh, oh, I don't want to,
[21:00.520 -> 21:02.320] the stewards aren't seeing me there.
[21:03.640 -> 21:07.000] The thing is, I think as well, like Joe in the end, he finished P12,
[21:07.000 -> 21:10.000] you know, it wasn't a mile off the points after a weekend that,
[21:10.000 -> 21:14.000] you know, didn't seem particularly kind of special for Alfa Romeo,
[21:14.000 -> 21:16.000] but he was able to gain.
[21:16.000 -> 21:21.000] And I do think there's definitely an argument for, again,
[21:21.000 -> 21:23.000] rather than changing the track,
[21:23.000 -> 21:25.680] I think there's an argument for keeping this,
[21:26.560 -> 21:28.720] it almost builds a degree of strategy.
[21:28.720 -> 21:31.520] Do you drive a little bit more conservatively,
[21:31.520 -> 21:33.500] but then potentially bank some,
[21:34.880 -> 21:38.680] you get three strikes and then it's the black and white flag,
[21:38.680 -> 21:40.840] drive a bit more conservatively
[21:40.840 -> 21:42.300] if people are getting penalties in front,
[21:42.300 -> 21:44.620] like we saw like the old last lap Lando
[21:44.620 -> 21:49.600] when Lewis got that five second back in 2021, 2020, sorry.
[21:50.600 -> 21:54.120] And Lando knew yet the five seconds,
[21:54.120 -> 21:57.000] yet to close that gap and he closed it to 4.8.
[21:57.000 -> 21:59.360] And again, we've got 20,
[21:59.360 -> 22:01.560] well, meant to have 24 races on the calendar.
[22:01.560 -> 22:03.920] And part of me is like, actually,
[22:03.920 -> 22:06.680] if they can get that system where they can really,
[22:06.680 -> 22:09.360] truly be accurate, Hawkeye-esque,
[22:09.360 -> 22:11.200] goal-line technology-esque,
[22:11.200 -> 22:14.960] if that can exist, then I'm not against
[22:14.960 -> 22:16.320] actually keeping it as it is
[22:16.320 -> 22:18.160] and just having this as a component.
[22:18.160 -> 22:20.680] And maybe you, Karun, as a racing driver,
[22:20.680 -> 22:21.640] you might not enjoy that,
[22:21.640 -> 22:23.440] but I think from an entertainment point of view,
[22:23.440 -> 22:32.080] as a fan, I could kind of buy into that. I think it's a big if. I sort of semi-agree with you. I think
[22:33.360 -> 22:39.520] it can work. I mean, I was at LODs on Saturday, and you're right, there's a dismissal happens,
[22:39.520 -> 22:43.520] and there's that element of, oh, as it all goes up to Third Empire, and you're all sitting there
[22:43.520 -> 22:45.360] waiting for a decision. And I agree, there is an element of sort of it all goes up to third empire and you're all sitting there waiting for a decision
[22:45.360 -> 22:50.800] and I agree there is an element of of sort of entertainment in that but it only works because
[22:50.800 -> 22:57.120] they've got an accurate system now in in cricket and in tennis um so I I sort of semi agree with
[22:57.120 -> 23:03.280] you um but I think it's a big big if at the moment and until we get to that point we need to find
[23:03.280 -> 23:06.440] another solution we can't have more races like this.
[23:06.440 -> 23:10.400] Yeah, certainly can't do it five hours after the race.
[23:10.400 -> 23:12.200] Just a final thought on it as well.
[23:12.200 -> 23:14.680] And I know Max, I think, well, you were saying
[23:14.680 -> 23:16.420] if you're not under pressure throughout a race,
[23:16.420 -> 23:18.640] then obviously you're not gonna be pushing the track limits
[23:18.640 -> 23:19.460] in the same way that you would
[23:19.460 -> 23:20.960] if you were in a wheel-to-wheel battle.
[23:20.960 -> 23:24.620] But just imagine if Max, having pitted onto softs
[23:24.620 -> 23:25.600] to get the fastest lap
[23:25.600 -> 23:32.320] and reduced his 25 second lead down to about five seconds imagine if he got pinged for the penalty
[23:32.320 -> 23:37.360] afterwards and that was the reason why Red Bull didn't win all the races this year just just
[23:37.360 -> 23:41.760] just imagine just imagine but you know what Matt and this is a good way to segue away from this
[23:41.760 -> 23:45.460] topic I just think he's operating at such a high level.
[23:45.460 -> 23:47.400] You know, I go back to Barcelona, right?
[23:47.400 -> 23:52.400] He was droning around doing low 117, 17.3, 17.4,
[23:52.840 -> 23:54.720] 17.3, 17.4, he didn't, you know,
[23:54.720 -> 23:56.560] on that occasion didn't pit for new tires.
[23:56.560 -> 23:58.840] Got on the radio and said, I'd like to go fastest lap.
[23:58.840 -> 24:01.320] They say to him, you've already had a track limits warning.
[24:01.320 -> 24:03.280] We want you to be careful.
[24:03.280 -> 24:06.000] Bosh, 16.3, like a second quicker than
[24:06.000 -> 24:11.360] he's been doing that entire stint just for kicks. And he didn't go off the track, he knew exactly
[24:11.360 -> 24:19.200] what he was doing. I just think he's a driver now who's in such a zone and the car is in such a good
[24:19.200 -> 24:24.320] position for him as well that he's just got the confidence that he knows he's not going to go
[24:24.320 -> 24:29.200] off track, he knows he's not going to lose the win. He knows he's not going to get a penalty. And
[24:29.200 -> 24:33.760] it's commendable, right? You know, you, but it's the same like when we watched that Lewis
[24:33.760 -> 24:39.600] era a decade ago, or nearly a decade ago, or you watched the Michael era two decades
[24:39.600 -> 24:46.620] ago, you just were watching greatness unfold. And it's, it's remarkable to see the little details that they achieve
[24:47.480 -> 24:53.260] The stats are incredible. I'm gonna nick one from your Twitter feed actually Karim. You said I'll send you the invoice
[24:53.800 -> 24:58.280] Yeah, thank you very much. You can you can put it on sky not not not Matt Baker. Thank you very much
[24:58.920 -> 25:05.520] Yeah, you would be you said max would be leading the construct' Championship himself by 51 points. Absolutely ridiculous.
[25:06.720 -> 25:12.160] And then also he's not far off the shared record of nine consecutive victories,
[25:12.160 -> 25:17.200] which is held by Alberto Ascari and Sebastian Vettel. So this was his fifth. He could reach
[25:17.200 -> 25:21.680] nine. It's very conceivable he could reach nine. And one more for you, that Red Bull scored their
[25:21.680 -> 25:25.140] 10th consecutive win, and that's the second longest streak in history
[25:25.140 -> 25:28.200] behind McLaren's 11 in a row in 1988.
[25:28.200 -> 25:29.880] So they have the chance to equal that
[25:29.880 -> 25:32.180] at Silverstone this week.
[25:32.180 -> 25:34.480] Tomo, what did you make of Verstappen's performance?
[25:34.480 -> 25:36.840] It like, everything that got thrown at him,
[25:36.840 -> 25:38.380] you know, well, which to be fair,
[25:38.380 -> 25:39.380] probably wasn't all that much,
[25:39.380 -> 25:42.000] but everything across the weekend,
[25:42.000 -> 25:43.920] they had the sprint, you know, the lack of practice,
[25:43.920 -> 25:46.440] he just seems to breeze through it, doesn't he?
[25:46.440 -> 25:48.840] It's inevitable, isn't it?
[25:48.840 -> 25:52.440] Just Max is, like you say, Karun, is the zone.
[25:52.440 -> 25:54.040] That's the perfect way of putting it.
[25:54.040 -> 25:57.120] There's no driver I think you can trust more
[25:57.120 -> 26:00.200] to drive on that absolute limit
[26:00.200 -> 26:03.720] and extract the absolute maximum from that incredible car.
[26:03.720 -> 26:07.640] And it's again, driver, car, in perfect harmony.
[26:09.040 -> 26:10.520] Yeah, it's so impressive.
[26:10.520 -> 26:12.240] And to do it in Austria as well,
[26:12.240 -> 26:15.200] which again, having been there for the first time,
[26:15.200 -> 26:19.640] it is like the support for Max for that is crazy.
[26:19.640 -> 26:23.480] It's mad, like going to a Grand Prix that is so,
[26:23.480 -> 26:24.600] I've never been to Italy,
[26:24.600 -> 26:26.600] so I've never seen the Ferrari support
[26:26.600 -> 26:29.680] you get in Monza, for example.
[26:29.680 -> 26:31.240] But I've been to Silverstone in Canada,
[26:31.240 -> 26:32.880] I've been to a few races,
[26:32.880 -> 26:34.360] and it's always been, you know,
[26:34.360 -> 26:36.960] it's a varied fan base,
[26:36.960 -> 26:40.960] but it's so heavy into Max in Austria,
[26:40.960 -> 26:42.200] so for him to do it there,
[26:42.200 -> 26:43.880] and go for the fastest lap as well,
[26:43.880 -> 26:49.280] and give the fans what they kind of wanted in that, because I'm sure Max acknowledges
[26:49.280 -> 26:52.540] that Austria has been, you know, was the de facto home race for a long time
[26:52.540 -> 26:57.080] before Zandvoort came on the calendar, so to do it there as well, yeah I'm glad
[26:57.080 -> 27:02.000] Red Bull let him come in and go for that fastest lap because that was like the
[27:02.000 -> 27:06.880] the cherry on top of what has been a incredible season for him.
[27:06.880 -> 27:08.880] Like it's easy to get to a point
[27:08.880 -> 27:10.760] where you kind of just take it for granted,
[27:10.760 -> 27:14.720] but he is doing incredible, you know,
[27:14.720 -> 27:18.960] peak Hamilton, Vettel, Schumacher, Senna-esque,
[27:18.960 -> 27:21.120] you know, performances week after week after week.
[27:21.120 -> 27:23.720] And it's, yeah, it's incredible.
[27:23.720 -> 27:27.680] Were you enjoying any of the Dutch EDM in the ground?
[27:27.680 -> 27:32.680] Yeah there was a bit, the Schnitzelburgers were really good.
[27:32.680 -> 27:35.960] They were quite pricey, I'll be honest they were quite pricey
[27:35.960 -> 27:39.320] but they were decent so they paid back.
[27:39.320 -> 27:41.080] Obviously there was a lot of Red Bull
[27:41.080 -> 27:41.960] because they owned the track,
[27:41.960 -> 27:44.160] there was a lot of Red Bull on show
[27:44.160 -> 27:46.960] but I'm not an energy drink drinker.
[27:46.960 -> 27:49.000] So, oh, and Karun's left us as well.
[27:49.000 -> 27:50.460] He had enough.
[27:50.460 -> 28:07.360] Ah, Karun, right, you're back. ♪ Hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey because I want to talk about McLaren and a really interesting weekend for McLaren. Norris, who actually finished fifth in the race
[28:07.360 -> 28:09.200] but was bumped up to P4.
[28:09.200 -> 28:11.420] Karun, big improvements at McLaren.
[28:11.420 -> 28:15.120] That upgrade package seems to be looking good, doesn't it?
[28:15.120 -> 28:17.840] Well, I'm always a bit nervous about this
[28:17.840 -> 28:20.820] because one swallow doesn't a summer make
[28:20.820 -> 28:24.520] and Austria is A, a track that Lando is exceptional at,
[28:24.520 -> 28:25.360] B, McLaren have
[28:25.360 -> 28:29.920] historically been pretty good there. So let's see as the rest of the season unfolds, you know,
[28:29.920 -> 28:34.880] they've been sort of up and down a bit, haven't they? But yeah, you're right, you know, hopefully,
[28:35.760 -> 28:39.200] hopefully, this is the turning point that the upgrade package has worked and
[28:39.200 -> 28:44.000] Oscar have it this weekend at Silverstone and we'll get to see because, you know, if you consider
[28:44.000 -> 28:48.560] where they were at the start of the year, you know, they had the slowest car at some
[28:48.560 -> 28:54.200] points in the opening three races and all of a sudden this weekend they're just off
[28:54.200 -> 28:58.160] the podium. They're quicker, genuinely quicker than Aston, genuinely quicker than Mercedes,
[28:58.160 -> 29:05.600] or at least Landa was. That's an amazing turnaround if this is not a one-off and this is something that could
[29:05.600 -> 29:06.600] carry on.
[29:06.600 -> 29:11.680] Tom, you were actually at the MTC yesterday, weren't you, for the launch of their new livery
[29:11.680 -> 29:13.240] this week.
[29:13.240 -> 29:14.240] What was the mood?
[29:14.240 -> 29:17.760] I imagine a lot better launching a livery where you've got a slightly better car, you
[29:17.760 -> 29:18.760] feel, underneath you.
[29:18.760 -> 29:23.160] Yes, Lando had a bit of a twinkle in his eye, I think.
[29:23.160 -> 29:25.680] He was very satisfied, rightly so, P4.
[29:27.040 -> 29:28.160] And I think Oscar, I know Oscar, I think he tweeted after the race,
[29:28.160 -> 29:29.560] you know, can't wait for the upgrades.
[29:29.560 -> 29:32.560] So, yeah, there's, I mean, you know,
[29:32.560 -> 29:35.160] around a track like Austria, like you say, Karun,
[29:35.160 -> 29:36.640] you know, they typically run well there.
[29:36.640 -> 29:37.560] And I think it goes both ways,
[29:37.560 -> 29:39.720] because I know Fernando after the race was like,
[29:39.720 -> 29:41.800] Aston Martin last year wasn't particularly strong
[29:41.800 -> 29:43.560] around here, so he's not overly surprised
[29:43.560 -> 29:46.280] they didn't have a lot of performance this week. But yeah I think
[29:46.280 -> 29:50.800] you know momentum is an important thing I suppose and you know being able to get
[29:50.800 -> 29:55.560] them upgrades I know there's more to come as well. I think there's going to be
[29:55.560 -> 30:01.880] some more potentially Silverstone slash Hungary maybe Singapore as well so yeah
[30:01.880 -> 30:04.360] I think there's there's more to come from McLaren it's a good upward
[30:04.360 -> 30:05.000] trajectory they need to the scrap is still with Alpine because like you say as well. So, yeah, I think there's more to come from McLaren. It's a good upward trajectory.
[30:05.000 -> 30:09.600] They need to... The scrap is still with Alpine because, like you say, Karun, at the start
[30:09.600 -> 30:16.200] of the season, the car was weak. So they have to make up for kind of lost points there.
[30:16.200 -> 30:21.000] But yeah, I think it's looking good. I think Piastri, you know, given this is his rookie
[30:21.000 -> 30:27.280] season, I think his gap relative to Lando typically has been pretty,
[30:27.280 -> 30:30.040] two, three attempts qualifying, kind of averaging out.
[30:30.040 -> 30:32.440] So, yeah, I think the mood in the team
[30:32.440 -> 30:34.160] should rightfully be positive.
[30:34.160 -> 30:36.620] I mean, I know Micah Hackett is feeling very positive.
[30:36.620 -> 30:39.680] I know there's been a few quotes from him saying that,
[30:39.680 -> 30:41.760] you know, he hopes the McLaren will be fighting
[30:41.760 -> 30:43.080] with Red Bull by the end of the season,
[30:43.080 -> 30:44.880] which I'm sure they'll take it.
[30:44.880 -> 30:46.440] I'm sure they'll take it. I'm sure they'll take it.
[30:46.440 -> 30:48.000] We'll see about that.
[30:48.000 -> 30:49.600] I love his optimism.
[30:50.480 -> 30:53.720] It was a strange weekend though, guys, wasn't it?
[30:53.720 -> 30:55.600] I was trying to get my head around it this morning
[30:55.600 -> 31:00.360] because did Aston and Mercedes underperform,
[31:00.360 -> 31:04.440] which made Ferrari look better than they did
[31:04.440 -> 31:06.720] and therefore made McLaren look better.
[31:06.720 -> 31:08.040] I think there is an element of that.
[31:08.040 -> 31:09.900] I think the circuit layout,
[31:11.000 -> 31:14.080] I think that the Mercedes didn't ever seem comfortable,
[31:14.080 -> 31:15.880] never got the car in a setup window
[31:15.880 -> 31:17.420] that they were happy at.
[31:17.420 -> 31:20.320] Their slow speed rotation wasn't great.
[31:23.200 -> 31:26.440] I think that somewhat flattered Lando and the Ferraris a bit.
[31:26.440 -> 31:28.360] So I'll be interested to see when we get to Silverstone,
[31:28.360 -> 31:31.280] which is a very different circuit,
[31:31.280 -> 31:35.200] obviously flat, no elevation changes really,
[31:35.200 -> 31:37.040] very high speed.
[31:37.040 -> 31:39.560] I do think the way that Aston and Mercedes
[31:39.560 -> 31:42.140] have got their rear ride height control
[31:42.140 -> 31:46.000] and the way they set their aero map, they should be more
[31:46.000 -> 31:49.640] competitive this coming weekend.
[31:49.640 -> 31:52.940] And I think Ferrari on a high speed track like this will start to struggle again with
[31:52.940 -> 31:56.540] overloading the tyres, but they've got an update obviously, you know, so maybe it has
[31:56.540 -> 31:57.540] changed it.
[31:57.540 -> 32:03.960] So I'm very sceptical about looking at, you know, one race and saying this is now the
[32:03.960 -> 32:05.400] form guide and Ferrari now have the second
[32:05.400 -> 32:10.680] fastest car. I just think that midfield pack between Ferrari, Mercedes and Aston are so
[32:10.680 -> 32:15.880] tight that there's certain weekends and certain circuits and conditions that suit one or the
[32:15.880 -> 32:21.480] other. We'll have to see as the updates come through because actually Gasly was quick and
[32:21.480 -> 32:26.720] Ocon were quick, weren't they? At different points of the weekend. They were both fast in qualifying and over one lap.
[32:26.720 -> 32:28.320] And then in the race, they seemed to fade away.
[32:28.320 -> 32:30.760] So that's just set up and tires.
[32:32.420 -> 32:34.740] Yeah, I think that's part of the intrigue.
[32:34.740 -> 32:38.480] I mean, was it George who said, Matt, a couple of races ago,
[32:38.480 -> 32:40.180] you know, if we got rid of Max,
[32:40.180 -> 32:43.340] this would be a fantastic World Championship battle.
[32:43.340 -> 32:44.180] It really was.
[32:44.180 -> 32:45.960] So we all just, we just need to scroll the page.
[32:45.960 -> 32:47.040] When you look at the Championship battle,
[32:47.040 -> 32:48.360] just look from second onwards.
[32:48.360 -> 32:51.200] I literally, I did a video about this.
[32:51.200 -> 32:53.560] So I replaced, I imagined that, you know,
[32:53.560 -> 32:55.920] Max was just a kind of back marker driver,
[32:55.920 -> 32:56.920] never scoring any points.
[32:56.920 -> 32:59.440] And before this weekend,
[32:59.440 -> 33:01.840] Fernando was actually one point ahead of Checo.
[33:02.880 -> 33:05.800] Now, obviously, Checo, Checo, good recovery results,
[33:05.800 -> 33:07.560] so he'd be now leading the championship.
[33:07.560 -> 33:08.640] But you're right, it would be super,
[33:08.640 -> 33:10.840] and Lewis would be right up there as well
[33:10.840 -> 33:11.960] in terms of points.
[33:11.960 -> 33:15.400] So yeah, look, I think again,
[33:15.400 -> 33:17.200] not to take anything away from Max,
[33:17.200 -> 33:21.120] he's doing incredible work at the front at the moment.
[33:21.120 -> 33:27.100] But I am also quite, I feel a degree of optimism that the convergence,
[33:27.100 -> 33:31.680] I mean, what, the top 10 in Q1 split by 8 1 1 1 1?
[33:31.680 -> 33:36.200] I know it's a short track, but I think that's,
[33:36.200 -> 33:38.640] it's positive, and I think even in Q3,
[33:38.640 -> 33:42.080] it was about 7 1 1 1 1, excluding Alex,
[33:42.080 -> 33:43.340] who got his time deleted.
[33:43.340 -> 33:46.680] So the convergence is I'm
[33:46.680 -> 33:51.440] feeling confident boys I don't know if that's I'm too optimistic yeah no I think
[33:51.440 -> 33:55.720] I think you are onto something there because I was looking back so obviously
[33:55.720 -> 34:01.120] a second year of a big regulation change and I compared it with 2015 which was a
[34:01.120 -> 34:12.000] second year of a big regulation change or the last big regulation change. This time around, the top 10 was covered by second in Q3. In 2015, it was a second
[34:12.000 -> 34:18.000] and a half. We're a big, big chunk closer in terms of that convergent that Tomo just
[34:18.000 -> 34:24.680] talked about. I put a tweet out saying, it'd be quite good fun if Max just went to draw
[34:24.680 -> 34:26.100] the Alcatrai for a few races
[34:26.100 -> 34:28.260] to let the championship battle tighten up.
[34:28.260 -> 34:30.380] Get Daniel in there, that'll be a chance
[34:30.380 -> 34:31.300] for them to evaluate.
[34:31.300 -> 34:33.900] Daniel versus Checo, shootout for next year.
[34:35.140 -> 34:35.980] Yeah, Max-
[34:35.980 -> 34:36.800] Well, because Max would have already won
[34:36.800 -> 34:38.340] the World Championship, so this is just kind of
[34:38.340 -> 34:39.780] a mid-season, you know.
[34:39.780 -> 34:41.820] But Crofty said a stat, didn't he,
[34:41.820 -> 34:44.580] that Max could miss every race until the Dutch Grand Prix
[34:44.580 -> 34:45.560] and still be in the championship
[34:45.560 -> 34:46.060] lead.
[34:46.060 -> 34:48.840] So stick him in an Alfa Tauri for three or four races,
[34:48.840 -> 34:50.960] and that'll be fun to watch and see what he can do.
[34:50.960 -> 34:52.640] What an extended holiday.
[34:52.640 -> 34:55.080] It'd be good marketing for Alfa Tauri, to be fair.
[34:55.080 -> 34:56.760] Yeah, exactly.
[34:56.760 -> 34:58.320] Yeah, I mean, it'd be pretty depressing
[34:58.320 -> 35:00.480] for their incumbent drivers if he's in an Alfa Tauri
[35:00.480 -> 35:01.760] and still getting on the podium.
[35:01.760 -> 35:02.260] Yeah.
[35:02.260 -> 35:04.120] True.
[35:04.120 -> 35:05.200] Very much so.
[35:05.200 -> 35:09.800] I wonder with the McLaren, obviously it's easy to get ahead of yourselves with McLaren
[35:09.800 -> 35:12.920] this weekend and say, you know, it's all looking good, it's all looking amazing.
[35:12.920 -> 35:17.120] I wonder if they will look at what happened to Mercedes in Spain and actually go, you
[35:17.120 -> 35:21.640] know, after Spain, Mercedes looked for all intents and purposes, like they'd made huge
[35:21.640 -> 35:23.880] gains and huge progress.
[35:23.880 -> 35:29.120] And Karim, I guess, you know, we have to remember that we're going to specific tracks that suit specific
[35:29.120 -> 35:34.520] cars. And, you know, would you say perhaps Silverstone is going to be a slightly more
[35:34.520 -> 35:38.440] level playing field? Is that is that fair to say? Are we going to get more of an idea
[35:38.440 -> 35:45.480] after this weekend about where the cars sit? Yeah, I mean Silverstone is all about high speed.
[35:45.480 -> 35:49.740] You've really only got three slow speed corners now.
[35:51.560 -> 35:53.280] Well, four if you argue, Luffield.
[35:53.280 -> 35:55.720] But it's a completely different track.
[35:55.720 -> 35:57.800] It's very wind sensitive, very wind affected,
[35:57.800 -> 35:59.360] and that's bad for Ferrari.
[35:59.360 -> 36:03.760] Their car is on a very narrow, sort of small knife edge
[36:03.760 -> 36:06.240] in terms of their wind sensitivity.
[36:06.240 -> 36:07.840] And that could be problematic.
[36:07.840 -> 36:10.280] I think, you know, I'm just looking at the trees
[36:10.280 -> 36:12.360] in my back garden at the moment and they are going mad.
[36:12.360 -> 36:14.760] So if this wind carries on for the rest of the week,
[36:14.760 -> 36:16.400] that's a big problem for Ferrari.
[36:17.960 -> 36:19.760] So I think let's take Red Bull out of it.
[36:19.760 -> 36:24.080] I would say we're gonna be back to a Fernando
[36:24.080 -> 36:25.200] versus the Mercedes.
[36:25.200 -> 36:27.120] And listen, that's great for the home crowd, right?
[36:27.120 -> 36:30.240] If we can have George and Lewis in contention for a podium,
[36:30.240 -> 36:32.480] that'll be fantastic for the home crowd.
[36:33.200 -> 36:37.680] Yeah. What do you make of Ferrari after Austria, Tommo?
[36:38.880 -> 36:41.520] Schall seemed pretty buoyed, didn't he, from that result?
[36:42.240 -> 36:46.280] And looking at Silverstone, which is a track that he likes.
[36:46.280 -> 36:50.200] Yeah, I think, I feel like Ferrari got, you know,
[36:50.200 -> 36:52.760] the timing of that VSC for Hulkenberg,
[36:52.760 -> 36:55.600] who's ironically running a Ferrari power unit.
[36:55.600 -> 36:57.440] I'm not sure if exactly it was the power unit
[36:57.440 -> 37:00.680] that went pop, but yeah, it wasn't great timing for them.
[37:00.680 -> 37:03.800] And Carlos's pace actually looks really strong, didn't it?
[37:03.800 -> 37:08.060] So there was a bit of a, Carlos was chomping at the bit,
[37:08.060 -> 37:09.460] thinking, oh, I want to get past Charles
[37:09.460 -> 37:11.100] when the team was saying to kind of hold position.
[37:11.100 -> 37:14.460] So that was kind of a bit of a conflicting one.
[37:14.460 -> 37:16.340] But again, this is the second, you know, Canada,
[37:16.340 -> 37:18.100] as much as their qualifying was bad,
[37:18.100 -> 37:20.260] their race pace was really good in Canada
[37:20.260 -> 37:21.540] and they got that clean air
[37:21.540 -> 37:23.540] and they managed to kind of move up through the field.
[37:23.540 -> 37:31.360] So two good races back to back for Ferrari. Yeah, I'd love, of course, you know, one lap pace,
[37:31.360 -> 37:36.240] you know, Scholl within a tenth of Max in qualifying in Austria, you know, is the only
[37:36.240 -> 37:41.680] driver not in a Red Bull who's got any pole positions this year. And of course, I'd love it
[37:41.680 -> 37:46.320] to be Ferrari if they can make up the lost ground
[37:46.320 -> 37:50.160] and hopefully got some kind of better understanding
[37:50.160 -> 37:51.560] of these tyre issues.
[37:51.560 -> 37:52.780] But like you say, Karun,
[37:52.780 -> 37:54.040] they're operating windows small,
[37:54.040 -> 37:55.840] same for a team like Williams,
[37:55.840 -> 37:57.560] very wind affected as well.
[37:57.560 -> 38:00.640] So I'd love to believe,
[38:00.640 -> 38:02.480] but Ferrari is just that team that
[38:03.520 -> 38:04.640] when it doesn't work out,
[38:04.640 -> 38:09.520] it hurts more because they just... there's no team like Ferrari and
[38:09.520 -> 38:13.520] I'd love to just for the I think it'd be so good for the sport to see them
[38:13.520 -> 38:18.400] backfired at the front and again I think Carlos is doing, he's impressed
[38:18.400 -> 38:26.080] me actually this year how he's been able to hang with Charles that little bit more. He's obviously outscored him
[38:26.080 -> 38:31.920] so far but Charles had his you know DNF in Bahrain and that. This isn't the year for Ferrari this
[38:31.920 -> 38:38.880] year but hopefully they can build and consolidate and maybe 2024 we'll see. That was Ferrari's most
[38:38.880 -> 38:45.500] convincing weekend of the season I think you know if race pace, obviously they qualified well in Bahrain,
[38:45.500 -> 38:48.160] but the race pace was appalling.
[38:48.160 -> 38:51.280] I actually think this was their most solid weekend
[38:51.280 -> 38:52.120] on the whole.
[38:52.960 -> 38:56.240] I think your point about Carlos is absolutely valid.
[38:56.240 -> 38:58.160] The first two stints of the race,
[38:58.160 -> 38:59.760] he was very, very competitive,
[38:59.760 -> 39:01.260] and then it just sort of went away from him,
[39:01.260 -> 39:03.120] and then the frustration, the track limits,
[39:03.120 -> 39:10.600] and just losing that time because guess what we had another Ferrari strategic
[39:10.600 -> 39:17.560] talking point around the first pit stop and it kind of messed Carlos's race up actually
[39:17.560 -> 39:22.320] you know having that, I think they should have split the strategy at that point which
[39:22.320 -> 39:26.800] is sort of what he was alluding to I think think he came on the radio, didn't he, and said, why do we pit and double stack?
[39:26.800 -> 39:29.960] Because he just lost, he lost seven, eight seconds,
[39:29.960 -> 39:31.080] and that puts you in the pack.
[39:31.080 -> 39:32.480] And then you have to come past people
[39:32.480 -> 39:33.840] and you lose another four, five seconds.
[39:33.840 -> 39:36.020] And it's, you know, across the race time,
[39:36.020 -> 39:39.020] he lost 10, 12 seconds to Schaal,
[39:39.020 -> 39:40.040] and then he's lost contact.
[39:40.040 -> 39:43.080] You know, then it's sort of, you're in this cycle then.
[39:43.080 -> 39:46.080] So I do think they could have done some things
[39:46.080 -> 39:47.680] to help him out at that first stage,
[39:47.680 -> 39:49.440] because I was watching it on the live timing.
[39:49.440 -> 39:53.880] And you could kind of tell there was a safety car
[39:53.880 -> 39:57.520] to VSC coming, because where Nico's car was,
[39:57.520 -> 39:59.680] it's like, that's not going to be quick to clear.
[39:59.680 -> 40:02.880] And we know Nils Vittich is pretty quick
[40:02.880 -> 40:05.560] with red flags and safety cars and things.
[40:05.560 -> 40:08.560] He's not keen to just let things go under double yellows.
[40:08.560 -> 40:10.400] So which is fair enough.
[40:10.400 -> 40:14.720] That's his philosophy and I think that it just is what it is.
[40:14.720 -> 40:18.680] So if I were Ferrari, I would have gambled on one or the other.
[40:18.680 -> 40:24.080] Just split the strategies, get one car in a lap earlier, which is when Lewis and people
[40:24.080 -> 40:26.360] like that came in for their first stop.
[40:26.360 -> 40:28.580] You know, I just feel again,
[40:28.580 -> 40:32.040] they're not as on it as a Red Bull
[40:32.040 -> 40:35.240] or a Aston or a Mercedes might be.
[40:35.240 -> 40:38.320] Yeah, because I mean, neither of the Red Bulls pitted,
[40:38.320 -> 40:41.200] they both kind of stuck to their strategy.
[40:41.200 -> 40:42.360] Obviously, they're in Red Bulls.
[40:42.360 -> 40:45.520] So, you know, maybe not I don't know if Carlos
[40:45.520 -> 40:50.640] would have I guess in hindsight maybe we'd have been really interested to see if he would have
[40:50.640 -> 40:56.480] you know been clear of Checo by the end obviously Checo was coming through quick but also it would
[40:56.480 -> 41:02.080] have it might have denied us that really really good multi-lap battle between the two of them so
[41:02.080 -> 41:05.720] you know swings and roundabouts.
[41:05.720 -> 41:10.520] Let's just, before we go, talk about upgrades. And I want to understand, Karim, from you,
[41:10.520 -> 41:14.560] there's a lot of talk of upgrades coming. We talked about with McLaren and a lot of
[41:14.560 -> 41:20.080] teams are rushing upgrades through. Can you just tell us about the process of, sort of
[41:20.080 -> 41:24.360] almost from designing an upgrade all the way through to getting it on the car. How easy
[41:24.360 -> 41:28.760] is it for teams to rush? I'm using the word rush because that's kind of what drivers are
[41:28.760 -> 41:31.960] saying, but how easy is it to get those upgrades through?
[41:31.960 -> 41:37.100] I think this is where you have to really pay tribute to what Williams did with Albon and
[41:37.100 -> 41:46.460] Ferrari have done. The upgrade that they brought I believe was only due for Budapest, which is quite some way away. And they had a massive push.
[41:46.460 -> 41:51.220] You know, to quickly summarize, if you think of an idea,
[41:51.220 -> 41:54.260] you're designing it in CFD, you're validating it,
[41:54.260 -> 41:56.580] then you make the model, it goes into the wind tunnel,
[41:56.580 -> 41:57.820] they're limited in the wind tunnel time,
[41:57.820 -> 42:00.100] so they have to be efficient in terms of validating it.
[42:00.100 -> 42:04.780] And nowadays, not everything is necessarily validated.
[42:04.780 -> 42:05.000] You know, sometimes they do take a risk and just look at the CFD numbers and nowadays not everything is necessarily validated.
[42:05.000 -> 42:07.280] Sometimes they do take a risk
[42:07.280 -> 42:09.520] and just look at the CFD numbers
[42:09.520 -> 42:10.840] and try and put something on the car,
[42:10.840 -> 42:13.040] but to sanity check it,
[42:13.040 -> 42:15.800] you're better off making a 60% scale,
[42:15.800 -> 42:17.040] put it in the wind tunnel.
[42:17.040 -> 42:18.360] So therefore the timeline,
[42:18.360 -> 42:19.720] you've got to think of an idea,
[42:19.720 -> 42:22.600] draw it up, design it, test it on CFD,
[42:22.600 -> 42:26.240] make a small model, test it in the wind tunnel. If it works,
[42:26.240 -> 42:33.380] then you have to build a full-size one. It has to be tested at the factory in terms of
[42:33.380 -> 42:41.920] loads and they'll have various ways to check the load-bearing effect of that, really. For
[42:41.920 -> 42:45.440] example, if you've got a wing and you're putting X amount of G onto it,
[42:45.440 -> 42:47.200] can it sustain the load of it if you've got
[42:47.200 -> 42:48.860] a new, updated, different front wing
[42:48.860 -> 42:50.700] or a different rear wing?
[42:50.700 -> 42:51.780] So once I go through all that,
[42:51.780 -> 42:54.640] you're looking at sort of six, seven weeks, really,
[42:54.640 -> 42:56.940] as a normal lead time, six to eight weeks,
[42:56.940 -> 42:59.000] depending on the size of the part and what it is.
[42:59.000 -> 43:02.000] And also, it has to work in conjunction with other bits.
[43:02.000 -> 43:06.080] You can't just, as Mercedes have said so many times, you can't
[43:06.080 -> 43:09.840] just take the side paws off a Red Bull and put it in their car. It has to work in conjunction
[43:09.840 -> 43:15.520] with the rest of the car. To make sure that it's all working fine and in tune with each
[43:15.520 -> 43:22.320] other nowadays with cost cap, with wind tunnel limitations, you cannot afford to bring a
[43:22.320 -> 43:27.320] part to a race weekend, put it on the car, that's not going to add lap time.
[43:27.320 -> 43:30.760] If it does, if it, you know, if you have that situation,
[43:30.760 -> 43:32.960] then you are in big trouble
[43:32.960 -> 43:35.080] because the competition is just too tough.
[43:35.080 -> 43:36.720] Tomo, we're seeing quite a few,
[43:36.720 -> 43:39.720] why do you think we're seeing so much of these upgrades
[43:39.720 -> 43:41.280] being rushed through this year?
[43:41.280 -> 43:43.880] It feels like that's the narrative of a lot of teams
[43:43.880 -> 43:47.720] is that they're really trying everything they can to push these upgrades through.
[43:47.720 -> 43:51.400] Yeah I mean I guess certain teams historically have had, you know Haas for
[43:51.400 -> 43:56.680] example, rarely do much kind of throughout the season. They tend to start
[43:56.680 -> 44:02.080] strong and then typically kind of taper away towards the end. I guess maybe the
[44:02.080 -> 44:05.000] cost cap has changed things a bit as well,
[44:05.000 -> 44:07.320] especially for the bigger teams,
[44:07.320 -> 44:11.440] and you've not necessarily got certain advantages baked in.
[44:11.440 -> 44:13.320] Obviously, you've still, you know, infrastructure.
[44:13.320 -> 44:15.040] James Vowles has talked about this a lot,
[44:15.040 -> 44:17.360] Williams and how a lot of the infrastructure
[44:18.360 -> 44:19.940] is holding them back,
[44:19.940 -> 44:22.920] and they're not able to be as efficient with the time
[44:22.920 -> 44:26.120] as other teams are.
[44:26.120 -> 44:27.700] There's always been time limits, of course,
[44:27.700 -> 44:30.020] but you can't just throw money at the problem
[44:30.020 -> 44:30.860] like you used to.
[44:30.860 -> 44:34.160] So I think, yeah, I think Karim, you nailed it.
[44:34.160 -> 44:37.340] Like it's, you can't afford to mess them up.
[44:37.340 -> 44:39.200] You know, in the past, you could,
[44:39.200 -> 44:41.080] the big teams with the big budgets,
[44:41.080 -> 44:43.780] the Ferraris, the McLarens, the Red Bulls,
[44:43.780 -> 44:49.080] could, you know, just try like five different wings and see if one works.
[44:49.080 -> 44:51.020] You know, you just, you throw money at the issue
[44:51.020 -> 44:53.920] and it was, cause you would have the top teams
[44:53.920 -> 44:57.260] literally spending, you know, three, four times
[44:57.260 -> 44:58.600] what the bottom teams were.
[44:58.600 -> 45:02.320] And I think it's that, it's not yet.
[45:02.320 -> 45:05.000] Rushing, rushing implies maybe that it's not, it's not, yeah, rushing implies maybe
[45:06.120 -> 45:08.000] that it's not well thought out.
[45:08.000 -> 45:10.360] I think it's just, you have to be efficient.
[45:10.360 -> 45:12.080] I think you look at a team like, you know,
[45:12.080 -> 45:13.720] Aston Martin, which obviously operated
[45:13.720 -> 45:17.180] as a force India for so long, super small team,
[45:17.180 -> 45:19.080] low budget, ultra efficient.
[45:19.080 -> 45:22.600] I think it's those kind of teams that are gonna,
[45:22.600 -> 45:24.600] and we've seen them jump up from, you know,
[45:24.600 -> 45:25.600] seventh last year
[45:25.600 -> 45:29.120] to second best calf, at least the kind of first half
[45:29.120 -> 45:30.200] of the season with Fernando.
[45:30.200 -> 45:35.120] So it's that efficiency that is really gonna,
[45:35.120 -> 45:38.120] you can't be bloated like maybe these big teams were
[45:38.120 -> 45:41.780] in the past, you have to operate on a solid one.
[45:42.600 -> 45:44.240] And you have to be careful as well,
[45:44.240 -> 45:47.220] because on one hand you're watching other people
[45:47.220 -> 45:48.060] and you kind of think,
[45:48.060 -> 45:49.540] ooh, that's quite a good idea on a Red Bull,
[45:49.540 -> 45:51.760] we should be able to copy that.
[45:51.760 -> 45:54.360] But you don't know what they're thinking.
[45:54.360 -> 45:55.360] You know, I'll give you a little example.
[45:55.360 -> 45:57.080] I remember, I think it was the early 2000s,
[45:57.080 -> 45:59.040] and I won't mention which team it was,
[45:59.040 -> 46:02.040] but McLaren that year had the fastest car.
[46:02.040 -> 46:07.040] And this particular team and their senior designers saw that McLaren
[46:07.040 -> 46:11.760] had a three-plane front wing for Monza and they said to the design office, right stop whatever
[46:11.760 -> 46:15.200] you're doing we need to get a three-plane front wing that's what we have to have get it get it
[46:15.200 -> 46:19.600] and they just stopped everything they put all their efforts huge amount of effort within so
[46:19.600 -> 46:26.360] three four weeks they had this three-plane front wing the Italian Grand Prix, got to Monza and McLaren had a two plane front wing.
[46:26.360 -> 46:33.760] And it's, as I say, I won't name names, but it's the sort of thing which you can get caught
[46:33.760 -> 46:34.760] out on, right?
[46:34.760 -> 46:38.200] You don't want to watch, yes, you have to keep an eye on what other people are doing,
[46:38.200 -> 46:42.760] but you have to have conviction in your own thought process, in your own design process,
[46:42.760 -> 46:46.300] in your own people, and your own philosophy.
[46:47.220 -> 46:49.840] So that reminded me of,
[46:49.840 -> 46:52.740] that reminded me of a Max quote, was he like,
[46:52.740 -> 46:55.720] when he would say, oh, we've come with no side pods.
[46:55.720 -> 46:59.580] Just imagine if Red Bull pulled out with no side pods
[46:59.580 -> 47:01.960] after Mercedes then put side pods on.
[47:01.960 -> 47:03.920] You know, that would have been,
[47:03.920 -> 47:05.120] no, because the thing is as well,
[47:05.120 -> 47:08.640] if you're always copying, and by the time you've actually
[47:08.640 -> 47:10.240] brought the upgrade, like you said Karun,
[47:10.240 -> 47:13.480] it's a long process, by the time you've actually bought it,
[47:13.480 -> 47:16.240] well that team's developed, they've not just been
[47:16.240 -> 47:19.160] sitting still that time, so it's, again,
[47:19.160 -> 47:22.600] and you can take influence, I know Red Bull took
[47:22.600 -> 47:25.440] the shape of their diffuser at the back. That was
[47:25.440 -> 47:29.040] apparently inspired by Williams, which you know, is a team towards the back, but that
[47:29.040 -> 47:32.840] doesn't mean that, you know, with Adrian and his notebook, he can't, you know, he's
[47:32.840 -> 47:38.280] taking it all in. Teams top and bottom ideas regardless and if you can make it
[47:38.280 -> 47:41.340] work, you can make it work, but like you say, you can't just bolt the Red Bull
[47:41.340 -> 47:45.240] side pods on and expect performance. It is a bit more complicated than that.
[47:45.240 -> 47:47.040] Goes right over my head, to be honest.
[47:48.480 -> 47:49.520] Yeah, it was fascinating.
[47:49.520 -> 47:51.880] And there's going to be even more upgrades coming.
[47:51.880 -> 47:53.080] We talked about McLaren.
[47:53.080 -> 47:55.080] I believe Mercedes also got some upgrades coming
[47:55.080 -> 47:55.960] for Silverstone as well.
[47:55.960 -> 47:58.220] So it can be very interesting to see what happens with those.
[47:58.220 -> 48:00.800] Right, Karine, I know you've got to go to Downing Street.
[48:00.800 -> 48:02.680] Not a line I thought we'd say on this podcast.
[48:02.680 -> 48:03.520] No.
[48:03.520 -> 48:06.120] But that's why we're going to have to draw it to a close here.
[48:06.120 -> 48:10.200] But can I just make a play out before I go?
[48:10.200 -> 48:14.920] Is there anyone out there in IT world who can send me a tweet and tell me why my camera's
[48:14.920 -> 48:15.920] gone purple?
[48:15.920 -> 48:20.640] If you could just tweet me a fig so that for the next episode, whenever Matt, you know,
[48:20.640 -> 48:24.120] lets me come on, I don't look like an alien from Jupiter.
[48:24.120 -> 48:25.920] Yeah, that's fair.
[48:25.920 -> 48:27.760] It's a good look. It's a good look. I like it.
[48:27.760 -> 48:31.200] Because clearly your solution of just doing it often back on again did not work.
[48:33.120 -> 48:35.440] Well, it's 50% of the time, 100% of the time.
[48:36.000 -> 48:39.920] Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. Well, you know, maybe I'll smart Harper, the transport secretary,
[48:39.920 -> 48:43.520] see what he has to say about the matter. Downing Street might have other things on his plate.
[48:43.520 -> 48:43.760] Yeah.
[48:45.280 -> 48:48.560] All right, guys, thank you so much for your time. Really appreciate it. We'll be back
[48:48.560 -> 48:56.960] next Tuesday after Silverstone to look back at that. So we hope you can join us then. Bye for now.