Season Review Part 1 of... Many

Spanners and Trumpets are joined by Video editor extraordinaire Steve Amey and F1 Tik Tok titan Cristina Lee Mace as they take a backward glance to start the season reviews. From the Angsty Alfa Romeos, to the wondrous Williams to the, well, Ferrariest Ferrari, no silver lining goes without its cloud in this, the latest episode of Missed Apex Podcast.

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**Season Review: Alfa Romeo**

* Finished ninth in the Constructors' Championship, with 55 points.
* Valtteri Bottas scored 49 points, while Zhou Guanyu scored 6 points.
* The team scored points in 13 of the 22 races, with a best finish of fifth place at the Emilia Romagna Grand Prix.
* Alfa Romeo struggled for pace throughout the season, and was often outpaced by its midfield rivals.
* The team's performance was also hampered by a number of reliability issues.
* Alfa Romeo is set to be replaced by Audi as Sauber's title sponsor in 2026.

**Positives:**

* Bottas was able to score points consistently, and was often the team's highest-finishing driver.
* The team showed some signs of improvement towards the end of the season, with Zhou scoring points in three of the final four races.

**Negatives:**

* Alfa Romeo lacked pace and was often outpaced by its midfield rivals.
* The team suffered from a number of reliability issues.
* The team's future is uncertain, with Audi set to take over as Sauber's title sponsor in 2026.

**Overall:**

Alfa Romeo had a disappointing season in 2023, finishing ninth in the Constructors' Championship. The team struggled for pace throughout the season and was often outpaced by its midfield rivals. The team's performance was also hampered by a number of reliability issues. Alfa Romeo is set to be replaced by Audi as Sauber's title sponsor in 2026, and it remains to be seen how the team will perform in the future. **Missed Apex: Formula One Season Review - Episode 4**

* **Williams:**

* Significant improvement in the 2023 season, moving up to 7th place in the Constructors' Championship.
* James Vowles' leadership and strategic decisions played a crucial role in the team's success.
* Vowles' communication skills and transparency with the media and fans were highly praised.
* The team's infrastructure limitations, particularly in terms of outdated technology and software, were acknowledged as a hindrance to further progress.
* Logan Sargent's performance as a rookie driver was a topic of debate among the hosts.
* Some hosts expressed skepticism about Sargent's abilities and questioned whether he deserved his seat based on merit or financial considerations.
* Others defended Sargent, highlighting his improvement over the season and the challenges he faced as a rookie with limited preparation time.
* The hosts acknowledged the financial benefits that Sargent brings to the team and the difficulty of finding a suitable replacement driver.
* The discussion emphasized the importance of balancing short-term results with long-term investments in infrastructure and driver development.

* **Alfa Romeo:**

* The team had a disappointing season, finishing in 6th place in the Constructors' Championship.
* The hosts attributed the team's struggles to a lack of competitiveness in the midfield and a failure to capitalize on opportunities.
* Zhou Guanyu's performance as a rookie driver was praised, with the hosts highlighting his potential and rapid improvement throughout the season.
* Valtteri Bottas' performance was seen as underwhelming, with the hosts questioning his motivation and commitment to the team.
* The hosts speculated about Bottas' future in Formula One, suggesting that he might be considering retirement or a move to a different team.
* The team's lack of progress and the need for significant improvements were emphasized.

* **Haas:**

* The team had a challenging season, finishing in 8th place in the Constructors' Championship.
* The hosts attributed the team's struggles to a lack of competitiveness and reliability issues.
* Kevin Magnussen's performance was praised, with the hosts highlighting his consistency and ability to score points.
* Mick Schumacher's performance was seen as disappointing, with the hosts criticizing his lack of consistency and costly mistakes.
* The hosts discussed the team's decision to replace Schumacher with Nico Hulkenberg for the 2024 season.
* The team's need for a more competitive car and improved reliability was emphasized.

* **Aston Martin:**

* The team had a disappointing season, finishing in 10th place in the Constructors' Championship.
* The hosts attributed the team's struggles to a lack of competitiveness and a failure to live up to expectations.
* Fernando Alonso's performance was praised, with the hosts highlighting his skill and experience.
* Lance Stroll's performance was seen as underwhelming, with the hosts criticizing his inconsistency and lack of progress.
* The hosts discussed the team's need for a more competitive car and a clearer direction for the future.

* **Alpine:**

* The team had a solid season, finishing in 4th place in the Constructors' Championship.
* The hosts praised the team's consistency and ability to score points throughout the season.
* Esteban Ocon's performance was seen as impressive, with the hosts highlighting his ability to challenge for podium finishes.
* Pierre Gasly's performance was seen as disappointing, with the hosts criticizing his lack of consistency and costly mistakes.
* The hosts discussed the team's potential to challenge for higher positions in the Constructors' Championship in the future.

* **McLaren:**

* The team had a disappointing season, finishing in 5th place in the Constructors' Championship.
* The hosts attributed the team's struggles to a lack of competitiveness and reliability issues.
* Lando Norris' performance was praised, with the hosts highlighting his skill and potential.
* Oscar Piastri's performance as a rookie driver was seen as promising, with the hosts highlighting his ability to adapt quickly to Formula One.
* The hosts discussed the team's need for a more competitive car and improved reliability.

* **Ferrari:**

* The team had a challenging season, finishing in 2nd place in the Constructors' Championship.
* The hosts attributed the team's struggles to strategic errors and a lack of reliability.
* Charles Leclerc's performance was praised, with the hosts highlighting his skill and ability to challenge for race wins.
* Carlos Sainz's performance was seen as disappointing, with the hosts criticizing his inconsistency and costly mistakes.
* The hosts discussed the team's need for improved strategic decision-making and a more reliable car.

* **Mercedes:**

* The team had a disappointing season, finishing in 3rd place in the Constructors' Championship.
* The hosts attributed the team's struggles to a lack of competitiveness and a failure to adapt to the new regulations.
* Lewis Hamilton's performance was praised, with the hosts highlighting his skill and experience.
* George Russell's performance was seen as impressive, with the hosts highlighting his ability to adapt quickly to the team and challenge for race wins.
* The hosts discussed the team's need for a more competitive car and a clearer direction for the future.

* **Red Bull:**

* The team had a dominant season, winning both the Drivers' and Constructors' Championships.
* The hosts praised the team's strategic decision-making, car performance, and driver lineup.
* Max Verstappen's performance was seen as exceptional, with the hosts highlighting his skill, consistency, and ability to dominate races.
* Sergio Perez's performance was seen as solid, with the hosts praising his ability to support Verstappen and score valuable points.
* The hosts discussed the team's potential to continue its dominance in the future. Sure, here is a summary of the podcast episode transcript:

**Missed Apex Season Reviews: Part 1**

- The episode features Spanners, Cristina Lee Mace, and Steve Amey, who join Matt to review the 2023 F1 season.

- The discussion begins with the Alfa Romeo team, which had a disappointing season despite high expectations.

- The team's drivers, Valtteri Bottas and Zhou Guanyu, struggled for consistency, and the car lacked pace.

- The team's management also came under fire for its handling of certain situations, such as the team orders controversy at the British Grand Prix.

- The conversation then shifts to Williams, which had a more positive season.

- Alex Albon emerged as a strong midfield driver, scoring points consistently and even challenging for podiums on occasion.

- However, there are concerns about the team's long-term prospects, as it still lacks the resources of its rivals.

- The reliability of the car was also an issue, with Albon and teammate Logan Sargeant both suffering from mechanical problems.

- The discussion moves on to Ferrari, which had a mixed season.

- The team made progress in the second half of the year, with Charles Leclerc and Carlos Sainz Jr. both winning races.

- However, the team's hopes of a championship challenge were hampered by poor strategy calls and reliability issues.

- The drivers also had a strained relationship, with Leclerc appearing to be the team's favored driver.

- The episode concludes with a brief discussion of Red Bull, Aston Martin, and Mercedes.

- Red Bull dominated the season, with Max Verstappen winning 15 races and the team securing both championships.

- Aston Martin had a solid season, with Fernando Alonso scoring points regularly and Sebastian Vettel showing glimpses of his old form.

- Mercedes struggled for pace throughout the year, with Lewis Hamilton failing to win a race for the first time in his career.

**Overall, the episode provides an in-depth analysis of the 2023 F1 season, with the panelists offering their insights and opinions on the key talking points.** # Missed Apex Podcast: Season Review Part 2

## Introduction

- The podcast begins with the hosts, Spanners, Matt Trumpets, Steve Amey, and Cristina Lee Mace, discussing the 2022 Formula 1 season.
- They talk about the dominance of Red Bull and Max Verstappen, and the struggles of Ferrari and Mercedes.

## Ferrari

- The hosts discuss Ferrari's season in detail, focusing on the team's strengths and weaknesses.
- They praise the performances of Charles Leclerc and Carlos Sainz, but also criticize the team's strategy and reliability.
- They debate who is the better driver between Leclerc and Sainz, and whether either of them could challenge Verstappen for the championship in the future.

## Aston Martin, Alpine, and McLaren

- The hosts briefly discuss the seasons of Aston Martin, Alpine, and McLaren.
- They talk about the potential of these teams to improve in the future, and which drivers could lead them to success.
- They also speculate on which teams Leclerc and Sainz might move to if they leave Ferrari.

## Conclusion

- The hosts wrap up the podcast by discussing the overall state of Formula 1 and what they expect to see in the 2023 season.
- They also thank their listeners for their support and encourage them to continue following the podcast.

## Key Points

- Red Bull and Max Verstappen were dominant in the 2022 season, winning 17 of the 22 races.
- Ferrari had a strong car but was let down by poor strategy and reliability.
- Charles Leclerc and Carlos Sainz are both talented drivers, but they have different strengths and weaknesses.
- Aston Martin, Alpine, and McLaren all have the potential to improve in the future.
- The 2023 Formula 1 season is expected to be more competitive, with several teams capable of challenging Red Bull.

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[01:38.480 -> 01:39.040] You are listening to missed Apex podcast.
[01:53.000 -> 01:55.360] We live F1. Welcome to Missed Apex Podcast.
[01:55.360 -> 01:59.680] It's our season review and I'm your host Richard Ready, but my friends call me Spanners.
[01:59.680 -> 02:01.720] So let's be friends.
[02:01.720 -> 02:06.960] I know the season is over and I know most outlets have smashed out a
[02:06.960 -> 02:12.760] half-arsed season review and then abandoned you for the winter like a penguin abandoning
[02:12.760 -> 02:18.840] its snow cave to go and hunt for ice badgers. But that's not us. We would never abandon
[02:18.840 -> 02:28.060] you. To us, you are the ice badger. So today we're covering the odd-numbered teams in the Constructors' Championship and talking
[02:28.060 -> 02:29.900] about how their season went.
[02:29.900 -> 02:34.180] And then next week we'll do the even numbers because there's no rush.
[02:34.180 -> 02:35.620] We've got time.
[02:35.620 -> 02:38.880] And we have a plan over the winter for content.
[02:38.880 -> 02:42.620] Each of our panel is going to bring us a topic over the break and then I'm going to interview
[02:42.620 -> 02:50.320] them as well about their lives so you can get to know them. There's a lot of panel and they're all really great, even
[02:50.320 -> 02:55.200] Kyle. So I want you to get to know them all. So they're going to bring you some topics.
[02:55.200 -> 03:00.720] So for example, Chris is going to bring a corner names topic to bring you for Christmas
[03:00.720 -> 03:06.240] Day. Uncle Steve is going to bring a topic about the history of F1 broadcasting
[03:06.240 -> 03:10.880] and there'll be some actually good segments as well. But for now we're going to do the season
[03:10.880 -> 03:15.920] review so let me remind you we are an independent podcast produced in the podcasting shed with the
[03:15.920 -> 03:19.760] kind permission of our better halves. We aim to bring you a race review before your Sunday morning
[03:19.760 -> 03:33.980] commute. Monday morning commute? No we can't go back in time. Before your Monday morning commute. We might be wrong about commuting times, but we're first.
[03:33.980 -> 03:40.320] And here sniggering at me messing up the intro is Matt tooooooo Rumpet, as if you do good
[03:40.320 -> 03:43.120] intros on your Tech Time segments.
[03:43.120 -> 03:46.400] I do perfectly fine ones, thank you. And although
[03:46.400 -> 03:50.640] we are bringing you the equivalent of coal in your stocking for Christmas with corner names,
[03:50.640 -> 03:53.840] which I still maintain are useless. You just want numbers.
[03:54.400 -> 04:01.520] And my love of numbers has led me to the following. 0.07, since I know you love a
[04:01.520 -> 04:04.400] podcast full of numbers. Yeah, no, I love it when you just
[04:04.400 -> 04:06.560] spew statistics endlessly.
[04:06.560 -> 04:09.080] It makes it as interesting and fun as Tech Time.
[04:09.080 -> 04:10.080] Absolutely.
[04:10.080 -> 04:12.480] And you're not even going to ask me what that number is, are you?
[04:12.480 -> 04:13.480] 0.7.
[04:13.480 -> 04:14.480] I guess I have to now.
[04:14.480 -> 04:17.200] Hey, Matt, what's the significance of 0.7?
[04:17.200 -> 04:22.960] That would be the average points per finished race of Logan Surgent.
[04:22.960 -> 04:23.960] 0.07?
[04:23.960 -> 04:24.960] Yes.
[04:24.960 -> 04:28.560] He finished 15 races and scored one point. You can do
[04:28.560 -> 04:33.960] that one on your calculator. I did round up for significant digits reasons. Okay, that's
[04:33.960 -> 04:39.000] not very many. We're also joined by Uncle Steve. Uncle Steve is here. How you going?
[04:39.000 -> 04:43.760] How's it going, babes? You good? Yeah, I'm good. Now the season's over. There's not a
[04:43.760 -> 04:48.960] lot to do except sit here and slowly get older. Yeah which you've been doing very successfully for
[04:48.960 -> 04:53.880] a long long time. Yeah you bet. But next season you've got two Australians to
[04:53.880 -> 04:57.520] cheer for so that is a... when is the last time that happened because I thought
[04:57.520 -> 05:01.600] there was a rule I thought it was like Sith where when one retired another one
[05:01.600 -> 05:06.480] came in but you know. I don't think it's ever happened before. Oh yes it did
[05:06.480 -> 05:14.960] once in about 1974 there were two Australians driving for maybe four or five races. Well there
[05:14.960 -> 05:20.880] you go and and and who knows Ricardo might last more than four or five races next season. Oh yeah
[05:20.880 -> 05:27.200] well let's hope so. And we're joined now by another hub of F1 excellence, Canada,
[05:27.200 -> 05:29.840] and we've got Christina Lemace joining us. Hey, Christina.
[05:29.840 -> 05:36.640] Hello. You are represented, not at all, actually. In my head, Logan Sargent is Canadian,
[05:36.640 -> 05:40.480] just because he's replaced Latifi, but you do have Stroll. There you go.
[05:40.480 -> 05:50.120] We do have Stroll, yes. I would love to have more Canadians. I would love to have a Canadian that doesn't right now look like a hockey bro. Because it's just a thing.
[05:50.120 -> 05:54.280] You will have to explain what a hockey bro is to the non-Canadian audience.
[05:54.280 -> 05:58.680] It's just a guy who looks like he plays hockey. Hockey men have a very specific aesthetic
[05:58.680 -> 06:02.940] and look. They have a way that they walk with the slightly wide duck feet. Their feet are
[06:02.940 -> 06:06.080] stuck in the position that their hockey skates are in.
[06:06.080 -> 06:10.020] And so they kind of just walk super wide as they're going around.
[06:10.020 -> 06:11.980] It's hilarious to watch them move in a pack.
[06:11.980 -> 06:14.360] They have the specific like facial hair.
[06:14.360 -> 06:15.360] Everyone's in a vial.
[06:15.360 -> 06:17.360] Way too many of them have mullets.
[06:17.360 -> 06:18.360] Yeah.
[06:18.360 -> 06:20.360] Hey, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.
[06:20.360 -> 06:24.200] Hank, if there is an Australian on the panel, you cannot besmirch the mullet.
[06:24.200 -> 06:25.360] Yes, I know.
[06:25.360 -> 06:26.920] I'll have to.
[06:26.920 -> 06:30.800] The World Mullet Championship is going on here in Australia at the moment, and there's
[06:30.800 -> 06:32.840] an Englishman who looks like he might win it.
[06:32.840 -> 06:33.840] Oh my goodness.
[06:33.840 -> 06:38.240] And Valtteri Bottas has been bullied into having a mullet by his Australian partner.
[06:38.240 -> 06:39.240] Yep, absolutely.
[06:39.240 -> 06:43.720] Yeah, so Christina, you're going to have to learn to be a bit more culturally sensitive
[06:43.720 -> 06:45.000] to Uncle Steve there.
[06:45.000 -> 06:48.000] But yeah, definitely Lance Stroll with his facial hair.
[06:48.000 -> 06:52.000] He is starting to look like the evil parallel universe, Lance Stroll.
[06:52.000 -> 06:54.000] Just a little bit.
[06:54.000 -> 06:56.000] All right, season review.
[06:57.000 -> 06:59.000] School really is out, isn't it, kids?
[06:59.000 -> 07:06.960] Okay, but we're gonna dive down into the season review and it's good Matt because you know sometimes we get criticism
[07:07.280 -> 07:12.360] For not focusing further down the grid or for not covering every single detail
[07:12.400 -> 07:17.540] but something we decided a long time ago for race reviews was we really wanted to watch the race and
[07:17.760 -> 07:24.480] Talk about what specifically grabbed our interest not a kind of oh now it's time to talk about
[07:27.120 -> 07:31.920] interest, not a kind of, oh, now it's time to talk about Alfa Romeo just for the sake of it. And it's hard to talk about teams like Alfa Romeo, which is our first odd-numbered team.
[07:31.920 -> 07:37.200] Alfa Romeo finished ninth in the championship. But there's rarely been a reason to talk about them.
[07:37.200 -> 07:44.880] There hasn't been, and it's because really they've been very anonymous. I think if I'm not
[07:47.040 -> 07:50.560] Because really they've been very anonymous. I think, if I'm not entirely off-base here, this is either the last year or next to last year of the Alfa Romeo sponsorship.
[07:50.560 -> 07:52.080] I think it's the last year, yeah.
[07:52.720 -> 07:58.560] So I think that is winding down. We talked about them a bit more at the beginning of 22, because
[07:58.560 -> 08:06.400] the one clever thing they could have done, which is show up with a car that weighed exactly the maximum weight and not
[08:06.400 -> 08:12.080] more. They did, and they got some good results and coasted on that, but they didn't really get
[08:12.080 -> 08:16.400] away. They didn't have anything like that they could just pull out of the bag for this season.
[08:16.960 -> 08:25.040] And honestly, they seem a bit like a shop that is sort of being mothballed in anticipation of 2026.
[08:25.040 -> 08:30.400] It is that, isn't it? That is bad. Okay, so before we quite get to the misery of Alfa Romeo,
[08:30.400 -> 08:33.040] and I don't think there's going to be an awful lot of great stuff to say, all right,
[08:33.040 -> 08:38.240] what are we looking at as far as a season review goes, Matt? What's important to us?
[08:38.240 -> 08:41.760] Well, I think what's, things we like to talk about, how did the teammates do?
[08:42.800 -> 08:45.420] How did the team do, you know, relative to last
[08:45.420 -> 08:50.120] season and relative to their competitors? And what do we predict for them? Sort of what
[08:50.120 -> 08:54.440] are we looking for going forward? Is there a silver lining? Is it all doom and gloom?
[08:54.440 -> 08:59.220] Okay. And also we'll have a little look at how the drivers compared against each other
[08:59.220 -> 09:07.280] as well. So I think then let's dig into Alfa Romeo, and I think this is the last season of them being
[09:07.280 -> 09:12.880] Alfa Romeo. I think they're going to race next season as Sauber. But Chris Stevens dropped us
[09:13.600 -> 09:20.720] some knowledge, didn't he, Matt, that the CEO of Alfa Romeo has been very happy with the partnership
[09:20.720 -> 09:25.160] of Sauber. So you kind of assume that that's gone south or they're leaving because everything was terrible.
[09:25.760 -> 09:30.360] It's the Audi thing if I'm being honest. It's just the Audi thing. Audi is coming in.
[09:30.980 -> 09:36.560] Obviously if Audi is a sponsor, you don't you don't want Audi on your car if you're Alfa Romeo.
[09:36.560 -> 09:42.200] That's a bit much even for, you know, Formula One where you do have the odd bedfellow or two.
[09:43.160 -> 09:47.440] I think they are off to greener, weck pastures
[09:48.560 -> 09:54.160] in search of a continued, very excellent return on their dollar. I mean, and they weren't happy
[09:54.160 -> 09:59.440] with it, but I don't really think they were bringing the amount of investment needed.
[09:59.440 -> 10:04.880] And you could make the same argument for Haas, like we saw the year of Schumacher and Mazepin,
[10:04.880 -> 10:05.680] where it's just like,
[10:05.680 -> 10:10.720] literally, we're going to give you enough to keep the lights on and keep our entry alive,
[10:11.280 -> 10:17.680] but we're not spending any extra money on this because we're waiting for something else to come
[10:17.680 -> 10:26.600] to fruition. And the worry for me is on the Salber side, if you or anyone with any kind of burning ambition
[10:26.600 -> 10:29.720] whatsoever, that's not the place you're going to want to be.
[10:29.720 -> 10:33.560] You're going to want to move to some place that's looking to be competitive.
[10:33.560 -> 10:39.600] So you might be losing some young, bright lights that you would really want in the future.
[10:39.600 -> 10:43.320] I think I'm going to have this complaint when we do the even number teams next season with
[10:43.320 -> 10:51.460] Haas, but there's a model here with the cost cap where there's no real incentive to overspend. And like the
[10:51.460 -> 10:57.760] Alfa Romeo CEO was saying, we made multiples out of the deal than we spent on it. And I
[10:57.760 -> 11:02.680] think all the teams down at the bottom, like even if you look at like Darolton as the owners
[11:02.680 -> 11:09.220] of Williams, they're picking up enough prize money and enough sponsorship and enough kind of commercial stuff with say
[11:09.220 -> 11:14.780] Logan Sargent that the maths doesn't really work out for them to go and really chase that
[11:14.780 -> 11:17.180] final championship position.
[11:17.180 -> 11:21.660] And I think with this cost cap franchise era, I think we might just end up with that bottom
[11:21.660 -> 11:24.600] three in perpetuity going forward.
[11:24.600 -> 11:28.080] Because why would they break the bank when you've got shareholders there
[11:28.080 -> 11:32.840] going, no we're quite happy making 30 million this year. Why would we push
[11:32.840 -> 11:36.480] forward Steve? And this is the thing we've been scared about which is the
[11:36.480 -> 11:43.440] franchise model ruining competitiveness. Yeah exactly. I can't see the point of...
[11:43.440 -> 11:46.480] if your team is now worth a billion dollars,
[11:47.120 -> 11:53.280] any investment company is sitting on a goldmine. So they don't really care whether they're coming
[11:53.280 -> 11:58.880] first, second or third, unless they've got the best car in the world. And let's face it,
[11:58.880 -> 12:03.920] you know, the bottom three teams don't have the best car in the world. So from an investment
[12:03.920 -> 12:05.200] point of view, the directors
[12:05.200 -> 12:10.720] are saying, okay, we won't do anything other than make certain we stay in the competition,
[12:11.680 -> 12:17.360] because, you know, we bought it for $160 million four years ago, and now it's worth close to a
[12:17.360 -> 12:22.080] billion. So from an investment point of view, we're doing the right thing for our shareholders.
[12:22.080 -> 12:28.560] And I think Haas will say the same thing, Matt. And that is really what Andretti are up against when they're trying to convince people to let them
[12:28.560 -> 12:33.200] come in. You've got teams like Haas going, no, we're making so much money.
[12:33.760 -> 12:39.120] Yeah, well, but their money is unrealized money. Their team is worth that only if they sell it.
[12:39.120 -> 12:44.720] And the less interested the wider world becomes in Formula 1, the less that team is going to be
[12:44.720 -> 12:46.080] worth. After all, a couple of years team is going to be worth after all.
[12:46.080 -> 12:58.580] Couple years ago it wasn't worth nearly that a couple years from now i mean you know hello crypto it could also not be worth a whole lot depending upon how things go you need to maintain interest and you need to maintain competitiveness.
[12:58.640 -> 13:00.600] As far as the teams go.
[13:05.220 -> 13:10.080] go, the damage is to your sponsors. The lower down the ladder is, the less your sponsorship is worth to a title sponsor.
[13:10.080 -> 13:13.600] So for a title sponsor looking for a bargain, it's a great deal.
[13:13.600 -> 13:21.480] I can scoop a name, you know, I can share the name with Sauber and get, like, exposure.
[13:21.480 -> 13:25.080] But if you don't do well enough to ever be on TV and the only way you get
[13:25.080 -> 13:30.360] known is because one of your drivers parades around in their absolute birthday suit all
[13:30.360 -> 13:31.360] the time, then...
[13:31.360 -> 13:34.480] Oh, I've got a comment on that.
[13:34.480 -> 13:37.400] Am I getting a return on this?
[13:37.400 -> 13:41.800] But despite that, there's other things to talk about in terms of the performance between
[13:41.800 -> 13:47.320] the drivers and their relative performance last year to this year and I'm sure we will get to that mostly
[13:47.320 -> 13:50.440] because it involves numbers. I think Steve's got something else on the cache.
[13:50.440 -> 13:55.480] Yes, Matt you're assuming that Zac Brown hasn't stolen all the sponsors.
[13:55.480 -> 14:00.220] Yeah, there's that. He's just taking everybody's sponsors. I mean how do they
[14:00.220 -> 14:04.640] fit them all on the car? Yeah, so who's that little board that changes names,
[14:04.640 -> 14:05.840] remember? That's the one. I haven't seen that Yeah. So who's that little board that changes names? Remember?
[14:05.840 -> 14:06.840] That's the one.
[14:06.840 -> 14:07.840] I haven't seen that yet.
[14:07.840 -> 14:08.840] Yeah.
[14:08.840 -> 14:11.720] And that reminds me, if you see Ready, if you see Ready Player One, and they're talking
[14:11.720 -> 14:15.720] about how much sponsorship they can fill your screen with, and they're like, we can fill
[14:15.720 -> 14:19.680] 83% of your vision without inducing seizure.
[14:19.680 -> 14:22.480] That's the McLaren attitude towards sponsorship.
[14:22.480 -> 14:24.560] We're just going to flash.
[14:24.560 -> 14:27.000] Who does Stake? Stake
[14:27.000 -> 14:28.000] is the sponsor of Alpha.
[14:28.000 -> 14:29.000] They're Australian.
[14:29.000 -> 14:30.000] Are they? So Stake.
[14:30.000 -> 14:33.320] Yeah, and Australian, they're a betting company. Online betting company.
[14:33.320 -> 14:37.680] See, they sponsor Alfa Romeo, or have done this season. If Alfa Romeo was suddenly to
[14:37.680 -> 14:42.780] become the number one team in F1, Stake wouldn't keep sponsoring them. They would then go and
[14:42.780 -> 14:48.400] look for the team that was currently in eighth because they want that bargain. So we'll turn to Christina LeMay's
[14:48.400 -> 14:54.760] here because we're being quite negative. You're an actress. Can you act as if there's some
[14:54.760 -> 14:57.200] positives from Alfa Romeo's season?
[14:57.200 -> 15:03.120] I mean, if they get no attention, no one can really notice that nothing's happened for
[15:03.120 -> 15:04.120] them.
[15:04.120 -> 15:06.640] Yep. So their tactic is to lie low.
[15:06.640 -> 15:09.360] Tasha Yeah, lay low. And I mean, at the end of
[15:09.360 -> 15:13.280] the day, they really just are a team that are kind of sitting there. They literally just are
[15:13.280 -> 15:18.080] sitting there and doing nothing. They're not earning points. Their social media is decent.
[15:18.080 -> 15:26.300] But again, yes, most of it is Botas showing off his butt, or the one picture a week of Joe entering the paddock looking
[15:26.300 -> 15:27.300] very stylish.
[15:27.300 -> 15:29.840] But that's about it.
[15:29.840 -> 15:33.340] That's really the only screen time that they get.
[15:33.340 -> 15:37.280] And like, going back to Matt's point of they're going to start losing staff, it has already
[15:37.280 -> 15:38.620] started to happen.
[15:38.620 -> 15:43.660] Their head of strategy, Ruth, announced at the end of the season that, yeah, she's going
[15:43.660 -> 15:45.680] on to do something else. So,
[15:46.800 -> 15:53.280] it's definitely a disadvantage for Sauber as a whole to, A, kind of let these be dead years,
[15:53.280 -> 15:56.880] when really they could be building gears. I'd seriously been hoping that this would be kind
[15:56.880 -> 16:02.800] of a transition period of, we know Audi is coming in, and so we're slowly going to have a gradual
[16:02.800 -> 16:06.340] shift of power instead of a cold, hard deadline,
[16:06.340 -> 16:07.680] but that doesn't seem to be happening.
[16:07.680 -> 16:11.860] They seem to just be, we'll wait around for two years.
[16:11.860 -> 16:13.940] Like, that is a choice,
[16:13.940 -> 16:17.000] but you lose so much momentum because of that,
[16:17.000 -> 16:18.560] and it puts you on such a back foot
[16:18.560 -> 16:20.080] for when 2026 comes around.
[16:20.080 -> 16:22.880] I think you might even actually be being generous
[16:22.880 -> 16:24.840] that there's any ambition to push forward at all,
[16:24.840 -> 16:25.400] because we're not really seeing that, because this team is Sauber, I think you might even actually be being generous that there's any ambition to push forward at all.
[16:25.400 -> 16:29.320] We're not really seeing that because this team is Sauber and then they've lent their
[16:29.320 -> 16:34.120] name to Alfa Romeo in what has been a kind of a basically a change of livery and title
[16:34.120 -> 16:35.680] sponsor status.
[16:35.680 -> 16:37.760] And they're really doing the same with Audi.
[16:37.760 -> 16:42.560] I know a lot's being made of Audi entering F1, but I don't know if it's a huge amount
[16:42.560 -> 16:50.160] different to what Alfa Romeo have been doing. So I think, Christina, you might be being even generous, saying that in 2026, they would push
[16:50.160 -> 16:55.600] forward. Maybe. I mean, the difference being is that Audi actually is going to own 51% of the
[16:55.600 -> 17:02.160] team. So they actually will have powers that Alfa Romeo didn't. And you would hope that with you
[17:02.160 -> 17:05.440] have power, you know, with power comes great responsibility,
[17:05.440 -> 17:09.600] you would hope that they would use it and would actually try to do something. I know, right?
[17:09.600 -> 17:14.240] People should put that on a t-shirt. You hope that they would do something. And my other big
[17:14.240 -> 17:18.800] thing with Sauber is that they also have a driver's academy, and those are people that it
[17:18.800 -> 17:25.320] also feels like they're kind of just dropping the ball on. And that's also very disappointing from them. You have Théopole
[17:25.320 -> 17:31.680] Scheyr that literally just won F2 and you're kind of just leaving him in no man's land
[17:31.680 -> 17:35.160] again. Just please do something. Do anything.
[17:35.160 -> 17:37.920] Danny Billyeu Yeah, that's not an uncommon problem for
[17:37.920 -> 17:42.500] F2 champions, to be fair. I've just looked on the Alfa Romeo Twitter page and looked
[17:42.500 -> 17:47.600] for their most recent post. And even though this is a post from today, it is pre-race,
[17:47.880 -> 17:52.120] Joe Guarniou entering the garage and speaking to Lance Stroll.
[17:52.240 -> 17:53.440] You're absolutely right.
[17:53.440 -> 17:56.440] That is a lot of what their social media is. Steve then, Matt?
[17:57.880 -> 18:00.280] My point was really had to do with
[18:02.280 -> 18:05.360] the lower end teams getting absolutely no coverage at all.
[18:05.360 -> 18:07.200] Is that why they crash so often?
[18:07.200 -> 18:09.560] So that they make certain they get a little bit of coverage
[18:09.560 -> 18:10.360] for their sponsors?
[18:10.360 -> 18:12.000] Is that some kind of strategy?
[18:12.000 -> 18:13.120] Well, what did we get?
[18:13.120 -> 18:17.040] What did we hear from the ex-Lotus boss, Matt, who said
[18:17.040 -> 18:19.840] they seriously considered at one point selling
[18:19.840 -> 18:22.960] the sponsorship on the underside of Maldonado's car
[18:22.960 -> 18:24.760] because he was flipped over often enough
[18:24.760 -> 18:26.800] that you'd get some good exposure from that.
[18:26.800 -> 18:30.040] But it really is an outfit, Matt, that I think,
[18:31.000 -> 18:32.320] I don't know many people who are like,
[18:32.320 -> 18:36.160] oh man, I'm a Salba fan, which you used to get,
[18:36.160 -> 18:38.680] you know, back when it was Salba, Salba,
[18:38.680 -> 18:40.600] but no one is following that team.
[18:40.600 -> 18:43.360] So it feels like a, inevitably,
[18:43.360 -> 18:46.480] if you're essentially a customer team, a customer
[18:46.480 -> 18:50.480] outfit, it feels a little bit soulless. Or is that is that too harsh?
[18:51.040 -> 18:56.960] No, it's not too harsh. A lot of the love for Alpha coming in is that they really did have
[18:56.960 -> 19:05.200] like the beautiful livery. But also it's worth remembering that as a team, Salver and that team, even when they started
[19:05.200 -> 19:10.360] out as Alpha, generated a lot of interesting innovation up and down.
[19:10.360 -> 19:14.200] They would have small things that would then get copied by other teams, including the big
[19:14.200 -> 19:21.000] teams when they started out, and they sort of gradually dwindled down to this point.
[19:21.000 -> 19:25.600] I do want to just briefly mention Audi is also supposed to be bringing a power unit
[19:25.600 -> 19:32.720] to this car. So it is a huge difference to the kind of partnership we have seen with Alfa Romeo.
[19:32.720 -> 19:36.560] Not rebadged Audi like Tag Heuer, Red Bull power train style.
[19:37.360 -> 19:39.520] Audi are building an F1 engine. How have I missed that?
[19:40.400 -> 19:45.760] Um, I guess I didn't say it enough times earlier in the season.
[19:45.760 -> 19:52.440] This has been the plan all along, that Audi is bringing a Volkswagen powertrain.
[19:52.440 -> 19:56.080] I mean, they'll call it Audi, of course.
[19:56.080 -> 19:59.520] Don't email me clips of Matt telling me this several times in the past.
[19:59.520 -> 20:00.520] I don't need that.
[20:00.520 -> 20:01.520] I don't need that.
[20:01.520 -> 20:03.160] I won't remember anyway.
[20:03.160 -> 20:05.760] But in an effort, the things that we
[20:05.760 -> 20:12.720] can say that are good is that there were teams that had lots more DNFs than Alpha did. It was
[20:12.720 -> 20:18.480] only three per driver. Um, they scored all of their points. I've decided this year, you know
[20:18.480 -> 20:26.040] how we hate sprint races? Yep. Even though it's not culturally acceptable to hate sprint races.
[20:26.040 -> 20:27.040] Why not?
[20:27.040 -> 20:28.040] I can hate whoever I want.
[20:28.040 -> 20:31.120] Well, I thought about it, and you know what?
[20:31.120 -> 20:35.720] When it comes to assessing drivers and teams, I think you're kind of right.
[20:35.720 -> 20:40.920] Because a sprint race, you don't really have to manage the tires, your car is super light,
[20:40.920 -> 20:45.000] reliability is almost not an issue because the race is too short.
[20:45.000 -> 20:49.000] Qualifying matters more, but we know in the race qualifying matters a lot less.
[20:49.000 -> 20:51.000] Something that I'm working on.
[20:51.000 -> 20:52.000] What are you working on?
[20:52.000 -> 20:55.000] Proving that qualifying doesn't matter anymore.
[20:55.000 -> 20:59.000] I may not be able to actually do it based on this season, but I thought I would take a look,
[20:59.000 -> 21:02.000] and you know what? It's going to take me more time than I thought.
[21:02.000 -> 21:04.000] This happens to me frequently, if I'm honest.
[21:04.000 -> 21:07.040] Well, that's interesting, because I did say like a couple of years ago
[21:07.040 -> 21:11.920] It became clear that qualifying has never been less important in Formula 1 than it is now
[21:12.480 -> 21:14.380] But I the counter in my head
[21:14.380 -> 21:19.140] I'm really looking forward to you bringing a detailed analysis of why qualifying doesn't matter at all
[21:19.800 -> 21:25.840] But I think Lewis Hamilton is single-handedly proving how poor qualifying days can really
[21:25.840 -> 21:32.320] affect your race. Because he's had the car to be P2 in the championship, and a lot of the time he's
[21:32.320 -> 21:36.480] just got messed up in midfield battles that that car should never have been involved in.
[21:37.120 -> 21:43.200] Yeah, yeah. So I want to look at it by comparing... well, I have many different thoughts,
[21:43.200 -> 21:45.760] but basically my idea was to look at where teammates
[21:45.760 -> 21:50.880] started relative to each other and then where they finished and to see if qualifying made a
[21:50.880 -> 21:57.040] difference relative to teammates. And if it did, then if where you qualified apart from your
[21:57.040 -> 22:01.440] teammate made a difference, like, do you always catch up to your teammate, even if it's five or
[22:01.440 -> 22:07.360] six spots? And this will obviously to a certain, be predicated on the car you're driving.
[22:07.360 -> 22:10.360] Obviously you're driving a Red Bull, you're much more likely to get back up to the front
[22:10.360 -> 22:13.440] of the grid, but then your teammate, that's a separate story.
[22:13.440 -> 22:14.440] Anyway.
[22:14.440 -> 22:15.440] Yeah, no, no, I think you're right.
[22:15.440 -> 22:18.640] In fact, the amount of times we've looked at, and again, I'll use Lewis Hamilton, you
[22:18.640 -> 22:20.840] go, oh, it's a disastrous qualifying for Hamilton.
[22:20.840 -> 22:30.960] And then you predict where he's going to finish and you kind of go probably roughly where George Russell is. So yeah, in a way that has been a kind of a sad fact of the
[22:30.960 -> 22:36.560] racing we've had this year. Okay, I think finally on Alfa Romeo, I think my main complaint
[22:36.560 -> 22:39.840] if we're talking social media, and I know you're more the expert on this, Christina,
[22:39.840 -> 22:53.520] than these other two, because it's on the internet, which they've yet to catch up with, is I don't consent to have been seeing Valtteri Bottas's buttocks as much as I have been. It's
[22:53.520 -> 22:57.360] just like I wake up in the morning, I get my coffee, I open up social media, and there is
[22:57.360 -> 23:09.920] Valtteri's ass, and I'm never prepared for it. It's there. It exists. It undoubtedly exists. I feel like I've been extremely desensitized to butts just because I regularly wake up
[23:09.920 -> 23:12.720] with Squeaks McGee's like bottom right there in my face.
[23:12.720 -> 23:13.720] That's her cat.
[23:13.720 -> 23:16.120] The butts don't give me a jump scare anymore.
[23:16.120 -> 23:20.900] As much as cat butt and human butt is slightly different, a butt is a butt.
[23:20.900 -> 23:23.360] And once you see it, it's like in for a penny, in for a pound.
[23:23.360 -> 23:30.160] I will say though, I think it'd be a smarter strategy to sell more calendars if you didn't give away the preview for
[23:30.160 -> 23:36.800] free. That's good, yeah. Why would you let people see your butt as liberally as you are when you
[23:36.800 -> 23:41.920] could just put the little peach emoji over it and be like if you want to actually see the thing you
[23:41.920 -> 23:51.120] got to buy the calendar. Like that just makes a little bit more sense to me. Now I know it's for a good cause, Matt, and it's awareness and raising funds for
[23:51.120 -> 23:56.880] prostate cancer. Okay, and where there's three of us here that are getting very much towards
[23:56.880 -> 24:02.080] that kind of age and that doctor's appointment. Well, I mean, I'm literally on right on the cusp
[24:02.080 -> 24:07.280] of that and I'm not looking forward to it at all. So it's a great cause, but he lost me.
[24:07.280 -> 24:11.800] There was a recent one where he was sitting on a school chair and so his butt's fully
[24:11.800 -> 24:17.160] exposed, like they are in all of them, but he turns around and it's the eye contact and
[24:17.160 -> 24:21.160] he has this very sinister eye contact and that's where he lost me.
[24:21.160 -> 24:23.280] I was like, no, I am alarmed.
[24:23.280 -> 24:28.000] Despite your good cause, I've had enough of Bottas's butt.
[24:28.000 -> 24:29.840] Oh, sorry.
[24:29.840 -> 24:33.920] I pressed the button too early.
[24:33.920 -> 24:38.080] My friend Matthew here wants to talk about Valtteri Bottas's ass a bit more.
[24:38.080 -> 24:39.080] No, I don't.
[24:39.080 -> 24:42.480] I want to talk about my fun made up stats that you will hate instead.
[24:42.480 -> 24:43.480] Okay, let's do it.
[24:43.480 -> 24:44.480] Let's do that.
[24:44.480 -> 24:49.440] All right. So, in an effort to be super kind, because we all know how brutal and awful the
[24:49.440 -> 24:53.920] world of Formula One can be. In an effort to be super kind to the drivers, I decided to do
[24:53.920 -> 24:59.120] the following thing. I decided to see how many points they scored on average for every race
[24:59.120 -> 25:04.480] they finished. So if they DNF'd, regardless of the cause, I don't care. I said, how many points
[25:04.480 -> 25:06.680] did they score for the races they finished?
[25:06.680 -> 25:10.480] And I said, let's see how much they would have scored if they finished all of the races,
[25:10.480 -> 25:13.940] because only Max Verstappen finished every race this season.
[25:13.940 -> 25:16.480] Everybody else had at least one DNF.
[25:16.480 -> 25:21.480] And so for the alpha drivers, turns out that our friend Botas would have scored 12 whole
[25:21.480 -> 25:23.740] points instead of 10.
[25:23.740 -> 25:26.400] And our friend Joe would have scored seven whole points instead of 10. And our friend Joe would have scored 7 hole points
[25:26.400 -> 25:33.520] instead of 6. And if we take that to the Drivers' Championship, we find that poor Botas loses a
[25:33.520 -> 25:38.320] place. Joe doesn't change at all. And then I thought, you know what, that's not really fun.
[25:38.320 -> 25:43.120] What could make this fun? And then I realized I had this moment of inspiration. I said,
[25:43.000 -> 25:46.080] I realized I had this moment of inspiration. I said, everybody gives Perez such a hard time
[25:46.080 -> 25:47.520] as a second driver.
[25:47.520 -> 25:50.880] What if I made a Red Bull multiplier?
[25:50.880 -> 25:54.840] So the highest scoring driver equals Max's score.
[25:54.840 -> 25:57.680] And for Alpha, it's embarrassingly,
[25:57.680 -> 26:00.400] you got to multiply by like 53 to get there.
[26:00.400 -> 26:01.960] And then I multiply this.
[26:01.960 -> 26:04.520] Is that for Red Bull score or Verstappen score?
[26:04.520 -> 26:08.480] That's for Botas to match Verstappen's score.
[26:08.480 -> 26:13.120] And then I multiply that by the second driver's score and see how that relates to Perez.
[26:13.120 -> 26:16.320] Okay, all right, go on then, go on then.
[26:16.320 -> 26:17.320] What's the verdict?
[26:17.320 -> 26:31.920] Well, the verdict is Joe, if he had had the Red Bull and scored the same relative amount of points to Botas, he would have scored 318 points, which is slightly more than Perez's 285, I'm afraid to tell
[26:31.920 -> 26:32.920] you.
[26:32.920 -> 26:33.920] So, there you go.
[26:33.920 -> 26:40.320] So, is this whole segment just going to be you giving Perez just a kicking, relatively,
[26:40.320 -> 26:41.320] for every segment?
[26:41.320 -> 26:44.920] I mean, mostly, I think that's designed to upset me, if I'm honest.
[26:44.920 -> 26:45.960] That's how I feel.
[26:45.960 -> 26:50.960] No, no, actually, it's actually, it's very even handed. He only gets a kicking about
[26:50.960 -> 26:51.960] half the time.
[26:51.960 -> 26:57.720] Okay, well, then it's fun for everyone then. All right. Assuming then that we don't have
[26:57.720 -> 27:03.080] an awful lot left for Alfa Romeo, I would just say, ask, you know, what constitutes
[27:03.080 -> 27:06.240] success for Sauber next season?
[27:06.240 -> 27:08.160] So they've finished ninth here, Steve.
[27:08.480 -> 27:10.440] What are they aiming for in 2024?
[27:11.400 -> 27:14.520] I think they should just be aiming for ninth again.
[27:14.520 -> 27:16.880] I don't think there's much chance of improving a lot.
[27:16.880 -> 27:19.720] I don't think that, I really don't.
[27:20.400 -> 27:26.800] I think that their game now is to hang on until 2026, you know, try not to embarrass themselves too much.
[27:26.800 -> 27:28.000] Yeah.
[27:28.000 -> 27:31.000] Well, they're not doing a lot of development
[27:31.000 -> 27:36.000] that is going to make the car much different next year than this year.
[27:36.000 -> 27:40.000] Well, at least we haven't seen any of it yet, there have been no hints of it.
[27:40.000 -> 27:51.000] So if they could hang on and at least not come last again next year, then that would be probably deemed a reasonably successful year for them.
[27:51.000 -> 27:57.000] So that is quite a bleak... yeah, if you don't come last, we'll be very, very happy with you.
[27:57.000 -> 28:07.640] Christina, but for Bottas, it's kind of looking a bit terminal, isn't it? Joe is an out-and-out pay driver who doesn't cause any trouble, which is all I want from
[28:07.640 -> 28:13.200] our pay drivers, but Bottas really should be wiping the floor with a driver like Joe
[28:13.200 -> 28:14.200] Grenou.
[28:14.200 -> 28:17.920] Obviously, we haven't got a reference point, we haven't seen Joe go up against other drivers,
[28:17.920 -> 28:23.840] but I think we want Bottas to be leading the way much more than he is currently.
[28:23.840 -> 28:24.840] Absolutely.
[28:24.840 -> 28:29.520] Bottas, with the record that he has, there's really no good excuse for why he
[28:29.520 -> 28:34.720] wouldn't be performing well. I will say, though, it just feels like his lifestyle has switched
[28:34.720 -> 28:40.800] so much since he left Mercedes. And it honestly feels like, you know, he's just finding his joy
[28:40.800 -> 28:50.080] and bliss and attention being spread to other things. So it just wouldn't surprise me if this was him kind of getting ready to say goodbye to Formula One because
[28:50.080 -> 28:55.200] he's enjoying doing other things more and he has time in his life now that he could enjoy those
[28:55.200 -> 29:00.640] other things more. And maybe that's where it's headed. Maybe that's why he's just not doing as
[29:00.640 -> 29:06.800] well as he just does not care as much anymore. So he had his kind of, he had his, literally he had his shot at the title.
[29:06.800 -> 29:10.080] So he had what other drivers dream of, which is a title winning car,
[29:10.800 -> 29:17.760] and you know, 2017, 2018, 2019, and 2020, he literally had his shot to go and win that title,
[29:17.760 -> 29:22.560] and he couldn't do it. So in a way, like that, that's a kind of busted flush. No top team
[29:22.560 -> 29:31.120] is then going to pick him up. So yeah, maybe he's seen this as an extended paid retirement and he's having a bunch of fun with it. Yeah. Yeah. I mean,
[29:31.120 -> 29:34.160] that's what Matt's been doing on this show for the last three years. He's on his way.
[29:34.160 -> 29:39.200] Yeah. Yeah. 12 more till I get my pension and then it's all downhill from that.
[29:39.200 -> 29:41.520] Gold missed apex watch and then you're out of here.
[29:41.520 -> 29:45.440] That's right. Um, no, I think Botas scored about two thirds of
[29:45.440 -> 29:51.120] the point. Joe scored one third of the points. And so I think he's, uh, that's actually pretty
[29:51.120 -> 29:58.480] similar to the Verstappen-Perez ratio. So I think, I think we'd like to ding Botas for doing worse.
[29:58.480 -> 30:03.440] And there are other ways to look at this that I'm still investigating, but on the whole, based on
[30:03.440 -> 30:05.440] points, you can't really doubt him too
[30:05.440 -> 30:12.720] much. If I'm Botas, what I'm hoping is that a team like Williams or someone in that similar vein
[30:12.720 -> 30:17.840] just needs a Wiley veteran for a couple of years, and I can move to a car that might be more
[30:17.840 -> 30:27.360] competitive. And if I'm Alpha, I think Steve nailed it. Look, Audi's coming in, they may or may not have a car revamp for next season,
[30:27.360 -> 30:33.040] but your basic goal is to not do any worse than you did this year. They dropped three positions,
[30:33.040 -> 30:39.120] I think, in the championship from last year to this year. You don't want to be Haas in this
[30:39.120 -> 30:44.480] situation. You still want to finish ahead of them and maybe be a bit more competitive if you can,
[30:44.480 -> 30:50.240] and I'm sure that's probably their goal. And Sam Harper, our patron here, was the one who sent me that comment
[30:50.240 -> 30:54.560] which I put to Christina. Sorry, I missed that out. Our patrons have given us great comments on
[30:54.560 -> 31:00.800] all the teams. Sam said, Joe being about even with Bottas all year is bad, and the team being tied
[31:00.800 -> 31:08.880] with Alpine for being the most anonymous thing on the grid are the things that stand out for Sam and Scott said there was a highlight the team randomly showed up with the
[31:08.880 -> 31:14.320] third fastest car in qualifying in Hungary after being terrible all year and then both drivers
[31:14.320 -> 31:20.560] immediately were out of the points with terrible starts. Well with that let's move on to Williams.
[31:21.000 -> 31:31.600] Williams. All right, so this might be a bit of a sensitive topic because I think we've got a couple of
[31:31.600 -> 31:38.880] Williams fans here on the podcast, so myself and Steve, and a lot of people of your generation,
[31:38.880 -> 31:40.900] Steve, are big Williams fans.
[31:40.900 -> 31:47.360] And certainly, for me, historically, Nigel Mansell, Damon Hill,
[31:44.880 -> 31:49.720] Coulthard, you know a lot of my heroes
[31:47.360 -> 31:52.240] growing up were Williams people and
[31:49.720 -> 31:54.640] it's been very difficult to watch the
[31:52.240 -> 31:56.040] continued slide and the post Frank
[31:54.640 -> 31:58.880] Williams kind of era, the Clare Williams
[31:56.040 -> 32:01.000] era was was really really hard for
[31:58.880 -> 32:03.360] Williams fans and now we're sort of just
[32:01.000 -> 32:13.200] starting to scramble around in the dirt looking for hope. Oh yeah, when I first got into Formula One it was just a year or two before. Alan Jones won
[32:13.200 -> 32:19.520] his world championship in a Williams and so I had been a Williams fan, you know, all the way through
[32:32.000 -> 32:42.000] And yes, you're right. The Clare after, the Clare Williams era was not strong and they've just slid right away ever since. To see them come back up and get 7th in the competition this year, for the first time in six years I think they got as high as 7th.
[32:42.000 -> 32:43.000] Is it?
[32:43.000 -> 32:46.240] 2016 I think they were 7th they were seventh. Oh no, they
[32:46.240 -> 32:51.000] were fourth or fifth. Well 2014 I think they didn't they finish second in the championship
[32:51.000 -> 32:55.360] in 2014? Something like that yeah. I'm gonna have to go and look that up in case I was
[32:55.360 -> 32:58.900] lying. But they basically that was with the new hybrid engine and if you didn't have a
[32:58.900 -> 33:03.740] Mercedes engine you were you were completely bored. No good at all. So to see them coming
[33:03.740 -> 33:05.800] up this year has been wonderful.
[33:05.800 -> 33:07.280] And the other thing that's made a difference,
[33:07.280 -> 33:08.720] I think is James Vowles.
[33:08.720 -> 33:11.400] He is, you know, turning into, you know,
[33:11.400 -> 33:13.600] one of the best team principals.
[33:13.600 -> 33:17.920] He's articulate, well-spoken, a good planner.
[33:17.920 -> 33:19.600] I think that he's gonna lead that team
[33:19.600 -> 33:20.800] to bigger and better things.
[33:20.800 -> 33:23.360] Well, let's put James Vowles under the microscope then,
[33:23.360 -> 33:31.200] because, you know, you're in the big chair now. now he's a celebrity he's an F1 team boss and Brad D in our Patreon slack chat
[33:31.200 -> 33:35.520] it's a little slack group that you get to join and it's a nice place to hang out if you're a
[33:35.520 -> 33:41.520] patron patreon.com forward slash missed apex I mean you're listening to an F1 podcast during the
[33:41.520 -> 33:46.080] winter season there's no F1 so we must be fine and maybe worthy of looking
[33:46.080 -> 33:51.680] at supporting this. Patreon.com forward slash missed apex. Brad D in the Patreon slack group
[33:51.680 -> 33:58.080] says Vowles is doing well. He's looked to spend more money on ancient infrastructure to make his
[33:58.080 -> 34:03.760] outfit more competitive and got the top team principals to show everyone. And got the top team
[34:03.760 -> 34:05.120] principals to show everyone how petul top team principals to show everyone how
[34:05.120 -> 34:10.800] petulant they can be at the same time. So, Christina, James Vowles is now at the top
[34:10.800 -> 34:14.640] table of F1. How do we rate his season so far?
[34:14.640 -> 34:21.240] Oh, I would give it a solid 8 out of 10. Like, very good. No questions asked. The fact that
[34:21.240 -> 34:26.320] he's communicating publicly is a genius move. Like, that kind of
[34:26.320 -> 34:30.640] transparency fans really appreciate, regardless of what he's saying, if it's true or not. If he's
[34:30.640 -> 34:34.640] being completely honest, like, I don't particularly care. They will tell us whatever narrative they
[34:34.640 -> 34:40.480] feel suits them best. But just giving fans that feeling that they're in the inner circle
[34:40.480 -> 34:46.320] is fantastic. That is a very smart move. As we said, he's very articulate. He just – he kind
[34:46.320 -> 34:51.160] of ticks all the boxes of what you hope a team principal is going to be, especially showing how
[34:51.160 -> 34:57.360] compassionate he can be towards Logan, who isn't having a great season. And that's – it feels like
[34:57.360 -> 35:01.520] he's on the same team as Logan, which you can't say the same thing for all team principals. Some
[35:01.520 -> 35:09.680] team principals will throw their own drivers under the bus. And you're like, are you sure you're on the same team? There's one thing to be said about
[35:09.680 -> 35:13.580] putting responsibility on the person who did mess up, but for a team principal, it should
[35:13.580 -> 35:19.080] never feel like they're fully throwing them underneath the double-decker. So great to
[35:19.080 -> 35:23.520] see James doing all that. Definitely a couple growing pains that you would like to see improved
[35:23.520 -> 35:25.200] on, like waiting until the
[35:25.200 -> 35:31.040] end of season, till the season has finished, to announce Logan. And no doubt that there were some
[35:31.040 -> 35:34.320] things behind the scenes going on that prevented that announcement from happening sooner, but
[35:34.880 -> 35:40.080] a bit more decisiveness towards decisions like that I think would be very appreciative.
[35:40.800 -> 35:43.200] But, asides that, very happy to see how he's doing.
[35:43.200 -> 35:48.280] In James Vowell's defence, it can take Chex an awfully long time to clear. So he did have
[35:48.280 -> 35:54.640] to delay the decision significantly. Let's see, Vivek says, Williams properly returning
[35:54.640 -> 35:59.360] to the midfield has been his Williams highlight. Hopefully they can improve further for 2024.
[35:59.360 -> 36:05.200] However, that lack of infrastructure is a millstone that will impede that.
[36:05.200 -> 36:08.480] What do you make of this whole infrastructure thing?
[36:08.480 -> 36:13.840] Because if you want to be cynical, you could say, well, for a new boss, that is quite a
[36:13.840 -> 36:17.360] big thing to kind of go, yes, we're making all these improvements, but look at this one
[36:17.360 -> 36:19.640] big thing here that isn't my fault.
[36:19.640 -> 36:24.760] So he's kind of giving himself a little failsafe with this infrastructure stuff, or how genuine
[36:24.760 -> 36:31.360] is that? I come here to praise vowels, not bury him. That's a quote from somewhere vaguely.
[36:31.360 -> 36:39.520] That is from Monty Python. Look, as far as the infrastructure goes, yeah, he's not wrong.
[36:39.520 -> 36:45.040] A couple of years ago, they couldn't even run computer simulations. They had to manually input
[36:45.040 -> 36:50.160] suspension parameters to run simulations. They didn't have it automated, and the servers weren't
[36:51.600 -> 36:58.080] efficient in their running of it. They've made huge strides. They're so, so far behind because
[36:58.080 -> 37:06.320] for more than a decade now, there's been an underinvestment in that side of it. And that underinvestment occurred
[37:06.320 -> 37:12.000] when there were no limits on what you could do, which is where we see the Mercedes and the Red
[37:12.000 -> 37:18.640] Bulls and the Ferrari having these huge baked-in advantages that we still hear them nattering on
[37:18.640 -> 37:26.000] about from time to time. Secondly, I would like to say, I think Vals did an excellent job taking what
[37:26.000 -> 37:31.320] Yos Capito and his team had set up for Williams and bringing it forward
[37:31.320 -> 37:35.760] successfully. They gained three places in the Constructors' Championship and
[37:35.760 -> 37:40.160] that's where the money is. They gained a lot of money with this and they have
[37:40.160 -> 37:45.700] Doralton saying that, no, no, we are fully on board, we are willing to spend
[37:45.700 -> 37:51.020] the money to get them to that next step of competitiveness, which would really be
[37:51.020 -> 37:56.020] sort of your Alpine Aston level we're talking about. They were far away from
[37:56.020 -> 38:01.580] it this season, but some of what their car had, some of the characteristics of
[38:01.580 -> 38:06.400] the car, particularly the car balance, imitated in a lot of ways the
[38:06.960 -> 38:13.280] design decisions that Red Bull had made at the start of this aerodynamic regulations.
[38:13.280 -> 38:19.600] If they figure out how to add the efficient downforce to it without losing what they have,
[38:19.600 -> 38:28.960] without losing their way in correlation, then there is a big scope for them to improve their performance
[38:29.680 -> 38:37.040] next season. I think you've also got to remember that one of the big improvements that Val's made
[38:37.040 -> 38:48.920] when he first came in was not so much with machinery, you know, like simulators and new rigs, that sort of thing. It was apparently they had no software management systems
[38:49.760 -> 38:52.720] that tracked the development of new parts,
[38:52.720 -> 38:57.000] you know, how long before they arrived,
[38:57.000 -> 38:57.840] all that sort of thing.
[38:57.840 -> 39:01.080] So he's the first, yeah, workflow kind of software.
[39:01.080 -> 39:08.000] So his big first expenditure was to get built a big software
[39:08.000 -> 39:15.700] management infrastructure, I suppose it is, that was able to make the whole organisation
[39:15.700 -> 39:21.900] run much more efficiently. I mean, that team had been let bleed to death for many years.
[39:21.900 -> 39:27.040] And so, yeah, I mean, it took a lot of transfusions to
[39:24.680 -> 39:28.760] get it back up to some sort of speed.
[39:27.040 -> 39:30.880] So I think what we all seem to be saying
[39:28.760 -> 39:34.080] is William's fate seems to be rested on
[39:30.880 -> 39:35.640] how good James Vowles is. Like, when you
[39:34.080 -> 39:37.200] talk about Williams, everyone is
[39:35.640 -> 39:39.760] talking about James Vowles. He's basically
[39:37.200 -> 39:42.160] the new broom that's swept clean. And a
[39:39.760 -> 39:44.520] lot of that, as Christina says, is
[39:42.160 -> 39:46.960] because he's a very, very good and calm orator. Like, he is like,
[39:46.960 -> 39:52.320] I would like him to be, you know, at my, on my deathbed as my kind of, you know, nurse on the
[39:52.320 -> 39:57.360] side, casually explaining to me why my body was about to fail me, but he'd do it in a calm way.
[39:57.360 -> 40:02.160] And you kind of go, oh, that's all right then, James, sorry to have bothered you. So he's
[40:02.160 -> 40:06.160] obviously a very good communicator. I feel really sorry
[40:06.160 -> 40:11.920] for him with this Logan Sargent situation. So I'm going to offend the Americans, the
[40:11.920 -> 40:16.280] North Americans for sure here, but I think that's the one situation that has kind of
[40:16.280 -> 40:21.740] forced him to lie a little bit, like a lot of team principals have to do, like Mike Crack
[40:21.740 -> 40:26.120] has to do as well. So to my mind, and feel free to argue with
[40:26.120 -> 40:27.120] me, Logan Sargent...
[40:27.120 -> 40:28.120] Okay.
[40:28.120 -> 40:31.840] Okay, yeah, I know. I didn't think you were going to struggle with that premise, if I'm
[40:31.840 -> 40:38.440] honest. So, James Vowles is very much, no, he's a talented driver, I was wrong to reject
[40:38.440 -> 40:42.600] him at Mercedes, he said, because I think he had a chance to hire Logan Sargent in a
[40:42.600 -> 40:47.600] sim development driver role. Oh, but he didn't. But then he was like, oh, well, I was actually, I was wrong about that
[40:47.600 -> 40:52.560] on Mercedes and Williams were right to take him on. And he's a top talent. He's there on merit
[40:52.560 -> 40:58.320] and he's a genuine salary driver. That's what James Val says. But I can't help but think that
[40:58.320 -> 41:03.920] there has to be a financial investment for keeping on someone who did as poorly as Logan Sargent did
[41:05.640 -> 41:11.940] investment for keeping on someone who did as poorly as Logan Sargent did this season. They would not have kept on a pure talent hire after a season like that. And if that
[41:11.940 -> 41:16.440] is the state F1 is in, that a driver with that season survives, you know, when they've
[41:16.440 -> 41:22.880] got all that talent on the bench, it's somebody tell me I'm wrong, that he is there for financial
[41:22.880 -> 41:29.480] reasons that Williams are keeping Logan Sargent in that second seat because they think it will be the financially most beneficial thing.
[41:29.480 -> 41:33.600] I reckon it's his father that's paying for it, just like Lando Norris' father used to
[41:33.600 -> 41:34.880] pay for him a few years ago.
[41:34.880 -> 41:39.840] But there's a denial though, Steve. If you say Logan Sargent's a pay driver, people will
[41:39.840 -> 41:41.320] yell at you on the internet.
[41:41.320 -> 41:45.280] Well, they do anyway, so, and they're wrong, so that's fine.
[41:45.280 -> 41:49.960] Yeah, so I mean Lance Stroll technically receives a salary.
[41:49.960 -> 41:50.960] So he's...
[41:50.960 -> 41:54.640] Lance Stroll is a salary driver, but no one's going to argue with me that he's a buy-in
[41:54.640 -> 41:55.640] pay driver, right?
[41:55.640 -> 41:58.120] Christina, am I offending you as a...
[41:58.120 -> 42:03.600] I know that he's nearly Canadian, because he's on that side of the world.
[42:03.600 -> 42:08.000] Salary allowance, like, call it what you want.
[42:08.000 -> 42:09.000] Thank you.
[42:09.000 -> 42:10.000] Pocket money.
[42:10.000 -> 42:13.080] You know, it's...
[42:13.080 -> 42:17.560] My big thing with Logan Sargent is that I could imagine Williams deciding that it's
[42:17.560 -> 42:22.120] much more worth it for them to have a known factor, even if it is two rookie years, two
[42:22.120 -> 42:28.080] bad rookie years in a row, than it is to take a risk on this new driver,
[42:28.080 -> 42:31.820] another rookie, that they have an unknown.
[42:31.820 -> 42:34.580] With Logan, at least they know what they're getting, at least it's somebody who's comfortable
[42:34.580 -> 42:40.460] with the team, and the only thing that they have to stomach is some poor results.
[42:40.460 -> 42:45.520] And with how Albon is pulling in so many points, they have a bit of buffer space, because
[42:45.520 -> 42:51.440] especially all the other teams that they're competing against aren't doing well either.
[42:51.440 -> 42:57.580] They have room where they can take the hit, that is, Logan not having great results.
[42:57.580 -> 43:02.520] And that risk might be worth it compared to this other rookie, looks like he could be
[43:02.520 -> 43:06.960] good, but again, they don't know.
[43:06.960 -> 43:07.960] That's my guess.
[43:07.960 -> 43:10.000] Well, it's not even a guess.
[43:10.000 -> 43:11.280] It's a certainty.
[43:11.280 -> 43:16.240] I'm pretty convinced from a while back, Val simply wanted to keep Sergeant.
[43:16.240 -> 43:20.280] Sergeant brings money to the team, he's a known quantity.
[43:20.280 -> 43:26.080] Anyone they were going to get that, I mean, there are some very exciting up and coming racers,
[43:26.880 -> 43:31.120] juniors on different teams. I think Williams will definitely have their eye on him, but let's
[43:31.120 -> 43:36.800] consider for a moment the path of Logan Sargent. Logan Sargent, his first year in F2, or his first
[43:36.800 -> 43:43.280] full year in F2, fighting for like fifth or sixth in the championship, is told by Williams,
[43:43.840 -> 43:46.000] if you get enough points for a super license,
[43:46.000 -> 43:52.160] you can come race for us. And then he goes on to do exactly that. So right off the bat,
[43:52.160 -> 43:57.920] he's like, he's here's the goal, reach the goal, you reach the goal. However, unlike a lot of his
[43:57.920 -> 44:03.760] compatriots who were also classed as rookies, Piastri in particular, he only got his day and
[44:03.760 -> 44:05.360] a half or whatever of testing
[44:05.360 -> 44:07.280] before he had to drive a Formula One car.
[44:07.280 -> 44:11.160] He didn't get months of being coached in simulators.
[44:11.160 -> 44:15.480] He didn't get to drive historical cars at all the tracks where he's racing that a lot
[44:15.480 -> 44:18.220] of these other junior academy drivers did.
[44:18.220 -> 44:22.260] He was literally thrown into the most deep of deep ends.
[44:22.260 -> 44:26.760] And despite that, at least early on, he wasn't that far off of album.
[44:26.760 -> 44:31.760] No one's going to forget his performance at Jetta, where he was looking like he was headed to what,
[44:31.760 -> 44:37.040] Q2, Q3, till he found that weird track limit that, why is that even a track limit there?
[44:37.040 -> 44:42.200] But whatever. Okay, fine. Rules are rules. And so now he finds himself in a situation where he's
[44:42.200 -> 44:46.120] told, you have to prove to us you belong at Williams.
[44:46.120 -> 44:52.000] And he clearly does enough, scores a point, comes close enough, shows clear improvement
[44:52.000 -> 44:53.560] across the season.
[44:53.560 -> 44:54.560] This is painful.
[44:54.560 -> 44:55.560] I'm sorry, Matt, this is painful.
[44:55.560 -> 44:56.560] No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no,
[44:56.560 -> 44:57.560] no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no,
[44:57.560 -> 44:58.560] no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no,
[44:58.560 -> 44:59.560] no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no,
[44:59.560 -> 45:00.560] no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no,
[45:00.560 -> 45:01.560] no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no,
[45:01.560 -> 45:09.680] no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, And now here's where I will agree with you. He should never have been put in that William's seat in the first place. He needed another year in Formula 2, and he needed the same
[45:09.680 -> 45:15.120] kind of coaching these other rookies we've seen do well have had before he was put in that seat.
[45:15.920 -> 45:21.120] But that's not his fault that he didn't get it. The opportunity was there. But if I'm Williams,
[45:21.680 -> 45:26.040] and Christina is absolutely right about this, there is no one out there
[45:26.040 -> 45:32.620] who will come in for a year, bring as much money as Sargent does, and at least already
[45:32.620 -> 45:37.300] know how to operate the car without mostly driving it into walls.
[45:37.300 -> 45:43.320] There is, I mean, he's the most obvious solution to the problem they currently have along a
[45:43.320 -> 45:45.160] number of facets, one of which is
[45:45.160 -> 45:48.080] the fact that he's actually a decent driver.
[45:48.080 -> 45:54.520] Okay, I'm sorry, we can't base F1 driver picks on just being scared how it would work out
[45:54.520 -> 45:56.280] with someone new, okay?
[45:56.280 -> 45:57.640] It's not my marriage.
[45:57.640 -> 46:04.760] I'm kidding, love you, but like, that can't be what we base F1 driver selection on.
[46:04.760 -> 46:05.380] And Matt, I'm sorry
[46:05.380 -> 46:12.320] You've just damned him with the faintest of praise and this happens with these billionaire drivers all the time your long list of excuses
[46:12.320 -> 46:14.560] For Logan sergeant was he scored a point?
[46:15.200 -> 46:21.960] Albon finished 13th in the championship. Then you go remember that one time when he was quite close to
[46:22.480 -> 46:25.840] His teammate and then he got his lap times disqualified for
[46:25.840 -> 46:26.840] breaking the rules?
[46:26.840 -> 46:27.840] Is that like...
[46:27.840 -> 46:28.840] The bar...
[46:28.840 -> 46:33.840] Why is the bar so low for Lance Stroll and for Logan Sargent?
[46:33.840 -> 46:35.320] It's really not.
[46:35.320 -> 46:39.960] You have to take into account the context that the team sees, the data the team sees
[46:39.960 -> 46:40.960] that we don't.
[46:40.960 -> 46:46.080] But simply put, the answer is a long-standing Formula One saw. You can't teach
[46:46.080 -> 46:52.480] quickness, you can teach consistency. Clearly the team think that he has the quickness to be a
[46:52.480 -> 46:59.840] partner to Albon next season. Beyond that, who knows? Because as you know, sometimes really good
[46:59.840 -> 47:08.360] drivers come up, sometimes it's a crop of drivers that aren't the least bit inspiring but what they do know or what they've convinced themselves of is that
[47:08.360 -> 47:13.440] he's going to be he because he knows the car now because he has experience of it
[47:13.440 -> 47:19.320] he will be a better fit an easier fit and less demanding fit than a brand new
[47:19.320 -> 47:30.800] driver who has exactly zero experience in a Formula One car. And it's very likely in his second season he will do better than in his first season.
[47:30.800 -> 47:33.200] So did he set the world on fire?
[47:33.200 -> 47:34.200] No.
[47:34.200 -> 47:37.760] Did he do enough to be the obvious, logical, and easy choice?
[47:37.760 -> 47:38.760] Yes.
[47:38.760 -> 47:41.000] And is that the case oftentimes in Formula One?
[47:41.000 -> 47:42.880] Well, yeah, sure, absolutely.
[47:42.880 -> 47:45.040] I mean, Perez is still at Red Bull, right?
[47:45.040 -> 47:50.480] True. But, okay, the other thing I think that's important to remember is that 2024,
[47:50.480 -> 47:56.480] three quarters of the contracts are up. And how appealing must it seem to Williams of,
[47:56.480 -> 48:02.560] oh, well, why don't we just keep Logan another year? It'll be a buffer. And 2024, maybe we can
[48:02.560 -> 48:06.680] snag someone with more experience. So this might also just be them
[48:06.680 -> 48:10.920] playing the long game of we suffer this year, we're not going to bring in another rookie,
[48:10.920 -> 48:16.760] that would be silly. You know what, no pain, no gain. Okay, sometimes you have to take
[48:16.760 -> 48:22.640] the hit to win in the long term. It's not about the battle, it's about the war. Like,
[48:22.640 -> 48:32.120] let's not forget, this is a long thing for Williams. They are trying to rebuild from a whole era of complete and utter, like, pile of flaming garbage.
[48:32.120 -> 48:33.120] Nobody here is-
[48:33.120 -> 48:34.120] It takes a while to put it out.
[48:34.120 -> 48:41.280] You see, so your defense for that is that they're a tire fire that is burning. Like,
[48:41.280 -> 48:48.480] none of you are saying Logan Sargent's the best choice for Williams. No, he is. He's obviously the best choice.
[48:48.480 -> 48:49.280] I think he is.
[48:49.280 -> 48:49.840] Steve!
[48:49.840 -> 48:53.760] They have a very specific set of needs.
[48:53.760 -> 48:56.240] Yeah, I agree with Christina.
[48:56.240 -> 48:56.800] Come on then, Steve.
[48:57.440 -> 49:03.840] Let's have this discussion. I want to know, what do you mean by best, then? He's cheapest,
[49:03.840 -> 49:07.200] he's most experienced, and he's probably going to do the least amount
[49:07.200 -> 49:11.240] of damage to the car next season relative to anyone else who would sit in that seat
[49:11.240 -> 49:13.160] that they can actually afford to get.
[49:13.160 -> 49:15.280] So what do you mean by best then?
[49:15.760 -> 49:17.240] Well, no, that's exactly right.
[49:17.240 -> 49:22.840] Williams have got enough to do in rebuilding the team without having to, you know, try
[49:22.840 -> 49:24.960] and bed in a totally new rookie.
[49:26.800 -> 49:32.640] the team without having to, you know, try and bet in a totally new rookie. So it was a safe bet for them to keep him there and they can concentrate on the other issues in terms of
[49:32.640 -> 49:37.920] design and implementation of infrastructure to try and make them better next year. I think it's
[49:37.920 -> 49:43.040] a reasonable choice. You know, this conversation is just such a good reminder to me that I can be
[49:43.040 -> 49:45.640] in a room with smart, intelligent,
[49:45.640 -> 49:50.280] talented people who disagree with me and I can still be the one that's right. You know,
[49:50.280 -> 49:54.080] it's a real thing that you have to kind of keep in mind just because all you smart folk
[49:54.080 -> 50:00.720] are defending this bonkers decision. Like I have to be, no, I can be right in the face of all of
[50:00.720 -> 50:05.320] this. Who instead? Who would do better? Like about a dozen drivers. Name
[50:05.320 -> 50:09.600] them please. Okay, so I would rather have that rookie that you're talking about. So
[50:09.600 -> 50:14.160] if I can get hold of a junior driver, if I can get hold of a junior driver, if I can
[50:14.160 -> 50:19.240] get hold of Lawson, and I guarantee you that there was some kind of negotiation going on
[50:19.240 -> 50:26.440] with Lawson because he was being super cautious. Okay, I would say if you're telling me, if you're literally telling me there isn't a
[50:26.440 -> 50:35.080] more suitable driver for that second Williams seat than Logan Sargent, who has caused nearly
[50:35.080 -> 50:39.360] five million dollars worth of damage over the course of the season and is likely to
[50:39.360 -> 50:43.880] do so again next season, if you're really telling me that is the state of motor racing
[50:43.880 -> 50:48.160] where there's no one more suitable for the job, then motor racing is in a very very sad
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[52:25.320 -> 52:29.440] it easy. Let's call a duck a duck because Logan Sargent is quacking.
[52:29.440 -> 52:34.440] Logan Sargent is a pay driver and as Christina says it's an allowance and I've noticed these
[52:34.440 -> 52:37.360] trends with young drivers all up and down the series.
[52:37.360 -> 52:39.640] None of them ever talk about their parents money.
[52:39.640 -> 52:44.280] They always talk about their sponsors and guess who's behind their personal sponsors.
[52:44.280 -> 52:49.840] That's right their family and their parents. So follow the money. Logan Sargent is a paid driver.
[52:49.840 -> 52:54.720] And I just, I think you're all nuts going, well, let's just stick with him due to a lack of
[52:54.720 -> 53:00.400] imagination. Let's wait another year. Instead of looking at the lineup of F2 drivers that are
[53:00.400 -> 53:06.880] consigned to no offense, Formula E, you could even go into Formula E and go and pull drivers out of there.
[53:06.880 -> 53:11.400] Are you literally telling me, Matt, that you can't think of a dozen drivers who would be
[53:11.400 -> 53:13.720] more suitable for that seat than Logan Sargent?
[53:13.720 -> 53:17.280] And I didn't mean to rant, but I didn't realise you were all going to be this wrong.
[53:17.280 -> 53:22.960] Well, I mean, I know it's frustrating to discover you haven't thought through the problem correctly.
[53:22.960 -> 53:23.960] Nevertheless...
[53:23.960 -> 53:29.000] I hate you. This is why I like Chris Moore.
[53:29.000 -> 53:38.000] I mean, you know, here I am being reasonable team principal. I know that with everyone's contracts being up,
[53:38.000 -> 53:48.200] and I know the rookie's coming up, Vestey, and what's his name from Macauau like there's so many good drivers out there who aren't ready they don't have the super license points they're not
[53:48.200 -> 53:53.040] ready to come to Formula One so I've got a year that I have to put somebody in my
[53:53.040 -> 53:58.760] seat go to go to Formula E well look at what happened to Nick DeVries that was a
[53:58.760 -> 54:03.160] genius choice wasn't it yeah I could bring in a Formula E driver but if it's
[54:03.160 -> 54:05.200] someone who's really good in Formula
[54:05.200 -> 54:09.280] E, are they going to be willing to give up their seat in Formula E to come to Formula
[54:09.280 -> 54:12.060] One for exactly one year before I kick them out?
[54:12.060 -> 54:16.680] And if they are, how much money am I going to have to pay them versus how much am I sure,
[54:16.680 -> 54:19.840] absolutely positive, Sargent is bringing to the team?
[54:19.840 -> 54:24.440] And last and not least of which is just because they're a good driver doesn't mean they're
[54:24.440 -> 54:27.080] going to be able to drive this car well.
[54:27.080 -> 54:32.740] Logan Sargent has had a year of practice with this car, and he's gotten better over that
[54:32.740 -> 54:36.760] year according to every metric that Fowlis has said he looked at.
[54:36.760 -> 54:39.120] Does that mean they didn't want Lawson?
[54:39.120 -> 54:40.880] No, I think they wanted Lawson.
[54:40.880 -> 54:45.500] I think what it came down to is they couldn't afford Lawson, which again
[54:45.500 -> 54:50.800] gets back to your, where is it more important to spend the money on the driver, who's probably
[54:50.800 -> 54:56.220] the least important factor, or the car, which is probably the most important factor. So
[54:56.220 -> 55:01.880] again, if I'm Vowles and I have to make that choice, bring in a cheap driver, even if they're
[55:01.880 -> 55:09.920] a placeholder, who might do better next year than they did this year, and let's spend some money upgrading our computer systems and on
[55:09.920 -> 55:14.400] engineering and stuff like that that will buy us actual lap time that will really matter,
[55:14.400 -> 55:16.080] especially in the hands of Albin.
[55:16.080 -> 55:18.400] David In the long term, you're dead right.
[55:19.600 -> 55:23.120] You know, Williams have got a new car to build.
[55:23.120 -> 55:26.720] They've also got all this infrastructure to repair.
[55:26.720 -> 55:28.360] I totally agree.
[55:28.360 -> 55:29.200] Leave him there.
[55:29.200 -> 55:30.120] He's got one year.
[55:30.120 -> 55:32.320] If he's still crap at the end of the year,
[55:32.320 -> 55:36.920] then we'll get Jack Doohan in or get Lawson in.
[55:36.920 -> 55:39.560] But yes, give the team another year
[55:39.560 -> 55:42.040] to try and get the backend stuff together
[55:42.040 -> 55:44.560] before we worry about the second driver.
[55:44.560 -> 55:48.760] Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. And let's delay that diet as well for another year. Let's just
[55:48.760 -> 55:53.760] keep stuffing ourselves with cake and then we'll just shift the belly fat in 2025, shall
[55:53.760 -> 55:58.000] we? Alright. And that's not even my biggest complaint with the driver line-up. So whilst
[55:58.000 -> 56:03.320] I don't think Logan Sargent should be in the second seat, because I don't think a team
[56:03.320 -> 56:05.400] like Williams, an aspirational team,
[56:05.400 -> 56:11.920] should be going for that pay driver role anyway. Do we have Alex Albon fans here? Because actually,
[56:11.920 -> 56:16.200] maybe they need to be more ambitious with their number one driver. Like, Christina,
[56:16.200 -> 56:20.880] I'm going to upset lots of people here, but I don't think we've seen any evidence that
[56:20.880 -> 56:25.360] Alex Albon is like a top, top tier driver. He might be, but we haven't really seen
[56:25.360 -> 56:32.880] that evidence. There could be way more to unlock in that package, but Albon's looking really good
[56:32.880 -> 56:39.280] against Logan Sargent. But again, it comes down to what Williams actually needs in their car.
[56:39.280 -> 56:43.760] They need to prove that, for one, that they can be a good team and build a good car before they're
[56:43.760 -> 56:48.800] going to attract top talent, and for two, they just need somebody who's going to help them develop the car.
[56:48.800 -> 56:52.800] So it really doesn't come down to, is this driver the absolute best? It comes down to,
[56:52.800 -> 56:58.640] what does Williams need? And at this point, Alex Albarn is pretty much exactly what Williams need.
[56:58.640 -> 57:06.400] He has a personality, he has pets, and nobody can dislike somebody who has that many adorable, fluffy animals
[57:06.400 -> 57:10.120] that run their own Instagram and that interact with Roscoe.
[57:10.120 -> 57:17.360] Like I'm sorry, but he is marketing magic, which is what they need.
[57:17.360 -> 57:20.280] They need to have a good public image and he does that.
[57:20.280 -> 57:25.440] And he brings in enough points compared to other teams that they're not dead last. He does what
[57:25.440 -> 57:31.360] they need and nothing else really matters. What about developing the car? Is he any good at
[57:31.360 -> 57:36.560] developing a car? I haven't heard anybody say that he's brilliant at it, so I mean, that should be
[57:36.560 -> 57:44.480] his first job at the moment as the team leader to develop that car. Is he any good at that?
[57:44.480 -> 57:48.240] I would say so. From what I can... Their car has been getting better and part of that, yes,
[57:48.240 -> 57:53.200] is going to be them improving infrastructure. But this next year will be very telling on if he can
[57:53.200 -> 57:58.160] help improve a car because now they actually have James Vowles that has had his year to get
[57:58.160 -> 58:03.040] comfortable and get into place. They're starting to feel a lot more like a team. So I think this
[58:03.040 -> 58:08.640] year is when we're actually going to be able to tell is if Alex Albon is worth his weight in whatever he's paid.
[58:08.640 -> 58:13.840] I'll tell you how to fix that problem and make certain that he performs. Kidnap his cats.
[58:13.840 -> 58:14.320] Oh my God.
[58:15.200 -> 58:18.160] And tell him he only gets them back if he does a good job.
[58:19.200 -> 58:23.200] This is normally where I go, Uncle Steve, can we make sure that gets edited out? But your
[58:23.200 -> 58:30.520] Uncle Steve, you have been wildly irresponsible in endorsing cat napping and I will have no truck with
[58:30.520 -> 58:31.520] that.
[58:31.520 -> 58:32.520] Oh my gosh.
[58:32.520 -> 58:37.080] So full John Wick that will happen if anybody ever like goes after Squeaks. I will make
[58:37.080 -> 58:40.400] John Wick look like a PG-13 film. Oh my gosh.
[58:40.400 -> 58:51.480] I can't believe we've not had Squeaks McGee, Christina's cat, on this stream yet. James says, surely outscoring your teammate by 2700% is enough evidence.
[58:51.480 -> 58:57.520] Look, maybe, but I think this has been one of my major criticisms of Williams through
[58:57.520 -> 59:01.760] that kind of managed decline pre-Deralton that me and Steve were talking about earlier
[59:01.760 -> 59:05.080] is, you know, perhaps Alex Albon was the driver,
[59:05.080 -> 59:08.960] like Matt says, that was available and they could afford. But if they're going to push
[59:08.960 -> 59:13.880] on, is Alex... if they ever got a title winning car, I don't know if Alex Albon is that that
[59:13.880 -> 59:18.040] top tier driver that they want. But this has been my concern with Williams. They really
[59:18.040 -> 59:22.920] haven't had the out and out driver packages to show what that car can do. And that has
[59:22.920 -> 59:25.120] to be a little bit demoralising for
[59:25.120 -> 59:29.280] the team. So like, look at George Russell's race pace now compared to Lewis Hamilton,
[59:29.280 -> 59:33.480] and he was looking great against Kubica, but now we know that Russell doesn't have that
[59:33.480 -> 59:39.160] ultimate Pirelli race pace of the top, top tier drivers unless he turns it around. But
[59:39.160 -> 59:44.680] over the last two seasons, you watch their comparable sector times on comparable stint,
[59:44.680 -> 59:45.120] and he's looked
[59:45.120 -> 59:50.820] nowhere really on race pace compared to Hamilton, aside from the very last race where he did
[59:50.820 -> 59:55.560] look on pace. So that's what I think, like, Matt, you know, we had arguments when it was
[59:55.560 -> 01:00:01.160] Stroll and Sorotkin there, and I was saying I think that's potentially a Q2, Q3 car, but
[01:00:01.160 -> 01:00:08.380] they were out of Q1, like, week in, week out, and I think you're not going to argue with me now that other drivers wouldn't have got more out of it than Sorotkin and
[01:00:08.380 -> 01:00:09.380] Stroll.
[01:00:09.380 -> 01:00:15.200] Uh, Sorotkin and Stroll, no. We have seen evidence in other teams that makes it easy
[01:00:15.200 -> 01:00:19.960] to make that determination. Albin, on the other hand, I'm not sure I agree with you
[01:00:19.960 -> 01:00:27.880] about. I think, I think it's pretty impressive that he's taken a car like that and been able to score points with it
[01:00:27.880 -> 01:00:31.840] been able to get it up into q2 and to q3 and
[01:00:33.000 -> 01:00:38.820] Honestly, if you just look at his racing around other drivers that you do rate
[01:00:38.820 -> 01:00:46.040] I don't think it's so easy to be dismissive of him. Well, I'm not being dismissive. I'm just saying we don't really know.
[01:00:46.040 -> 01:00:48.520] I don't think we have any evidence.
[01:00:48.520 -> 01:00:50.100] What did Alban do?
[01:00:50.100 -> 01:00:56.020] He looked okay against Kvyat, and then obviously he went into the Red Bull second driver trap,
[01:00:56.020 -> 01:00:58.420] and that's really all the evidence we've got.
[01:00:58.420 -> 01:01:03.520] Him up against Logan Sargent is no measure of how good he is as a driver.
[01:01:03.520 -> 01:01:08.400] Well, I mean, if we are going to argue Logan Sargent didn't give us much of a benchmark
[01:01:08.400 -> 01:01:12.560] for Albon, well, you know, there's an argument you're always going to win because he didn't,
[01:01:12.560 -> 01:01:14.640] quite frankly, because he's an out-and-out rookie.
[01:01:14.640 -> 01:01:20.640] But I think if you look at his tire management in a car like the Williams, that I believe
[01:01:20.640 -> 01:01:23.080] he has matured as a driver.
[01:01:23.080 -> 01:01:27.680] If you look at his race craft, I think he has matured as a driver.
[01:01:27.680 -> 01:01:32.160] Yeah, I don't know. Put him in a Mercedes. Would he be faster than Russell? Maybe, maybe not. I
[01:01:32.160 -> 01:01:38.560] don't know. Be interesting experiment to run, but it's not one that we can, unfortunately, run right
[01:01:38.560 -> 01:01:45.200] now. But what we will see is what he brings to the car next season. By all accounts, the Williams was not the easiest
[01:01:45.200 -> 01:01:50.720] car to drive. But frankly, the main reason you should be a giant Albin fan is that he will always
[01:01:50.720 -> 01:01:57.120] reveal all sorts of telling technical details whenever they interview him post-race. Unlike
[01:01:57.120 -> 01:02:01.520] most drivers, he will just say, he will just say things out loud with his whole chest. And you'd
[01:02:01.520 -> 01:02:06.900] be like, whoa, did you just tell me that about your own car? Because wow, I'm glad I know that now.
[01:02:06.900 -> 01:02:09.100] The Russell fan in the Slack group is upset with me.
[01:02:09.100 -> 01:02:10.600] Sorry, Maria.
[01:02:10.600 -> 01:02:13.100] She says, nowhere is a bit harsh on Russell race pace.
[01:02:13.100 -> 01:02:16.700] And we will get to that with the Mercedes segment next week.
[01:02:16.700 -> 01:02:18.500] But you finished P8.
[01:02:18.500 -> 01:02:20.500] You finished P8 for a reason.
[01:02:20.500 -> 01:02:22.800] And that reason is race pace.
[01:02:22.800 -> 01:02:26.240] So we're not going to get through five teams, Matt.
[01:02:26.240 -> 01:02:29.120] So I think we're gonna have one more team.
[01:02:29.120 -> 01:02:34.120] So we'll let Christina, as the newest mapper here,
[01:02:34.520 -> 01:02:36.200] you can choose between Ferrari,
[01:02:36.200 -> 01:02:38.920] Aston Martin and Red Bull, Christina.
[01:02:38.920 -> 01:02:41.040] Pressure, there's a lot of pressure.
[01:02:41.040 -> 01:02:41.960] Oh, geez.
[01:02:41.960 -> 01:02:45.000] You're shaping the path of Missed Apex here.
[01:02:45.000 -> 01:02:50.000] This is so much power, oh my goodness. Let's go Ferrari.
[01:02:50.000 -> 01:02:53.000] Let's do Ferrari. Let's do Ferrari.
[01:02:57.000 -> 01:03:01.000] Okay, good, that was next on my list and it involves a lot less scrolling.
[01:03:01.000 -> 01:03:05.300] Well, thank you for choosing that, Christina, but we should also, we should introduce people
[01:03:05.300 -> 01:03:13.320] to you properly as well. Christina Lee Mace, you create some very direct and intellectual,
[01:03:13.320 -> 01:03:18.900] I would say, and clear and concise TikTok videos. And I don't think it's unfair to say
[01:03:18.900 -> 01:03:28.280] you kind of aimed it at newer F1 fans. It's kind of a very explanatory tone and we can all trust
[01:03:28.280 -> 01:03:33.160] auntie Christina on her F1 knowledge. That is the goal, it's to curate
[01:03:33.160 -> 01:03:38.760] information so it's not overwhelming and very accessible. Accessible, that's what
[01:03:38.760 -> 01:03:42.360] yeah and I do like that it's you know it's not a wasted word there's a lot of
[01:03:42.360 -> 01:03:45.220] content creators now especially when you go on the scrolling apps and they've spent half an hour telling you like hi it's Derek here oh it's not a wasted word. There's a lot of content creators now, especially when you go on the scrolling apps.
[01:03:45.220 -> 01:03:47.340] And they'll spend half an hour telling you,
[01:03:47.340 -> 01:03:48.900] hi, it's Derek here.
[01:03:48.900 -> 01:03:49.860] Oh, it's a bit chilly.
[01:03:49.860 -> 01:03:51.060] That's why I've got my coat.
[01:03:51.060 -> 01:03:53.260] No, it's straight to the point.
[01:03:53.260 -> 01:03:55.820] And you can have information fired at you
[01:03:55.820 -> 01:03:57.400] from Christina's brain.
[01:03:57.400 -> 01:03:59.940] How do we follow that account?
[01:03:59.940 -> 01:04:02.220] On TikTok, I'm Christina.fastcars.
[01:04:02.220 -> 01:04:04.620] And everywhere else, Christina Leigh Mace.
[01:04:04.620 -> 01:04:06.400] There'll be links in the show notes below. Go and follow Christina. Right, I'm Christina.fastcars, and everywhere else, Christina Leigh Mace. There'll be links in the show notes below.
[01:04:06.400 -> 01:04:07.600] Go and follow Christina.
[01:04:07.600 -> 01:04:11.600] Right, you picked Ferrari, so this is your fault.
[01:04:11.600 -> 01:04:15.640] Success or failure for Ferrari?
[01:04:15.640 -> 01:04:18.000] Everything's a failure for Ferrari.
[01:04:18.000 -> 01:04:19.760] That's their brand.
[01:04:19.760 -> 01:04:22.480] I mean, that's being definitely a little harsh,
[01:04:22.480 -> 01:04:24.720] but I feel like that's just the gut feeling that you
[01:04:24.720 -> 01:04:29.440] get when you look at the team. I know that they're doing better in some ways than they have in the
[01:04:29.440 -> 01:04:36.400] past, but they're also not… they're just not doing anything to instill any confidence in me
[01:04:36.400 -> 01:04:42.720] as a fan, which makes it very difficult for me to cheer for them. Like, if they're not confident
[01:04:42.720 -> 01:04:46.040] in what they're doing, how on earth am I supposed to feel
[01:04:46.040 -> 01:04:52.080] confident in what they're doing when all of Charles's radio messages are just like,
[01:04:52.080 -> 01:04:57.280] I'm sorry, but play that for a therapist and tell me that you don't need help.
[01:04:57.280 -> 01:05:10.280] It's... that's kind of just where I'm feeling with Ferrari,... That's savage. I want more from them. That's savage, but you're right, because the sad Leclerc radio messages and just all the
[01:05:10.280 -> 01:05:11.280] pictures.
[01:05:11.280 -> 01:05:12.280] Sad, the angry.
[01:05:12.280 -> 01:05:16.200] Yeah, anytime there's a camera pointed at him, you just feel this kind of, it's just,
[01:05:16.200 -> 01:05:21.200] hello darkness, my old friend, just on a loop every time we see Leclerc.
[01:05:21.200 -> 01:05:25.920] I will say Sky Sports did a tweet saying, describe Ferrari season in one word,
[01:05:25.920 -> 01:05:30.800] and my response to that was simply Ferrari. Because Steve, Ferrari have just built this
[01:05:30.800 -> 01:05:37.520] reputation of, I don't know, it's almost like snatching defeat from the jaws of victory,
[01:05:37.520 -> 01:05:50.480] just over and over again on a loop. Well, it was 22 years, I think, between the late 1970s up to around about 2000,
[01:05:51.320 -> 01:05:57.240] in between Ferrari's championship wins, and they won almost no races during that period.
[01:05:57.600 -> 01:06:01.000] And then they had the Michael Schumacher period.
[01:06:01.760 -> 01:06:06.880] And then after that, they've had another long stretch of not a lot of success.
[01:06:06.880 -> 01:06:13.880] Anybody who's a Ferrari fan would should be used to the fact that they're nowheresville 99% of the
[01:06:13.880 -> 01:06:21.200] time. I can't see that it's any different now. The team is still in got the same kind of mentality
[01:06:21.200 -> 01:06:26.160] about it. When they win. It's a huge celebration because it comes so few and far between.
[01:06:26.160 -> 01:06:34.520] All right. I knew I made up all these numbers for a reason. And here we go, sports fans.
[01:06:34.520 -> 01:06:40.240] Here we go. So if I look at when I looked and this genuinely surprised me because I
[01:06:40.240 -> 01:06:44.480] did, I split off the sprint points because like I said, sprint sprints aren't real GP
[01:06:44.480 -> 01:06:49.840] racing, so we don't care about them. Get in the bin, sprint races. Did not change the order between
[01:06:49.840 -> 01:06:54.000] Leclerc and Sines. So then I did the next thing, which is I said, well, let's figure out how many
[01:06:54.000 -> 01:07:00.560] points they made every time they finished a race. And what I discovered was that if they had finished
[01:07:00.560 -> 01:07:08.260] all the races, Leclerc would have scored 239 points and Sainz would have scored 206, again, not including the sprints.
[01:07:08.260 -> 01:07:13.320] And that change, if I apply it to all the teams and drivers, would have seen Leclerc
[01:07:13.320 -> 01:07:19.820] finish second, Ferrari finish second in the championship with over 400 points.
[01:07:19.820 -> 01:07:25.680] Leclerc move up to third overall, displacing Hamilton, and signs move up to fifth overall,
[01:07:25.680 -> 01:07:27.360] both of them gaining two places.
[01:07:27.360 -> 01:07:32.080] So if there was a real problem for Ferrari, it was with the DNFs.
[01:07:32.080 -> 01:07:37.400] And interestingly, they had a real issue, and I forgot to mention for the Alfa Romeo,
[01:07:37.400 -> 01:07:41.440] and I bring it up now, is they had a new team principal this year, and they stole that team
[01:07:41.440 -> 01:07:51.240] principal from Alfa Romeo. Yeah. So that might also go a certain distance to explaining the total lack of focus of this
[01:07:51.240 -> 01:07:52.320] Alba team.
[01:07:52.320 -> 01:07:59.480] But Fred Vasseur seems like nice and he seems calm, which is probably what Ferrari needs
[01:07:59.480 -> 01:08:04.040] because when you listen to their radio messages, it doesn't ooze, we got this, does it?
[01:08:04.040 -> 01:08:05.680] There's not a we got this vibe
[01:08:05.680 -> 01:08:10.240] in general when you're listening to the team radio but you know it's very much we're figuring
[01:08:10.240 -> 01:08:17.120] it out as we go along kind of vibe right yeah but but fred oh freddy if i can call him fred uh i
[01:08:17.120 -> 01:08:23.280] like how angry he got uh after the las vegas uh free practice where that that journalist kept
[01:08:23.280 -> 01:08:25.360] trying to ask him yeah but apart from your
[01:08:25.360 -> 01:08:30.720] car being completely destroyed by incompetence of the facilities, like it's great, like the
[01:08:30.720 -> 01:08:34.520] flashing lights are brilliant aren't they Fred? Please no, I'm upset. But what about
[01:08:34.520 -> 01:08:39.120] the sphere Fred? And like he was so close to like picking up a sofa and just throwing
[01:08:39.120 -> 01:08:45.720] it at the journalist. So, while he won't have been able to have had an immediate impact, the
[01:08:45.720 -> 01:08:54.240] 2022 Ferrari isn't, sorry, the 2023 Ferrari isn't as Ferrari as the 2022 Ferrari team.
[01:08:54.240 -> 01:08:59.800] If that makes, if I've used Ferrari as a verb too much, let me know. But I think, bizarrely,
[01:08:59.800 -> 01:09:01.720] I think everyone will know what I mean.
[01:09:01.720 -> 01:09:09.660] No, I think they will. But the thing with the Ferrari that is most interesting to me as a car is that they really struggled
[01:09:09.660 -> 01:09:15.060] with the rear of the car. It snapped early season so badly they eventually
[01:09:15.060 -> 01:09:20.740] went along with Carlos Sainz and essentially permanently dialed understeer
[01:09:20.740 -> 01:09:26.000] in there to keep that from happening. But that really that disadvantaged Leclerc as a
[01:09:26.000 -> 01:09:33.040] driver. And when they got to Japan, they brought the new floor and the new floor really to a large
[01:09:33.040 -> 01:09:39.600] extent solved that issue. His points per start went up by three did Leclerc and he pretty much
[01:09:40.240 -> 01:09:47.560] beat the pants off signs from the new floor to the end of the season, drain covers accepted.
[01:09:47.560 -> 01:09:52.920] But what I also want to mention, and the other even more minor thing, is coming out of, I
[01:09:52.920 -> 01:09:57.280] can't remember the race, but they have always struggled with their tires.
[01:09:57.280 -> 01:10:01.400] And you can see it because they score more points in the sprint, relatively speaking,
[01:10:01.400 -> 01:10:05.600] than they do in the Grand Prix, because they lose out on tire degradation.
[01:10:05.600 -> 01:10:11.200] But they said, oh, you know, we had a thought about our hybrid deployment map, and we've
[01:10:11.200 -> 01:10:15.680] changed it for the exit of corners, and we think we've improved our tire management.
[01:10:15.680 -> 01:10:19.680] And since then, they actually really have.
[01:10:19.680 -> 01:10:22.440] So if, I mean, I know it's a joke.
[01:10:22.440 -> 01:10:26.040] If you're a Ferrari fan, there's always hope on the horizon.
[01:10:26.040 -> 01:10:31.700] But they've made several very concrete and correlated steps that you can observe in their
[01:10:31.700 -> 01:10:41.860] point scoring and overall performance in races this season. That is a good sign, I think,
[01:10:41.860 -> 01:10:46.000] for the team. I think they did better than people realized. It was just they had these early
[01:10:46.000 -> 01:10:50.440] season struggles technically, which is not surprising with the new staff coming in and
[01:10:50.440 -> 01:10:56.480] everything like that. But the fact they were able to get on top of it surprised me. I was not thinking
[01:10:56.480 -> 01:11:03.000] that was going to happen, but they did. So yeah, I mean, Ferrari's definitely one of those teams
[01:11:03.000 -> 01:11:05.800] that could do something next season. I mean, that's reflected one of those teams that could do something next season.
[01:11:05.800 -> 01:11:07.280] I mean, that's reflected in the fact
[01:11:07.280 -> 01:11:10.120] that they took six poles this year,
[01:11:10.120 -> 01:11:13.880] five of which came after the summer break.
[01:11:13.880 -> 01:11:17.160] And the other thing you've got to also say about Ferrari
[01:11:17.160 -> 01:11:20.600] is it's the first time since 2011
[01:11:20.600 -> 01:11:23.420] that they only won one race in the season.
[01:11:24.960 -> 01:11:27.400] All of their performance came at the end of the year.
[01:11:27.560 -> 01:11:30.800] I mean, that was partly, uh, the car development.
[01:11:31.100 -> 01:11:37.140] I think it was also partly, um, the strategy team started to get their stuff
[01:11:37.140 -> 01:11:37.800] together.
[01:11:37.880 -> 01:11:42.280] Um, and I think that, you know, that's probably Fred's influence.
[01:11:42.360 -> 01:11:45.560] He's, you know, was there for the first half of the season and I think he
[01:11:45.560 -> 01:11:49.640] said when he first came in, I'm going to spend the first month just looking and observing
[01:11:49.640 -> 01:11:57.280] and seeing what needs to be done. And he's the sort of person that goes about his management
[01:11:57.280 -> 01:12:04.680] fairly quietly. And it took quite a long time to start to get his influence in. So they
[01:12:04.680 -> 01:12:05.760] certainly did better at the
[01:12:05.760 -> 01:12:11.200] end of the year than they did early in the year and maybe that will be reflected next year. I
[01:12:11.200 -> 01:12:16.480] guess we have to wait and see. I do like Matt talking about the hope of Ferrari fans and as
[01:12:16.480 -> 01:12:21.360] someone who's always seen Ferrari as a deadly, deadly rival and I will say deadly, deadly rival
[01:12:21.360 -> 01:12:26.240] but the Ferrari fan base I think is one of the best fan bases out there
[01:12:26.240 -> 01:12:30.800] actually one of the least toxic fan bases mostly because they've just had their souls
[01:12:31.360 -> 01:12:37.680] beaten with a heavy rug um but I even though I like them I have a lot of respect for the
[01:12:37.680 -> 01:12:42.800] Ferrari fan base their little faces at the beginning of every season before testing when
[01:12:42.800 -> 01:12:49.320] there's a hope that they might not Ferrari as hard as they Ferrari'd in previous seasons. That is one of the highlights of my year.
[01:12:49.320 -> 01:12:54.920] Please, please, Ferrari, by all means, look quite good in testing. Get their little hopes
[01:12:54.920 -> 01:13:01.200] up. But the one question that Ferrari makes it harder to answer than other teams is which
[01:13:01.200 -> 01:13:06.000] driver is better in that lineup? Because I don't know, Christina, there's not been a lot
[01:13:06.000 -> 01:13:11.600] to pick between those two drivers. I would have said a couple of years ago Leclerc's gonna wipe
[01:13:11.600 -> 01:13:17.360] the floor with signs and it just hasn't happened. My big thing, and I've said this so many times,
[01:13:17.360 -> 01:13:22.560] I'm kind of tired of saying it, but I think we all know that Leclerc, he has better race craft.
[01:13:23.200 -> 01:13:26.000] Straight up, that has always been his stronger point,
[01:13:26.000 -> 01:13:31.280] just pure skill. He's come in with a lot of talent, and that's what carried him throughout
[01:13:31.280 -> 01:13:35.040] his junior career, all the way up to getting into Formula One and being put in that Ferrari team his
[01:13:35.040 -> 01:13:42.880] second year on the grid. But the result of that is he hasn't had to develop all of those auxiliary
[01:13:42.880 -> 01:13:47.440] skills that can also make you very good as a driver, that can make you very talented.
[01:13:47.440 -> 01:13:51.320] He has always been with a good team or a decent enough team,
[01:13:51.320 -> 01:13:55.000] whether that was in his junior years and then now,
[01:13:55.000 -> 01:13:55.940] Ferrari is what it is.
[01:13:55.940 -> 01:13:58.320] But it is technically a top three team.
[01:13:58.320 -> 01:14:00.880] So he hasn't had to push for his own strategies.
[01:14:00.880 -> 01:14:03.960] He hasn't necessarily had to push as hard to make changes
[01:14:03.960 -> 01:14:05.360] to a car that he wants.
[01:14:05.360 -> 01:14:10.640] Whereas someone like Carlos Sainz, where he's developed all of these other skills,
[01:14:10.640 -> 01:14:16.480] like pushing for his own strategy and being very vocal about what he wants. And now,
[01:14:16.480 -> 01:14:21.600] in these moments, that is what's making a very big difference, is that all of those other skills,
[01:14:22.240 -> 01:14:27.120] Carlos has them and knows when to deploy them. So he's very much an
[01:14:27.120 -> 01:14:31.440] I'm going to wait for the opportunity and know when to jump through it type of driver. And that's,
[01:14:31.440 -> 01:14:38.280] it's making a big difference this year now. So like, science politicking basically shows like
[01:14:38.280 -> 01:14:43.240] a lot of strength of character that that stop inventing, which I talk about a lot, the, you
[01:14:43.240 -> 01:14:46.440] know, that was because they because the team was trying to manipulate
[01:14:46.440 -> 01:14:50.080] a driver swap and he was trying to tell them not to do that
[01:14:50.080 -> 01:14:52.520] and to literally go on the radio and say, stop inventing,
[01:14:52.520 -> 01:14:55.160] stop making things up, that's not real.
[01:14:55.160 -> 01:14:56.560] And you have to imagine that he take,
[01:14:56.560 -> 01:14:58.040] if he does that in public,
[01:14:58.040 -> 01:15:00.180] you have to imagine that he takes that to the garage.
[01:15:00.180 -> 01:15:06.160] So Carlos Saenz really has stood up for himself in Ferrari because he easily
[01:15:06.160 -> 01:15:07.520] could have got Vettel out the door.
[01:15:07.520 -> 01:15:12.080] Exactly. He is somebody who's going to advocate for himself. He's going to make those career
[01:15:12.080 -> 01:15:19.040] decisions that make sense for him. He's a very calculated thinking driver. And that's something
[01:15:19.040 -> 01:15:23.920] that until Leclerc does that, he's not going to be in a championship fight. If he's just along for
[01:15:23.920 -> 01:15:31.080] the ride with whatever the team wants and can't self-advocate, the moment that his race goes slightly sideways,
[01:15:31.080 -> 01:15:34.360] he's not going to have much work. He's not just going to have anywhere to go.
[01:15:34.360 -> 01:15:39.200] Right. So, Matt, this has been something we've argued about for years, I think, Carlos Sainz.
[01:15:39.200 -> 01:15:43.820] I've always thought, not so much of him, you've always been a big Carlos Sainz fan. I definitely
[01:15:43.820 -> 01:15:50.640] would see myself as someone who wishes well on Charles Leclerc, but yeah, I've been a little bit disappointed
[01:15:50.640 -> 01:15:55.440] that that gap hasn't been wider. And you have to wonder now, because they're both in contract
[01:15:55.440 -> 01:16:01.200] negotiations, they both seem to be talking to other teams and also making noises about
[01:16:01.200 -> 01:16:05.520] new contracts. I think it's probably going to be Leclerc and Sainz for a while, isn't it?
[01:16:05.520 -> 01:16:11.800] Yeah, well, I mean, ask yourself, who would go where? Where could Leclerc go better than
[01:16:11.800 -> 01:16:17.000] Ferrari, where he will be at worst second or third in the constructors and have a car
[01:16:17.000 -> 01:16:23.000] that will occasionally at least win races? And the same would be true for Sainz. Where
[01:16:23.000 -> 01:16:25.040] would he really, I mean, Mercedes?
[01:16:25.040 -> 01:16:27.600] Well, when Hamilton retires, maybe that's a discussion
[01:16:27.600 -> 01:16:28.360] they have.
[01:16:28.360 -> 01:16:31.040] But for right now, drivers always talk to other teams.
[01:16:31.040 -> 01:16:33.920] And they do that so that the team they're on
[01:16:33.920 -> 01:16:35.960] knows that other people want them.
[01:16:35.960 -> 01:16:40.640] This is just classic business negotiations 101.
[01:16:40.640 -> 01:16:42.320] But the fact of the matter is, if you
[01:16:42.320 -> 01:16:46.880] look at the points scored and you look at the percentages
[01:16:47.440 -> 01:16:51.840] of the point scored just in the races now because again we've agreed we're not going to consider the
[01:16:51.840 -> 01:16:58.480] sprint races at all there is only one team i think that is closer than the teammates of ferrari and
[01:16:58.480 -> 01:17:04.560] what i think that really shows you is ferrari have a very well complemented pair of drivers
[01:17:07.840 -> 01:17:15.280] you is Ferrari have a very well complemented pair of drivers. Sainz isn't the driver Leclerc is in a lot of ways, but the driver he is fits very well with Leclerc and together they make a really,
[01:17:15.280 -> 01:17:21.280] really good team. Had they managed to finish those races that they couldn't finish and score the same
[01:17:21.280 -> 01:17:25.080] points that they scored when they did finish the races, well, like
[01:17:25.080 -> 01:17:28.680] I said, it would be a different story for them in the championship.
[01:17:28.680 -> 01:17:33.240] The only thing that was untouchable this year was Red Bull.
[01:17:33.240 -> 01:17:36.640] And for that, we just have to wait and see what everybody shows up with next season.
[01:17:36.640 -> 01:17:38.820] ALICE So if it's a title fight, Steve, though, which
[01:17:38.820 -> 01:17:41.840] one of those drivers ends up on top?
[01:17:41.840 -> 01:17:46.400] I still think it's the
[01:17:43.480 -> 01:17:49.240] clerk edging it. Oh I think it's probably
[01:17:46.400 -> 01:17:52.680] signs that would end up on top. I have a
[01:17:49.240 -> 01:17:55.000] question. Yeah I think signs is a, has more of
[01:17:52.680 -> 01:17:59.840] a killer instinct that you know a real top
[01:17:55.000 -> 01:18:03.360] driver needs. And a question, is
[01:17:59.840 -> 01:18:05.440] perhaps Audi in 2026 a viable
[01:18:03.360 -> 01:18:05.440] position for either one of them?
[01:18:05.440 -> 01:18:10.400] Because if I was Audi, I'd be looking for a top line driver to come in to lead the team
[01:18:10.400 -> 01:18:11.760] from then on.
[01:18:11.760 -> 01:18:16.960] Audi have a long successful history in all forms of motorsport.
[01:18:16.960 -> 01:18:22.640] I mean, they might not be contending for the championship in 2026 itself, but I'll guarantee
[01:18:22.640 -> 01:18:25.400] that 2027 and on, they'll be up
[01:18:25.400 -> 01:18:27.520] there pushing very hard.
[01:18:27.520 -> 01:18:31.560] That's really optimistic. Okay, so look, this is a fun little diversion. So let's go down,
[01:18:31.560 -> 01:18:34.920] you know, that route. Let's say you're Leclerc or Sainz and you're like, no, this is it.
[01:18:34.920 -> 01:18:39.480] What's my chance? Because Ferrari are going to keep Ferrari-ing. Now, where is my chance?
[01:18:39.480 -> 01:18:44.800] Where do I go? I think that's massively optimistic, Steve, with Audi. I'm really not expecting
[01:18:44.800 -> 01:18:47.480] them to do anything different to what Alfa Romeo have done, but
[01:18:47.480 -> 01:18:52.840] it would be fun to see another team in with the mix with the likes of McLaren and Alpine.
[01:18:52.840 -> 01:18:57.800] I think the two teams where you might look at and go, well, maybe there's a chance, is
[01:18:57.800 -> 01:19:01.080] a post-stroll Aston Martin.
[01:19:01.080 -> 01:19:05.320] You know, if they're a team that's genuinely on the up, which they look to be.
[01:19:05.320 -> 01:19:09.040] And I know we're not going to have time to get to Aston Martin, but if you look at the
[01:19:09.040 -> 01:19:14.100] statistics on the points and you double Alonso's score, there was actually a lot more potential
[01:19:14.100 -> 01:19:17.520] in that car than it even appeared at the beginning of the season.
[01:19:17.520 -> 01:19:23.520] So you might go, okay, once the Strolls get bored and go, I'll take a technical directive
[01:19:23.520 -> 01:19:26.000] until I know, well, we're going to cover that next week.
[01:19:26.000 -> 01:19:30.600] So basically, we've put this off to next week, we'll get sued by Aston Martin next week when
[01:19:30.600 -> 01:19:32.760] we talk about the technical directive.
[01:19:32.760 -> 01:19:37.560] So there's that, and then the other one is that perennial hope of the Alpine.
[01:19:37.560 -> 01:19:42.160] You know, Alpine in three years, you know, it's that ever, it's like an everlasting
[01:19:42.160 -> 01:19:45.120] gobstopper, the Alpine promise.
[01:19:48.400 -> 01:19:54.560] Alpine are the only team that can out Ferrari Ferrari. They do Alpine quite hard, don't they? But they have all the ingredients to push on.
[01:19:55.280 -> 01:19:56.640] Except for an engine.
[01:19:56.640 -> 01:19:59.760] At some point a driver is going to be correct.
[01:19:59.760 -> 01:20:04.080] Because they've had the ingredients for 10 years to push on and they haven't managed.
[01:20:04.080 -> 01:20:08.160] So because Alonso took the gamble, didn't he? He was seduced by that. Daniel Ricciardo took
[01:20:08.160 -> 01:20:14.000] his 40 million a year or whatever for that contract. This same conversation we're having,
[01:20:14.000 -> 01:20:19.120] lots of good drivers have made that, looked around and gone, yes, Renault, Alpine,
[01:20:19.120 -> 01:20:24.400] that's the gamble. That's the Hamilton Mercedes move that every driver is looking for.
[01:20:24.400 -> 01:20:27.720] At some point, one of them's going to be right.
[01:20:27.720 -> 01:20:34.680] But if you out and out say, which team has the potential to, at some point, go bang and join the top three,
[01:20:34.680 -> 01:20:37.520] it's McLaren or Alpine, realistically, isn't it?
[01:20:37.520 -> 01:20:41.120] I'd say Aston Martin or McLaren.
[01:20:41.120 -> 01:20:47.920] I don't... look, I'll get shot down for this, but Alpine's a French team. I know
[01:20:47.920 -> 01:20:51.960] lots of French people. They'll never be successful in the next 10 years.
[01:20:51.960 -> 01:20:55.320] Oh my God, Steve, can we edit that out? Oh no, it's Steve again. Steve has done that
[01:20:55.320 -> 01:21:01.080] again. So, but Alpine do have a disadvantage. Well, no, they're located in near Silverstone,
[01:21:01.080 -> 01:21:03.080] aren't they? So they're UK based.
[01:21:03.080 -> 01:21:08.680] Oh well, part of them is. The other part's in Viry, in France, and to start with, that's a huge problem that they've got.
[01:21:08.680 -> 01:21:10.680] RILEY Disadvantage, for staff.
[01:21:10.680 -> 01:21:11.680] Yeah.
[01:21:11.680 -> 01:21:12.680] ALICE Yeah.
[01:21:12.680 -> 01:21:13.680] ALICE Yeah.
[01:21:13.680 -> 01:21:17.000] ALICE Alpine is frustrating, but Rino is even more
[01:21:17.000 -> 01:21:25.660] frustrating, because despite their overt pronouncements from corporate corporate what you hear from people who've left the team.
[01:21:25.740 -> 01:21:37.520] I think particularly pat fry perhaps although if i miss attributing this i do apologize is that they said the words but they weren't really serious about the words.
[01:21:37.700 -> 01:21:47.200] So they would say yes yes yes we're committed to that but when you went to them and said we need x to do the thing that you said you wanted us to do, they'd be like, well, yeah, but we don't really want to do that.
[01:21:47.200 -> 01:21:52.000] We don't really want to spend that money after all. So just make do and it's all going to be
[01:21:52.000 -> 01:21:56.160] fine until they fire you because someone else said they could do it better for cheaper.
[01:21:56.160 -> 01:22:00.240] And, and, and, and, and, and, you know, like here we are talking about Alpine,
[01:22:00.240 -> 01:22:01.760] we don't want it, it's not who we're talking about.
[01:22:01.760 -> 01:22:06.240] Yes, I know. Okay. I know. I like the little diversion of what team would you go to if you
[01:22:06.240 -> 01:22:10.960] wanted to jump ship from Ferrari. And I think Alpine is not an unreasonable choice to go and
[01:22:10.960 -> 01:22:15.920] try and make Alpine your own as a driver. Alpine, if they ever commit to resources.
[01:22:16.480 -> 01:22:23.680] I think if you account for the reported horsepower loss of their engine, as I bothered to do at one
[01:22:23.680 -> 01:22:27.720] point, go through and calculate it, they pretty much did what they said they were going to do.
[01:22:27.720 -> 01:22:31.920] What let them down was the engine is weak compared to all the other engines
[01:22:31.920 -> 01:22:36.000] which, despite being frozen, somehow managed to gain all this horsepower. And
[01:22:36.000 -> 01:22:42.560] this is a trick that Renault, as a power plant, has missed multiple times over the
[01:22:42.560 -> 01:22:49.000] years. I don't know, if you're Leclerc, and you're looking for your next career step,
[01:22:49.000 -> 01:22:54.000] and they offer you Ocon seat, you take that, you wipe the floor with Ghazly,
[01:22:54.000 -> 01:22:59.000] you look great, and you have a chance of a manufacturer team pushing towards the top.
[01:22:59.000 -> 01:23:02.000] The other thing you do is you go to McLaren, and you beat Norris,
[01:23:02.000 -> 01:23:03.000] because then you look like a...
[01:23:03.000 -> 01:23:05.160] McLaren has a better chance, if you ask me then you look like... McLaren has a better chance if you ask me.
[01:23:05.160 -> 01:23:06.160] Oh, right.
[01:23:06.160 -> 01:23:08.640] But McLaren has a better chance.
[01:23:08.640 -> 01:23:14.480] Aston is the most interesting choice going to 26 because they have a new power unit coming
[01:23:14.480 -> 01:23:16.120] in and they're going to be a works team.
[01:23:16.120 -> 01:23:17.120] Yeah.
[01:23:17.120 -> 01:23:18.120] Okay, we definitely did that.
[01:23:18.120 -> 01:23:19.120] Did I make that up?
[01:23:19.120 -> 01:23:20.120] Did I make that up?
[01:23:20.120 -> 01:23:21.120] I think I heard that somewhere.
[01:23:21.120 -> 01:23:22.120] Yeah.
[01:23:22.120 -> 01:23:24.240] Possibly, may or may not be true.
[01:23:24.240 -> 01:23:27.880] They have just signed a new engine deal with Mercedes though.
[01:23:27.880 -> 01:23:28.880] That was McLaren.
[01:23:28.880 -> 01:23:29.880] Oh right, sorry.
[01:23:29.880 -> 01:23:30.880] Not Aston.
[01:23:30.880 -> 01:23:31.880] Sorry, sorry.
[01:23:31.880 -> 01:23:32.880] Yeah, yeah.
[01:23:32.880 -> 01:23:33.880] Oh, okay.
[01:23:33.880 -> 01:23:34.880] Have you just made that up?
[01:23:34.880 -> 01:23:35.880] Is that breaking you?
[01:23:35.880 -> 01:23:36.880] Honda's going to Aston Martin.
[01:23:36.880 -> 01:23:37.880] Yeah, that's what I thought.
[01:23:37.880 -> 01:23:38.880] Oh, right.
[01:23:38.880 -> 01:23:39.880] That's what I thought, too.
[01:23:39.880 -> 01:23:40.880] Again, I've missed that.
[01:23:40.880 -> 01:23:42.080] I've got to stop just not listening to Matt.
[01:23:42.080 -> 01:23:49.000] That's clearly, that's clearly, you've definitely told me that before. So I remember that. Okay, brilliant. All right, well, we're still on Ferrari then.
[01:23:49.000 -> 01:23:53.240] And I think that Steve, I think essentially your point is correct, which is they've got
[01:23:53.240 -> 01:23:57.640] those two drivers because both those drivers will think in their head that they're in the
[01:23:57.640 -> 01:24:03.280] best position to potentially fight for a championship. But actually, I think for both of them, Steve,
[01:24:03.280 -> 01:24:08.480] it's hard because you've got a team that is underperforming, even when they've got a car to challenge,
[01:24:08.480 -> 01:24:14.120] they seem to do their best to not quite get things right operationally. And then even
[01:24:14.120 -> 01:24:19.480] if the team did get everything right, they both have a very good driver to go up against.
[01:24:19.480 -> 01:24:23.960] So they really have to find themselves in a situation where they have a car that's head
[01:24:23.960 -> 01:24:29.760] and shoulders beyond Red Bull and Mercedes and the rest of the field so that the two of them can fight it out.
[01:24:29.760 -> 01:24:33.360] Because I think any kind of close battle and they're just taking points off each other.
[01:24:33.920 -> 01:24:39.440] Sure and that's why signs will come out on top you know. In a dog fight I'll take signs any day.
[01:24:39.440 -> 01:24:42.560] He's a harder, Leclerc is uh...
[01:24:44.000 -> 01:24:48.640] Fragile? Is that too... harder. Leclerc is, uh, fragile. He doesn't, yes, he's mentally fragile. If things don't
[01:24:48.640 -> 01:24:54.680] go exactly the way that they should for him, uh, I think that, uh, he kind of gives up
[01:24:54.680 -> 01:25:01.920] the ghost a little bit. So signs as you know, if I was hiring, I'd be going after signs,
[01:25:01.920 -> 01:25:05.000] not after Leclerc. I think he's a bit overrated.
[01:25:05.000 -> 01:25:06.000] He was great in the junior...
[01:25:06.000 -> 01:25:07.000] Ooh, we're going to get emails.
[01:25:07.000 -> 01:25:08.000] Yeah, yeah, sure.
[01:25:08.000 -> 01:25:13.360] He was great in the junior categories.
[01:25:13.360 -> 01:25:15.840] So tell me how great he's been since he's been at Ferrari.
[01:25:15.840 -> 01:25:16.840] All right.
[01:25:16.840 -> 01:25:21.400] So if you email feedback at msapex.net and do the subject line, shut up, Steve.
[01:25:21.400 -> 01:25:22.400] You don't know what you're talking about.
[01:25:22.400 -> 01:25:23.400] Leave Leclerc alone.
[01:25:23.400 -> 01:25:24.400] He's brilliant.
[01:25:24.400 -> 01:25:26.800] If you use that subject line, I'll forward those on to Steve.
[01:25:27.360 -> 01:25:30.000] Yeah, thanks. I'd be interested in looking at those.
[01:25:31.040 -> 01:25:35.920] Is that, Christina, is that harsh with the saying? He does come across sometimes as,
[01:25:35.920 -> 01:25:40.960] as like a little fragile, but you know, he, like Lewis Hamilton, he wears his heart on his face,
[01:25:40.960 -> 01:25:43.200] doesn't he? Like you can see what he's feeling.
[01:25:43.840 -> 01:25:48.480] Absolutely. He's, he's not shy about making it obvious when he's happy or when he's not,
[01:25:48.480 -> 01:25:54.000] and that's perfectly fine. But the big advantage that Ferrari have, and that I wish that they
[01:25:54.000 -> 01:25:58.400] would take advantage of, is that they have two drivers that, yes, have different strengths and
[01:25:58.400 -> 01:26:04.400] different weaknesses, which means that different championship fights, they're going to be able to
[01:26:04.400 -> 01:26:05.520] throw their weight behind a different driver, and they have to be willing to do that fights, they're going to be able to throw their weight behind a
[01:26:05.520 -> 01:26:10.080] different driver and they have to be willing to do that. And they're not right now. Right now,
[01:26:10.080 -> 01:26:14.240] they've made it so clear that they're always going to prioritize Leclerc, whether that is the thing
[01:26:14.240 -> 01:26:30.480] to do that makes sense or not. There are some races where it will make sense to prioritize prioritise Sainz. Leclerc is so unlucky, regardless of why it is, but he has bad luck enough times
[01:26:30.480 -> 01:26:36.080] that Sainz was ahead in the championship for a good chunk of the year, and yet they still were
[01:26:36.080 -> 01:26:43.040] not prioritising him to go and get more points. And if a championship battle comes about where
[01:26:43.040 -> 01:26:49.760] you need somebody who's going to be jumping at every single opportunity and who's going to go for those moments of key strategy and
[01:26:49.760 -> 01:26:55.200] thinking because that's what that's how Sainz won his two races is he out thought the other
[01:26:55.200 -> 01:26:56.200] teams.
[01:26:56.200 -> 01:26:57.880] He was smart about it.
[01:26:57.880 -> 01:27:02.040] And if Ferrari aren't willing to put their weight behind him when it counts, they're
[01:27:02.040 -> 01:27:05.700] going to screw themselves out of a lot of opportunities.
[01:27:05.700 -> 01:27:07.080] That's their big mistake, is they
[01:27:07.080 -> 01:27:09.900] have two drivers that, under the right circumstances,
[01:27:09.900 -> 01:27:12.220] could both be exceptional.
[01:27:12.220 -> 01:27:15.260] And they're not willing to shift where they prioritize.
[01:27:15.260 -> 01:27:18.380] And it does feel like Leclerc is the chosen one at the moment.
[01:27:18.380 -> 01:27:22.020] They do seem to have always that driver that is the Ferrari team.
[01:27:22.020 -> 01:27:23.420] And at the moment, it is Leclerc.
[01:27:23.420 -> 01:27:26.080] But Sainz is way, way closer,
[01:27:26.080 -> 01:27:31.680] and sometimes even ahead, than the likes of, you know, Massa, Barrichello, Raikkonen.
[01:27:32.480 -> 01:27:37.440] And I would say just look at a race like Singapore, where, to my memory, they more or less
[01:27:37.440 -> 01:27:46.960] use Leclerc like a chess piece to help delay the advancing drivers. They seem to be more willing to take whatever driver's behind
[01:27:46.960 -> 01:27:49.240] and put them on a weird or alternate strategy
[01:27:49.240 -> 01:27:52.240] if they think it will help the driver farthest ahead
[01:27:52.240 -> 01:27:56.440] in the actual race, which I think is an improvement
[01:27:56.440 -> 01:27:59.040] from years ago, where they just had a driver that they would
[01:27:59.040 -> 01:28:01.520] move you around till that driver was ahead of you,
[01:28:01.520 -> 01:28:03.560] regardless of how you were actually driving
[01:28:03.560 -> 01:28:05.640] at that particular point in the race.
[01:28:05.640 -> 01:28:07.880] So you know, progress.
[01:28:07.880 -> 01:28:14.200] But it's interesting, I like Christina's observation quite a bit, that they're going to have to
[01:28:14.200 -> 01:28:20.240] figure out who is up for the fight, because so far it's not been an issue, because no
[01:28:20.240 -> 01:28:23.240] one has had a real car to beat Red Bull with.
[01:28:23.240 -> 01:28:25.600] When the team finally shows up with a car to
[01:28:25.600 -> 01:28:31.920] potentially beat Red Bull, we're going to get a lot of questions answered very rapidly, I suspect.
[01:28:31.920 -> 01:28:37.360] Yeah, you're right. Ferrari have often gone quite Lord Foir-Croix about it, haven't they?
[01:28:37.360 -> 01:28:43.840] Some of you may die, but it's a sacrifice I'm willing to make. But yeah, I like that kind of
[01:28:43.840 -> 01:28:45.240] strategy element with Ferrari
[01:28:45.240 -> 01:28:50.240] I really do so as we were doing the Alfa Romeo section. I was looking at the clock going
[01:28:50.240 -> 01:28:52.340] Yeah, we're not getting through five teams
[01:28:52.340 -> 01:28:59.920] We're gonna we're gonna call it quit there and I'll quit there and our two-parter season review has magically become a three-parter
[01:28:59.920 -> 01:29:02.560] But for Ferrari just end on some of the patron comments here
[01:29:03.040 -> 01:29:06.560] Phil points out the clerks overtake on Perez at Vegas.
[01:29:06.560 -> 01:29:08.860] And I think that's what you're talking about there,
[01:29:08.860 -> 01:29:13.220] Christina, with some of that pure just wheel-to-wheel skill.
[01:29:13.220 -> 01:29:17.380] That's where Leclerc seems to really have the edge over Sainz.
[01:29:17.380 -> 01:29:19.540] Tiro says the strategy department
[01:29:19.540 -> 01:29:23.280] being run from the second car cockpit is his highlight.
[01:29:23.280 -> 01:29:30.560] So again, absolutely correct that that is. S Signs does seem to just have that strategic brain and it really shows through.
[01:29:31.120 -> 01:29:36.720] And Tim Redd says his highlight is the Vossor possibly being the no BS team principal that
[01:29:36.720 -> 01:29:45.520] could turn Ferrari around? Big question mark there. So let's see. Go and follow my panel on the social medias. Click the link below
[01:29:45.520 -> 01:29:52.120] to follow Christina and check out her TikToks. And I don't know, maybe keep an eye out to
[01:29:52.120 -> 01:29:57.480] see if she ends up hosting some kind of motorsport podcast in the near future. Who knows? Go
[01:29:57.480 -> 01:30:08.080] and follow Uncle Steve by going to his house. Steve lives on 188 Acacia Avenue and when he eats a banana he turns into Banana Man.
[01:30:08.080 -> 01:30:09.080] That's the one.
[01:30:09.080 -> 01:30:10.080] Right, okay, I got that right.
[01:30:10.080 -> 01:30:15.080] You're still, you're anonymous, you're a lurker on social media, Steve.
[01:30:15.080 -> 01:30:19.240] Yes, I'm not on any of them and nor do I want to be.
[01:30:19.240 -> 01:30:21.400] But you can still send him abuse, don't worry.
[01:30:21.400 -> 01:30:30.080] So feedback at msapex.net specifically for all the the clerk stuff he said. And why not just feedback at MrApex.net to tell them all how wrong they were
[01:30:30.080 -> 01:30:36.480] about all the Williams stuff? Follow Matt at MattPT55 on Twitter and you were going to promote
[01:30:36.480 -> 01:30:42.480] some show or other, Matt. Yes, the New York City Scott Orchestra is playing at Shapeshifter Lab,
[01:30:43.040 -> 01:30:45.840] 873 Union Street in good old Park Slope, Brooklyn,
[01:30:45.840 -> 01:30:52.080] so if you're a Mr. Apex fan who also likes music, come by and say hi. We'd love to see you there.
[01:30:52.080 -> 01:30:59.040] I'd appreciate it. Oh, and speaking of Steve's stuff, click the link for the iRacing Season 7
[01:30:59.040 -> 01:31:06.120] Final, where we do iRacing in single-seaters. it was the final. Chris Stevens and Chris Capmantana are on commentary.
[01:31:06.120 -> 01:31:09.200] Steve does a beautiful, beautiful sim racing broadcast.
[01:31:09.360 -> 01:31:13.600] And, you know, the likes of me, Matt, Kyle, Alex, all have raced
[01:31:13.600 -> 01:31:17.000] throughout the season in that up against some listeners as well.
[01:31:17.000 -> 01:31:18.560] So that's all been great fun.
[01:31:18.560 -> 01:31:22.480] Go and check out Missed Apex Motorsport on YouTube.
[01:31:22.880 -> 01:31:28.400] You can follow the show on TikTok and YouTube Shorts. We are getting in there
[01:31:28.400 -> 01:31:34.240] on the Vertical Video Game, so if you're a fan of those platforms, go and check us out. Just search
[01:31:34.240 -> 01:31:38.400] for MrApexPodcast everywhere, but we will stick some links in the show notes as well. And follow
[01:31:38.400 -> 01:31:45.360] me, I'm the best one, at Spanners Ready, or be my friend on Facebook. Look for Richard Ready there or Spanners Ready
[01:31:45.360 -> 01:32:10.000] on Instagram. Until we see you next, work hard, be kind and have fun. This was Miss ♪♪
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